Jesus Christ was God manifest in the Flesh

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

There is only one true God and His name is Jesus Christ and every knee shall bow to that name.

THIS is what I've been saying!!!! This is not Trinity.

The Soul (Father) and Spirit (Holy Spirit) of God embodied within the soul-spirit of Jesus for us to see Him face (prosopon) to face (prosopon).

 

[Dutch41]

Yet for us there is but ONE GOD, THE FATHER FROM WHO all things came and FOR WHOM we live and ONE LORD JESUS CHRIST THROUGH WHOM all things came and THROUGH WHOM we live
1 Cor 8:6

Yes.. this is interesting isn’t it? kai heis kurios isious so there is one kurios? Well maybe you have to look the Septuaginta (The Greek OT) who this kurios is.

But I am afraid like all others who believe as you do you dismiss the plainest of verses on this subject,

Of course.. when you are doing some magic with verses to proof you self. Using eiseges and accuse another.

W ell I am sure you have the King James.. and instead the word of YHWH you can use the word LORD.
This text prove that YHWH is talking and He is sent by YHWH.. like Isaiah saw YHWH in Isaiah 6
Am I correct if you said: Jesus didn't saw God? If that is true.. I think I will use my Dutch Bible
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by Him, and without Him was not anything made that was made.

Come one.. read your Bible. You want that I read 1cor 15:24-28 too.. And please don't change the word
Okee.. if we agree that Christ is the Word, change the Word into Christ.
?
Christ is the word of God, but the word itself is God's word, spoken through the son. Why is this so hard to understand?
You say I change the word? I have given you plain words of scripture that say Christ is not God Himself

Yes.. magic.. So you agree that the Word is Christ? Don’t play magic and read what there is written: The WORD WAS GOD.. and that all was in the beginning with God. AND THE WORD BECAME FLESH. When you accuse people that they have to read the Scripture you have to do it too.

Christ is the word of God, but the word itself is God's word, spoken through the son. Why is this so hard to understand?
You say I change the word? I have given you plain words of scripture that say Christ is not God Himself

And did you read Rom 9:5?
Whose are the fathers and of whom as concerning the flesh of Christcame, who is over all, God blessed forever. Amen
Rom 9:5 What is this proving?

Put the magic away and read it again..

He said: And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

I think if Adam and Eve believed they would be as gods(KJV) they would have thought of this as equality with God.

Ohh Adam and Eve believed it and would have. And wasn’t it the lie from the satan that he gave the thought at A&E, that they are equal when they eat from the ‘apple’. Here again.. you are doing eisegese.. I can’t found in Genesis 3 complete that they WHERE EQUAL at God.. What A&E things is not what God think..

I agree, Christ had the form of God, he was the EXACT representation of the Fathers being Heb 1:3How does this make any difference?

Ohh actually Christ was an EXACT representation of a human.. But He wasn’t.. if I follow your logic.. about this verse..

I am not in a difficult position. The problem with Isiaih and peoples interpretation of it is understanding when God is speaking through the son
You are in an impossible position according to the words of Paul, let me repeat again

When it says that everything has been put under him IT IS CLEAR THAT THIS DOES NOT INCLUDE GOD HIMSELF WHPO PUT EVERYTHING UNDER CHRIST

But you will not accept what Paul wrote will you? So doubtless you will not accept what I write either, and Paul knew better than us the OT scrkiptures you refer to

No, the problem is with you.. your interpretation.. not with another.. But you are blind to see that.

But savedbygrace there much more evidence.. Can you tell me.. Who is Elohim in Gen 1:1-3 and why is He talking in plurality.. Ohh and please dont come with the answer: He is doing that because the plural majestici..

Well I go by the kjv or the NIV. BVerse one speaks of God. Verse two speaks of thespirit of God. Verse three speaks of God

Try the Hebrew Bible it said Elohiem..
and He is speaks in plural.. (see vs 26) And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.

 

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

PPS

Can I ask what a semi nestorian belief is?

