If a Sabbath is forced, Will you keep Sunday holy?

[bud62]

20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. [This shows that the Sabbath, was before Moses]
20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: [ The 4th commandmentssays remember the Sabbath,]
20:10 But the seventh day [is] the sabbath of the LORD thy God: [in it] thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that [is] within thy gates:
20:11 For [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them [is], and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. { this tells us how we are to treat and do on the Sabbath }
The BIBLE SAYS THAT Abraham keep GOD's Commandments, So GOD is saying that Abraham kept HIS HOLY Sabbath, about 400 years before Moses gives, this really proves that the commandments GO back to Creation, And I believe that GOD's Commandments GO much farther back then that, GOD did not have no beginning, AND GOD is very wise, And GOD not having HIS TEN COMMANDMENTS till JUST 6000 years ago DON'T make no since, HE has much more then JUST this earth AND ALL the Angels that haft to be governed. AND HE Would haft to have LAWS to do this, specially with the freewill angels, He would have knew that he needed laws,
The reason that he told Israel, To REMEMBER the Sabbath, is that HE knew that they had forgotten the Sabbath after they had been in Egypt for 430 years, so GOD said remember the Sabbath. And the first 4 commandments ARE LOVE FOR GOD, AND we worship GOD BY BEING OBEDIANT TO GOD'S WORD and OUR of the COVENANT to GOD, that is the Commandments, And BY obeying GOD'S COMMANDMENTS we are keeping our part of the NEW COVENANT, these are the LAWS that GOD writes on OUR HEARTS.

 

[shittim]

Concerning post #340- Also 2 of the gospels at least tell of why they were written "to tell who Jesus was", and after 2,000 we pretty much know who He was.
One post here mentioned the verse about "hardened hearts", I believe we are seeing some who have a wrong thought so imbedded they cannot get it corrected, "concrete thinking" is one description I have heard. JW's are very hard to speak with, they're error is so strong they are very difficult to reach.
best wishes

 

[Blik]

GALATIANS 5:4
KJ21
Christ then becomes of no effect unto you, whosoever of you claim justification by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

Who on here are you accusing of denying Christ?

 

[Blik]

Concerning post #340- Also 2 of the gospels at least tell of why they were written "to tell who Jesus was", and after 2,000 we pretty much know who He was.
One post here mentioned the verse about "hardened hearts", I believe we are seeing some who have a wrong thought so imbedded they cannot get it corrected, "concrete thinking" is one description I have heard. JW's are very hard to speak with, they're error is so strong they are very difficult to reach.
best wishes

Who are these people on this site who you accuse of this error? Are you absolutely sure you are not looking for the evil instead of looking for good in fellow Christians? That would not be love at all. Falsely accusing is wrong.

This is not a site for atheist who feel they don't need Christ.

 

[bud62]

20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. [This shows that the Sabbath, was before Moses]
20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: [ The 4th commandmentssays remember the Sabbath,]
20:10 But the seventh day [is] the sabbath of the LORD thy God: [in it] thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that [is] within thy gates:
20:11 For [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them [is], and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. { this tells us how we are to treat and do on the Sabbath }
The BIBLE SAYS THAT Abraham keep GOD's Commandments, So GOD is saying that Abraham kept HIS HOLY Sabbath, about 400 years before Moses gives, this really proves that the commandments GO back to Creation, And I believe that GOD's Commandments GO much farther back then that, GOD did not have no beginning, AND GOD is very wise, And GOD not having HIS TEN COMMANDMENTS till JUST 6000 years ago DON'T make no since, HE has much more then JUST this earth AND ALL the Angels that haft to be governed. AND HE Would haft to have LAWS to do this, specially with the freewill angels, He would have knew that he needed laws,
The reason that he told Israel, To REMEMBER the Sabbath, is that HE knew that they had forgotten the Sabbath after they had been in Egypt for 430 years, so GOD said remember the Sabbath. And the first 4 commandments ARE LOVE FOR GOD, AND we worship GOD BY BEING OBEDIANT TO GOD'S WORD and OUR of the COVENANT to GOD, that is the Commandments, And BY obeying GOD'S COMMANDMENTS we are keeping our part of the NEW COVENANT, these are the LAWS that GOD writes on OUR HEARTS.

