James's Faith With Works VS Paul's Faith Without Works
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James applies to us just as much as it does any future tribulation people.
we have hearers who are not doers
we have people who look at our reflection and forget who we are
we have people in our churches who act all religious, but do as James said, and treat poor people as second hand citizens
we have people who claim to have faith, but merely have mental agreement, and need to test their faith to make sure it is not dead.
in James day, even in Paul's, they considered they were already in the last days, so any reference to it does not mean that is what is meant (Tribulation)
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Smh
1, yes, their redemption was not applied however until Jesus died and took them to the third heaven.
5, yes, they are part of the body
the rest could not happen before they died, yet do not prove they were saved different.
Abraham was declaired righteous before he worked. David was considered a man after Gods heart before he works.
both committed grave sins after they were declaired gods children.
I seriously do not get why you think their eternal life is based on anything different than what ours was. We are no better than they were.
5, yes, they are part of the body
the rest could not happen before they died, yet do not prove they were saved different.
Abraham was declaired righteous before he worked. David was considered a man after Gods heart before he works.
both committed grave sins after they were declaired gods children.
I seriously do not get why you think their eternal life is based on anything different than what ours was. We are no better than they were.
Yes, there are many applications for us today, but the question I have is, who is the audience of the book of James and what is the time period? Let's continue with chapter 5:
14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.
Do you agree with this today? Not, might save the sick...SHALL save the sick. And, the prayer of elders will forgive the sins of others. Not for us today my friend.
17 Elias was a man subject to like passions as we are, and he prayed earnestly that it might not rain: and it rained not on the earth by the space of three years and six months.
18 And he prayed again, and the heaven gave rain, and the earth brought forth her fruit.
Why Elijah? Why 3 1/2 years? Elijah will be one of the two witnesses during the tribulation.
14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.
Do you agree with this today? Not, might save the sick...SHALL save the sick. And, the prayer of elders will forgive the sins of others. Not for us today my friend.
17 Elias was a man subject to like passions as we are, and he prayed earnestly that it might not rain: and it rained not on the earth by the space of three years and six months.
18 And he prayed again, and the heaven gave rain, and the earth brought forth her fruit.
Why Elijah? Why 3 1/2 years? Elijah will be one of the two witnesses during the tribulation.
I disagree seeing how from the very first verse of the second chapter, James was addressing the church's willful neglect and abuse of the poor. Reading how they were going a step further by verbalizing faith in God's Providence to provide for the poor in a departing benediction as if by saying so, "Be warmed & be filled", God will do it , but it is in the eyes of the poor towards that church's faith in God's Providence as that church's faith in God's Providence that is dead, as the church was not leading by example. So the church's lack of example in living by that faith in God's Providence will not PROFIT the poor nor save the poor.
The profiting and the saving is not in regards to the church verbalizing that faith in God's Providence, but in regards to how the lack of example by the church of the church's faith in God's providence that will not profit nor save the poor as they would perish from the elements and/or starvation.
In context, James was not talking about any other kind of faith, but the application of faith in God's providence in how a church would get out of helping the poor as this was James rebuke towards such practices.
Galatians 2:[SUP]9 [/SUP]And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.[SUP] 10 [/SUP]Only they would that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.
So no. James was not talking about faith in Jesus Christ for salvation at all, but correcting abuses by the church.
The profiting and the saving is not in regards to the church verbalizing that faith in God's Providence, but in regards to how the lack of example by the church of the church's faith in God's providence that will not profit nor save the poor as they would perish from the elements and/or starvation.
In context, James was not talking about any other kind of faith, but the application of faith in God's providence in how a church would get out of helping the poor as this was James rebuke towards such practices.
Galatians 2:[SUP]9 [/SUP]And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.[SUP] 10 [/SUP]Only they would that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.
So no. James was not talking about faith in Jesus Christ for salvation at all, but correcting abuses by the church.
Being saved through the suffering and trials of the tribulation into the Millennial Kingdom of Jesus Christ. It matches with Matthew 24.
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. (Saved does not always mean the eternal salvation of the soul. Sometimes it means not dying.)21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. (If the days were not shortened, no one would physically survive because the tribulation will be so great.)
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. (Saved does not always mean the eternal salvation of the soul. Sometimes it means not dying.)21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. (If the days were not shortened, no one would physically survive because the tribulation will be so great.)
Impossible to separate faith from works its all one in the same kind of work .
Men do not die because of a lack of food necessary for these bodies of death or of a thirst for water. But do die for lack of Christ’s faith working in them to both will and do His good pleasure. No water (gospel) no food to the will of Him unseen. The question I would ask is when he does come will he find that kind of faith or just a worn out religious book that cannot quicken a persons soul giving us His understanding .