Hi, LBG-

Nestorianism is a Christological view of the Trinity that Jesus had two separate natures, the human and the divine. It is an understanding that God was manifest IN man rather than manifest AS man. Nestorianism was anathematized by the Council of 431, and Dyophitism was later anathematized. The Councils declared EVERYTHING heresy at one point or another except Tripartitism.

You're not Trinitarian, and it is only partially descriptive of what I perceive from what you've said. I simply referred to it as semi-Nestorianism for comparison sake. I certainly don't tie you to any particular belief; just trying to describe some of the boundaries that you are within for salvific faith. I find no scriptural reason to impugn your faith as non-salvific.

 

[livingbygrace]

A certain ruler asked him
Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?
Why do you call me good, Jesus answered. No-one is good but God alone
Luke 18:18&19

Would you say that Christ is claiming here to be the one true God?

Therefore God exlted him to the highest place
and gave him the name that is above every name
That at the name of Jesus every knee shall bow and every tongue confess
that Jesus Christ is Lord
To the Glory of God the Father

So if Christ is the one true God, did God therefore exalt Himself to the highest place and give Himself a name that was above every name so he may be glorified?

But about the son he says
Your throne O'God will last forever and ever
And rightewousness will be a sceptre of your kingdom
You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness
Therefore GOD, YOUR GOD has set you above your companions and annointede you with the oil of joy
Heb 1:8&9

So, if Christ is the one true God, is it true that because God loved righteousness and hated wickedness he set himself above his companions and annointed himself with the oil of joy?

And the one true God(God Himself) must refer to someone as My God

The Lord said to my Lord
Sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet
Psalm 110:1

So if Christ is the one true God, did God say to himself that he was to sit at his own right hand until he had put all his enemies under his own feet?

If you receiver authority from someone, isn't it true that the person who gives authority is greater than than the person who receives authority from them?

Dutch

I am quite happy to reply to your post, but it is your turn to respond to this post of mine first as you said you would yesterday

I am not being churlish, but after so many have simply asked me to answer their questions and ignored mine I do now set fair rules for debate
I respond to a set of questions put to me, then I ask that the person whom with I am debating responds to a set of questions I put forward

Thanks

 

[livingbygrace]

Hi, LBG-

Nestorianism is a Christological view of the Trinity that Jesus had two separate natures, the human and the divine. It is an understanding that God was manifest IN man rather than manifest AS man. Nestorianism was anathematized by the Council of 431, and Dyophitism was later anathematized. The Councils declared EVERYTHING heresy at one point or another except Tripartitism.

You're not Trinitarian, and it is only partially descriptive of what I perceive from what you've said. I simply referred to it as semi-Nestorianism for comparison sake. I certainly don't tie you to any particular belief; just trying to describe some of the boundaries that you are within for salvific faith. I find no scriptural reason to impugn your faith as non-salvific.

Thanks for this explanation

I do believe myself that God was manifest in Christ, but not that Christ was therefore God Himself, so I guess if I have understood the point correctly
I would believe God was manifest IN Christ, but not as God Himself, and therefore not AS man

I appreciate your belief that I have salvific faith and am therefore saved, despite the fact we do not see this subject exactly the same

 

[Dutch41]

certain ruler asked him
Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?
Why do you call me good, Jesus answered. No-one is good but God alone
Luke 18:18&19

Would you say that Christ is claiming here to be the one true God?

Yes. Here Jesus His return question was: Why do you call me good? No-one is good but God alone. Here Jesus didn’t said that He wasn’t good. His name is the Good Shepherd. It would be different if Jesus said: I am not good. No-one is good but god alone.. Like the angel said.. Don’t worshipe me.. but worship the Lord. (Rev 22:8)

Therefore God exlted him to the highest place
and gave him the name that is above every name
That at the name of Jesus every knee shall bow and every tongue confess
that Jesus Christ is Lord
To the Glory of God the Father

So if Christ is the one true God, did God therefore exalt Himself to the highest place and give Himself a name that was above every name so he may be glorified?

