If the saved that is dead is in heaven ,With GOD ,Why dose the BIBLE say that the dead can not PRAISE the LORD .

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
14,644
6,897
113
#82
I do not believe that they are in Heaven myself ,Neither do I believe that the BIBLE teaches , that they are in Heaven ,
Then you are of all men most miserable: If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable. (1 Cor 15:19)
 

Absolutely

Well-known member
Jul 23, 2018
8,449
2,268
113
#83
It's important to define these terms. Here's an article that you may find helpful with the word eternal: That word "Everlasting" or "Eternal."

https://focusonthekingdom.org/37.pdf?x48648
What organizations believe like you?

If you are being stealthy,that is hiding friend.
Post a link to the religious entities that believe your doctrine.
I already showed one,watchtower.
Show me another group/ entity/ organization.

Should be so easy.
 

Absolutely

Well-known member
Jul 23, 2018
8,449
2,268
113
#84
Then you are of all men most miserable: If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable. (1 Cor 15:19)
I think he is saying the lost have no soul or spirit.
They are destroyed or vaporized. (Die)

They are probably watchtower since they hide their affiliation.
 

EternalFire

Well-known member
Jan 3, 2019
449
253
63
#86
What organizations believe like you?

If you are being stealthy,that is hiding friend.
Post a link to the religious entities that believe your doctrine.
I already showed one,watchtower.
Show me another group/ entity/ organization.

Should be so easy.
Reference some of the groups listed here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_mortalism

This video will also help you understand the topic more.
 
Jan 4, 2020
1,506
264
83
63
washburn Tn
#87
It's important to define these terms. Here's an article that you may find helpful with the word eternal: That word "Everlasting" or "Eternal."

https://focusonthekingdom.org/37.pdf?x48648[/QUOl
definitely NOT,
Malachi 4:1 For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.
4:2 But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall.
4:3 And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do [this], saith the LORD of hosts.
ISAIAH 47:14 Behold, they shall be as stubble; the fire shall burn them; they shall not deliver themselves from the power of the flame: [there shall] not [be] a coal to warm at, [nor] fire to sit before it. it tells us here that when they are ashes that there will not even be a fire to warm at, GOD DOSE NOT LIE
 

Absolutely

Well-known member
Jul 23, 2018
8,449
2,268
113
#89
Hiding.
Will not reveal their affiliation.
Not of God
 

Corlove13

New member
Oct 7, 2020
11
1
3
#90
Paul states clearly that if we are absent from the body, we are present with the Lord.

2 Corinthians 5
6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:)
8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
Does it say when you are Absent you are immediately present?
 

Robo36

Active member
Nov 27, 2019
186
57
28
#91
Well then count yourself among the men who are MOST MISERABLE.

As to your title question, the dead could not praise God while they were in Sheol/Hades before the resurrection of Christ. But all the Old Testament saints are indeed now IN HEAVEN, praising and worshiping God.

Obviously you have been influenced by your denomination, but the Bible is freely available to all. So why not put aside your preconceived notions and do a thorough study of the subject of the afterlife as revealed in BOTH the Old and New Testaments?
And Jesus said, “And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.” John 3:13
 

Robo36

Active member
Nov 27, 2019
186
57
28
#92
It is true our spirit returns tot he Lord, but when? We are taught this in th ewritings of the resurrection....remember, there must be a resurrection....
Good question, "but when?" Excellent observation.
 

Robo36

Active member
Nov 27, 2019
186
57
28
#93
Mark 9:2-4 (ESV)
And after six days Jesus took with him Peter and James and John, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. And he was transfigured before them, and his clothes became radiant, intensely white, as no one on earth could bleach them. And there appeared to them Elijah and Moses, and they were talking with Jesus.

Luke 20:37-38 (ESV)
But that the dead are raised, even Moses showed, in the passage about the bush where he calls the Lord the God of Abraham and the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob. Now he is not God of the dead, but of the living, for all live to him."
Could you please present the biblical verses that say Elijah and Moses actually went to "heaven?"
 

Robo36

Active member
Nov 27, 2019
186
57
28
#94
Why did paul say that he was going to sleep then, Paul was after JESUS
You keep posting "common sense." Why would Jesus need to open the graves when he returns if the dead were already in heaven?
 

