Naming days like the pagans. Why do we do that?

[IamWhoIam]

Start by observance of the Sabbaths that are outlined in the feasts, and then we will know where to begin. Read Exodus chapter 16. Remember, Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath, He is our Creator, and I think it is laid out so no one can actually calculate the times and seasons except the Lord of the times and seasons. He created them, not us.

yes indeed, remember all calanders have to adjust the days, they have always done that, it would be really hard to go in reverse mode back to the first century.

looking at Genesis God said He rested on the seventh day, in a 28 day cycle there are 4 sabbaths, can you explain why the Jewish calander goes by a lunar calander, a lunar cycle is 29.5 days? Why didn't they Just keep counting to 7 then rest on that day the seventh? Then on the 14th then on the 21st, 28th, 35th, and so on.

has the system Jewish system been flawed from the beginning, if so why did Jesus honor the sabbath on the day Jewish people do on a Saturday they did it in Biblical times, the Jewish people stil do it today.

 

[AbigailZeke]

I think we're not only tempted in this world. We're constantly distracted by trivial stuff.

Mary chose the one thing that matters.

 

[Locutus]

 

[IamWhoIam]

If we lived our lives worried about every little thing affected by pagan culture we'd have to ship all Christian to their own little island and create a new culture. Hopefully one that would be self sufficient since it'd be impossible to initiate trade with other countries due to our rejecting the days of the week. And in doing so we would become isolated and an irrelevant group of religious nuts.

We are 'in' the world, not of it. The bible does say we are in the world. And being in that world as ambassadors. These trivialities you mention do nothing but distract from the real purpose of following Christ. Is God really concerned if i say Monday? Doubt it. Put up a Christmas tree? Not likely. No doubt if i continued going down the list of pagan influenced norms i'd find something that you do and would make excuses for continuing. I've yet to meet a single 'cut out the pagan' types willing to take it 100%. For all the bluster they end up compromising in the end. Making the entire process irrelevant. Correction, more irrelevant.
But i didn't see God complaining about such things. God is more worried about our striving in a relationship with Him, supporting our brothers and sister and being witnesses. Worrying about the name of the day or the week doesn't have much importance in the message of the Cross.

And the Jewish people as well, their no better than Christians, God said the seventh day is the sabbath, I really don't know why they honor the sabbath on a Saturday, yet go by a lunar calander, there are in 28 days 4 sabbaths. why did the Jewish people just stop counting days and move to the lunar calander.

And I agree we shouldn't get all emotional over if it's the 14th day of a Jewish calander or the second Saturday in a month. neither one of these statements are correct. that's why I think Jesus honored that day every week no matter who thought that day was either the 14th or Saturday. He went along with what was being used at that time.

 

[unobtrusive]

yes indeed, remember all calanders have to adjust the days, they have always done that, it would be really hard to go in reverse mode back to the first century.

looking at Genesis God said He rested on the seventh day, in a 28 day cycle there are 4 sabbaths, can you explain why the Jewish calander goes by a lunar calander, a lunar cycle is 29.5 days? Why didn't they Just keep counting to 7 then rest on that day the seventh? Then on the 14th then on the 21st, 28th, 35th, and so on.

has the system Jewish system been flawed from the beginning, if so why did Jesus honor the sabbath on the day Jewish people do on a Saturday they did it in Biblical times, the Jewish people stil do it today.

I have yet to find anyone quoting a scripture that names days.

 

[IamWhoIam]

I don't think we use the system like the Roman pagans but it is what has been used for many centuries. Wasn't really something adopted at some point but what people have used for a very long time.
A web write up on it.

