Demons and electronics.
- Thread starter Yet
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
J
If we get nothing else from the Bible, God has a controversy with sin! To say that all the evils men do are God's will is beyond the pale. Holy God cannot sin, nor be tempted to sin. The suffering of the apostles was the result of sinful man, persecuting them, not God. That God has His way of working with and resolving such situations to His glory is not to say He would rather not that men sin, obviously. Let's not check our brains at the door. Clearly, much happens in this sinful world, 24x7, things NOT the will of holy God, even, rather, the will of sinful men and devils.
T
Dig deeper friend. Read through Acts 3 and 4 and get back to me. I am not being mean, or snide...I want to you to learn this on your own.
If Peter was preaching the Gospel, which is the very will of God[see 2 Peter 3.9] then why would it be God's will that Peter be stopped from preaching the Gospel by being beaten and thrown in Jail!?!?!?
Simply put, God's will cannot be contradictory, he may allow things to happen to us, like Peter getting beaten and thrown in Jail, but his will is for the Gospel to be preached unto all men.
Satan will do anything to stop the Gospel from being preached...PERIOD. Think about this my friend, read through Acts 3-4 and let me know if you have any questions.
If Peter was preaching the Gospel, which is the very will of God[see 2 Peter 3.9] then why would it be God's will that Peter be stopped from preaching the Gospel by being beaten and thrown in Jail!?!?!?
Simply put, God's will cannot be contradictory, he may allow things to happen to us, like Peter getting beaten and thrown in Jail, but his will is for the Gospel to be preached unto all men.
Satan will do anything to stop the Gospel from being preached...PERIOD. Think about this my friend, read through Acts 3-4 and let me know if you have any questions.
For the most part I agree with you. I would say that God allowed them to be in prison and to suffer for a specific purpose, not as a result of demonic hinderance.
Of course men sin and walk in rebellion to God, which often affects God's people. But even that sin and rebellion is known by God and is worked out for the good of His Kingdom. But I don't believe that a demon or anything else has any power over God's people that God doesn't know about or allows. So I don't see the sources of trials and tribulations as potential demons, but God's opportunity to have me strengthened, and for His Kingdom to be strengthened.
When I'm walking out of His will or out of relationship with Him, that's a different story.
Of course men sin and walk in rebellion to God, which often affects God's people. But even that sin and rebellion is known by God and is worked out for the good of His Kingdom. But I don't believe that a demon or anything else has any power over God's people that God doesn't know about or allows. So I don't see the sources of trials and tribulations as potential demons, but God's opportunity to have me strengthened, and for His Kingdom to be strengthened.
When I'm walking out of His will or out of relationship with Him, that's a different story.
T
Matt, anything that stops the Gospel from going forth and being preached is not God's will, it is a demonic Hindrance....
Have you ever had a Christian friend who answered the all to be a preacher, evangelist or missionary and then suddenly it seems like all hell breaks loose around them and obstacles are thrown up. That is not God friend, that is the enemy attempting to keep that person from answering the call. When you first answer a call to service to God it is full blown, on like donkey kong demonic war...period.
Now if you want to go even deeper, then we need to learn the difference between God allowing things to happen to you to refine you for his call, which is not an attack of the enemy. Many Christians never move past this point and claim everything is an attack of the enemy and that simply is not true...God kept the children of Israel in the wilderness for 40 years to refine , mature , equip and complete them, so when they did cross the Jordon, they could posses the prophetic promise...
Far too many Christians spend time trying to cross the river or never do cross the river, because they refuse to let God refine them to take on the next challenge. They then let hurt and offense keep them from claiming their inheritance of the promises of God or talk about the giants that are larger than they are and how big the mountains are that keep them from possessing everything God has promised.
You will never possess all that God has for you, if you will not submit to his refinment and maturing, completing and equipping you. Caleb and Joshua were ready to take on the giants, because they knew God was with them and for them and had completed them. 10 others stirred up a lie to the people and they stayed put and never crossed over.
The fear of the Lord gives you the wisdom to discern between an demonic obstacle/attack and if God is refining you for service.
Have you ever had a Christian friend who answered the all to be a preacher, evangelist or missionary and then suddenly it seems like all hell breaks loose around them and obstacles are thrown up. That is not God friend, that is the enemy attempting to keep that person from answering the call. When you first answer a call to service to God it is full blown, on like donkey kong demonic war...period.
Now if you want to go even deeper, then we need to learn the difference between God allowing things to happen to you to refine you for his call, which is not an attack of the enemy. Many Christians never move past this point and claim everything is an attack of the enemy and that simply is not true...God kept the children of Israel in the wilderness for 40 years to refine , mature , equip and complete them, so when they did cross the Jordon, they could posses the prophetic promise...
Far too many Christians spend time trying to cross the river or never do cross the river, because they refuse to let God refine them to take on the next challenge. They then let hurt and offense keep them from claiming their inheritance of the promises of God or talk about the giants that are larger than they are and how big the mountains are that keep them from possessing everything God has promised.
You will never possess all that God has for you, if you will not submit to his refinment and maturing, completing and equipping you. Caleb and Joshua were ready to take on the giants, because they knew God was with them and for them and had completed them. 10 others stirred up a lie to the people and they stayed put and never crossed over.
The fear of the Lord gives you the wisdom to discern between an demonic obstacle/attack and if God is refining you for service.