Amo 8:11 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of "hearing the words" of the LORD:
Men do not die because of a lack of food necessary for these bodies of death or of a thirst for water. But do die for lack of Christ’s faith working in them to both will and do His good pleasure. No water (gospel) no food to the will of Him unseen. The question I would ask is when he does come will he find that kind of faith or just a worn out religious book that cannot quicken a persons soul giving us His understanding .
Amo 8:11 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of "hearing the words" of the LORD:
Paul,faith alone,not saved by works,when we confess Christ,for that is all we can do,because our works are as filthy rags,and we are a sinner.
James,faith without works is dead,a person is justified by works,and not faith alone,receiving the Spirit,and laboring for the kingdom of God,help the poor and needy,preach the Gospel,works of the Spirit.
Paul and James both collaborate,if they have the means to feed,and clothe the poor,and they do not do it,James,faith without works is dead,Paul,they have erred from the faith,John,the love of God does not dwell in them.
Paul was dealing with Gentiles and their false religions,that their works in those religions will not save them,but confess Christ.
James was dealing a lot after a person received the Spirit.
James,faith without works is dead,a person is justified by works,and not faith alone,receiving the Spirit,and laboring for the kingdom of God,help the poor and needy,preach the Gospel,works of the Spirit.
Paul and James both collaborate,if they have the means to feed,and clothe the poor,and they do not do it,James,faith without works is dead,Paul,they have erred from the faith,John,the love of God does not dwell in them.
Paul was dealing with Gentiles and their false religions,that their works in those religions will not save them,but confess Christ.
James was dealing a lot after a person received the Spirit.
Peter brings them both into one thought.
II Peter 1:3-11 "His divine power has granted to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of him who called us to his own glory and excellence,4 by which he has granted to us his precious and very great promises, so that through them you may become partakers of the divine nature, having escaped from the corruption that is in the world because of sinful desire.5 For this very reason, make every effort to supplement your faith with virtue, and virtue with knowledge,6 and knowledge with self-control, and self-control with steadfastness, and steadfastness with godliness,7 and godliness with brotherly affection, and brotherly affection with love.8 For if these qualities are yours and are increasing, they keep you from being ineffective or unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.9 For whoever lacks these qualities is so nearsighted that he is blind, having forgotten that he was cleansed from his former sins.10 Therefore, brothers, be all the more diligent to confirm your calling and election, for if you practice these qualities you will never fall.11 For in this way there will be richly provided for you an entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ."
It is God at work in us and we work with Him in our lives as in Philippians 2:12-13 "Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling,13 for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure."
It is our sanctification process, it is our co-operation with God in our lives.
II Peter 1:3-11 "His divine power has granted to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of him who called us to his own glory and excellence,4 by which he has granted to us his precious and very great promises, so that through them you may become partakers of the divine nature, having escaped from the corruption that is in the world because of sinful desire.5 For this very reason, make every effort to supplement your faith with virtue, and virtue with knowledge,6 and knowledge with self-control, and self-control with steadfastness, and steadfastness with godliness,7 and godliness with brotherly affection, and brotherly affection with love.8 For if these qualities are yours and are increasing, they keep you from being ineffective or unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.9 For whoever lacks these qualities is so nearsighted that he is blind, having forgotten that he was cleansed from his former sins.10 Therefore, brothers, be all the more diligent to confirm your calling and election, for if you practice these qualities you will never fall.11 For in this way there will be richly provided for you an entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ."
It is God at work in us and we work with Him in our lives as in Philippians 2:12-13 "Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling,13 for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure."
It is our sanctification process, it is our co-operation with God in our lives.
James 1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.
Let's define the "twelve tribes" shall we...
Genesis 49:28 All these are the twelve tribes of Israel: and this is it that their father spake unto them, and blessed them; every one according to his blessing he blessed them.
Exodus 24:4 And Moses wrote all the words of the Lord, and rose up early in the morning, and builded an altar under the hill, and twelve pillars, according to the twelve tribes of Israel.
Exodus 28:21 And the stones shall be with the names of the children of Israel, twelve, according to their names, like the engravings of a signet; every one with his name shall they be according to the twelve tribes.
Ezekiel 47:13 Thus saith the Lord God; This shall be the border, whereby ye shall inherit the land according to the twelve tribes of Israel: Joseph shall have two portions.
Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
Acts 26:7 Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come. For which hope's sake, king Agrippa, I am accused of the Jews.