Again the answer is in John 1:14 and Phil 2:6-8.

But about the son he says
Your throne O'God will last forever and ever
And rightewousness will be a sceptre of your kingdom
You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness
Therefore GOD, YOUR GOD has set you above your companions and annointede you with the oil of joy
Heb 1:8&9

So, if Christ is the one true God, is it true that because God loved righteousness and hated wickedness he set himself above his companions and annointed himself with the oil of joy?

Yes.. answer again John 1:14 and Phil 2:6-8. But I think you can read too Is 11. The oil is a figure of the Spirit..

And the one true God(God Himself) must refer to someone as My God

The Lord said to my Lord
Sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet
Psalm 110:1

So if Christ is the one true God, did God say to himself that he was to sit at his own right hand until he had put all his enemies under his own feet?

Remember the passage from Zach 2:8-9? The only True YHWH sent YHWH.. How could He sent Him self? Why? Because God became a human.. again pointing at the verses above. Interesting is here.. what does it say the Right hand. Did Stephanus really saw Jesus standing at the right hand of YHWH? Did He saw YHWH? Or is it here the position? The Position of an advocate in a court? Well it is that.. He is the Mediator.. and when that is over.. the throne from Jesus and the Father will be one.. Read Rev 21:23-22:1

If you receiver authority from someone, isn't it true that the person who gives authority is greater than than the person who receives authority from them?

In nature or position? Is a man greater than a woman?

 

[Dutch41]

THIS is what I've been saying!!!! This is not Trinity.

The Soul (Father) and Spirit (Holy Spirit) of God embodied within the soul-spirit of Jesus for us to see Him face (prosopon) to face (prosopon).

I love more the word Tri-unity

 

[Dutch41]

Dutch

I am quite happy to reply to your post, but it is your turn to respond to this post of mine first as you said you would yesterday

I am not being churlish, but after so many have simply asked me to answer their questions and ignored mine I do now set fair rules for debate
I respond to a set of questions put to me, then I ask that the person whom with I am debating responds to a set of questions I put forward

Thanks

And in this I fully agree.. And I did, like I promised.. And because I answered 'short' it gave you some food to reply.. at the question that I gave.. So my suggestion is..

We can now focus at your questions.. and let the other part of the discussion for what it is.

And now it is time for sleeping

 

[livingbygrace]

Yes. Here Jesus His return question was: Why do you call me good? No-one is good but God alone. Here Jesus didn’t said that He wasn’t good. His name is the Good Shepherd. It would be different if Jesus said: I am not good. No-one is good but god alone.. Like the angel said.. Don’t worshipe me.. but worship the Lord. (Rev 22:8)


I'm sorry, but this is no answer to the verse given.

Jesus said
WHY DO YOU CALL ME GOOD? NO-ONE IS GOOD BUT GOD ALONE

Again the answer is in John 1:14 and Phil 2:6-8.
Again you are not answering the point of the question

Yes.. answer again John 1:14 and Phil 2:6-8. But I think you can read too Is 11. The oil is a figure of the Spirit..

Nor here


Remember the passage from Zach 2:8-9? The only True YHWH sent YHWH..
Christ has the Title God, but ther Father is still Christ's God, being the one true God
Heb 1:8&9

This you need to always remember

How could He sent Him self? Why? Because God became a human.. again pointing at the verses above. Interesting is here.. what does it say the Right hand. Did Stephanus really saw Jesus standing at the right hand of YHWH? Did He saw YHWH? Or is it here the position? The Position of an advocate in a court? Well it is that.. He is the Mediator.. and when that is over.. the throne from Jesus and the Father will be one.. Read Rev 21:23-22:1