In ancient Mesopotamia, astrologers assigned each day of the week the name of a god. In a culture where days were consumed by religion, it is unsurprising that the days of the week were made in homage to the gods believed to rule the lives of mortals.
Many centuries later, the Romans, upon beginning to use the seven day week, adopted the names of the week to fit their own gods. These were then adopted by Germanic people who also adjusted the names according to their gods. It is predominantly these Germanic and Norse gods that have lived on today in the days of the week, which are outlined below.
Sunday, as you may be able to guess, is the “Sun’s Day” – the name of a pagan Roman holiday. In many folklore traditions, Sunday was believed to be a lucky day for babies born. Many societies have worshiped the sun and sun-gods. Perhaps the most famous is the Egyptian Sun-god Ra, who was the lord of time.
Monday comes from the Anglo-Saxon ‘monandaeg’ which is the “Moon’s Day”. On this day people gave homage to the goddess of the moon. It was believed by ancients that there were three Mondays during the year that were considered to be unlucky: first Monday in April, second in August and last in December.
Tuesday is the first to be named after a Germanic god – Tiu (or Twia) – a god of war and the sky and associated with the Norse god Tyr, who was a defender god in Viking mythology. Tiu is associated with Mars. He is usually shown with only one hand. In the most famous myth about Týr he placed his hand between the jaws of the wolf Fenrir as a mark of good faith while the other gods, pretending to play, bound the wolf. When Fenrir realised he had been tricked he bit off Tyr's hand.
Wednesday means “Woden’s Day” (in Norse, ‘Odin’), the Old Norse’s equivalent to Mercury, who was the messenger to the gods and the Roman god of commerce, travel and science. He was considered the chief god and leader of the wild hunt in Anglo-Saxon mythology, but the name directly translated means “violently insane headship” – not exactly the name of a loving and kind god! Woden was the ruler of Asgard, the hoe of the gods, and is able to shift and change into different forms.
Thursday was “Thor’s Day”, named after the Norse god of thunder and lightning and is the Old Norse equivalent to Jupiter. Thor is often depicted holding a giant hammer and during the 10 thand 11 th centuries when Christians tried to convert the Scandinavians, many wore emblems of Thor’s hammer as a symbol of defiance against the new religion.
Friday is associated with Freya, the wife of Woden and the Norse goddess of love, marriage and fertility, who is equivalent to Venus, the Roman goddess of love.
Lastly, Saturday derives from “Saturn’s Day”, a Roman god associated with wealth, plenty and time. It is the only English week-day still associated with a Roman god, Saturn. The Hebrews called Saturday the "Sabbath", meaning, day of rest. The Bible identifies Saturday as the last day of the week.
The seven-day week originates with in ancient Babylon prior to 600 BC, when time was marked with the lunar cycle, which experienced different seven-day cycles. A millennium later, Emperor Constantine converted Rome to Christianity and standardised the seven-day week across the Empire. Rome may initially have acquired the seven-day week from the mystical beliefs of Babylonian astrologers. But it was the biblical story of creation, God making the Heavens and Earth and resting on the seventh day that will have led the first Christian emperor of Rome to make sure it endured to this day.

 

[unobtrusive]

I think we're not only tempted in this world. We're constantly distracted by trivial stuff.

Mary chose the one thing that matters.

What did Mary choose?

 

[unobtrusive]

I don't think we use the system like the Roman pagans but it is what has been used for many centuries. Wasn't really something adopted at some point but what people have used for a very long time.
A web write up on it.

