Is the Hebrew Roots Movement a cult?

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john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
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That word sabbatismos that is translated keeping of a sabbath could refer to a weekly sabbath, a 7-year land sabbath, or a festival sabbath depending on the context.

The context of Hebrews 4 is not a weekly sabbath, nor a 7-year land sabbath, but the sabbath rest of the promised land, Israel, which many could not enter into because of unbelief. That example serves as a shadow of the reality of the keeping of the sabbath of the fulfilled day of atonement (a festival sabbath) when those who do believe enter into GOD's final and permanent rest.
It probably means space shuttle by your twisted logic.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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Can't read? Third and final time...


Heb 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
Heb 8:9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
Heb 8:11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.


Quoting from Jer 31:31-34...

Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
Jer 31:32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:
Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

where the word for Law is...

H8451
תּרה תּורה
tôrâh tôrâh
to-raw', to-raw'
From H3384; a precept or statute, especially the Decalogue or Pentateuch: - law.

The problem is the passage in Hebrews that says directly that the New Covenant is the writing of the Law in our hearts and minds. This is not what you WANTED it to be.
LOL! huh?

the Moral precepts of the Law do not change.


the types and shadows are fulfilled in Christ.


did you receive the Spirit by works of the Law or by HEARING BY FAITH?


you're so far from the Gospel, i can't do a thing for you.


find ONE SINGLE instruction on sabbath keeping in the New COVENANT.

one....anywhere.

post it.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
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amen. the feast of unleavened bread was replace by the lords supper. We remember the cross where our sins are passed over as we are freed from slaver. Not the passover, where israel was free from Egypt (the symbol)
And this is why Paul wrote this to a Gentile church...

1Co 5:6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?
1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
1Co 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
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amen. the feast of unleavened bread was replace by the lords supper. We remember the cross where our sins are passed over as we are freed from slaver. Not the passover, where israel was free from Egypt (the symbol)
I hesitate to say this, especially in this particular thread, but it is beautiful when you can see the shadow for what it is.

After the Lord has opened our eyes to Him we can see that all the feasts, the ceremony, the sacrifices, the laws, ordinances and statutes point to Him and what He (will do for them) has done for us. The Lord Jesus Christ has fulfilled ALL of it.

The feast of unleavened bread. The manna which has come down from heaven, unleavened by works of the religious, has been freely given to us in the form of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ and is taught again by the Lord in the Lords Supper. He is the Bread of Life.

The Passover. Where Gods People are saved from the angel of Death. The blood of the lamb was applied to sides of the doorposts and to the top and bottom of the door frame.

That blood was in the same spots on the Cross of the Lord Jesus Christ. The sides of the cross where His Hands were nailed. The bottom of the cross where His Feet were nailed. And the top of the cross where He was wearing the crown of thorns.

Almost as if the angel of Death were seeing the Lord Jesus Christ on the cross superimposed on those doors during Passover...

Passover was a picture of what being saved from death and given Life was going to look like in the Spirit. It wasn't going to come because of religion, or works. It was going to come by the Blood of the Lamb.

Freed from slavery. Boy you said it. The hebrews were freed from slavery but they still had the slavery mindset. Some Christians are freed from slavery too, but some still have the slavery mindset.

Would you say this slavery mindset could be called a yoke of bondage? Do you think it could be seen as a Heavy Burden and cause people to become weary?
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
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And this is why Paul wrote this to a Gentile church...

1Co 5:6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?
1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
1Co 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
soooo....do you only obey this commandment (instruction) during the the Feast of Unleavened Bread?

what is the REAL important of that? HIS RESURRECTION.


the meaning of the Feast of Unleavened Bread is that the resurrected Jesus Christ lives in each one of us.

1 Corinthians 15:17
If Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins!

Galatians 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me"

Our Crucified and risen Savior is our power to remove the leaven of sin from our lives

Paul is talking about no longer sinning...not searching for packets of yeast.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
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soooo....do you only obey this commandment (instruction) during the the Feast of Unleavened Bread?

what is the REAL important of that? HIS RESURRECTION.


the meaning of the Feast of Unleavened Bread is that the resurrected Jesus Christ lives in each one of us.

