Many CC Discussions Could Be Solved With Antinomy.

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homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,442
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#81
Considering that the Bible was written by 40+ people of God from many different cultures, over thousands of years - it's amazing that the collection (book) is as cohesive as it is and interrelates with itself and that all doctrines necessary for salvation etc. are internally consistent. That testifies to the power of God and the reality of the Bible being divine revelation from the Holy Spirit, not the strange imaginings of various people across the ages.
1 Corinthians 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,442
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#82
It's clear that the bible and beliefs do change over time. If you could read a king James bible to a first century christian they might not recognize that it was the bible or whatever they called the scriptures at the time. First off they wouldn't know what Easter was!

They never called jesus Jesus and probably had a different name for the gods as many first century Christians were just getting away from polytheistic beliefs.

If you went to seminary you would see the light about how the bible was written.
Yet no matter it is the Spirit of God given to us that teaches us and tell us all about Father and Son, and we are set free in truth and all is cohesive as to the Love of God given through Mercy through Son's Death
[h=3]Colossians 1:21-23[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

[SUP]21 [/SUP]And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled [SUP]22 [/SUP]in the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight: [SUP]23 [/SUP]if ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,442
204
63
#83
first off Hinduism and the Egyptian religions predate Judaism, can you show evidence otherwise?
What does that matter, when there has been no other that went to a cross died and was risen three days later in order to cancel out the old code through death, which brought in the new will and life to the believer from Father, in receiving his love best described in 1 cor 13:4-13
 
Aug 15, 2009
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#84
I thought of a very simple but scriptural paradox. So maybe there is a truth to this whole thing.

"Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." Romans 12:2

be transformed - μεταμορφοῦσθε Metamorphousthe.

This verb is the passive imperative in Greek. That means, that we are COMMANDED (imperative) to do this. But it is also passive, which means we are being acted upon by God.

I have pondered this verb in this important verse of Scripture for over 3 years now. How can we obey a command that requires God to do it to us?

I guess because we are walking with God, and we are obeying him, so he is transforming us, as we passively allow him to do it to us.

Is that an example of scriptural antimony, on the micro level?
Perhaps this scripture will help:
Ephesians 2:8-10 (KJV) [SUP]8 [/SUP]For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: [SUP]9 [/SUP]Not of works, lest any man should boast. [SUP]10 [/SUP]For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

God makes the change, & we allow ourselves to walk in it thru our subjection to Christ.
I look at your scripture like this: "you have been transformed, now live like it. Be who God has made you."
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,442
204
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#85
Was that not the EXACT same with Saul who became Paul? Saul wanted to KILL Christians, but GOD CHOSE him for a vessel to MAKE MORE CHRSITIANS...Do you see that Saul WILLED Satan's will but God's Will was that he would be PAUL for GOD'S will?

Where is Saul's free choice? Saul HAD no choice! God chose HIM not Sau lChose God! Man I think we should focus on who chose who for what. If God does not CHOOSE you, you will NEVER do God's will NEVER! And since when did ANY sinner choose to do God's will? If you look at the SALVATION process, it is ALL GOD! There is not one single step where man's will is a contributing factor to the salvation of the man. In fact the CHOICES the man made in the past is why the man NEED God and His salvation.

You think to highly of yourself if you think you contribute to your slavation with your will or choice. If God wants a man for His Kingdom, GOD WILL DO HIS WILL. And the man, does not even have a say in the process, let alone a will or a choice! God will save whom HE WANTS saved. And the rest? They will not get saved, as easy as that!
Saul still had free choice to choose not to do God's will, not forced, he changed his mind from unbelief to belief. Peter was told and did and then did not, then did again, back and forth was Peter being conflicted to walking flesh and listening to the Spirit of God, doing and not doing, yet as he experienced he learned. God just loves us, the more we grasp that concept while we were yet sinners Christ died for us, the deeper we might see the rescurrected Christ in us, and thus walk as he walked. It is a growth process.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,721
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#86
contraindications exist in the Bible because different people wrote it at different time periods. you cannot have the same idea as the next guy 100 years later living in a different city with possible differences in culture. laws inevitably change over time this is just part of the evolution of morality and the sociality of mankind
Doesn't the Author of Scripture transcend time and cultures, and why would He contradict Himself?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,442
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#87
Yes. Now, when two people claiming to be filled with the spirit disagree on a major issue, who is without the holy spirit?
I personally do not decide that for I judge no one, not even myself, that is God's job in me that takes care of the boards, boards or specks that get in my own eye being in unredeened flesh. Therefore I die daily to the self with Christ back at the cross, and be alive learning from God to listen to God and be wise and harmless at the same time
Romans 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
Romans 12:16 Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.
Romans 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
[h=1]Psalm 1 (Authorized (King James) Version)[/h]
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Add parallel[h=3]Psalm 1[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

[h=3]Psalm 1[/h][SUP]1 [/SUP]Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly,
nor standeth in the way of sinners,
nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful.
[SUP]2 [/SUP]But his delight is in the law of the Lord;
and in his law doth he meditate day and night.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water,
that bringeth forth his fruit in his season;
his leaf also shall not wither;
and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,721
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#88
first off Hinduism and the Egyptian religions predate Judaism, can you show evidence otherwise?
Well, if the Scriptures are true, and I believe they are, then you can't get any earlier than Adam and Eve.
Jesus spoke of Adam and Eve thus validating their primal existence.
Jesus had eyewitnesses (about 500) of his rising from the dead, thus validating His teachings.
What 'real world' proofs do you have that Hinduism and the Egyptian myths not only predate the Scriptures but are rooted in some kind of provable reality?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,442
204
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#89
Well, there isn't free will in scripture. Only slavery.

