Not By Works

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FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
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Wrong again.

In Matt: 13:22 Jesus said the seed in the third soil represents a man who hears the word but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke it making it unfruitful.

A planted seed can take life and grow without bearing fruit because neither of these are fruit-bearing events.

Ever see a tomato plant with no tomatoes...it happens.

The way a believer bears fruit is to remain in a close personal relationship with the Lord, following the prompting of the Holy Spirit, and working in the strength of the Lord.

Many people do not do this.

Plus fruit in this parable can mean converts.
I was talking to a brother about our lives the other day.
He had done a bible study and had written out a bible study conclusion.

It was his understanding of Gods word in his life.
And I saw the fruit of the word of life in another. It is the words of life
flowing from someone like it is part of who they are.
This fruit is not good works alone, but the word of God being expressed in
His people.

So me sharing here is part of the word being expressed and any other
believer whose Jesus's words dwell within. So the idea of fruit as good
works is actually a distraction. If the word is polluted and destroyed,
it can die, and the faith collapse. This implies these people lose salvation
and their eternal destiny, because they have become enemies to the very
word that brought them life.
 

Hevosmies

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2018
3,461
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Wrong again.

In Matt: 13:22 Jesus said the seed in the third soil represents a man who hears the word but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke it making it unfruitful.

A planted seed can take life and grow without bearing fruit because neither of these are fruit-bearing events.

Ever see a tomato plant with no tomatoes...it happens.

The way a believer bears fruit is to remain in a close personal relationship with the Lord, following the prompting of the Holy Spirit, and working in the strength of the Lord.

Many people do not do this.

Plus fruit in this parable can mean converts.
But Jesus also said the Father takes away all branches that dont bear fruit. So I believe its impossible to not have fruit and be saved.

Here is the verses i mean:


Joh 15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
Joh 15:2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
Joh 15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
Joh 15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
Joh 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Joh 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

In verses1 and 2 it says its the Father thats takes away those branches with no fruit.
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
5,251
2,463
113
Good.
You haven't much to say anyway....
Thus the comments that make no sense.
I have the capacity to understand that you do not, nor do you possess the ears to hear. Tragic really. My prayer is that God would grant you both.

Beyond all of this, your position is untenable.
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
113
I have the capacity to understand that you do not, nor do you possess the ears to hear. Tragic really. My prayer is that God would grant you both.

Beyond all of this, your position is untenable.
You don't know my position...
You just think you do.

And thanks for your prayers.
We all could use some prayer.
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
5,251
2,463
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right.

no fruit- no salvation.

but, that is where the conversation needs to end.
when you start talking about how much fruit one bears, what time frame does one bear it, in then the focus turns from faith to works, which do NOT save.

your salvation is not maintained by bearing fruit, fruit tress bear fruit BECAUSE they are fruit trees, not to prove that they are fruit trees.
Right on....
 
Oct 31, 2015
1,807
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WHAT!!???

THIS IS a false, works Gospel!

God is NOT going to toss HIS born again Children in Hell.
Those who have built on the firm foundation of Jesus Christ with wood hay and stubble will suffer loss, but THEY themselves will be saved.


This type of works for Salvation Gospel by JPT is dangerous, and needs to be stamped out.

Your opinion carries no weight at all.


Stating your opinion based theology in direct opposition to what the scriptures teach is extremly foolish.


As we all see, it’s not a “works based” Gospel.


Not one single person hear claims we are saved, born again, by doing good works.


The fact that you create this bald faced lie, only proves you are the one who is promoting a false gospel, because your gospel is all about your man made theology.



Here is the plain truth.


Here is who will receive eternal life on that Day.



  • eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7



Why do you disagree with this scripture?



You are only deceiving yourself and your family.