31:13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it [is] a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that [ye] may know that I [am] the LORD that doth sanctify you.
[They say that the Sabbath is just for ISRAEL, JESUS SAYS that the Sabbath was MADE FOR MAN. GENTLES ARE MAN TO, And the Sabbath GO'S back to Abraham For GOD says that Abraham obeyed HIS commandments , And keeping the Sabbath is the 4th commandment, So to ME that is saying that GOD'S commandments go back to creation at less, BUT I think they GO MUCH farther back then THAT, Satan and his angels falling show us that GOD needed the commandments for them also,
So there is no telling how old GOD's commandments are, since GOD has NO beginning,]

31:14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it [is] holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth [any] work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people.
31:15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh [is] the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth [any] work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
31:16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, [for] a perpetual covenant.
31:17 It [is] a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.
31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.

They try to say that the commandments are for ISRAEL, Well to GOD All those that are gentiles and ARE SAVED are SPIRITUAL ISRAEL,
GALATIONS 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
So We are Abraham seed, So GOD is saying, IF WE ARE saved WE are SPIRITUAL ISRAEL, That would mean THAT the Sabbath GOD'S HOLY 7th DAY IS FOR US also,

 

[tourist]

You depend too much on the OT ! The old is obsolete, the NT is the only one that counts.

Saturday is not a time to worship but to party and have fun ...

Your position is in error according to this verse from the NT.
Timothy 3:16
“All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:”

The 4th commandment that is in regards to the Sabbath is the only one with the word "Remember". You are of course free to party on Saturday or any day of the week for that matter. Each day, regardless of which day, is the time to worship. You are wrong on this point as well. Sad.

 

[shittim]

If we choose to go back under the law, we must adhere to all the law, sacrifices, etc.

 

[tourist]

If we choose to go back under the law, we must adhere to all the law, sacrifices, etc.

Depends on exactly what the law is. I don't consider anything that Moses personally initiated to be the 'law' and would not advise anyone to try to live within it, especially each and every point. I don't see how the 10 commandments are obsolete. Of course, adherence to even the 10 commandments does not provide for salvation.

 

[Ahwatukee]

If the powers of this world ask us to observe a Sabbath for the common good (environment, health, social and religious reasons), will you keep Sunday holy and worship the pagan sun god, and man made traditions?

"One person regards a certain day above the others, while someone else considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. He who observes a special day does so to the Lord;"

I would add, he that considers every day alike, i.e. worships God on another day besides Sunday or every day, also does so to the Lord.

Did God not make every day? Just because one worships God on Sunday does not make him a pagan sun god worshiper. Isn't the Lord the One who searches the hearts and the minds? He knows if it is Him that you are worshiping or not.

 

[posthuman]

2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
1. 7th Day.is our Saturday That God Blessed and sanctified, Blessed is spiritual happiness and the favor of God.
1. sanctified = Made holy; consecrated; set apart for sacred services}
2.sanctified = Affectedly holy.

on what day did Genesis 3 take place?

 

[bud62]

