Not By Works

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dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
46,144
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I only believe in 3 points of the 5 point Calvinism. Therefore they DO NOT WANT TO CLAIM ME.

AND the Armenians DO NOT WANT TO CLAIM ME because I do believe in 3 Points of Calvinism.

SO WHAT AM I ? JUST AN BORN AGAIN CHRISTIAN, I attend a non-denominational, conservative evangelical type of Church.

I think it bugs everybody that is into that ARMENIAN VS. CALVINISM ARGUMENT.
Same here.....could care less about label or acronymns used to describe beliefs.....the bible describes us well enough.....!!
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
46,144
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lol. Ok, keep believing this. Its worse than I thought.. No wonder you have no faith in God. You do not even know who he is.

As for positional sanctification.

Paul

1 Cor 6: 11 You HAVE been washed, You HAVE been justified, you HAVE been sanctified (a completed act) thats positional sanctification

Heb 10: 10 - We HAVE BEEN (perfect tense) Sanctified. Again, A completed act.

Jude 1. To those who ARE SANCTIFIED (perfect tense) and preserved in christ. (Again, a completed act)

Again, Nice try, But you are wrong. Period.
It blows my mind when a supposed believer will lip flap and say something is not in scripture when it is listed and given NUMEROUS TIMES in context....at the end of the day it is PRIDE that keeps them lost in their beliefs.....they absolutely cannot admit the truth, because to do such would state that they or a loved one or their priest or preacher etc. were wrong....I had a Methodist man argue tooth and nail that if he was a good, moral man that God would not send him to hell....his reasoning...My Grandaddy and Daddy believed it and if it was good enough for them, it ia good enough for me.......my step dad is the same way....lost and though convicted at one time refused it because it contradicted his lost dad, that went out from cancer screaming that he was in flames and to please help him, begging for help and died that way screaming, wailing and weeping......true story!
 

lukeabers

Active member
Dec 6, 2018
223
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It blows my mind when a supposed believer will lip flap and say something is not in scripture when it is listed and given NUMEROUS TIMES in context....at the end of the day it is PRIDE that keeps them lost in their beliefs.....they absolutely cannot admit the truth, because to do such would state that they or a loved one or their priest or preacher etc. were wrong....I had a Methodist man argue tooth and nail that if he was a good, moral man that God would not send him to hell....his reasoning...My Grandaddy and Daddy believed it and if it was good enough for them, it ia good enough for me.......my step dad is the same way....lost amd though convicted at one time refused it because it contradicted his lost dad, that went out from cancer screaming that he was in flames to to help him, begging for help and died that way screaming, wailing and weeping......true story!
Well, at this point, you should maybe stop wasting so much time on people that don't want to listen and start helping those that are already on the same page.
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
46,144
20,066
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Well, at this point, you should maybe stop wasting so much time on people that don't want to listen and start helping those that are already on the same page.
Bro....I keep swinging for those who read the thread....I will address every false post until the gates of hell are welded shut.....and make no mistake friend....this thread, though very controversial and argumenative at times has helped quite a few people see the light.....they have stated so openly as well as behind the scenes emails.....I despise false gospels and those who devalue Jesus, his promises, power and work on our behalf....just saying bro and I like your statement that you made a few minutes ago....I am in Westfield Plaza in Penrith Australia on a Saturday 10:53 AM swinging the sword MATE...
 

lukeabers

Active member
Dec 6, 2018
223
35
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Bro....I keep swinging for those who read the thread....I will address every false post until the gates of hell are welded shut.....and make no mistake friend....this thread, though very controversial and argumenative at times has helped quite a few people see the light.....they have stated so openly as well as behind the scenes emails.....I despise false gospels and those who devalue Jesus, his promises, power and work on our behalf....just saying bro and I like your statement that you made a few minutes ago....I am in Westfield Plaza in Penrith Australia on a Saturday 10:53 AM swinging the sword MATE...
Well, I understand the sentiment, and there is certainly a place and time for everything...but, times are getting pretty dark...the time for harvest is closing. It is my hope to find those left within the Church that still believe...that still hear from God...

Evil in this world is quite organized...while each of us remain separate, conducting our own personal quixotic war...

I have spent a lot of time doing what you are doing, and I wonder if there is a better way.