1 Corinthians 15:17
If Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins!

Galatians 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me"

Our Crucified and risen Savior is our power to remove the leaven of sin from our lives

Paul is talking about no longer sinning...not searching for packets of yeast.
The meaning of the Feast of Unleavened Bread is that Christ can put sin out of our lives. The leavened bread is a type of sin and the unleavened bread is the type of what Christ can do for us.

Leviticus 23 states very plainly the Feasts of God, now show me Christmas and Easter in the Bible.

Here's a hint...

Jer 10:2 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them.
Jer 10:3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.
Jer 10:4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.
Jer 10:5 They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil, neither also is it in them to do good.

and Easter sunrise services...

Eze 8:15 Then said he unto me, Hast thou seen this, O son of man? turn thee yet again, and thou shalt see greater abominations than these.
Eze 8:16 And he brought me into the inner court of the LORD'S house, and, behold, at the door of the temple of the LORD, between the porch and the altar, were about five and twenty men, with their backs toward the temple of the LORD, and their faces toward the east; and they worshipped the sun toward the east.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
The meaning of the Feast of Unleavened Bread is that Christ can put sin out of our lives. The leavened bread is a type of sin and the unleavened bread is the type of what Christ can do for us.

Leviticus 23 states very plainly the Feasts of God, now show me Christmas and Easter in the Bible.

Here's a hint...

Jer 10:2 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them.
Jer 10:3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.
Jer 10:4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.
Jer 10:5 They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil, neither also is it in them to do good.

and Easter sunrise services...

Eze 8:15 Then said he unto me, Hast thou seen this, O son of man? turn thee yet again, and thou shalt see greater abominations than these.
Eze 8:16 And he brought me into the inner court of the LORD'S house, and, behold, at the door of the temple of the LORD, between the porch and the altar, were about five and twenty men, with their backs toward the temple of the LORD, and their faces toward the east; and they worshipped the sun toward the east.
i'm not wasting time on your HR easter/christian days etc is pagan mythology.
do what you wish.

Judaism will send you to hell if that's where you're headed.
 
Dec 26, 2012
5,853
137
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The meaning of the Feast of Unleavened Bread is that Christ can put sin out of our lives. The leavened bread is a type of sin and the unleavened bread is the type of what Christ can do for us.

Leviticus 23 states very plainly the Feasts of God, now show me Christmas and Easter in the Bible.

Here's a hint...

Jer 10:2 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them.
Jer 10:3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.
Jer 10:4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.
Jer 10:5 They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil, neither also is it in them to do good.

and Easter sunrise services...

Eze 8:15 Then said he unto me, Hast thou seen this, O son of man? turn thee yet again, and thou shalt see greater abominations than these.
Eze 8:16 And he brought me into the inner court of the LORD'S house, and, behold, at the door of the temple of the LORD, between the porch and the altar, were about five and twenty men, with their backs toward the temple of the LORD, and their faces toward the east; and they worshipped the sun toward the east.
Got to love it. Nothing like taking scripture out of context. :mad:
 
Sep 4, 2012
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That word sabbatismos that is translated keeping of a sabbath could refer to a weekly sabbath, a 7-year land sabbath, or a festival sabbath depending on the context.

The context of Hebrews 4 is not a weekly sabbath, nor a 7-year land sabbath, but the sabbath rest of the promised land, Israel, which many could not enter into because of unbelief. That example serves as a shadow of the reality of the keeping of the sabbath of the fulfilled day of atonement (a festival sabbath) when those who do believe enter into GOD's final and permanent rest.
That the writer of Hebrews was referring in chapter 4 to the keeping of the sabbath of the fulfilled day of atonement, that yet remained for the people of GOD, is further evidenced by these facts.

The children of Israel were originally to enter into their rest in the promised land during the time of first ripe grapes, which was in fall of the year when the day of atonement occurred.

And Moses sent them to spy out the land of Canaan ... Now the time was the time of the first ripe grapes. Numbers 13:17-20


In other words their entering into their rest corresponded with the day of atonement.

However, they did not enter in because of unbelief, and wandered in the desert for 40 years. Afterwards they entered into the promised land near the time of Passover.

This change from day of atonement to Passover signifies the postponement of the people of GOD's final rest until Christ, our Passover, could accomplish and establish the more excellent way that would allow GOD's people to forever enter into their final rest on the fulfilled day of atonement.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
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i'm not wasting time on your HR easter/christian days etc is pagan mythology.
do what you wish.

