How many sins were forgiven by Son on that cross to his Father
- Thread starter homwardbound
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
I think the opposite of what this verse claims to unconfessed sins.
“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.”
The way this verse reads could be also read unconfessed sins are sins God will not forgive because they were not confessed.
Jesus paid for sins is not the same as confessing sins for forgiveness.
“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.”
The way this verse reads could be also read unconfessed sins are sins God will not forgive because they were not confessed.
Jesus paid for sins is not the same as confessing sins for forgiveness.
-
2
- Show all
Hello again Homwardbound, it's true that, unlike 1 John 1:7, the forgiveness and cleansing of our sins by God in v9 looks back to the Cross as a past, present and future reality that has, for us, already been accomplished (since both words, ἀφίημι/forgive and καθαρίζω/cleanse, are in the Greek aorist tense).
However, this is not the case for 'us' (and what our half of v9 tells us to do), as ὁμολογέω/confess is in the Greek ~present~ tense instead. This Greek present tense indicates that an action is happening both presently and/or ongoing, thus the reason that our "confession" half of v9 is something that we are to do "over and over and over again", as often as we need to because of the ongoing sins in our lives.
I thought that I should also point out that I am not the one that you are actually disagreeing with. Rather, your disagreement is with the Holy Spirit, and also with the Apostle John, who (interestingly) included himself in the mix with the rest of us (in 1 John 1-2, see the words in bold at the bottom of this post) as someone who needed to continue to confess 'his' ongoing sins to God, as well, just like the rest of us need to do (not to be saved again or to remain saved, as the Law (our legal standing before our holy God) can only be satisfied at the Cross, but for the purpose of getting back the close fellowship that we enjoyed with Him, our loving Abba, which is lost, to one degree or another, whenever we sin).
As the murderer/adulterer King David prayed in Psalm 51:12, "restore unto me the ~JOY~ of Thy salvation", not salvation itself, because that was never lost (even though his sins were heinous).
God bless you!!
~Deuteronomy (David)
p.s. - question, if you're home watching something on TV, and when reaching for some food you end up knocking your wife's most precious family heirloom to the floor and shattering it into a hundred pieces, do you say anything to her, or does "love mean never having to say 'you're sorry'" in your home?
The Christian life is ALL about the ongoing and (hopefully) growing personal relationship that we have with our loving, heavenly Father/Abba .. cf Matthew 7:22-23; John 17:3. Or as one of my word studies puts it, "sin in a Christian’s life is a matter, not between a lawbreaker and a judge, but between a child and his father."
You know what, that word study (on 1 John 1:9/by Wuest) says it all better than I could ever hope to, so I'll post it for all to see/read in next post below.
However, this is not the case for 'us' (and what our half of v9 tells us to do), as ὁμολογέω/confess is in the Greek ~present~ tense instead. This Greek present tense indicates that an action is happening both presently and/or ongoing, thus the reason that our "confession" half of v9 is something that we are to do "over and over and over again", as often as we need to because of the ongoing sins in our lives.
I thought that I should also point out that I am not the one that you are actually disagreeing with. Rather, your disagreement is with the Holy Spirit, and also with the Apostle John, who (interestingly) included himself in the mix with the rest of us (in 1 John 1-2, see the words in bold at the bottom of this post) as someone who needed to continue to confess 'his' ongoing sins to God, as well, just like the rest of us need to do (not to be saved again or to remain saved, as the Law (our legal standing before our holy God) can only be satisfied at the Cross, but for the purpose of getting back the close fellowship that we enjoyed with Him, our loving Abba, which is lost, to one degree or another, whenever we sin).
As the murderer/adulterer King David prayed in Psalm 51:12, "restore unto me the ~JOY~ of Thy salvation", not salvation itself, because that was never lost (even though his sins were heinous).
God bless you!!
~Deuteronomy (David)
p.s. - question, if you're home watching something on TV, and when reaching for some food you end up knocking your wife's most precious family heirloom to the floor and shattering it into a hundred pieces, do you say anything to her, or does "love mean never having to say 'you're sorry'" in your home?
The Christian life is ALL about the ongoing and (hopefully) growing personal relationship that we have with our loving, heavenly Father/Abba .. cf Matthew 7:22-23; John 17:3. Or as one of my word studies puts it, "sin in a Christian’s life is a matter, not between a lawbreaker and a judge, but between a child and his father."You know what, that word study (on 1 John 1:9/by Wuest) says it all better than I could ever hope to, so I'll post it for all to see/read in next post below.
1 John 1
7 If we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.
8 If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.
9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.
1 John 2
1 My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. But if anyone does sin, we ~have~ an Advocate (now and ongoing) with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous;
2 and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.
As I see you believe and are stuck in sin as I have been in past and could be again. This, if I may say to you. Great you repent over and over and over again, trying to not sin again Amen
Yet you are trapped in a vicious cycle of the same sin you do not want to do and yet are doing it also, as I have for many years before seeing the truth of this reconciliation given by God Father through Son to us all ( 2 Cor 5:17-20)
Are by chance, are you denying the Christ that went to that cross for you, in his shed blood for you? Or do you not know there is no forgiveness without the shedding of blood as was set up to see that in the first testament. where it was there under Law, where there was no purging from the consciousness of sin as goes on to this day in repenting over and over again and again, that denies that final sacrifice of God for us through Son Jesus to us?