P.S. I mean no disrespect here. I am an ally, brother. Christ is with us, and we are guided by the Holy Spirit....but it is easy to get distracted, the deck is, after all, stacked against us.
 

ljs

Member
Jan 13, 2018
305
440
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in Christ Alone my hope is found !!!!!

For any new believers reading this thread , just put your faith and trust in Christ for your salvation !!!!
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
10,259
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Here is both sides of the controversy with Biblical defense of both.

Quinquarticular Controversy
The diametrically opposed Calvinist and Armenian 5 points

Reformed/Calvinism
TULIP
1. Total depravity
2. Unconditional election
3. Limited atonement
4. Irresistible grace
5. Perserverance of the Saints

Armenianism
1. Free will or Human ability
2. Conditional election
3. Universal Redemption or General Atonement
4. The Holy Spirit can be Effectually Resisted
5. Falling from Grace

For a deeper discussion of the differences go to these web sites,

https://www.gotquestions.org/Calvinism-vs-Arminianism.html

Arminianism vs Calvinism Controversial Passages
https://www.xenos.org/essays/calvinism-arminianism-controversial-passages

There are denominations adhering to Calvinism, Arminianism, and parts of each creating a spectrum of different views of these issues.

Calvinism Armenianism debate
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Calvinist–Arminian_debate

Biblical Defense of Calvinism
https://www.fivesolas.com/tulipscriptures.htm

Biblical Defense of Arminianism
http://www.evidenceunseen.com/theology/calvinism-versus-arminianism/biblical-defense-of-arminianism/

And I believe BOTH have serious FLAWS IN THEM. Proof is in HOW LONG THIS ARGUMENT CONTINUES and CONTINUES.


Proverbs 6:16-19 (NIV)
16 There are six things the LORD hates, seven that are detestable to him:
17 haughty eyes, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood,
18 a heart that devises wicked schemes, feet that are quick to rush into evil,
19 a false witness who pours out lies and a man who stirs up dissension among brothers.
 

TruthTalk

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2017
2,904
2,259
113
Seoche....your drivel has no value with me....you are nothing more than a Catholic and an accuser of the brethern......exactly why what you post = valueless......!!

Get your facts straight and post some truth for once in your life and maybe you won't be put on ignore again by most and or sent packing!!
Hi decon, Argueless is Seoche, how the heck did that happen? Thanks for the warning.
 

TruthTalk

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2017
2,904
2,259
113
Quote VCO: "Reciting Creeds gives the people a FALSE SENSE OF SECURITY."

So what Kept man made false doctrines and errors from CREEPING INTO THOSE CREEDS, when MANY of the men who were instrumental in forming the CREEDS did not believe in BORN AGAIN, or had a False Opinion about IT ? ? ?

NONE of those were famous for teaching BORN AGAIN, and most of those were CATHOLIC in origin, OR Eastern Orthodoxy, so what prevented their particular SLANT on Scripture from Creeping in ? ? ? Eastern Orthodoxy or Oriental Orthodoxy are no more than a Hop Skip and a Jump from Catholicism. Reciting Creeds gives the people a FALSE SENSE OF SECURITY, that all they have to do is recite that CREED, and they are Saved, when they have NEVER BEEN BORN AGAIN. No remorseful repent of sin, No LOVING Personal Relationship with JESUS, No Submission to HIM as LORD meaning Master OUT OF PURE LOVE FOR HIM, etc. Reciting the Historical events of Christ does not make you a Christian; even the DEMONS CAN DO THAT. THAT IS THE PROBLEM WITH CREEDS.

Mark 5:7-9 (NIV)
7 He shouted at the top of his voice,
"What do you want with me, Jesus, Son of the Most High God?
Swear to God that you won't torture me!"

8 For Jesus had said to him, "Come out of this man, you evil spirit!"
9 Then Jesus asked him, "What is your name?"
"My name is Legion," he replied, "for we are many."
Quote VCO: "Reciting Creeds gives the people a FALSE SENSE OF SECURITY."

Amen and thank you VCO for your biblical insight. No true born again Christian is going to heaven based on reciting the words of a man made creed. It is only through believing in God's gift of faith in our redeemer and the blood bought faith of the "Death, Burial and Resurrection of our Lord and Master Jesus Christ."
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
46,144
20,066
113
Well, I understand the sentiment, and there is certainly a place and time for everything...but, times are getting pretty dark...the time for harvest is closing. It is my hope to find those left within the Church that still believe...that still hear from God...