FOR THIS IS WHAT THE LORD ALMIGHTY SAYS. After HE has honoured me and has SENT ME against the nations that have plundered you-for whoever touches you touches the apple of his eye-I will surely raise my hand against them. Then you will know that the Lord Almighty has sent me
Zech 2:8&9
You are certainly reading that worongly
So, God is sending himself against the nations-yes?
In nature or position? Is a man greater than a woman?
Well maybe you can answer this then

You must believe that Christ has always been llower in position than the Father, but not in nature, therefore this must be how you explain Christ being subject to the Father. Therefore you must believe Christ has always been subject to the Father in position, but in nature he cannot be

Then why does Paul say that Christ WILL become subject to the Father in 1 Cor 15:28 when all dominion, power and authority has been defeated. In what way WILL Christ then become subject to the Father? According to your beief it cannot be in position for he always has been subject to the Father in position
And according to you it cannot be in nature, that is impossible
So in what way WILL Christ in the future become subject to God?

Although you have not answered hardly any of my questions I will later this evening or in the morning respond to yours

One more point. According to Paul, Christ was hidden in the OT
The Pharisees had no answer to Jesus when he asked them how the Messiah could be Davids Lord and his son
And please understand Christ was the God of Israel in the OT.

 

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

Thanks for this explanation

I do believe myself that God was manifest in Christ, but not that Christ was therefore God Himself, so I guess if I have understood the point correctly
I would believe God was manifest IN Christ, but not as God Himself, and therefore not AS man

I appreciate your belief that I have salvific faith and am therefore saved, despite the fact we do not see this subject exactly the same

There are numerous formulations and variations of maintaining Monotheism while accommodating the Incarnation. Trinity isn't even the "bullseye" of the target, much less the sole target with no other "points". There are also infinite variations of both Social and Anti-Social Trinity models, but most haven't a clue beyond "their" perception of the version they were taught through indoctrina... er, discipleship. And few bother to have awareness or understanding of anything outside their myopic view.

I come so hard at Trinity because its default entitlement elitist majority status is what left me without salvation for 28 years. And Trinitarians have no possibility of defending their view beyond conceptual inference. The most ignorant are the most adamant.

 

[livingbygrace]

I come so hard at Trinity because its default entitlement elitist majority status is what left me without salvation for 28 years. And Trinitarians have no possibility of defending their view beyond conceptual inference. The most ignorant are the most arrogant.

Going by what I have witnessed on cc you have Trinitarians perfectly simmed up

I know I should not get so exasperated by their opininons but when you are continually told by some that you are condemned and a heretic and possessed by the spirit of antichrist simply for believing what Christ plainly stated when he walked this earth was the neccessary belief for salvation it does become wearying at times and provoke a reaction

 

[zackabba]

The very reason I stopped visiting this site is because it seems to be more about tearing others down, and not bringing others up.

It's fine to debate. But when you judge a whole people based on what you've seen on ChristianChat...it either means you need to just check yourself, pray, or get out more.

I am a Trinitarian, and will remain one because it presents itself in the Scriptures.

(...and here come the comments about indoctrination, me calling others heretics, etc etc etc....I can see them from a mile away)

God Bless you all.

 

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

The very reason I stopped visiting this site is because it seems to be more about tearing others down, and not bringing others up.

It's fine to debate. But when you judge a whole people based on what you've seen on ChristianChat...it either means you need to just check yourself, pray, or get out more.

I am a Trinitarian, and will remain one because it presents itself in the Scriptures.

(...and here come the comments about indoctrination, me calling others heretics, etc etc etc....I can see them from a mile away)

God Bless you all.

Hi, Z-

I've spent a good bit of time praying for you, and discerning your spirit. I'm excited about what God has ahead for your life. I believe you have a sensitive and seeking heart. You've sown many tears. Reap with joy.

 

[livingbygrace]

Yes.. this is interesting isn’t it? kai heis kurios isious so there is one kurios? Well maybe you have to look the Septuaginta (The Greek OT) who this kurios is.



If you are not prepared to accept the KJV of the Bible which is well reputed we are unable to have a debate, please let me know if you will not accept the words written in it
In 1 Cor 8:6 Paul was backing up Christ's words in John 17:3 and John in 1 John 4:12, are all of these wrong according to your Greek septuaginta?

