Doctrine of Unconditional Election
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Prove it. Those who are able to discern the context know that Jesus was using the Jews' own words in His answer.
They asked, “What must we do to do the works God requires?” in v.28. Got it? They thought that Go required works for eternal life.
Then, Jesus answered: “The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent.”
Both Eph 2:8,9 and Rom 4:4,5 prove that salvation is NOT by our works, but by trusting/believing in Christ.
If you don't comprehend that, there is not much use in further discussion. It's called "being at loggerheads".
They asked, “What must we do to do the works God requires?” in v.28. Got it? They thought that Go required works for eternal life.
Then, Jesus answered: “The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent.”
Both Eph 2:8,9 and Rom 4:4,5 prove that salvation is NOT by our works, but by trusting/believing in Christ.
If you don't comprehend that, there is not much use in further discussion. It's called "being at loggerheads".
Actually, the word is defined in lexicons, which the Bible uses to convey what God wants mankind to know.
"save" means to deliver or rescue from danger/etc in its basic meaning.
The concept of salvation has 3 tenses that need to be understood, or many parts of the Bible will not be properly understood.
Past tense salvation: saved from the penalty of sin. This is our justification.
Present tense salvation: saved from the power of sin. This is our sanctification. Refers to spiritual growth.
Future tense salvation: saved from the presence of sin. This is our glorification.
What do you think I missed?
"save" means to deliver or rescue from danger/etc in its basic meaning.
The concept of salvation has 3 tenses that need to be understood, or many parts of the Bible will not be properly understood.
Past tense salvation: saved from the penalty of sin. This is our justification.
Present tense salvation: saved from the power of sin. This is our sanctification. Refers to spiritual growth.
Future tense salvation: saved from the presence of sin. This is our glorification.
What do you think I missed?
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How about you grow up and lose some of that hypersensitivity?
When are you going to prove my posts are wrong? You've been pretty busy making all these charges, none of which you can prove because you don't have any evidence.
Just provide Scripture that you think refutes any of my posts.
Do you not realize that I don't want to be wrong any more than you do? If I am wrong, I want to know so I can repent (change my mind) and believe what is truth.
If you have the same attitude, there should be no tension between us. That's if we both want truth.
When are you going to prove my posts are wrong? You've been pretty busy making all these charges, none of which you can prove because you don't have any evidence.
Just provide Scripture that you think refutes any of my posts.
Do you not realize that I don't want to be wrong any more than you do? If I am wrong, I want to know so I can repent (change my mind) and believe what is truth.
If you have the same attitude, there should be no tension between us. That's if we both want truth.
No, if what you say is true it would say "righteousness was credited to him for faith", not "faith was credited to him for righteousness".
Besides, how could an imperfect faith, from an imperfect person, result in perfect righteousness? The faith in view must be
a perfect given by Christ alone.
[Gal 3:6 KJV] 6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.
[Phl 1:29 KJV] 29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;
Besides, how could an imperfect faith, from an imperfect person, result in perfect righteousness? The faith in view must be
a perfect given by Christ alone.
[Gal 3:6 KJV] 6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.
[Phl 1:29 KJV] 29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;
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So, according to your definition and relative to Tit 3:7, we have been justified by His grace and heirs according to the hope
of eternal life. Sounds like being saved to me. Notice, the "justified by His grace", and not "justified by our faith">
[Tit 3:7 KJV]
7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
[Rom 3:24 KJV] 24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
[1Co 6:11 KJV] 11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
of eternal life. Sounds like being saved to me. Notice, the "justified by His grace", and not "justified by our faith">
[Tit 3:7 KJV]
7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
[Rom 3:24 KJV] 24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
[1Co 6:11 KJV] 11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
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FreeGrace2 said:
Gen 15:6 - Abram believed the LORD, and he credited it to him as righteousness.
Do you realize what you are saying? I quoted the verse and you try to be some kind of expert about what I believe to tell me that if I'm right the verse would be different? Are you kidding??
I believe the verse AS IT STANDS. So don't tell me how it would read if I am right. I believe what it says. Don't you?
Who says one's trust in Christ is imperfect? You got a verse for that comment? No, you don't. All you have are opinions.
The Bible teaches quite clearly that salvation is based on man trusting in what Jesus did for him and gives eternal life to those who do trust Him.
1 Cor 1:21 - For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.
I've highlighted the main point of the verse. Do you believe the red words? It seems to me that you don't believe them.
What say you?
So, where is this "imperfect faith" that you speak of? I don't see it.
Other translations use "granted" which conveys the meaning better.
iow, God permits man to believe.
What the verse does NOT SAY is that God causes people to believe.
Gen 15:6 - Abram believed the LORD, and he credited it to him as righteousness.
Do you realize what you are saying? I quoted the verse and you try to be some kind of expert about what I believe to tell me that if I'm right the verse would be different? Are you kidding??
I believe the verse AS IT STANDS. So don't tell me how it would read if I am right. I believe what it says. Don't you?
Who says one's trust in Christ is imperfect? You got a verse for that comment? No, you don't. All you have are opinions.
The Bible teaches quite clearly that salvation is based on man trusting in what Jesus did for him and gives eternal life to those who do trust Him.
1 Cor 1:21 - For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.
I've highlighted the main point of the verse. Do you believe the red words? It seems to me that you don't believe them.
What say you?
So, where is this "imperfect faith" that you speak of? I don't see it.
Other translations use "granted" which conveys the meaning better.
iow, God permits man to believe.
What the verse does NOT SAY is that God causes people to believe.
Please point out where I've been "refuted" if you can. I would appreciate it.
Well, there you go again. Highly emotional and throwing charges that you cannot prove. Nice try is right.
This seems to be about all you have in your "armament". You give little or no Scripture to back up or support your claims. Most of your comments are just hypersensitive criticisms of others (me).
It is your tactics that are childish. But childish people don't recognize their own issues.
Well, there you go again. Highly emotional and throwing charges that you cannot prove. Nice try is right.
This seems to be about all you have in your "armament". You give little or no Scripture to back up or support your claims. Most of your comments are just hypersensitive criticisms of others (me).
It is your tactics that are childish. But childish people don't recognize their own issues.
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