Is God A Moral Monster?

[Roughsoul1991]

Blimey! I was beginning to feel very alone on this thread.....and here you come, not defending a monster God. Very Marcionite by the way.

If you begin feeling alone on a theological subject you may need to reexamine your thoughts on that subject.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

One things for sure, any "angry atheist" who starts attacking a believer hasn't a leg to stand on when you ask them if they have actually read the Bible? In fact, I always ask when they read the book, so they have to deny they have. They have no idea what is in it, cannot even talk about the characters in it, and when I ask them how can they give an opinion on a book they haven't even picked up, they stare blankly. And yes, the thread isn't about Richard Dawkins, but he has caused by his book more anger and anti-Christ people to believe him by reading his book and not Gods. Yet now "Intelligent Design" is the way forward, he is quite happy to believe in "Ancient Aliens". Anyone without a face. Anyone that doesn't judge or hold him accountable so Ancient Aliens will do. Anything but God you could say as far as he is concerned.

I heard Richard Dawkins interviewed once, he was asked if he ever did believe in God once. He said when he was a little kid, in South Africa or something, he was lonely so he prayed to God that the animals would talk to him and it "didn't work". Get over it RD. God willing, maybe one day a Donkey might come and have a chat with you.

I enjoy Intelligent design science. I just know who the intelligence is.

 

[Heyjude]

If you begin feeling alone on a theological subject you may need to reexamine your thoughts on that subject.

Not necessarily. Jesus was standing alone when his thoughts and deeds were questioned. Just because you are the only one in the room thinking one way, doesn't mean you are wrong. Just sayin...

 

[Heyjude]

I didn't know we could pick and choose what is true in the Bible? OT acts was either God commanded or acts of disobedience. Very clear was God's commands to Joshua.

Moses disobeyed God plenty of times, probably to show that men are not perfect only God is perfect in his ways. Moses killed and buried a man in the sand, struck the rock when he was told not to etc and made mistakes so much so that he never got to enter the Promised Land. Quite a big deal after leading everyone through the wilderness so long. I think the whole of Scripture is to learn the difference between Good and Evil and which "WHO" says what. Otherwise, which one of Jobs so called "friends" do you believe? You cant believe them all. And oh yes, Solomon was right. Much study makes you weary but it takes much much much study. Yes I said that three times.

 

[PS]

There is only ONE God:

The One Who created the heavens and the earth;
The One Who called Abram out of Haran;
The One Who destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah;
The One Who spoke to Moses from the burning bush;
The One Who led Israel through the Red Sea;
The One Who gave the Law through Moses;
The One Who commanded the annihilation of sinful Canaanites;
The One Who raised up judges, prophets, kings and priests;
The One Who rebuked David for his adultery and murder;
The One Who told Hosea to marry a harlot;
The One Who appeared to Isaiah;
The One Who spoke and fulfilled prophecy repeatedly;
The One Who came in the flesh;
The One Who healed the sick and raised the dead;
The One Who was crucified on a Roman cross;
The One Who rose again to life;
The One Who will judge the living and the dead at at the end.

One King. One Judge. One God.

ONE GOD, lots of false gods.

 

[PS]

God's judgment is just. God chose this judgment and commanded his people to carry it out. To believe anything else goes against the scripture and you have no evidence to prove otherwise. The Lord Almighty says is quite clear.

So what do you make of this verse?

1 Samuel 15:2-3

2 This is what the Lord Almighty says: ‘I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt.
3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them

God did not destroy them, it was Saul. God said HE would do it. God uses His creation which is nature as in the Red Sea when he destroyed the Egyptian army.

 

[PS]

Your motives are are not accurate. Cherry picking scriptures just because you do not like events in the old is the wrong approach. Finding a theological answer to those verses are way more wise than telling people the Bible isn't 100% accurate.

If the Bible isnt 100% accurate then you are just choosing what you want to believe.

I am giving example the same as you. Yes moses and others did do horrible things, Not God. The Bible is true. It tells of mans wickedness.

 

[PS]

Where are your sources? This is some far left field stuff.

From Jewish sources.

 

[calibob]

I didn't know we could pick and choose what is true in the Bible? OT acts was either God commanded or acts of disobedience. Very clear was God's commands to Joshua.

Your motives are are not accurate. Cherry picking scriptures just because you do not like events in the old is the wrong approach. Finding a theological answer to those verses are way more wise than telling people the Bible isn't 100% accurate.

If the Bible isnt 100% accurate then you are just choosing what you want to believe.

@Roughsoul1991 The following is not directed at you but rather piggybacking on some thing and adding some thoughts; Context is everything and although I do believe there are errors in translation. (That's not Gods fault.) Amoung so many slightly different translations my study partner and I read from two translations and compare them paragraph by paragraph one chapter at a time. We also take notice of the same plot (for lack of a better term,) repeating itself over and over.