Of course.. when you are doing some magic with verses to proof you self. Using eiseges and accuse another.


I wont accept plain words. Please, I am trying not to laugh here. How about this PLAIN verse of scripture
The Father is greater than I John 14:28
So, do you accept that plain verse or to use your words, will you do magic with the words?
You clearly do not accept much plainly written scripture but accuse me of playing magic with words-OK!

Yes.. magic.. So you agree that the Word is Christ? Don’t play magic and read what there is written: The WORD WAS GOD.. and that all was in the beginning with God. AND THE WORD BECAME FLESH. When you accuse people that they have to read the Scripture you have to do it too.

Christ is the WORD OF GOD, so who is doing magic?
In the begining was the word(Christ) and the word was with/besides God and the word(itself) was God, He was with God in the Begining
where is the magic please?
Do you deny Christ is the word of God?
Do you deny Christ spoke the words the Father gave him?
The only contentious words in John 1:1 are the word was God. Well scripture is clear you know, Christ spoke the words the Father gave him. The Father in effect spoke through the son
But I know you believe that in the begining God Himself was with God Himself

No-one has seen God
1 John 4:12
So it is strange that you believe John is saying that Christ is God Himself, but at the same time he clearly states no-one has seen God.
So do we dismiss John's Gospel because you obviously believe it is full of contradictions?


Put the magic away and read it again..

Ohh Adam and Eve believed it and would have. And wasn’t it the lie from the satan that he gave the thought at A&E, that they are equal when they eat from the ‘apple’. Here again.. you are doing eisegese.. I can’t found in Genesis 3 complete that they WHERE EQUAL at God.. What A&E things is not what God think..

For God doth know that in the day you eat thereof then your eyes shall be opened AND YE SHALL BNE AS GODS, knowing good and evil
Gen 3:5

I agree, Christ had the form of God, he was the EXACT representation of the Fathers being Heb 1:3How does this make any difference?

Ohh actually Christ was an EXACT representation of a human.. But He wasn’t.. if I follow your logic.. about this verse..

The son is the radiance of God's g;lory and the EXACT representatioon of his being
Heb 1:3
I have just told you what the verse says, if you hjave a problem with that sobeit
No, the problem is with you.. your interpretation.. not with another.. But you are blind to see that.

But savedbygrace there much more evidence.. Can you tell me.. Who is Elohim in Gen 1:1-3 and why is He talking in plurality.. Ohh and please dont come with the answer: He is doing that because the plural majestici..

Well I go by the kjv or the NIV. BVerse one speaks of God. Verse two speaks of thespirit of God. Verse three speaks of God

Try the Hebrew Bible it said Elohiem..
and He is speaks in plural.. (see vs 26) And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.
Now I am confused. Are we discussing Gen 1:1-3 or the plurality of Gen 1:26?

AS you mention plural I will take it Gen 1:26

This baffles me, Christ was with the Father from the begining, so what are you trying to prove here? That Chrtist existed with God in Genesis, you don't need to, I agree. And I will repeat. The Jews had all the OT scriptures written in HEBREW I believe. How many of them were expecting God Himself to come as their Messiah?

Now can you tell me please. Who was the God of Israel in the OT?

And can you explain in your own words please

You believe that because God Himself loved righteousness and hated wickedness he set himself above his companions and annointed himself with the oil of Joy.
Therefore God Himself cannot have been above his companions in the first place, so he must have been equal to them, yes?

You do have a strange idea of God, don't you!
Please note, I answered fully your questions, you basically skipped over nearly all mine and just replied with a bible verse or two

 

[Red33]

Thanks for this explanation

I do believe myself that God was manifest in Christ, but not that Christ was therefore God Himself so I guess if I have understood the point correctly
I would believe God was manifest IN Christ, but not as God Himself, and therefore not AS man

I appreciate your belief that I have salvific faith and am therefore saved, despite the fact we do not see this subject exactly the same

What you are saying is that Jesus Christ was not God in the flesh. Either Jesus Christ was God or he was not. You have plainly said in your own words that...