Romans 6

[SUP]15 [/SUP]What then? Shall we sin because we are not under the law but under grace? By no means! [SUP]16 [/SUP]Don’t you know that when you offer yourselves to someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey—whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness? [SUP]17 [/SUP]But thanks be to God that, though you used to be slaves to sin, you have come to obey from your heart the pattern of teaching that has now claimed your allegiance. [SUP]18 [/SUP]You have been set free from sin and have become slaves to righteousness.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]I am using an example from everyday life because of your human limitations. Just as you used to offer yourselves as slaves to impurity and to ever-increasing wickedness, so now offer yourselves as slaves to righteousness leading to holiness. [SUP]20 [/SUP]When you were slaves to sin, you were free from the control of righteousness. [SUP]21 [/SUP]What benefit did you reap at that time from the things you are now ashamed of? Those things result in death! [SUP]22 [/SUP]But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the benefit you reap leads to holiness, and the result is eternal life. [SUP]23 [/SUP]For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in[SUP][b][/SUP] Christ Jesus our Lord.
When one is born again you are free indeed
I am a willing slave unto Father through Christ, and you are not, is that you are saying? If this is so, you make God out to be a tyrant.
Did he not say to Adam he has free will, yet in this free will if he ate from that certain tree he would die, that would be the consequence right? Did God lie? I think not, now man has been enslaved ever since to flesh yes, but when born of the Spirit we are freed form the bondage of flesh and alive forever more, eating from the tree of life (Christ) dead to flesh and alive in the Spirit of God. being a willing vessel for God to use us, not force us. If that was the case he would have forced Peter, and he never did, instead poured Mercy on him over and over again, and Peter came to full truth and learned to trust God to walk in it, and thus was free all the time, thanks to the Mercy of God through Son, Christ

It is this love of God that teaches a man to say no to unrighteousness willingly by the Mercy given. Where as commandment causes the flesh to continue to sin
Gal. 6:8
Galatians 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting
 

Tr

Banned
Jan 22, 2014
186
1
0
#90
I never said they were true, I just said that they predate Judaism and that is a fact, along with a few other religions.

Well, if the Scriptures are true, and I believe they are, then you can't get any earlier than Adam and Eve.
Jesus spoke of Adam and Eve thus validating their primal existence.
Jesus had eyewitnesses (about 500) of his rising from the dead, thus validating His teachings.
What 'real world' proofs do you have that Hinduism and the Egyptian myths not only predate the Scriptures but are rooted in some kind of provable reality?
 
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
141
0
#91
I used to call these seemingly contradictory beliefs "Godly paradoxes", but Immanuel Kant's philosophical device the "antinomy" appears to be more relevant.

Antinomies occur when there are two truths presented in the Bible that seem to contradict each other. Things such as human responsibility and God's election, the command to pray and God's sovereignty, or Jesus' status as God-man can cause people to stumble in their faith or pursue bad theology. By choosing one truth over the other, you are forced to reject or reinterpret Scriptures to fit your view. It is important to understand the practical application of an antinomy. By faith you can accept both seemingly opposing ideas to be equally true and therefore grasp the message of the various texts of Scripture (Landis, Don. 2013 The Genius of Ancient Man, p.102).

Our Triune God is Absolute Truth, as is His Word, the Bible. If we believe those beliefs to be true, the truths revealed in the Bible that seem to be at odds with each other, must equally be true. Think about it.
Antinomies are resolved, and do not conflict, in the secret will of God (Dt 29:29).
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,721
3,659
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#92
I never said they were true, I just said that they predate Judaism and that is a fact, along with a few other religions.
I just gave you evidence that the Scriptures are older and are rooted in time and space, you gave me nothing.
 
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Tintin

Guest
#93
Antinomies are resolved, and do not conflict, in the secret will of God (Dt 29:29).
You're correct but the words 'seem to conflict' are key here.
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#94
Jimmy, yes, we're slaves to sin or slaves to righteousness. But being a slave to righteousness is markedly different to being a slave in the flawed, sinful, human understanding of the word. It's working for God and doing His will, as we were first created to do.
 
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phil112

Guest
#95
I think it is an injustice to say we are slaves to righteousness. Slavery is something that happens to an unwilling participant. We are fellow workers, yoked together, for Christ. We labor much as a team of yoked oxen might (or we should), but that is something we do volunteerily.
 
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Tintin

Guest
#96
I think it is an injustice to say we are slaves to righteousness. Slavery is something that happens to an unwilling participant. We are fellow workers, yoked together, for Christ. We labor much as a team of yoked oxen might (or we should), but that is something we do volunteerily.
It's the terminology the Bible uses. Like I said, it's very different to our understanding of slavery that treats people like animals or worse.
 
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Tintin

Guest
#97
I never said they were true, I just said that they predate Judaism and that is a fact, along with a few other religions.
How can pagan religions predate the one True God, whom you pertain to believe in?
 
B

BananaPie

Guest
#98
first off Hinduism and the Egyptian religions predate Judaism, can you show evidence otherwise?
...before there were people in India & Egypt, God had found favor upon Noah, Abraham, Isaac & Jacob. These are the Bible's patriarchs. :)
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,280
6,565
113
#99
Is it possible God selects any who turn to Him. If one seeks truth earnestly, he does find It, and It is God. Thus, God chooses those who seek Him.

Knock and the door shall be opened.
 
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Tintin

Guest
...before there were people in India & Egypt, God had found favor upon Noah, Abraham, Isaac & Jacob. These are the Bible's patriarchs. :)
Yes, all the people of the world (at the time) travelled from the Tower of Babel to Egypt and India and so on.