End Times Timeline

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Rondonmon

Senior Member
May 13, 2016
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Is this verse mis-translated too?
Mal 1:3 And I hated Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness.
Did Jesus tell people to hate their parents ? I have do an extensive study on it, the word means hates less, thats a fact.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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You start out addressing "this generation" but focused on the phrase, "last days".

Jesus said, "this generation"; none of the three versions of the Olivet discourse has Him saying the "last days" or "last time". Therefore, the uses of those phrases aren't directly relevant for interpreting "this generation".

This generation or beginning (genesis) represents the last days ending on the last day. The last of generations time periods of time under the Sun.

The pervious generation that was reformed was the generation of Kings in Israel. From that time forward. Never again will there be so great spiritual tribulation. Today it is still doing its work of trying to place a outward face on Christianity . . up until the last day . .
 
Mar 28, 2016
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Did Jesus tell people to hate their parents ? I have do an extensive study on it, the word means hates less, thats a fact.
"Hate" in other words "withhold blessing".
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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This generation or beginning (genesis) represents the last days ending on the last day. The last of generations time periods of time under the Sun.
You need to provide Scripture to back up your assertions. Jesus said, "This generation". I see nothing in the text to suggest that it "represents" anything other than what it literally says: "This generation," as in those Israelites alive when Jesus spoke the words.
 

GaryA

Truth, Honesty, Love, Courage
Aug 10, 2019
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To those who believe the abomination of desolation happened.... How do you view the return of our Lord?
I do not agree the AoD happened yet.

I am speaking of the future.

To those who believe the AoD happened, how do you view the coming return of our Lord?
The meaning of the verses you posted is not affected (any at all) by when the AoD [actually] occurred.

I believe the AoD occurred in 167 B.C.

I believe the meaning of the reference to it by Jesus in the Olivet Discourse is very different than what most people believe.

If you understand why the parenthetical statements in Matthew 24:15 and Mark 13:14 were included - and what they are referring to - it becomes crystal clear - the AoD issue is really a non-issue.
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
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You need to provide Scripture to back up your assertions. Jesus said, "This generation". I see nothing in the text to suggest that it "represents" anything other than what it literally says: "This generation," as in those Israelites alive when Jesus spoke the words.
While I disagree with garee's take on it, I also believe it encompasses more than just the immediate ppl in the first century, for the following reasons...

Consider:

A few things help us ascertain just "when" the phrase "this generation" speaks of, or to "what" it pertains...

1) Q: is this the SAME [reference to] "this generation" in Lk21:32? (as a pre-tribber even, I do believe it is the SAME);
so, in Lk21:32's placement and its phrase "till ALL be fulfilled" necessarily INCLUDES the info just provided in verse 24 ("and they shall be led away captive into all the nations" AND "Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles UNTIL the TIMES of the Gentiles be fulfilled"<--both of these items MUST be included in v.32's "ALL" / "till ALL be fulfilled");


2) from there (if we agree they are the same "reference," and that these TWO items ^ must be INCLUDED in the overall understanding of the term),
we can then examine the other SEQUENCE issues, such as:
are the Matt24:4-8/Mk13:5-8/Lk21:8-11 [all known as] "the beginning of birth PANGS" even though the third one (Lk21:8-11) isn't LABELED as such?...
and my conclusion is that they ARE (they ARE parallel/identical events; known as "the BoBPs");


3) from there (if we agree that all three of those sections are THE SAME [PARALLEL/identical] events ['the BoBPs']),
then we can examine what verse 12 (following this section) says and means, when it states in Lk21:12, "But BEFORE ALL THESE [i.e. BEFORE all these beginning of birth pangs],"
before all those BoBPs, the events of the following section must take place first (vv.12-24a's reference to "the 70ad events"--so this is saying "the 70ad events" must take place BEFORE "all the beginning of birth PANGS" of the prior section);
and then in Matthew 24, THAT record is STARTING OUT with this [NEXT-IN-THE-SEQUENCE] "beginning of birth PANGS" (same for the Mk13 record);
and which "BoBPs" are then FOLLOWED by the "AoD" point in time / event [unique to Matt24/Mk13]



____________

Those ^ considerations provide us with the SEQUENCE of events (all of which pertain to and involve the "this generation" phrase, as I see it :) )… and that SEQUENCE proves to be:

1) the 70ad events [its (own) "SEE-then-FLEE" and the "led away captive into all the nations"] must take place before...