In ancient Mesopotamia, astrologers assigned each day of the week the name of a god. In a culture where days were consumed by religion, it is unsurprising that the days of the week were made in homage to the gods believed to rule the lives of mortals.
Many centuries later, the Romans, upon beginning to use the seven day week, adopted the names of the week to fit their own gods. These were then adopted by Germanic people who also adjusted the names according to their gods. It is predominantly these Germanic and Norse gods that have lived on today in the days of the week, which are outlined below.
Sunday, as you may be able to guess, is the “Sun’s Day” – the name of a pagan Roman holiday. In many folklore traditions, Sunday was believed to be a lucky day for babies born. Many societies have worshiped the sun and sun-gods. Perhaps the most famous is the Egyptian Sun-god Ra, who was the lord of time.
Monday comes from the Anglo-Saxon ‘monandaeg’ which is the “Moon’s Day”. On this day people gave homage to the goddess of the moon. It was believed by ancients that there were three Mondays during the year that were considered to be unlucky: first Monday in April, second in August and last in December.
Tuesday is the first to be named after a Germanic god – Tiu (or Twia) – a god of war and the sky and associated with the Norse god Tyr, who was a defender god in Viking mythology. Tiu is associated with Mars. He is usually shown with only one hand. In the most famous myth about Týr he placed his hand between the jaws of the wolf Fenrir as a mark of good faith while the other gods, pretending to play, bound the wolf. When Fenrir realised he had been tricked he bit off Tyr's hand.
Wednesday means “Woden’s Day” (in Norse, ‘Odin’), the Old Norse’s equivalent to Mercury, who was the messenger to the gods and the Roman god of commerce, travel and science. He was considered the chief god and leader of the wild hunt in Anglo-Saxon mythology, but the name directly translated means “violently insane headship” – not exactly the name of a loving and kind god! Woden was the ruler of Asgard, the hoe of the gods, and is able to shift and change into different forms.
Thursday was “Thor’s Day”, named after the Norse god of thunder and lightning and is the Old Norse equivalent to Jupiter. Thor is often depicted holding a giant hammer and during the 10 thand 11 th centuries when Christians tried to convert the Scandinavians, many wore emblems of Thor’s hammer as a symbol of defiance against the new religion.
Friday is associated with Freya, the wife of Woden and the Norse goddess of love, marriage and fertility, who is equivalent to Venus, the Roman goddess of love.
Lastly, Saturday derives from “Saturn’s Day”, a Roman god associated with wealth, plenty and time. It is the only English week-day still associated with a Roman god, Saturn. The Hebrews called Saturday the "Sabbath", meaning, day of rest. The Bible identifies Saturday as the last day of the week.
The seven-day week originates with in ancient Babylon prior to 600 BC, when time was marked with the lunar cycle, which experienced different seven-day cycles. A millennium later, Emperor Constantine converted Rome to Christianity and standardised the seven-day week across the Empire. Rome may initially have acquired the seven-day week from the mystical beliefs of Babylonian astrologers. But it was the biblical story of creation, God making the Heavens and Earth and resting on the seventh day that will have led the first Christian emperor of Rome to make sure it endured to this day.

I thank you greatly for these facts. To all the read this thread, be it known, Constantine wasn't a Christian. His priority was Rome.

 

[IamWhoIam]

I have yet to find anyone quoting a scripture that names days.

no you won't and you won't find the Jewish calander following what God said every 7th day is a rest day, do Jewish people honor the sabbath on a Friday or Sunday or Monday, no they do not but you will find that they honor it on a Saturday as well they did that in biblical times, Jesus honored the sabbath every 7th day, not by what God said to do, but by the Jewish ways that was being used a lunar cycle which has 29.5 days one day and a half longer then 28 days, Jesus knew the system was flawed but did it anyways, for actual time is only for man and man only, I wouldn't get overly concerned with the system, every time system calander that has ever been in use is flawed.

if people actually followed what God said and rested on the seventh day, then at some point that day will be in a middle of a week. when Jesus was on the cross the sabbath wasn't being honored in the middle of the week regardless want the name of that day is or isn't.

God rested on the seventh day, but God is always working, Jesus said that himself.

 

[IamWhoIam]

Have a good weekend, I usely don't get on during that time so this be last post for afew days. lol

 

[unobtrusive]

no you won't and you won't find the Jewish calander following what God said every 7th day is a rest day, do Jewish people honor the sabbath on a Friday or Sunday or Monday, no they do not but you will find that they honor it on a Saturday as well they did that in biblical times, Jesus honored the sabbath every 7th day, not by what God said to do, but by the Jewish ways that was being used a lunar cycle which has 29.5 days one day and a half longer then 28 days, Jesus knew the system was flawed but did it anyways, for actual time is only for man and man only, I wouldn't get overly concerned with the system, every time system calander that has ever been in use is flawed.

if people actually followed what God said and rested on the seventh day, then at some point that day will be in a middle of a week. when Jesus was on the cross the sabbath wasn't being honored in the middle of the week regardless want the name of that day is or isn't.