Robo36

Active member
Nov 27, 2019
186
57
28
#95
"Sleep" is just a metaphor for death, since when the body is placed in the grave, it gives the appearance of sleep. But the soul and spirit are very much awake and alive with Christ in Heaven. Only the body turns to dust.
Then why does Jesus need to open the graves when he returns if the dead are already in heaven?
 

Robo36

Active member
Nov 27, 2019
186
57
28
#96
JESUS tells us here that the save and the lost is in the GRAVES
11:23 Jesus saith unto her, Thy brother shall rise again.
11:24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.
They are going to rise out of the GROUND, they do no come down from HAVEN
Right on!
 

Robo36

Active member
Nov 27, 2019
186
57
28
#97
Here let me help. Are our loved ones already with Christ? If they have to be resurrected at His coming—they must not be. I believe our lost loved ones are asleep; they have no awareness of time.

Ecclesiastes 9:5,6: “For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.”

Psalms 6:5: “For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks?”

Psalms 30:9: “What profit is there in my blood, when I go down to the pit? Shall the dust praise thee? shall it declare thy truth?”

Psalms 115:17: “The dead praise not the LORD, neither any that go down into silence.”

Isaiah 38:18: “For the grave cannot praise thee, death can not celebrate thee: they that go down into the pit cannot hope for thy truth.”

Psalms 88:10-12: “Wilt thou shew wonders to the dead? shall the dead arise and praise thee? Selah. Shall thy lovingkindness be declared in the grave? or thy faithfulness in destruction? Shall thy wonders be known in the dark? and thy righteousness in the land of forgetfulness?

Psalms 115:17: “The dead praise not the LORD, neither any that go down into silence.”

Job 14:12-17 “So man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens be no more, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep. O that thou wouldest hide me in the grave, that thou wouldest keep me secret, until thy wrath be past, that thou wouldest appoint me a set time, and remember me! If a man die, shall he live again? all the days of my appointed time will I wait, till my change come. Thou shalt call, and I will answer thee: thou wilt have a desire to the work of thine hands. For now thou numberest my steps: dost thou not watch over my sin? My transgression is sealed up in a bag, and thou sewest up mine iniquity.
Your evidence is beyond repute!
 
K

Karraster

Guest
#98
I do not believe that they are in Heaven myself ,Neither do I believe that the BIBLE teaches , that they are in Heaven ,
I believe you are correct. This is an age old argument as Paul himself used to his advantage.

Now when Paul perceived that one part were Sadducees and the other Pharisees, he cried out in the council, “Brothers, I am a Pharisee, a son of Pharisees. It is with respect to the hope and the resurrection of the dead that I am on trial.” 7And when he had said this, a dissension arose between the Pharisees and the Sadducees, and the assembly was divided. 8For the Sadducees say that there is no resurrection, nor angel, nor spirit, but the Pharisees acknowledge them all.

...furthermore

The following night the Lord stood by him and said, “Take courage, for as you have testified to the facts about me in Jerusalem, so you must testify also in Rome.”

The evidence is overwhelming, it is appointed man to die once then the resurrection, unto everlasting life or the second death.
For those who take the utmost interest in these things, I am not affiliated with any institutionalized 501c3 religions nor do I intend to be.
 

Absolutely

Well-known member
Jul 23, 2018
8,449
2,268
113
#99
I believe you are correct. This is an age old argument as Paul himself used to his advantage.

Now when Paul perceived that one part were Sadducees and the other Pharisees, he cried out in the council, “Brothers, I am a Pharisee, a son of Pharisees. It is with respect to the hope and the resurrection of the dead that I am on trial.” 7And when he had said this, a dissension arose between the Pharisees and the Sadducees, and the assembly was divided. 8For the Sadducees say that there is no resurrection, nor angel, nor spirit, but the Pharisees acknowledge them all.

...furthermore

The following night the Lord stood by him and said, “Take courage, for as you have testified to the facts about me in Jerusalem, so you must testify also in Rome.”

The evidence is overwhelming, it is appointed man to die once then the resurrection, unto everlasting life or the second death.
For those who take the utmost interest in these things, I am not affiliated with any institutionalized 501c3 religions nor do I intend to be.
The ones before the throne are in heaven (Rev 6 or so) That is BEFORE THE resurrection after the mil.

Stop acting like there is nothing there.
..and the comma changed to make Jesus words on the cross mean the opposite is appalling,

We can see why the warning is there against changing the bible.