I do believe myself that God was manifest in Christ, but not that Christ was therefore God Himself

There is no mistaking what you have said, it is plain as day. You do not believe in your heart...

... that Christ was therefore God Himself

Does your good friend VW believe as you do that Christ was not God Himself? Who else believes as you do on this site? The spirit of antichrist denies that God became flesh and dwelt among men through the person of His Son. This is what is in your heart and has been their for some time. You do not believe that Jesus Christ was God in the flesh and you have confessed it with your mouth plainly. God has a way of bringing out what is in the heart of man.

How can God be manifest in the flesh and not be the one and true God?

 

[livingbygrace]

What you are saying is that Jesus Christ was not God in the flesh. Either Jesus Christ was God or he was not. You have plainly said in your own words that...

Well firstly I note that you have decided to stop putting me on ignore and debate with me again
Now, when I asked ylou questions didn't you say something like I shouldn't ask for questions to be answered by you, just leave it up to a person if they comemnted or not? Oh well, never mind. I am not reticenmt to answer your questions EVEN THOUGH YOU DO NOT ANSWER MINE
I do believe myself that God was manifest in Christ, but not that Christ was therefore God Himself

There is no mistaking what you have said, it is plain as day. You do not believe in your heart...

Yes, it is absoloutely as plain as day what I have said. God was manifest in Christ via the Spirit, absolutely.
God is in us too Red, does that make us God Himself?

... that Christ was therefore God Himself

No, Christ is not God Himself, but God is manifest in Christ. And herein is your big mistake. The Father is in the son, but the son is still the son, and the Father is the one true God, they are Christ's words.
The Spirit was on Christ in BODILY FORM but he still said
The Father is greater than I
The Father is greater than all
The FATHER IS THE ONE TRUE GOD
As I have said many times the fulness of the Godhead bodily dwells in Christ, BUT that does not make Christ the one true God
Not according to the Father, son, Paul and John anyway. This is where you ansd so many others err/. You put your man made logic and the logic of those you follow above the plain words of scripture


Does your good friend VW believe as you do that Christ was not God Himself? Who else believes as you do on this site?
Journey 41 and Devolution to name but two I believe. I knowe you are trying to put a wedge anyway you can between myself and vw, but would you say you are being led by God and sincere motives in tryiong to do this
I believe that VW stands on scripture as to the basic belief to be saved and have eternal life, you plainly do not. If there are other disagreements these SHOULD NOT stop people accepting one another as fellow Christians. The Bibliocal truth of what is neccessary for salvation is what VW and I believe, I repeat, you do not accept the Biblical requirement but add to it

The spirit of antichrist denies that God became flesh and dwelt among men through the person of His Son. This is what is in your heart and has been their for some time. You do not believe that Jesus Christ was God in the flesh and you have confessed it with your mouth plainly. God has a way of bringing out what is in the heart of man.

I believe Christ is who he claimed to be and the Pharisees believed he claimed to ne incidentally, the son of the living God. If you say that by my believing the words of Christ as to who he was means I am possessed by the spirit of antichrist that of course is your right
But one day you will stand before Christ, and if he asks you why you said someone had the spirit of antichrist in them for believing he was who he claimed to be what will you reply?

Can you give me a verse of scripture where Christ commanded anybody to berlieve he was God Himself? Oh I forgot you don't answer questions such as that do you
How can God be manifest in the flesh and not be the one and true God?
This is the whole problem. I am grateful you have asked this question. You see I do not seek to understand wiith my logical rational mind, nor do I blindly follow man. Scripture clearly states Christ is not God Himself, I accept scripture and believe the plain words of scripture in simple, childlike faith. You with your belief have no choice but to pick and choose the scripture you believe, and you have ended up in total confusion
You now say that the name of the one true God is Christ.
I pointed out to you that you would be more likely to be oneness than Trinitarian with your belief. PPS has pointed out to you your belief is not Trinitarian, but you say you are Trinitarian.
The Bible does not say the name of the one true God is Jesus Christ. It says the Father is the one true God

And just to repeat, you have more views contrary to the Bible by continuing to demand for salvation a belief that is not written in the Bible.
Red, you need to go away and spend time in earnest prayer and seek truth on all of this in my opinion.