2) ...the beginning of birth pangs, which take place prior to...

3) ...the AoD [and ITS (unique/distinct) "SEE-then-FLEE"], which then precedes and leads UP TO...

4) ...His Second Coming to the earth (Matt24:29-31)


I hope that helps you see my perspective. :)
 

GaryA

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Aug 10, 2019
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and which "BoBPs" are then FOLLOWED by the "AoD" point in time / event [unique to Matt24/Mk13]
Why do you say this?

Just because a group of verses occurs later in a passage, does not mean that they occur later in time.
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
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Why do you say this?

Just because a group of verses occurs later in a passage, does not mean that they occur later in time.
I don't say it merely because it follows in the text, but for reasons I've already named elsewhere (Posts #16, 95 and 346 [of some recent thread, maybe this one], if I am recalling correctly those posts):

--[also] Jesus' use, here, of the SINGULAR for the words "abomination" and "desolation" (along with His phrase "spoken of by Daniel the prophet"), and where we can see those are [only] in both Dan11:31 and 12:11 (the latter of which is set in a specific "time-slot" [which ENDS with Daniel being resurrected to "stand in thy lot" (that is, on the earth)], and where in v.11 has also the words "[BE] SET UP [H5414]" where I've shown in past posts the parallel ideas in other passages, which I won't elaborate on in this post... no one is wanting to read lengthy studies, esp ones already posted :D );

--the descriptions of what they are to "SEE" in each [of the "SEE-then-FLEE" passages] being distinct, even though there are SOME similarities;

--the phrase "when ye THEREFORE" in Matt24:15 gives us reason to consider just what the "therefore" is THERE FOR, in this text;

--considering that if vv.4-8 are "the BEGINNING of birth pangs," that this indicates that FURTHER birth pangs FOLLOW ON from these BEGINNING of them (and that this is not the only place covering the idea of "birth PANGS" in tribulation, such as Isaiah 26:16-21, which I've shown before that I believe is parallel to a number of passages like Hosea 5:15-6:3 [its "TILL"; and its wording LIKENED UNTO a resurrection] and Ezekiel 37:12-14,20-23 [LIKENED UNTO a resurrection] and Daniel 12:1-4 [LIKENED UNTO a resurrection] and Romans 11:15 [LIKENED UNTO a resurrection], and more...<--all speaking of "Israel's FUTURE");

--the parallel wording in Rev7:9,14 "the GREAT tribulation" (for Matt24:15's similar reference), but when we view the latter verses of that Rev7 passage, we see that a latter verse aligns with Isaiah 49:10 (an earthly MK passage/context) and that there is mention in Rev7:15 uses the words "and serve God NIGHT and day in His temple" and that "he that sitteth on the throne shall TABERNACLE OVER them" (so these ought not to be conflated with the "Rapture" of Church which is His body, as though this "description" is somehow the NH&NE, or the New Jerusalem [see Rev22:5 "NO NIGHT there" and Rev21:22 "I saw NO TEMPLE there, for..." … etc]);

--more... but I've run out of gas... and I reckon it is too tedious to wade through anyway... but I'll try to double-check if I have the RELATED POST numbers correct, so that the reader can then reference some of the things I've already covered along these lines (esp the SEQUENCE issues, of which there are a number of these!!)
 

PreacherG

New member
Nov 17, 2018
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Mat 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
Mat 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
Mat 24:6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
Mat 24:7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

When do the verses above take place, during the tribulation or at the 2nd coming of Christ or some other time?
I recall, when the Branch Davidians were all over the news, remembering that Koresch's declaring himself to be the Christ was merely a sign of the end of times.
More recently, however, I been learning a lot, from a man, who lives in Richardson, TX. (Note: Richardson is in the Dallas, TX, area, where I used to live. Back then, I knew nothing about this man and I had no idea that he would be the one, spoken of by Daniel, when Daniel admitted that he, himself, didn't understand the prophecy he'd just given.
Daniel added that one would come, in the end of the age, who would understand these things.

