Doctrine of Unconditional Election

[FreeGrace2]

Doctrine of Unconditional Election


The elect are those who chose.

No, the "elect" are those who have been chosen.

The real question is to what are the chosen chosen for.

The answer is service. This is seen in EVERY verse that tells us the reason or purpose for election.

A few examples:

Acts 9:15 - But the Lord said to Ananias, “Go! This man is my chosen instrument to proclaim my name to the Gentiles and their kings and to the people of Israel.

1 Cor 1-
27 But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong.
28 God chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things—and the things that are not—to nullify the things that are,

Eph 1:4 - For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love

The "us in Him" is a reference to believers, already saved. The word "us" is clearly defined in v.19 - "us who believe".

However, God also chooses or elects unbelievers for service.

John 6-
70 Then Jesus replied, “Have I not chosen you, the Twelve? Yet one of you is a devil!”
71 (He meant Judas, the son of Simon Iscariot, who, though one of the Twelve, was later to betray him.)

Those who believe that election is to salvation, are invited to find and quote any verse that shows this.

The Bride is indeed predestined. Let us be found in that number when the Bridegroom cometh. Let thy lamp be trimmed and burning.

The Bride didn't choose to be the Bride. God chose believers to be the Bride.

 

[rogerg]

I didn't ask any question. I made a statement with full awareness of the definition of the word "measure," but for whatever reason you saw the need to inform me of it.

Ok, so then you weren't injecting into the dialog between freegrace2 and myself - but just out of the blue you were
moved for some reason to "make a statement" about Romans 12:3 - right, got it.

 

[Mem]

To sort out the confusion to my answer, "No," to your conditional statement, "...if that's ('to measure') what I mean."

The ability to measure faith - to measure (as in measurement) Christ's faith, not given faith, if that's what you mean

Here, you explain the term "measure" as a verb.
And there, you show the definition presented as a noun. Hence my mirrored sentiment of 'huh?'

No??? I don't understand what you mean ?

For G1063 I say, G3004 through G1223 the grace G5485 given G1325 unto me, G3427 to every man G3956 that is G5607 among G1722 you, G5213 not G3361 to think of himself more G3844 highly G5252 than G3739 he ought G1163 to think; G5426 but G235 to think G5426 soberly, G1519 G4993 according as G5613 God G2316 hath dealt G3307 to every man G1538 the measure G3358 of faith. G4102

The KJV translates Strong's G3358 in the following manner: measure

1. measure, an instrument for measuring
   1. a vessel for receiving and determining the quantity of things, whether dry or liquid
   2. a graduated staff for measuring, a measuring rod
   3. proverbially, the rule or standard of judgment
2. determined extent, portion measured off, measure or limit
   1. the required measure, the due, fit, measure

 

[rogerg]

Here, you explain the term "measure" as a verb.
And there, you show the definition presented as a noun. Hence my mirrored sentiment of 'huh?'

Good to know. I didn't realize the reply was an English final for which I would be graded. Either way, it isn't a quantity of something given to someone, and that was my point. Do we really need to continue with this?

 

[Mem]

Good to know. I didn't realize the reply was an English final for which I would be graded. Either way, it isn't a quantity of something given to someone, and that was my point. Do we really need to continue with this?

Except it is my view that it is a quantity given to everyone, more or less, and I saw a need to make that clear so as not to be misrepresented by anyone misinterpreting it. So no, we needn't continue, unless further clarification of any misconstruing is warranted.

 

[rogerg]

Except it is my view that it is a quantity given to everyone, more or less, and I saw a need to make that clear so as not to be misrepresented by anyone misinterpreting it. So no, we needn't continue, unless further clarification of any misconstruing is warranted.

Yeah, well, by your first post I figured out that's your view - no big surprise there

 

[Jackson123]

grace is unconditional to all if grace is only for the elect then it is no longer unconditional is it?

Faith is condition to acces grace

 

[CS1]

Faith is condition to acces grace

faith in the noun Belief is the Verb

 

[Jackson123]

faith in the noun Belief is the Verb

Yep
16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

Whosoever believe is the condition to acces grace of salvation

 

[justpassinthrough]

Yeah, well, by your first post I figured out that's your view - no big surprise there

Please explain how a person is saved who has never heard or believed the Gospel of Jesus Christ?





JPT

 

[JaumeJ]

A person may be saved by turning to God and He gives him the Gospel.

 

[justpassinthrough]

A person may be saved by turning to God and He gives him the Gospel.

The Gospel is the message, the call to repent.

Repent means to turn to God, in submission to Jesus Christ as Lord.





JLB

 

[JaumeJ]

Turning to God is repenting, He then leads the person, the repentant, to Jesus Yeshua. I know,. T"is is how I came to the Cross.

 

[FreeGrace2]

A person may be saved by turning to God and He gives him the Gospel.

No, a person will be saved when he believes the biblical gospel.

 

[JaumeJ]

God has always spoken directly to His Children, always at the moment of receiving the Holly Spirit.

Do not infere I should deny my salvation in Jesus Yeshua. You, nor anyone else today, is authorized to judge others so.

 

[justpassinthrough]

God has always spoken directly to His Children, always at the moment of receiving the Holly Spirit.

Do not infere I should deny my salvation in Jesus Yeshua. You, nor anyone else today, is authorized to judge others so.

No one here is judging anyone.


What we are saying is no one gets saved apart from hearing and believing the Gospel.



If you believe otherwise, then please post the scriptures that says unbelievers are saved.

 

[Onesimus63]

A person may be saved by turning to God and He gives him the Gospel.

There may be some truth in what you wrote:

Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them. Romans2:14&15

The only way you cannot know God's laws if if you have never read a bible, but if the law is in your heart, you must be in a saved state, for that is where the law now is for believers

 

[peldom10]

A person may be saved by turning to God and He gives him the Gospel.

You mean he can become...born again? or...are you speaking of saved....as in being granted ...saved...by Christ upon judgement...after death?

 

[JaumeJ]

You mean he can become...born again? or...are you speaking of saved....as in being granted ...saved...by Christ upon judgement...after death?

I believe Jesus Yeshua, so what do you think it means?

 

[JaumeJ]

No, a person will be saved when he believes the biblical gospel.

It is the Spirit Who gives life, the written word is dead and can be death without the Holy Spirit.

I learn from the written Word only when the Holy Spirit reveals, there is no other way to learn from the Word. Even if you have somene gifted with that of being a teacher, it can only be taught through him by the Holy Spirit, and understood too.