Revelation 21:12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
In every instance, OT and NT, the phrase "twelve tribes" always, always, always is a reference to the ALL the descendants of the twelve boys of Jacob, the nation of Israel. There is no justification for taking this as anything other than an address to the twelve tribes of Israel, the whole nation, and not a specific called out group of Christians from that nation.
Let's define the "twelve tribes" shall we...
Genesis 49:28 All these are the twelve tribes of Israel: and this is it that their father spake unto them, and blessed them; every one according to his blessing he blessed them.
Exodus 24:4 And Moses wrote all the words of the Lord, and rose up early in the morning, and builded an altar under the hill, and twelve pillars, according to the twelve tribes of Israel.
Exodus 28:21 And the stones shall be with the names of the children of Israel, twelve, according to their names, like the engravings of a signet; every one with his name shall they be according to the twelve tribes.
Ezekiel 47:13 Thus saith the Lord God; This shall be the border, whereby ye shall inherit the land according to the twelve tribes of Israel: Joseph shall have two portions.
Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
Acts 26:7 Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come. For which hope's sake, king Agrippa, I am accused of the Jews.
Revelation 21:12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
In every instance, OT and NT, the phrase "twelve tribes" always, always, always is a reference to the ALL the descendants of the twelve boys of Jacob, the nation of Israel. There is no justification for taking this as anything other than an address to the twelve tribes of Israel, the whole nation, and not a specific called out group of Christians from that nation.
Saved believers are to run that race by looking to the author & finisher of our faith to help us lay aside every weight & sin.
But not every saved believer is looking to Jesus Christ in that way to run that race which is why many will be found as not abiding in Him when the Bridegroom comes and thus become castaways to be received later on as vessels unto dishonor in His House after the great tribulation in serving the King of kings for the milleniel reign of Christ.
But not every saved believer is looking to Jesus Christ in that way to run that race which is why many will be found as not abiding in Him when the Bridegroom comes and thus become castaways to be received later on as vessels unto dishonor in His House after the great tribulation in serving the King of kings for the milleniel reign of Christ.
The harmony of Romans 4:2-3 and James 2:24 is seen in the differing ways that Paul and James use the term "justified." Paul, when he uses the term, refers to the legal (judicial) act of God by which He accounts the sinner as righteous (Romans 3:24; 5:1). James, however is using the term to describe those who would prove or show the genuineness of their faith by the works that they do.
*Man is saved through faith and not works (Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9); yet genuine faith is vindicated, substantiated, evidenced by works (James 2:14-24).
The word "alone" in regards to salvation through faith "in Christ alone" conveys the message that Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not based on the merits of our works.
*It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not by the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (solitary, unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony.*
*Man is saved through faith and not works (Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9); yet genuine faith is vindicated, substantiated, evidenced by works (James 2:14-24).
The word "alone" in regards to salvation through faith "in Christ alone" conveys the message that Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not based on the merits of our works.
*It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not by the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (solitary, unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony.*
[h=1]1 John 4:20King James Version (KJV)[/h]20 If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?
if a man love God, he will love other.
if a man love other, he will do good to other, ex, helping the poor, love the needy.
if a man love his good friend only, or love the rich only than what is the different with non Christian
have a faith in Jesus will follow by love other, it's follow by helping the needy/work
if a man say I have a faith in Jesus, and not helping the poor, he is liar
if a man love God, he will love other.
if a man love other, he will do good to other, ex, helping the poor, love the needy.
if a man love his good friend only, or love the rich only than what is the different with non Christian
have a faith in Jesus will follow by love other, it's follow by helping the needy/work
if a man say I have a faith in Jesus, and not helping the poor, he is liar
Which Jew was it written to? Remember not all Isreal is Isreal. Just as in the same way not all Christians, the promised new name God named his chosen ones, are Christians.
James and Paul are saying the same. The thoughts of God are after no man It did not come from their minds as private interpretation .It would be balashemy to attribute the mutual source of the faith of God by the faith of Christ and have that in resepct to the sent ones (apostles) Prohecy is God's interpretation to us not from or of us .
We all have the authority of the faith of God working in us to both will and performhis good will but it is never to be assumed it could be of us. That would spell out...Blasphemy
2Co 4:7 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.
Where does the idea of puffing up one apostle over that of another get its foundation?
James and Paul are saying the same. The thoughts of God are after no man It did not come from their minds as private interpretation .It would be balashemy to attribute the mutual source of the faith of God by the faith of Christ and have that in resepct to the sent ones (apostles) Prohecy is God's interpretation to us not from or of us .
We all have the authority of the faith of God working in us to both will and performhis good will but it is never to be assumed it could be of us. That would spell out...Blasphemy
2Co 4:7 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.
Where does the idea of puffing up one apostle over that of another get its foundation?
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