I agree that it very may well be the work of the enemy to try hinder God's plans, but I also know that the focus of such situations shouldn't be on what demons may or may not be at work and what they're doing. Instead, I should thank God for the trial and seek His deliverance from it. Who did Job argue with when Satan was afflicting him? He argued with God alone. Satan was merely a tool, whose power was only granted Him by God Himself. What happened to Job was real and devastating, but it was God who was doing the work, not Satan.
J
So, God has a specific purpose that requires sin to take effect? Some sins, or all sin? Or would this be complicity? Is knowing what will be participating in what will be? Who's to say what is not demonic where there's evil? How can you determine this?
If I had to bet on two world systems, one where man would be on his own, the other where he would be assisted by Satan and demons, until it's a whole world system that revolves around senseless, destructive sin, as in now, I'd bet on the former being a better place. Who was in the Garden, promoting sin? Again, a clear distillation of the problems,
Ephesians 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
But, I assure, God is not up to promoting sin, that grace may abound.
If I had to bet on two world systems, one where man would be on his own, the other where he would be assisted by Satan and demons, until it's a whole world system that revolves around senseless, destructive sin, as in now, I'd bet on the former being a better place. Who was in the Garden, promoting sin? Again, a clear distillation of the problems,
Ephesians 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
But, I assure, God is not up to promoting sin, that grace may abound.
Ultimately, I think we're just quibbling over details about sources. All of us go through trials and tribulations; some brought on by ourselves and some brought on by external forces. So what should our response be? To try and figure out who to fight? Or walking in the knowledge that God is our strength and trusting Him for victory and peace in all things and that His Kingdom is being strengthened.
I could care less who's attacking me. All I care about is who is saving me.
I could care less who's attacking me. All I care about is who is saving me.
There is a possibility that your diagnosis of this girl is correct, but have you thought about that you may not have been given the power to make a final decision about whether it was a simple need for attention or was the girl listening to demons to guide her? From what I have learned, the diagnosis of demon possession is a complicated one requiring the training of physicians, psychologist, and the listening prayers of men of God. Yet, we are to believe that you can make the diagnosis without any of these qualifications based only that she got up and walked away.
J
This is not the same thing as using sin for His purposes, as if some preferred tool in the toolbox, taking umbrage to your statement of the evil(s), "It was God's will." But this probably wasn't what you meant. Yes, God uses evil entities in His plan, but despite themselves, their sin not according to His will, aiding the Lord not their will, but that His more perfect will is made known, despite sin and evil.
I would say that if the girl was legitimately under demonic attack and was freed from it, she would have stayed and praised God. I know I would have.
But it appears she just got up and walked out. I agree with highway, I think she just wanted the attention and split when it stopped working.
(As always though, I reserve the right to be wrong before God's perspective.)
But it appears she just got up and walked out. I agree with highway, I think she just wanted the attention and split when it stopped working.
(As always though, I reserve the right to be wrong before God's perspective.)
Oh I absolutely agree with you there, which was one of my points at the beginning. Just because we get burned by the stove burner, doesn't mean the stove was possessed by demons (which goes back to the whole demon-possessed appliances discussion
).
That's why my approach to trials, tribulations and hurts goes through the following process:
1) Did I do anything to cause this?
2) If not, why did God allow it?
3) What does God want to do with it?
).That's why my approach to trials, tribulations and hurts goes through the following process:
1) Did I do anything to cause this?
2) If not, why did God allow it?
3) What does God want to do with it?
T
The Holy Ghost teaches men all they need about demons. In fact Acts 10.38 tells us how Jesus was able to deal with demons.
Stop leaning on mans wisdom and rely on God's wisdom found in the Bible.
I can assure you the girl had no demon and was not seeking attention because of a demon, she was starved for attention.
When you take the attention of of man or demon and place it on Jesus, it is amazing what happens.
For the record, I watched in horror, as a couple of physicians and psychologists attempted to deliver a girl from being demonized once. They both nearly were killed. All it took was a believer powered by the Holy Ghost to look at that girl and say IN the name of Jesus came out of her....What took trained men hours to attempt to do at the cost of broken bones and physical beatings, took a believer anointed with power and the Holy Ghost and using the name above all names, the name of Jesus about 5 minutes.
Jesus never consulted with physicians or psychologists, and despite the fact it will make your head explode, he did not do the things he did, especially delivering the demoniac, merely because he was the SON of God. Acts 10.38 tells you how he did it and that model is for believers today, regardless of all those, including yourself, who like to try to take the power of God away for a time such as this.
Stop leaning on mans wisdom and rely on God's wisdom found in the Bible.
I can assure you the girl had no demon and was not seeking attention because of a demon, she was starved for attention.
When you take the attention of of man or demon and place it on Jesus, it is amazing what happens.
For the record, I watched in horror, as a couple of physicians and psychologists attempted to deliver a girl from being demonized once. They both nearly were killed. All it took was a believer powered by the Holy Ghost to look at that girl and say IN the name of Jesus came out of her....What took trained men hours to attempt to do at the cost of broken bones and physical beatings, took a believer anointed with power and the Holy Ghost and using the name above all names, the name of Jesus about 5 minutes.
Jesus never consulted with physicians or psychologists, and despite the fact it will make your head explode, he did not do the things he did, especially delivering the demoniac, merely because he was the SON of God. Acts 10.38 tells you how he did it and that model is for believers today, regardless of all those, including yourself, who like to try to take the power of God away for a time such as this.
T
You better re-read Job God commanded Satan that he could do anything to Job but take his life.....
Job 1.12:
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And the Lord said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand.
God did not take away anything from Job, the destroyer did....
Job 1.12:
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And the Lord said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand.
God did not take away anything from Job, the destroyer did....