 

[Red33]

Either Jesus Christ was God in the flesh or He was not God in the flesh. Which one is it? If Jesus Christ was God in the flesh then Jesus Christ was God. If Jesus Christ was not God in the flesh then He was not God. If anyone believes that Jesus Christ was not God in the flesh, that is the spirit of antichrist because that spirit denies that Jesus Christ was God in the flesh. I think that is plain enough.

 

[silverwind]

John 14, 7-10
John 10:30
John 14:11
Matthew 27:43
John 17:11
Plain and simple!

 

[zone]

God never changes.

Malachi 3:6 For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed. ​

Jesus never changes.
Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever. ​

God is the only Saviour.
"I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour." Isaiah 43:11
To the only wise God our Saviour... Jude 1:12​

God our Saviour.
Titus 2:10 ...we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour. I Timothy 4:10 God my Saviour. Luke 1:47 ​

Jesus is the only Saviour.
...the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world. 1 John 4:14
...our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. II Peter 3:18
...God and our Saviour Jesus Christ. II Peter 1:1
...the Christ, the Saviour of the world. John 4:42
...the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour. Titus 1:4
a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord. Luke 2:11
Neither is there salvation in any other (than Jesus): for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.
--Acts 4:12
...salvation... is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.
--2 Timothy 2:10
...captain of their salvation [Jesus] perfect through sufferings.
-- Heb 2:10 [Jesus]...author of eternal salvation...
-- Heb 5:9 ​

God created the universe and earth by Himself.
I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself. Isaiah 44:24 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Genesis 1:1 ​

Jesus Christ created the universe and the earth.
unto the Son he saith...Thou, LORD, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands. Hebrews 1:10
By him [Jesus] were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth...all things were created by him, and for him. Colossians 1:16 All things were made by him; and without him was not anything made that was made. John 1:3 ​

God is the Word.
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God John 1:1 ​

Jesus is the Word.
...the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us...John 1:14 ​

God is the first and the last.
I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he. Isaiah 41:4 ​

Jesus is the first and the last.
Jesus said, "Fear not; I am the first and the last:" Revelation 1:17 ​

God forgives sins.
[T]he Lord..forgiveth all thine iniquities... Psalm 103:2-3 "[W]ho can forgive sins but God only?" Mark 2:7 ​

Jesus forgives sins.
Jesus...said..."Son, thy sins be forgiven thee." Mark 2:5 ​

God is our redeemer.
[T]hou, O LORD, art our father, our redeemer.. Isaiah 63:16 ​

Jesus redeemed us.
[T]the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ...gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity.. Titus 2:13-14 ​

God is one.
Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD. Deuteronomy 6:4 ​

Jesus and God are one.
I and my Father are one. John 10:30
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God...All things were made by him...He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not...And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us John 1:1, 3, 10, 14
Jesus saith...he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father? John 14:9 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 1 John 5:7​

God has a Son.
[T]he LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee. Psalms 2:7 ​

Jesus is God's Son.
... [Jesus] said also that God was his Father... John 5:18​

God is the Holy One
Psalms 71:22 I will also praise thee with the psaltery, even thy truth,O my God: unto thee will I sing with the harp, O thou Holy One of Israel.
Psalms 78:41 Yea, they turned back and tempted God, and limited the Holy One of Israel.
Psalms 89:18 For the LORD is our defence; and the Holy One of Israel is our king.
Isaiah 10:20 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the remnant of Israel, and such as are escaped of the house of Jacob, shall no more again stay upon him that smote them; but shall stay upon the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, in truth. Psalms 16:10 For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption. (Messianic Psalm)​