LEV19:30 Ye shall keep my sabbaths, and reverence my sanctuary: I [am] the LORD.
LEV 23:3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day [is] the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work [therein]: it [is] the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.
sabbath of rest, = [ A Day that we sit all of our fleshly works and the things that we like todo Aside, AND Study And DO the GOD's work, A rest from our labor, to GOD's Work.
holy convocation
CONVOCATION, ==
1. The act of calling or assembling by summons. {This tells us it is the HOLY DAY that we should be coming together at the Sanctuary's}
2. An assembly.
NEH 9:12 Moreover thou leddest them in the day by a cloudy pillar; and in the night by a pillar of fire, to give them light in the way wherein they should go.
9:13 Thou camest down also upon mount Sinai, and spakest with them from heaven, and gavest them right judgments, and true laws, good statutes and commandments:
[This lets US know that GOD came down and give them true laws, good statutes and commandments: These are GOD'S laws that GOD give,]
9:14 And madest known unto them thy holy sabbath, and commandedst them precepts, statutes, and laws, by the hand of Moses thy servant: [This are the sacrificial laws the hand writings of Moses And lasted till JESUS came, And was nailed to the Cross ]
9:15 And gavest them bread from heaven for their hunger, and broughtest forth water for them out of the rock for their thirst, and promisedst them that they should go in to possess the land which thou hadst sworn to give them.
9:16 But they and our fathers dealt proudly, and hardened their necks, and hearkened not to thy commandments, [Sounds like a lot of what people are doing these days.]

 

[posthuman]

Depends on exactly what the law is.

that's exactly right

i don't see that the Bible treats "the law" -- all the commandments given with the covenant in Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy & Numbers -- as divisible. in fact i see that the Bible treats them explicitly as indivisible.

my position is that the whole idea of 'moral vs. civil vs. ceremonial' etc. and the idea that somehow the decalogue transcends Moses and is unaffected by the death of God Himself on a cross to free us is completely human-origin tradition supporting a works-based slavery to a carnal imitation of righteousness posing as salvation. i don't believe the Bible supports that at all.
i think that righteousness is independent of the law - including the 10 commandments. including the greater commandments, which aren't even part of the decalogue. i think that God tested and proved the Israelites to be a stubborn, ungrateful, disobedient and unbelieving people when He took them out of Egypt -- and gave them exactly the law that such a people deserve, in order to teach them both their need for Christ and what God, in the person of Christ, does to justify and save them. the law is humiliating and designed for lawbreakers. including the 10 commandments. if you have to be told, 'have no other god but YHWH,' then from square one you know you are not righteous. and when you are told, daily provide blood atonement from now to all of your generations, you know right away there isn't any hope that righteousness can come from the law. that's not what it's for. it's to make you fear God and look for His mercy.
the law isn't good news.

people say, oh post, are you saying it's OK to murder? no. i am saying that the righteous don't need a law to tell them that. and they don't need a law to tell them that God is the One who sanctifies ((see again Exodus 31:13, Ezekiel 20:12 )). and that is the gospel: that the Son of God became man and gave His life in order to provide for us a righteousness not of ourselves - a sanctification & justification not of ourselves - but of Himself. my position is that that righteousness is an eternal righteousness, and Christ is not righteous because He obeys some higher law He is enslaved to, but because He is I AM, the only law-giver. He said, "a new commandment" and the old passed away for those who hear Him. righteousness is righteousness. God doesn't change. but it doesn't have anything to do with being under the law - not even being under the 10 commandments or the actual basis of the law, the statutes in Deuteronomy 6 & Leviticus 19 ((no accident they aren't in Exodus 20)) - righteousness has to do with faith, with walking humbly before God, loving mercy & justice. whoever loves, fulfills the righteousness of the law, apart from the letter.

you & i have both been around here a long while -- you know i can support all of that from scripture. it'll take a lot of typing lol.
and you know too, our beloved brother @mailmandan probably already has posted or soon will post all the scripture necessary to arrive at those conclusions in a thread like this
((he's really good at that!!))

 

[bud62]