It is the mixing of Law and Grace that is happening today, many not seeing this and have gotten caught up under Law to not sin. Not seeing this: no flesh after Son Jesus can any flesh nature please God Romans 8:3
Ask God if you are denying God's final sacrifice in repenting to him by saying you need more forgiveness, that Son's done work is not good enough really?
In essence when I repent over and over again, I am still obviously sinning in need for God's forgiveness, and in essence I am then asking for more forgiveness and God will not shed anymore blood for anymore forgiveness will Son come back to die all over again?
Thank you It is finished (John 19:30) the new Hebrews 9:14-17
The fulfillment of Law Christ did that for you, me and all others too. to give us new life in his risen life for all those that believe God in the Son as resurrected for them, and are given it. these that continue in trust to God over what is done for them, get peeled like onions one sin at a time taken out of them to be grateful to God in as in 2 Cor 12:7-10, oh read from verse one please
Caught up in the third Heaven out of body or not I do not know, yet I can't speak of this. three verse 7 for us to turn to God to depend on Gods only, thank youmnot the self flesh efforts of
“Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.”
James 4:17 KJV
when that happens the solution is
“If we confess our sins, ( confessed sin what we do )
he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness( what he does ).
If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”
1 John 1:9-10 KJV
“Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, Whose sin is covered. Blessed is the man unto whom the LORD imputeth not iniquity, And in whose spirit there is no guile.
…I acknowledged my sin unto thee, And mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the LORD; And thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah.”
Psalm 32:1-2, 5 KJV
“John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins. And there went out unto him all the land of Judæa, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins.”
Mark 1:4-5 KJV
Awareness of , Repentance over , confession of , and forgivness of are all tied together in the doctrine This part is really important
“Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.”
James 4:17 KJV
if I don’t know I’ve sinned I can never repent and confess it but it was never counted against me anyways in Christ if I don’t know what I’m doing is wrong it’s when we do know that it becomes sinful
it’s importwnt to know the individual nature the sort of subjective nature of whether we know we are sinning or dont know we are sinning
Repentance and confession is for when we do know we have done a wrong that’s when repentance will become induced . Through our conscience and the sorrow sin brings a believer in Christ
“For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.”
2 Corinthians 7:10 KJV
If im sorry for my sin it’s going to prompt me to talk to the lord about it honestly and deal with it between he and I his way
if we confess our sins ( our role )
he is faithful and just to forgive( his role )
James 4:17 KJV
when that happens the solution is
“If we confess our sins, ( confessed sin what we do )
he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness( what he does ).
If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”
1 John 1:9-10 KJV
“Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, Whose sin is covered. Blessed is the man unto whom the LORD imputeth not iniquity, And in whose spirit there is no guile.
…I acknowledged my sin unto thee, And mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the LORD; And thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah.”
Psalm 32:1-2, 5 KJV
“John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins. And there went out unto him all the land of Judæa, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins.”
Mark 1:4-5 KJV
Awareness of , Repentance over , confession of , and forgivness of are all tied together in the doctrine This part is really important
“Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.”
James 4:17 KJV
if I don’t know I’ve sinned I can never repent and confess it but it was never counted against me anyways in Christ if I don’t know what I’m doing is wrong it’s when we do know that it becomes sinful
it’s importwnt to know the individual nature the sort of subjective nature of whether we know we are sinning or dont know we are sinning
Repentance and confession is for when we do know we have done a wrong that’s when repentance will become induced . Through our conscience and the sorrow sin brings a believer in Christ
“For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.”
2 Corinthians 7:10 KJV
If im sorry for my sin it’s going to prompt me to talk to the lord about it honestly and deal with it between he and I his way
if we confess our sins ( our role )
he is faithful and just to forgive( his role )
-
1
-
1
- Show all
Sin is only sin to us when we are aware of it , it isn’t imputed upon ignorance
“Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do. And they parted his raiment, and cast lots.”
Luke 23:34
v
“Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.”
James 4:17
my point is if I dont know I did something wrong I’ll never confess that I did something wrong , and God knows what I know by his spirit within me and judges me according to that rather than a written law but what rather I am aware of and conscious of
goes back to that term “willful sin “
if I dont know what I’m doing is sinful or if I’m not convicted yet by the lord , im never going to confess it as sin because I’m not aware . If I do know I’ve sinned , then confession is my answer to clear my conscience of whatever the sin was it’s the promise that comes with it that has the power
“If we confess our sins,
he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.”
1 John 1:9 KJV
if I believe this it’s going to be beautiful and a revelation , if I reject it and explain why it’s not like that ….it’s because I don’t believe it
“Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do. And they parted his raiment, and cast lots.”
Luke 23:34
v
“Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.”