Judaism will send you to hell if that's where you're headed.
Hmmm, now I am espousing Judaism? Where did that come from?
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
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Got to love it. Nothing like taking scripture out of context. :mad:
Perhaps you can explain how decorating an Xmas tree is scriptural? Maybe you can point out a few scriptures that command us to do that.

And going to church on Ishtar morning at daybreak and facing the rising sum in the East is scriptural? And don't tell me that people don't do that, I came out of the Methodist church.
 
Dec 26, 2012
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Perhaps you can explain how decorating an Xmas tree is scriptural? Maybe you can point out a few scriptures that command us to do that.

And going to church on Ishtar morning at daybreak and facing the rising sum in the East is scriptural? And don't tell me that people don't do that, I came out of the Methodist church.

What has that to do with taking scripture out of context? Which is what you did.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
Uh excuse me, I see a man who admitted he broke the Sabbath, then was able to repent and QUIT breaking the Sabbath, whereas you encourage people to break the Sabbath.

Hmmm, and where is the hypocracy?
lol, you did not read a thing he said! you missed the whole picture he was trying to make completely!

and I agreed with him 100 % and you screamed at me.. thus you screamed at him (well no you did not)

thus YES YOU ARE A HYPOCRITE
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
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What has that to do with taking scripture out of context? Which is what you did.
I'm asking you to show me how I took these scriptures out of context. show me the correct explanation of these scriptures and how it is just fine and dandy to put an Xmas tree in your house and worship God by facing East at the rising of the sun. Show me the scriptures.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
And this is why Paul wrote this to a Gentile church...

1Co 5:6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?
1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
1Co 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
Paul is talking about sin and false doctrines here. NOT the feast of unleavened bread. man the more you talk.. well.. wow. just wow!!!!

so you remember the passover?? WHY??

I remember my saviors death..
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
Would you say this slavery mindset could be called a yoke of bondage? Do you think it could be seen as a Heavy Burden and cause people to become weary?
I not only fell under it for many years of my early christian life. I have seen many broken by it (including myself for a few years before God brought me back, and showed me truth.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
63
Paul is talking about sin and false doctrines here. NOT the feast of unleavened bread. man the more you talk.. well.. wow. just wow!!!!

so you remember the passover?? WHY??

I remember my saviors death..
What do you think the Passover is? Sometimes I think you say things you don't really mean. Is there anybody here who does not know Christ is our Passover?

1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

And of course if Paul said Unleavened Bread it was a slip of the tongue, he really meant Ishtar.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
Got to love it. Nothing like taking scripture out of context. :mad:
people always make it about them.. it is all about self. that is why sin is so rampant in this world. and why so many people can not find true grace, even though they THINK they are doing Gods will.

Jesus told us what the bread represented.

"Take, eat, this is my body which is shed for you"

the unleaven represented a savior, with no sin, who fulfilled the moral law. and by it was able to break his body for us!!
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
63
people always make it about them.. it is all about self. that is why sin is so rampant in this world. and why so many people can not find true grace, even though they THINK they are doing Gods will.

Jesus told us what the bread represented.

"Take, eat, this is my body which is shed for you"

the unleaven represented a savior, with no sin, who fulfilled the moral law. and by it was able to break his body for us!!
When did He shed His body? I thought He shed His blood and His body was broken for us. Hmmm, whatever book you are reading from is different than mine. Hey, that is beginning to explain a lot.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
What do you think the Passover is? Sometimes I think you say things you don't really mean. Is there anybody here who does not know Christ is our Passover?
does anyone not know Jesus said " do this OFTEN in remembrance of me"

yet you want us to do this once a year?? WOW!!!


1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

And of course if Paul said Unleavened Bread it was a slip of the tongue, he really meant Ishtar.


Has nothign to do with unleavened bread. It has to do with the passage you took out of context to prove a point.

The feast of unleavened bread is no longer APPLICABLE TO US.. so you can not use it

it has been replaced by the Lords supper. Like circumcision was replaced with baptism.

Do you force all new believers you bring to Christ who have not been circumcised to get circumcised too??


I honestly have never met anyone more enslaved in my life than i see in you!