In the OT family members often married each other, men had concubines and fornicated with prostitutes and their women committed adultery. The majority of the non Hebrew or Israelites were quite hedonistic and practiced, Idolatry, divination and their human leaders demanded to be worshiped as Gods. While Gods people fell away and disobeyed him and his precepts. They picked up influences of other foreign and local cultures. So God allowed them to be taken hostage over and over, repented over and over the repeat the same stupid mistakes again. They were fortunate he didn't cause another flood. Does he expect to be respected like our father, worshiped like our God, Obeyed like our master (lord) and loved like our mother, brother and children through it all? Yes do we have a choice yes it's called Hell! Lucky for us we have a mediator that paid our bail. He's Jesus. If we accept his payment in blood, we become his. It's not rocket science, it's better and easier. In the beginning God said let there be light and there was light... I'd bet it made a loud Bang too. At the end he said "Yes, I am comming soon." It's not debatable. he is God. We are not.

 

[PS]

Why believe the first and not the later events? Where is your evidence that after the Red sea the God who spoke was a corrupted Version by Moses?

God uses nature, man uses his own strength. If Moses had been obedient, God would have led them into the promised land in 40 weeks, not 40 years.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

Not necessarily. Jesus was standing alone when his thoughts and deeds were questioned. Just because you are the only one in the room thinking one way, doesn't mean you are wrong. Just sayin...

On core beliefs these are what separates Christianity from Christian cults. And Jesus wasn't alone but had a remnant of sheep, many prepared by John the Baptist and then all the disciples that stuck with him.

 

[PS]

On the contrary; https://overviewbible.com/authors-who-wrote-bible/

Did I say the Bible. I was talking about the books of Moses. Sorry if I said the Bible.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

God did not destroy them, it was Saul. God said HE would do it. God uses His creation which is nature as in the Red Sea when he destroyed the Egyptian army.

It literally says now go attack...

 

[Roughsoul1991]

I am giving example the same as you. Yes moses and others did do horrible things, Not God. The Bible is true. It tells of mans wickedness.

Yes I agree but you are still denying the clear parts that God commanded

 

[Roughsoul1991]

God uses nature, man uses his own strength. If Moses had been obedient, God would have led them into the promised land in 40 weeks, not 40 years.

Yes agreed but again I am speaking on behalf of the OP scriptures. Not all of the events related to Moses, Joshua, Saul etc.

 

[Roughsoul1991]

From Jewish sources.

What sources

 

[PS]

God dealt differently with people after Jesus came, the new testament is different from the old one. Yet he is the same God.

God is unchanging, He is personified in Jesus Christ. Can you see Jesus murdering people?

 

[Roughsoul1991]

Moses disobeyed God plenty of times, probably to show that men are not perfect only God is perfect in his ways. Moses killed and buried a man in the sand, struck the rock when he was told not to etc and made mistakes so much so that he never got to enter the Promised Land. Quite a big deal after leading everyone through the wilderness so long. I think the whole of Scripture is to learn the difference between Good and Evil and which "WHO" says what. Otherwise, which one of Jobs so called "friends" do you believe? You cant believe them all. And oh yes, Solomon was right. Much study makes you weary but it takes much much much study. Yes I said that three times.

Agreed where I am speaking on is the clear God commanded judgments or Mosaic law. The OP scriptures. We have either God commanded actions or rebellious actions. The reader has to determine which.

 

[PS]

It literally says now go attack...

Which president was it who said God told him to go into Iraq?

 

[Roughsoul1991]

@Roughsoul1991 The following is not directed at you but rather piggybacking on some thing and adding some thoughts; Context is everything and although I do believe there are errors in translation. (That's not Gods fault.) Amoung so many slightly different translations my study partner and I read from two translations and compare them paragraph by paragraph one chapter at a time. We also take notice of the same plot (for lack of a better term,) repeating itself over and over.

In the OT family members often married each other, men had concubines and fornicated with prostitutes and their women committed adultery. The majority of the non Hebrew or Israelites were quite hedonistic and practiced, Idolatry, divination and their human leaders demanded to be worshiped as Gods. While Gods people fell away and disobeyed him and his precepts. They picked up influences of other foreign and local cultures. So God allowed them to be taken hostage over and over, repented over and over the repeat the same stupid mistakes again. They were fortunate he didn't cause another flood. Does he expect to be respected like our father, worshiped like our God, Obeyed like our master (lord) and loved like our mother, brother and children through it all? Yes do we have a choice yes it's called Hell! Lucky for us we have a mediator that paid our bail. He's Jesus. If we accept his payment in blood, we become his. It's not rocket science, it's better and easier. In the beginning God said let there be light and there was light... I'd bet it made a loud Bang too. At the end he said "Yes, I am comming soon." It's not debatable. he is God. We are not.

Yes very true. It takes good study to know God's original will, his commands, his actions, and which events or actions was of mans rebellion. That is what I love about God and the Bible. It records the good, the bad, and the ugly.