God rested on the seventh day, but God is always working, Jesus said that himself.

Jesus would never have attributed to something that was flawed.

 

[IamWhoIam]

Maybe one more, in the Jewish calander what ever the name of the sabbath day falls on 14th or 15th, you can be rest assured it's equalvalent is equal to what we call Saturday, how do I know look at how the Jewish people honor the sabbath no matter what they call it it is the same as what we call Saturday,

thanks for the OT statement of the 14th being the Passover for I know now what day that is in my terminology I use, it's Saturday.

 

[IamWhoIam]

Jesus would never have attributed to something that was flawed.

o yea are humans flawed, I rest my case, cya bud,

 

[unobtrusive]

yes indeed, remember all calanders have to adjust the days, they have always done that, it would be really hard to go in reverse mode back to the first century.

looking at Genesis God said He rested on the seventh day, in a 28 day cycle there are 4 sabbaths, can you explain why the Jewish calander goes by a lunar calander, a lunar cycle is 29.5 days? Why didn't they Just keep counting to 7 then rest on that day the seventh? Then on the 14th then on the 21st, 28th, 35th, and so on.

has the system Jewish system been flawed from the beginning, if so why did Jesus honor the sabbath on the day Jewish people do on a Saturday they did it in Biblical times, the Jewish people stil do it today.

When we are talking about scripture between each other, just number the days instead, just like the Bible. I know we cannot live by the numbering of days, and yes we are in the world, but we don't need to use the naming of days when conversing about scripture. It's not necessary, and it causes problems. When conversing Biblical doctrine, use Biblical terms. That's all I'm saying.

 

[unobtrusive]

Maybe one more, in the Jewish calander what ever the name of the sabbath day falls on 14th or 15th, you can be rest assured it's equalvalent is equal to what we call Saturday, how do I know look at how the Jewish people honor the sabbath no matter what they call it it is the same as what we call Saturday,

thanks for the OT statement of the 14th being the Passover for I know now what day that is in my terminology I use, it's Saturday.

I don't follow Judaism, and neither should we. I don't follow evangelicals either. They have it just as messed up as the Jewish traditions, just in the opposite direction. Find the truth in scripture, one reference confirming the other. If there seems to be a contradiction, then we have it all wrong.

 

[Kavik]

Day names in European cultures were in place LONG before Christianity ever entered the picture. After being Christianized, as others mentioned, people still needed a way to recon the days and mark/reference time. Names were already in place and incredibly well established; I'm pretty sure the thought was "why re-invent the wheel?". In historical texts (as well as the Bible), actual names of the week are not often mentioned; typically the formula is "Upon x day of x month, in the year x" . We still do it today - if something happens on a particular date, we don't typically also reference what day of the week it was.

 

[unobtrusive]

Day names in European cultures were in place LONG before Christianity ever entered the picture. After being Christianized, as others mentioned, people still needed a way to recon the days and mark/reference time. Names were already in place and incredibly well established; I'm pretty sure the thought was "why re-invent the wheel?". In historical texts (as well as the Bible), actual names of the week are not often mentioned; typically the formula is "Upon x day of x month, in the year x" . We still do it today - if something happens on a particular date, we don't typically also reference what day of the week it was.

Good points that you make. Concerning the "true" Sabbath day, it may not be Saturday or Sunday, neither one. For all we know it could be Wednesday, or Thursday, but what's the difference when we are supposed to be edifying each other, and it turns into an argument about what day of the week this or that should be observed, when none of us actually know. I don't care when the Jews observe the Sabbath. I don't care when evangelicals observe the Sabbath. Are we not all supposed to be one in the sight of God? However they can serve the Lord Jesus Christ in spirit and in truth, that is what matters. Stop quibbling about Saturday and Sunday, Wednesday, or even "Good Friday." It is vanity to say the least. And may I add, in my opinion, and probably in Christ's opinion, it's rather disgusting to discuss the truth, and then start naming days.

I came in CC as "unobtrusive" so I'd better let my feelings subside.

 

[Dino246]

When discussing scripture, is it wise to name the days?