James 4:17
my point is if I dont know I did something wrong I’ll never confess that I did something wrong , and God knows what I know by his spirit within me and judges me according to that rather than a written law but what rather I am aware of and conscious of
goes back to that term “willful sin “
if I dont know what I’m doing is sinful or if I’m not convicted yet by the lord , im never going to confess it as sin because I’m not aware . If I do know I’ve sinned , then confession is my answer to clear my conscience of whatever the sin was it’s the promise that comes with it that has the power
“If we confess our sins,
he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.”
1 John 1:9 KJV
if I believe this it’s going to be beautiful and a revelation , if I reject it and explain why it’s not like that ….it’s because I don’t believe it
-
2
- Show all
Amen also when Jesus taught mankind to pray he told us to always forgive anything we may have against others as well as the other parts of the doctrine regarding confessing
i think it just makes sense if I do a wrong to you and then after I can act like I never did anything wrong nd never mention it again or it’s going to hurt my heart because of what I did to my brother in Christ nd I’m. Ot going to be able to just act as if I didn’t do anything wrong I’m going to be led to come discuss things with you talk to you tell you what went wrong ect
if you think about “ forgivness of sin “ if I the sinner refuse to acknolwedge my sins to begin with , can I ever receive forgivness for my sins ? Someone could say to me “ I know you sinned and o forgive you “ but can I accept it if I won’t acknowledge the sin to begin with ?
lol is it the chicken or the egg I reckon 😂
i think it just makes sense if I do a wrong to you and then after I can act like I never did anything wrong nd never mention it again or it’s going to hurt my heart because of what I did to my brother in Christ nd I’m. Ot going to be able to just act as if I didn’t do anything wrong I’m going to be led to come discuss things with you talk to you tell you what went wrong ect
if you think about “ forgivness of sin “ if I the sinner refuse to acknolwedge my sins to begin with , can I ever receive forgivness for my sins ? Someone could say to me “ I know you sinned and o forgive you “ but can I accept it if I won’t acknowledge the sin to begin with ?
lol is it the chicken or the egg I reckon 😂
-
1
- Show all
Brother why would you resist change though ? You’re just explaining no one does that ….God is saying this to you the believer giving you this information that believe in him
First this is how we look at sin only you know your sins
“Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.”
James 4:17 KJV
now your telling me no one could ever confess the things tbey know they did that was sinful ?
It’s an instruction for you in Christ brother. To walk in the light of Christ and have fellowship with him . It’s not about what anyone else does or doesn’t do it’s the lord word trying to sink into our hearts that believe him look at it rather as the lord teaching you to be more than you used to be and not one of the crowd he’s telling us his ways who believe ….
First this is how we look at sin only you know your sins
“Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.”
James 4:17 KJV
now your telling me no one could ever confess the things tbey know they did that was sinful ?
It’s an instruction for you in Christ brother. To walk in the light of Christ and have fellowship with him . It’s not about what anyone else does or doesn’t do it’s the lord word trying to sink into our hearts that believe him look at it rather as the lord teaching you to be more than you used to be and not one of the crowd he’s telling us his ways who believe ….
It's not a question of regularly confessing sin. All true believers will do this. But no one actually confesses all their sins, because they aren't aware of all their sins. For example, suppose I make a flippant remark that hurts one of my children's feelings. Then suppose they cover my sin by simply saying within themselves that they forgive me and do not form any bitterness in their heart towards me. I remain unaware of my offense but indeed I have sinned and not confessed it. What happens as a result of my unconfessed sin?
-
1
- Show all
Before I lay my head down at night...I ask the Lord to cleanse me from the days filth , like when the Lord washed Peters feet , but had already told Peter that he was already clean...
I ask the Lord to forgive me from any unrightousness that I may have , in thought , word or deed...
I ask the Lord to forgive me from any unrightousness that I may have , in thought , word or deed...
-
1
-
1
- Show all
Jesu paid the debt for sin. All Past, present, and future sin that is what he was saying when we read in John 19:28-29
"It is finished" in Greek means a payment of a debt. Jesus was saying the debt is paid, or it is now completely paid forever.
No other payment is needed, and no more sacrifices can be offered. This is it; "it is finished."
"It is finished" in Greek means a payment of a debt. Jesus was saying the debt is paid, or it is now completely paid forever.
No other payment is needed, and no more sacrifices can be offered. This is it; "it is finished."
-
1
- Show all
I believe God's wrath was satiated at the cross. Whatever one believes concerning the extent of sins paid for, that's the only time in history when sins were paid for.
When God saves a person in space and time, as part of salvation He makes known to the individual what He has done for them in Christ.
When God saves a person in space and time, as part of salvation He makes known to the individual what He has done for them in Christ.
can you show me where in the bible it says Gods wrath was satisfied at the cross, ? Or is this one of your latest understandings your challenging, or do you truly believe what your saying 🤔 on your understanding is it through scriptures understandings, if you could, could you show me how your believing this, is this a latest understanding or have you always believed this
I recall Jesus pleasing with the father asking him to forgive them
But I don't recall that as meaning Gods wrath was satisfied.
I recall Jesus pleasing with the father asking him to forgive them
But I don't recall that as meaning Gods wrath was satisfied.