Jesus is the Holy One.
Acts 2:27 Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
3:13-14 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go. But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you; 13:34-35 And as concerning that he raised him up from the dead, now no more to return to corruption, he said on this wise, I will give you the sure mercies of David. Wherefore he saith also in another psalm, Thou shalt not suffer thine Holy One to see corruption​

Only God is worshipped.
... Then saith Jesus unto him... Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve. Matthew 4:10 ​

Jesus is worshipped.
While [Jesus] spake these things unto them, behold, there came a certain ruler, and worshipped him... Matthew 9:18
And again, when [God] bringeth in the firstbegotten [Jesus] into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him. Hebrews 1:6 And Thomas answered and said unto [Jesus], My Lord and my God. John 20:28 ​

God is Messiah.
...unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder...and his name shall be called... The mighty God, The everlasting Father... Isaiah 9:6 ​

Jesus is Messiah.
The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things. Jesus saith unto her, I that speak unto thee am he. John 4:25-26 ​

Only God is glorified.
I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another... Isaiah 42:8 ​

God glorified Jesus.
And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. John 17:5
[A]ll men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him. John 5:23 But unto the Son he [God] saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. Hebrews 1:8 ​

God is 'I am'.
And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you. Exodus 3:14 ​

Jesus is 'I am'.
Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am
John 8:58 ​

God heals all diseases.
Bless the LORD...who healeth all thy diseases. Psalms 103:2 ​

Jesus heals all diseases.
[Jesus] healed all that were sick. Matthew 8:16 ​

God is the Judge of the whole earth.
O Lord God, to whom vengeance belongeth; O God, to whom vengeance belongeth, shew thyself. Lift up thyself, thou judge of the earth: render a reward to the proud. Psalms 94:1-2 [Abraham to God]...Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right? Genesis 18:25​

Jesus is the Judge of the whole earth.
[T]he Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: John 5:22​

God has life in Himself.
[T]he Father hath life in himself; John 5:26 ​

Jesus has life in Himself.
so hath [God] given to the Son to have life in himself; In [Jesus] was life; and the life was the light of men. John 1:4 ​

God raises the dead.
[T]he Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; John 5:21 ​

Jesus raises the dead.

[T]he Son quickeneth whom he will. John 5:21​

 

[livingbygrace]

Either Jesus Christ was God in the flesh or He was not God in the flesh. Which one is it? If Jesus Christ was God in the flesh then Jesus Christ was God. If Jesus Christ was not God in the flesh then He was not God. If anyone believes that Jesus Christ was not God in the flesh, that is the spirit of antichrist because that spirit denies that Jesus Christ was God in the flesh. I think that is plain enough.

Well I hope that everyone who reads this dialogue between us notices that I respond to your questions, while you continuosly ignore mine.

God was manifest in his son, but that does not mean that the son was completely God Himself. The Father being manifest in Christ does not mean that Christ was soley and completely the one true God Himself.
God was in the flesh of Christ, but Christ was not God Himself on earth.

Now answer this. If Christ was God Himself from Birth he would have had to be completely filled with the spirit from birth would he not? The spirit would have had to completely and fully reside in Christ from birth.
For Christ himself said that the evidence of the Father in him was the work of the Father he was doing, and Christ also confirmed the miracles were done by the power of the Holy Spirit in him
So why did the Spirit descend on Christ in bodily form at his Baptism? It could not have happened if Christ was already God Himself on earth, would you like to answer that question?
And it was after this event that Christ was tempted and began his public ministry, IN THE POWER OF THE SPIRIT

And this is the problem people who think like you have. Because you cannot accept that Christ can have the spirit fully on him but not be the one true God you have to inevitably cast much plain scripture to one side.

BTW the God of Israel in the OT did walk this earth, absolutely, but Christ was not the one true God Himself