When I was in Bible college, back in the early '80's, my professors were unable to explain the feet on the statue in King Nebuchadnezzar's dream. They all understood everything, EXCEPT the feet, which is understandable.
Well, the man, I've mentioned, understands that the legs, which are iron and represent the Roman Catholic church, from the time Christ was on earth, has reappeared. You see, the legs are iron and the feet are iron, mired with clay. This is understandable, when you consider that, now, the Catholic Institution has become mixed with the European Union (I recall thinking that the end was near, when the EU began and the Euro monetary system was reported in the news....Now, as we see the Euro being reported to have overtaken the dollar in strength, it's becoming obvious that the worldwide monetary system is almost upon us.

Another thing, I've learned, is this: The beasts, in the visions, given to Daniel, in chapter 7 and, then, to John, in Revelation, chapter
13, have one striking difference: The eagle is in Daniel's vision but the eagle doesn't appear in John's vision. The explanation, given by Irvin Baxter is that the Holy Spirit simply changed secretaries, so the latter vision differs from the former.

The only difference is that the eagle, America, isn't in John's vision. However, John DOES mention the eagle, when he shows the final attempt by the devil to destroy the Kingdom of Jesus Christ and the mother and baby are taken away on the wings of a great eagle.

Irvin Baxter shows how America is going to remain in place, throughout the Tribulation.

Lastly, the main thing, misunderstood, by Christians, is the length of the Great Tribulation.
In 1999, I contacted a man, whom I've known since 1981 and he told me he'd written a book, in which he ooutlined how the belief in a 7-year Great Tribulation isn't true.
When Irvin Baxter said the same thing, I realized the truth had been missed, for a long, long time. Revelation 13:5 tells us the Great Tribulation (without mentioning it by name, of course) will extend 42 months.
Now, so as to first forty-two months, I think that is when the antiChrist will deceive the Israelites and, in so doing, set many of them up to be slaughtered, when he begins a holocaust that will make Hitler's WWII holocaust dull in comparison.

This is going to happen is the very near future and the beginning of the 7-year Tribulation will be when Israel, either willingly, or by force (probably from the U.N.) gives the West Bank to Palestine.


















I believe many have come already but this statement is more directed at what starts the great tribulation and leads up unto

vvvv


Daniel 9:27
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
Daniel 11:31
31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.


Matthew 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)


No?
I think the "one week," mentioned by Daniel, has to do with the coming Tribulation. However, most of us have the timing down wrong. You see, the "one week," will be the time of the entire Tribulation. However, the Great Tribulation is a period of only 3 1/2 years.
 

PreacherG

New member
Nov 17, 2018
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I recall, when the Branch Davidians were all over the news, remembering that Koresch's declaring himself to be the Christ was merely a sign of the end of times.
More recently, however, I been learning a lot, from a man, who lives in Richardson, TX. (Note: Richardson is in the Dallas, TX, area, where I used to live. Back then, I knew nothing about this man and I had no idea that he would be the one, spoken of by Daniel, when Daniel admitted that he, himself, didn't understand the prophecy he'd just given.
Daniel added that one would come, in the end of the age, who would understand these things.

When I was in Bible college, back in the early '80's, my professors were unable to explain the feet on the statue in King Nebuchadnezzar's dream. They all understood everything, EXCEPT the feet, which is understandable.
Well, the man, I've mentioned, understands that the legs, which are iron and represent the Roman Catholic church, from the time Christ was on earth, has reappeared. You see, the legs are iron and the feet are iron, mired with clay. This is understandable, when you consider that, now, the Catholic Institution has become mixed with the European Union (I recall thinking that the end was near, when the EU began and the Euro monetary system was reported in the news....Now, as we see the Euro being reported to have overtaken the dollar in strength, it's becoming obvious that the worldwide monetary system is almost upon us.

Another thing, I've learned, is this: The beasts, in the visions, given to Daniel, in chapter 7 and, then, to John, in Revelation, chapter
13, have one striking difference: The eagle is in Daniel's vision but the eagle doesn't appear in John's vision. The explanation, given by Irvin Baxter is that the Holy Spirit simply changed secretaries, so the latter vision differs from the former.

The only difference is that the eagle, America, isn't in John's vision. However, John DOES mention the eagle, when he shows the final attempt by the devil to destroy the Kingdom of Jesus Christ and the mother and baby are taken away on the wings of a great eagle.

Irvin Baxter shows how America is going to remain in place, throughout the Tribulation.