Evil in this world is quite organized...while each of us remain separate, conducting our own personal quixotic war...

I have spent a lot of time doing what you are doing, and I wonder if there is a better way.

P.S. I mean no disrespect here. I am an ally, brother. Christ is with us, and we are guided by the Holy Spirit....but it is easy to get distracted, the deck is, after all, stacked against us.
Oh I agree, but greater is he that is in us than he that is in the world.....Noah preached 120 years and won no one and even Jesus had all forsake him for a time, but he said...."Not my will, but your will be done" Keep swinging friend.....even if NONE OR ONE believes it will be worth the effort IMV
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
46,144
20,066
113
Hi decon, Argueless is Seoche, how the heck did that happen? Thanks for the warning.
Well, He posts in the same accusatory style with the same drivel, same verbiage and has not denied it whan I called him Seoche....so......if not, my bad....if it is....walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, looks like a duck.......!!!
 

TruthTalk

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2017
2,904
2,259
113
why are all these people coming back under different user names ????
Hi Ljs, yes exactly my thoughts as well, is there any way to stop this deception, I think every body would like to know.

God bless!
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
46,144
20,066
113
why are all these people coming back under different user names ????
You know....history is an interesting subject.....for example and based upon 32 or 33 years of studying the bible, rise and fall of 7 kingdoms and other various disciplines I have come to the following truth....

Horus is Bel is Marduke is Merodach is Jupiter is Zeus is Allah is Satan.......

Different names, same old story and idolatrous false dogmas........!!!!

I figure you are smart enough to get it!

Keep swinging friend
 

J70x7

Active member
Jun 13, 2018
402
63
28
You know....history is an interesting subject.....for example and based upon 32 or 33 years of studying the bible, rise and fall of 7 kingdoms and other various disciplines I have come to the following truth....

Horus is Bel is Marduke is Merodach is Jupiter is Zeus is Allah is Satan.......

Different names, same old story and idolatrous false dogmas........!!!!

I figure you are smart enough to get it!

Keep swinging friend
2 Thessalonians 2:14
Therefore, brethren, stand fast; and hold the traditions which you have learned, whether by word, or by our epistle.

Titus 1:9
Embracing that faithful word which is according to doctrine, that he may be able to exhort in sound doctrine, and to convince the gainsayers.
 

J70x7

Active member
Jun 13, 2018
402
63
28
You know....history is an interesting subject.....for example and based upon 32 or 33 years of studying the bible, rise and fall of 7 kingdoms and other various disciplines I have come to the following truth....

Horus is Bel is Marduke is Merodach is Jupiter is Zeus is Allah is Satan.......

Different names, same old story and idolatrous false dogmas........!!!!

I figure you are smart enough to get it!

Keep swinging friend
Matthew 10:22
And you shall be hated by all men for my name's sake: but he that shall persevere unto the end, he shall be saved

Matthew 24:13
But he that shall persevere to the end, he shall be saved.

Hebrews 12:7
Persevere under discipline. God dealeth with you as with his sons; for what son is there, whom the father doth not correct?
 

Argueless

Active member
Oct 21, 2018
658
161
43
Seoche....your drivel has no value with me....you are nothing more than a Catholic and an accuser of the brethern......exactly why what you post = valueless......!!

Get your facts straight and post some truth for once in your life and maybe you won't be put on ignore again by most and or sent packing!!
Only proves you believe in yourself and not God. Keep rejecting the truth of God and believe your FALSE MAN MADE DOCTRINES.

Why did God give warnings if IT'S not necessary because you believe that ONCE a person is saved, HE is always saved.

When there are warnings and you don't take heed of them, YOU have to suffer the consequences.

You warned me of being banned from this forum but I'd rather take heed of GOD'S warnings if I were you.

...do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body i n hell. Matthew 10:28

...But the COWARDLY, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and ALL LIARS—their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.” Revelation 21:8

...He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the majesty of his power 2Thessalonians 1:8-9

...Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God’s wrath comes on those who are disobedient.7 Therefore do not be partners with them. Ephesians 5:6