Possibly, if it helps the reader understand the context. If we understand the Shabbat to fall on Friday/Saturday (rightly or wrongly) then we can talk about Wednesday, or whatever, in relation to Saturday, rather than using a somewhat-awkward and verbose construction like, "the third day before Shabbat". That could actually lead to more confusion, as we don't readily understand the scriptural method (or cultural method of that time) of referencing days.

For example, when Jesus is responding regarding Herod, he says, “Go and tell that fox, ‘Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today and tomorrow, and the third day I reach My goal.’ There is an implied reference to his death and resurrection, but it would be "two days from today" rather than "three days from today" the way we read His words. Yet when He is referring to Jonah, He says, "for just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the sea monster, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." Only if the first instance took place in the evening could those be reconciled; Scripture doesn't tell us that part.

If Jesus had said, "I will be crucified on a 'Naphtali-day' and rise again to life on a 'Reuben-day', we might understand a little better what He meant. That He didn't use (or inspire) names for weekdays, doesn't mean we shouldn't; it only means there is no biblical standard for us to use, so we use the one in our culture.

Japan attacked Pearl Harbour on December 7, 1941. The date means a lot to Americans and historians because of that attack and the war that followed. What some don't know is that it was a Sunday morning, partly chosen by the Japanese as a time when the American people would be relaxed and looking forward to a peaceful day. The date lives 'in infamy' but the day of the week was, at the time, more important. Even so, the name given to the day is irrelevant, other than as a cultural standard.

I suggest that where the Scripture is silent, we don't make an issue of it. Where the Holy Spirit convicts us personally, then we are to follow His leading.

 

[unobtrusive]

Possibly, if it helps the reader understand the context. If we understand the Shabbat to fall on Friday/Saturday (rightly or wrongly) then we can talk about Wednesday, or whatever, in relation to Saturday, rather than using a somewhat-awkward and verbose construction like, "the third day before Shabbat". That could actually lead to more confusion, as we don't readily understand the scriptural method (or cultural method of that time) of referencing days.

For example, when Jesus is responding regarding Herod, he says, “Go and tell that fox, ‘Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today and tomorrow, and the third day I reach My goal.’ There is an implied reference to his death and resurrection, but it would be "two days from today" rather than "three days from today" the way we read His words. Yet when He is referring to Jonah, He says, "for just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the sea monster, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." Only if the first instance took place in the evening could those be reconciled; Scripture doesn't tell us that part.

If Jesus had said, "I will be crucified on a 'Naphtali-day' and rise again to life on a 'Reuben-day', we might understand a little better what He meant. That He didn't use (or inspire) names for weekdays, doesn't mean we shouldn't; it only means there is no biblical standard for us to use, so we use the one in our culture.

Japan attacked Pearl Harbour on December 7, 1941. The date means a lot to Americans and historians because of that attack and the war that followed. What some don't know is that it was a Sunday morning, partly chosen by the Japanese as a time when the American people would be relaxed and looking forward to a peaceful day. The date lives 'in infamy' but the day of the week was, at the time, more important. Even so, the name given to the day is irrelevant, other than as a cultural standard.

I suggest that where the Scripture is silent, we don't make an issue of it. Where the Holy Spirit convicts us personally, then we are to follow His leading.

I was born on Pearl Harbor Day. This year it is on a Thursday. Maybe Christ was killed on Wednesday the 14th. Maybe this year it is Sunday. We can paraphrase all we want, but when discussing God's Word why not use the phraseology He used - why clutter the discussion with our modern cultural departure from what Almighty God gave us in His Word to us? Isn't that exactly what Israel did by adopting Canaanite tradition? And then we have the audacity to say that Israel forsook the instructions of their Master and because of that the covenant with them is null and void. Are we not doing exactly the same thing, making excuses for what we have been forced into, and then bringing those excuses into the church - how sad!

 

[unobtrusive]

o yea are humans flawed, I rest my case, cya bud,

CYA = Cover your........ How sad.

Rebuke not an elder, but intreat him as a father; and the younger men as brethren; (1 Timothy 5:1)

What have we become these days?