Lastly, the main thing, misunderstood, by Christians, is the length of the Great Tribulation.
In 1999, I contacted a man, whom I've known since 1981 and he told me he'd written a book, in which he ooutlined how the belief in a 7-year Great Tribulation isn't true.
When Irvin Baxter said the same thing, I realized the truth had been missed, for a long, long time. Revelation 13:5 tells us the Great Tribulation (without mentioning it by name, of course) will extend 42 months.
Now, so as to first forty-two months, I think that is when the antiChrist will deceive the Israelites and, in so doing, set many of them up to be slaughtered, when he begins a holocaust that will make Hitler's WWII holocaust dull in comparison.

This is going to happen is the very near future and the beginning of the 7-year Tribulation will be when Israel, either willingly, or by force (probably from the U.N.) gives the West Bank to Palestine.



















I think the "one week," mentioned by Daniel, has to do with the coming Tribulation. However, most of us have the timing down wrong. You see, the "one week," will be the time of the entire Tribulation. However, the Great Tribulation is a period of only 3 1/2 years.
You're correct. Daniel mentioned one week and also used the term seven days, in reference to the coming Tribulation. The man ting is this: The week is going to be split in half and, in the middle of the week, when the new Temple is completed in Jerusalem, he will begin a holocaust that will destroy more Jews than Hitler did.

We will know the final seven years has begun, when Israel (either willingly or having been forced by the U.N.0 signs a treaty, with Palestine, giving up the rights to the Westbandk.
The Jews will be given a choice. They will either remain in that area, as a sub-Palestine group or they will leave. Those, who decide to stay, will be the ones, who will have to flee, when the Antichrist begins his holocaust,
 

PreacherG

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Nov 17, 2018
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The attitude of the world, right now, is leading to the Antichrist. However, the Antichrist, himself, has yet to be revealed.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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The verse that was offered is continue. The new creatures drink in the gospel daily

(Oba 1:16) For as ye have drunk upon my holy mountain, so shall all the heathen drink continually, yea, they shall drink, and they shall swallow down, and they shall be as though they had not been.
For ye (edom) Have (past tense) Drank on my mountain.

past tense, already done, as I told KJV.

and yes, the heathan continue to drink, even today.
 

OneOfHis

Well-known member
Mar 24, 2019
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The meaning of the verses you posted is not affected (any at all) by when the AoD [actually] occurred.

I believe the AoD occurred in 167 B.C.

I believe the meaning of the reference to it by Jesus in the Olivet Discourse is very different than what most people believe.

If you understand why the parenthetical statements in Matthew 24:15 and Mark 13:14 were included - and what they are referring to - it becomes crystal clear - the AoD issue is really a non-issue.
You didn't understand.😅

I was asking PEOPLE who believe the AoD happened, how do YOU view the coming return of our Lord.

Thank you for your views on the AoD, never heard that before, but I am was curious about how you (or anyone who believes as you do) would view Christ returning.


My posts in this thread aren't me trying to paint a picture but listen to other peoples understandings. (I have shared my opinions but only to show why I was asking certain questions)
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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While I disagree with garee's take on it, I also believe it encompasses more than just the immediate ppl in the first century, for the following reasons...

Consider:

A few things help us ascertain just "when" the phrase "this generation" speaks of, or to "what" it pertains...

1) Q: is this the SAME [reference to] "this generation" in Lk21:32? (as a pre-tribber even, I do believe it is the SAME);
so, in Lk21:32's placement and its phrase "till ALL be fulfilled" necessarily INCLUDES the info just provided in verse 24 ("and they shall be led away captive into all the nations" AND "Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles UNTIL the TIMES of the Gentiles be fulfilled"<--both of these items MUST be included in v.32's "ALL" / "till ALL be fulfilled");


2) from there (if we agree they are the same "reference," and that these TWO items ^ must be INCLUDED in the overall understanding of the term),
we can then examine the other SEQUENCE issues, such as:
are the Matt24:4-8/Mk13:5-8/Lk21:8-11 [all known as] "the beginning of birth PANGS" even though the third one (Lk21:8-11) isn't LABELED as such?...
and my conclusion is that they ARE (they ARE parallel/identical events; known as "the BoBPs");