20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. [This shows that the Sabbath, was before Moses]
20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: [ The 4th commandmentssays remember the Sabbath,]
20:10 But the seventh day [is] the sabbath of the LORD thy God: [in it] thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that [is] within thy gates:
20:11 For [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them [is], and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. { this tells us how we are to treat and do on the Sabbath }
The BIBLE SAYS THAT Abraham keep GOD's Commandments, So GOD is saying that Abraham kept HIS HOLY Sabbath, about 400 years before Moses gives, this really proves that the commandments GO back to Creation, And I believe that GOD's Commandments GO much farther back then that, GOD did not have no beginning, AND GOD is very wise, And GOD not having HIS TEN COMMANDMENTS till JUST 6000 years ago DON'T make no since, HE has much more then JUST this earth AND ALL the Angels that haft to be governed. AND HE Would haft to have LAWS to do this, specially with the freewill angels, He would have knew that he needed laws,
The reason that he told Israel, To REMEMBER the Sabbath, is that HE knew that they had forgotten the Sabbath after they had been in Egypt for 430 years, so GOD said remember the Sabbath. And the first 4 commandments ARE LOVE FOR GOD, AND we worship GOD BY BEING OBEDIANT TO GOD'S WORD and OUR of the COVENANT to GOD, that is the Commandments, And BY obeying GOD'S COMMANDMENTS we are keeping our part of the NEW COVENANT, these are the LAWS that GOD writes on OUR HEARTS.

13:15 In those days saw I in Judah [some] treading wine presses on the sabbath, and bringing in sheaves, and lading asses; as also wine, grapes, and figs, and all [manner of] burdens, which they brought into Jerusalem on the sabbath day: and I testified [against them] in the day wherein they sold victuals.
13:16 There dwelt men of Tyre also therein, which brought fish, and all manner of ware, and sold on the sabbath unto the children of Judah, and in Jerusalem.
13:17 Then I contended with the nobles of Judah, and said unto them, What evil thing [is] this that ye do, and profane the sabbath day?
13:18 Did not your fathers thus, and did not our God bring all this evil upon us, and upon this city? yet ye bring more wrath upon Israel by profaning the sabbath.
13:19 And it came to pass, that when the gates of Jerusalem began to be dark before the sabbath, I commanded that the gates should be shut, and charged that they should not be opened till after the sabbath: and [some] of my servants set I at the gates, [that] there should no burden be brought in on the sabbath day.
13:20 So the merchants and sellers of all kind of ware lodged without Jerusalem once or twice.
13:21 Then I testified against them, and said unto them, Why lodge ye about the wall? if ye do [so] again, I will lay hands on you. From that time forth came they no [more] on the sabbath.
13:22 And I commanded the Levites that they should cleanse themselves, and [that] they should come [and] keep the gates, to sanctify the sabbath day. Remember me, O my God, [concerning] this also, and spare me according to the greatness of thy mercy.
[This lets us know some of the things that we can't do and things we should do ON the Sabbath]

 

[bud62]

13:15 In those days saw I in Judah [some] treading wine presses on the sabbath, and bringing in sheaves, and lading asses; as also wine, grapes, and figs, and all [manner of] burdens, which
Isaiah 56:1 Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation [is] near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.
56:2 Blessed [is] the man [that] doeth this, and the son of man [that] layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.
[This says MAN, And means any MAN THAT will keep it, and keep it HOLY] [and keepeth his hand from doing any evil]
56:3 Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I [am] a dry tree.
56:4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose [the things] that please me, and take hold of my covenant;
56:5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.
56:6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
56:7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices [shall be] accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.
56:8 The Lord GOD which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, Yet will I gather [others] to him, beside those that are gathered unto him.
STRANGER, n.
1. A foreigner; one who belongs to another country. Paris and London are visited by strangers from all the countries of Europe.
2. One of another town, city, state or province in the same country. [ NOT ISRAEL but Gentiles]
every one that keepeth the sabbath This is saying more then just ISRAEL

 

[bud62]