3) from there (if we agree that all three of those sections are THE SAME [PARALLEL/identical] events ['the BoBPs']),
then we can examine what verse 12 (following this section) says and means, when it states in Lk21:12, "But BEFORE ALL THESE [i.e. BEFORE all these beginning of birth pangs],"
before all those BoBPs, the events of the following section must take place first (vv.12-24a's reference to "the 70ad events"--so this is saying "the 70ad events" must take place BEFORE "all the beginning of birth PANGS" of the prior section);
and then in Matthew 24, THAT record is STARTING OUT with this [NEXT-IN-THE-SEQUENCE] "beginning of birth PANGS" (same for the Mk13 record);
and which "BoBPs" are then FOLLOWED by the "AoD" point in time / event [unique to Matt24/Mk13]



____________

Those ^ considerations provide us with the SEQUENCE of events (all of which pertain to and involve the "this generation" phrase, as I see it :) )… and that SEQUENCE proves to be:

1) the 70ad events [its (own) "SEE-then-FLEE" and the "led away captive into all the nations"] must take place before...

2) ...the beginning of birth pangs, which take place prior to...

3) ...the AoD [and ITS (unique/distinct) "SEE-then-FLEE"], which then precedes and leads UP TO...

4) ...His Second Coming to the earth (Matt24:29-31)


I hope that helps you see my perspective. :)
First... you overuse emphasis (caps, bold, italics, bold-italics and underlining). You have emphasized so much of your post that it is difficult to read. If everything is important, nothing stands out.

Second, I see no problem with your sequence of four events, except that Matthew 4:29-31 does not require Jesus to come "to the earth".

I don't have time to address your post in detail at this time, but I will return to it later. :)
 

Rondonmon

Senior Member
May 13, 2016
329
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"Hate" in other words "withhold blessing".
It actually means loved less......of course Jesus was also saying we should love our parents LESS than him or vice versa.

In other instances God can say he HATES Esau like he hates the Nicolatian's, but that is about their ways/actions/sins. A Baby not born yet could not have acted in any way, so God loved Jacob more, He choose Jacob to bless. If that makes sense.
 

pottersclay

Senior Member
Aug 13, 2015
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The Church is Biblical Israel. Pagan Israel is not. God removed them because they rejected Christ Romans 11.
You my friend are very much misinformed. The church is not Israel not by a long shot. God cursed them but did not remove them.
Replacement theology is false. Please disregard that replacement nonsense.
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
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Second, I see no problem with your sequence of four events, except that Matthew 4:29-31 does not require Jesus to come "to the earth".
Thank you for your advice, I will endeavor to do better.

Just to note, I didn't want to go into any greater detail in that particular post... I was trying to just stick with the "sequence" issues relative to certain things in that text...

for example, in that post, [I'm mentioning now for the readers' sakes] I did not go into [what I've placed in other posts regarding the "sequence" issues] the point about how:

1) "our Rapture" precedes "the beginning of birth pangs" (I did not cover THAT Subject in my post, at all); and

2) "the beginning of birth pangs" are the same thing as the "SEALS" of Rev6; and

3) Rev1:1's parallel wording indicates that the FUTURE aspects of the Book (1:19c / 4:1 / 1:1 [7:3]) must take place "IN QUICKNESS [NOUN]" (not transpire over some 2000 years, as the Historicist view has it); and

4) they (and that section) END with Rev19 (which I am calling "His Second Coming to the earth" / His "RETURN" to the earth) parallel with the wording of Rev1:7, and parallel with about 9 or 10 other passages regarding "BLESSED" (including Daniel 12:12's " BLESSED is he that waiteth, and cometh to the 1335 days" which is at the conclusion, thereabouts, of the Dan12 "time-period" [end of 2nd half of trib, the "time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation [speaking of the nation 'Israel,' (v.1), per context] even to that same time," which I believe is parallel to Matt24:15,21's wording, IMO]); and

5) Matt24:29-31 (which I stated pertains to His Second Coming to the earth), as I've mentioned in past posts (so didn't want to elaborate there) is parallel the Isaiah 27:12-13, when Israel "will be gathered ONE BY ONE [not 'AS ONE' as we will be] to worship the Lord in the holy mount, AT JERUSALEM" (this event, occurring at the "GREAT trumpet"--One of the reasons I see this as being distinct from the Lk21:12-24a "70ad" section, is because they have very OPPOSITE "ends [/conclusions / outcomes]"... in the one, they are led away captive into all the nations," whereas in the other, they are "gathered ONE BY ONE to worship the Lord in the holy mount, AT JERUSALEM"... I'm not going into further detail in this post, cluttering it up further, but I'm just pointing out how I've made these points in other past posts.

Thanks for your consideration in this matter. :)
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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If prophecy is not literally fulfilled then it is meaningless
anyone can prophesy and say their prophesy came true by using your form
Of interpretation. Nostodumus should teach you that
the passage said when they drank. When they went in while Israel was overrun by Babylon. It’s why god punished them
I don't why you say that those verse weren't literally fulfilled, they were literally fulfilled at the first coming of Christ. Are you suggesting that "drinking on God's holy mountain" literally means that Esau sat on top of a literal mountain and drank something? I'm just trying to see where you're coming from.

Drinking on God's holy mountain would be akin to eating the flesh and drinking the blood of Christ... I know you don't take that literally. The flesh of Christ is figuratively referring to the word of God.

The same is true with drinking on God's holy mountain - drinking on God's holy mountain means to partake and be apart of the things of God, the covenants, the promises and all the rest... Esau, nor the Edomites did that.
 

KJV1611

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Nov 23, 2013
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It depends who you are.
Which side of a door is a door? The inside or the outside? Both.
The day of the lord is both terror to his enemies and delight to the saved. We are told about it many times.


Just three examples, there are more. I used the KJV because I know you don't trust anything else ;)

Isaiah 66:
14 When you see this, your heart shall rejoice,
And your bones shall flourish like grass;
The hand of the Lord shall be known to His servants,
And His indignation to His enemies.
15 For behold, the Lord will come with fire
And with His chariots, like a whirlwind,
To render His anger with fury,
And His rebuke with flames of fire.
16 For by fire and by His sword
The Lord will judge all flesh;
And the slain of the Lord shall be many.


Joel 3:
14 Multitudes, multitudes in the valley of decision!
For the day of the Lord is near in the valley of decision.
15 The sun and moon will grow dark,
And the stars will diminish their brightness.
16 The Lord also will roar from Zion,
And utter His voice from Jerusalem;
The heavens and earth will shake;
But the Lord will be a shelter for His people,
And the strength of the children of Israel.


Nahum 1:
6 Who can stand before His indignation?
And who can endure the fierceness of His anger?
His fury is poured out like fire,
And the rocks are thrown down by Him.
7
The Lord is good,
A stronghold in the day of trouble;
And He knows those who trust in Him.
8 But with an overflowing flood
He will make an utter end of its place,
And darkness will pursue His enemies.
I realize that point could be argued, but to say that God protected his people from harm while he destroyed the wicked isn't the same thing as the return of Christ in my opinion.

The darkness and destruction would be a side note to his return. I see where you're coming from though but I respectfully disagree.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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I don't why you say that those verse weren't literally fulfilled, they were literally fulfilled at the first coming of Christ. Are you suggesting that "drinking on God's holy mountain" literally means that Esau sat on top of a literal mountain and drank something? I'm just trying to see where you're coming from.

Drinking on God's holy mountain would be akin to eating the flesh and drinking the blood of Christ... I know you don't take that literally. The flesh of Christ is figuratively referring to the word of God.

The same is true with drinking on God's holy mountain - drinking on God's holy mountain means to partake and be apart of the things of God, the covenants, the promises and all the rest... Esau, nor the Edomites did that.
for some reason you just do not seem to wish to read the actual scripture to see what it says, You must just glance over it.

Obadiah 1: Concerning Edom
For violence against your brother Jacob,
Shame shall cover you,

And you shall be cut off forever.
11 In the day that you stood on the other side—
In the day that strangers carried captive his forces,
When foreigners entered his gates
And cast lots for Jerusalem—
Even you were as one of them.


12 “But you should not have gazed on the day of your brother
In the day of his captivity;
Nor should you have rejoiced over the children of Judah
In the day of their destruction;
Nor should you have spoken proudly
In the day of distress.

13 You should not have entered the gate of My people
In the day of their calamity.

Indeed, you should not have [gazed on their affliction
In the day of their calamity,

Nor laid hands on their substance
In the day of their calamity.

14 You should not have stood at the crossroads
To cut off those among them who escaped;

Nor should you have delivered up those among them who remained
In the day of distress.


these are things they did, And here in bold is the fact they entered the gates and laid hands on their substance inside the gates (they drank from the holy mountain)