13:15 In those days saw I in Judah [some] treading wine presses on the sabbath, and bringing in sheaves, and lading asses; as also wine, grapes, and figs, and all [manner of] burdens, which they brought into Jerusalem on the sabbath day: and I testified [against them] in the day wherein they sold victuals.
JER 13:16 There dwelt men of Tyre also therein, which brought fish, and all manner of ware, and sold on the sabbath unto the children of Judah, and in Jerusalem.
13:17 Then I contended with the nobles of Judah, and said unto them, What evil thing [is] this that ye do, and profane the sabbath day?
13:18 Did not your fathers thus, and did not our God bring all this evil upon us, and upon this city? yet ye bring more wrath upon Israel by profaning the sabbath.
13:19 And it came to pass, that when the gates of Jerusalem began to be dark before the sabbath, I commanded that the gates should be shut, and charged that they should not be opened till after the sabbath: and [some] of my servants set I at the gates, [that] there should no burden be brought in on the sabbath day.
13:20 So the merchants and sellers of all kind of ware lodged without Jerusalem once or twice.
13:21 Then I testified against them, and said unto them, Why lodge ye about the wall? if ye do [so] again, I will lay hands on you. From that time forth came they no [more] on the sabbath.
13:22 And I commanded the Levites that they should cleanse themselves, and [that] they should come [and] keep the gates, to sanctify the sabbath day. Remember me, O my God, [concerning] this also, and spare me according to the greatness of thy mercy.
[This lets us know some of the things that we can't do and things we should do ON the Sabbath]

 

[bud62]

13:15 In those days saw I in Judah [some] treading wine presses on the sabbath, and bringing in sheaves, and lading asses; as also wine, grapes, and figs, and all [manner of] burdens, which they brought into Jerusalem on the sabbath day: and I testified [against them] in the day wherein they sold victuals.
JER 13:16 There dwelt men of Tyre also therein, which brought fish, and all manner of ware, and sold on the sabbath unto the children of Judah, and in Jerusalem.
13:17 Then I contended with the nobles of Judah, and said unto them, What evil thing [is] this that ye do, and profane the sabbath day?
13:18 Did not your fathers thus, and did not our God bring all this evil upon us, and upon this city? yet ye bring more wrath upon Israel by profaning the sabbath.
13:19 And it came to pass, that when the gates of Jerusalem began to be dark before the sabbath, I commanded that the gates should be shut, and charged that they should not be opened till after the sabbath: and [some] of my servants set I at the gates, [that] there should no burden be brought in on the sabbath day.
13:20 So the merchants and sellers of all kind of ware lodged without Jerusalem once or twice.
13:21 Then I testified against them, and said unto them, Why lodge ye about the wall? if ye do [so] again, I will lay hands on you. From that time forth came they no [more] on the sabbath.
13:22 And I commanded the Levites that they should cleanse themselves, and [that] they should come [and] keep the gates, to sanctify the sabbath day. Remember me, O my God, [concerning] this also, and spare me according to the greatness of thy mercy.
[This lets us know some of the things that we can't do and things we should do ON the Sabbath]

 

[Benadam]

i could say the same thing about observing the feast of Passover.
so are the feasts 'moral' commandments?

Everything they did to worship pointed at the Incarnation so worship before the Incarnation has to be seen as unnecessary because their purpose was fulfilled. No need to point anymore. Their true object is found. Now we worship the real thing.

 

[Papou]

Your position is in error according to this verse from the NT.
Timothy 3:16
“All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:”

The 4th commandment that is in regards to the Sabbath is the only one with the word "Remember". You are of course free to party on Saturday or any day of the week for that matter. Each day, regardless of which day, is the time to worship. You are wrong on this point as well. Sad.

I wouldn't say the first position is in error. First as Shittim mentioned, you do not want to go back to be under the OT law. Secondly, it is expected that Paul would say that since he was a fervent Jew. Anyways, my point is that you do not need the OT anymore. The reason being that all commandments that really matter to any Christians are included in the NT. For example,: A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you. And also: There is no greater love than to lay down one’s life for one’s friends. And so.on.. Then no need to look at the OT because the NT has much better commandments and they come directly from Christ.

 

[iamsoandso]

The Commandments is the Laws that HE write On OUR hearts And our part of the COVENANT, and to break them is sin and breaking your Covenant with GOD,
Hebrews 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Have you been SDA for some time or is it something you recently became?

 

[Benadam]

Do you actually think that all these posts opposing the idea that God blessed the last day of the week is not ridiculing anyone who thinks that?

I think everybody thinks that God blessed the last day of the week. I think there is a reason He blessed it. Do you? Just wondering.