JPT
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,198
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I will address you directly this one time only. and this is for fran also.
the reason I fight so hard is this- THERE IS ONLY ONE WAY- believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.
you and others are offering another way.
there is no other way. there is no " believe in Jesus and....."
once you put the "and " in there, you just left the narrow way.
once you leave it, you are on the broad road of destruction.
I understand that it is hard to resist religion, religion says " do good and be saved ".
but, that is not the Gospel.
the Gospel- believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. and you will be saved.
"believe" what about Jesus. Believe He cannot change you and make you into His likeness.

It is a hollow faith to believe slop buckets stay slop buckets. Are you saying this is true?
And I know the analogy is too strong for you, because you actually have no answer to it.
If you believed Christ could transform you into His likeness, your heart would cry
halleluyah, Abba Father, because that is your heart song.

Paul expressed he strained all the time for the day of a new body, that removed our
limitations we have now.

When I came to faith, pride was hurt, I was brought so low, I felt I was undone, and
had to learn everything from scratch. Little did I know how true this was.
The Lord is our King, and His way is the only way to eternal life, Amen.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
8,027
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"believe" what about Jesus. Believe He cannot change you and make you into His likeness.

It is a hollow faith to believe slop buckets stay slop buckets. Are you saying this is true?
And I know the analogy is too strong for you, because you actually have no answer to it.
If you believed Christ could transform you into His likeness, your heart would cry
halleluyah, Abba Father, because that is your heart song.

Paul expressed he strained all the time for the day of a new body, that removed our
limitations we have now.

When I came to faith, pride was hurt, I was brought so low, I felt I was undone, and
had to learn everything from scratch. Little did I know how true this was.
The Lord is our King, and His way is the only way to eternal life, Amen.
see, right here.

load of garbage.

" believe in Jesus for transformation ".

no, no , no.

believe in Jesus for SALVATiON.

then, transformation will come.

and, now, I wil no longer address you .

you have been " transformed " so much that you think it is fine to try to deceive the site and members into thinking that you are not someone who has been banned at least twice.
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
5,251
2,463
113
Looks like we have newly conscripted trolls infesting the board. CHALISofbenediction and a few others. Clearly spamming and obstructing. Soon to be reported.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,198
113
see, right here.
load of garbage.
" believe in Jesus for transformation ".
no, no , no.
believe in Jesus for SALVATiON.
then, transformation will come.
and, now, I wil no longer address you .
you have been " transformed " so much that you think it is fine to try to deceive the site and members into thinking that you are not someone who has been banned at least twice.
"load of garbage"
My friend, your bucket has been split.

The truth is no matter what I say, it does not echo with your heart so you through
out words that display this. I feel you heart, and hear it.

Jesus put is like this

For the one whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God gives the Spirit without limit.
The Father loves the Son and has placed everything in his hands.
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God's wrath remains on him."
John 3:34-36

You cannot get a simpler idea. Can Jesus transform you? You hate this notion
you dress it up in other language and I hear you. God bless you, I wish you well
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,198
113
see, right here.
load of garbage.
" believe in Jesus for transformation ".
no, no , no.
believe in Jesus for SALVATiON.
then, transformation will come.
and, now, I wil no longer address you .
you have been " transformed " so much that you think it is fine to try to deceive the site and members into thinking that you are not someone who has been banned at least twice.
A religious man will say, I am saved, but not I walk like Jesus, because they know
this is impossible.
A disciple will say, Jesus is my Saviour, and I follow, and He is transforming me as
I walk into eternal life. I am saved because He will bring me to His likeness, now
or when I meet Him, knowing He can complete the work He is doing in their heart.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
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What a song of praise, to be like Jesus, to reign with Him on His throne.

Can any sheep, any believer not rejoice at these promises, or doubt their
reality? I think not, because then it would deny their salvation.

So if you heart says "I am saved" yet declares not the above what are you?
Ask Jesus, because I can but testify to the great joy this expectation brings
me above all things.

And we, who with unveiled faces all reflect the Lord's glory, are being transformed into his likeness with ever-increasing glory, which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit
2 Cor 3:18

For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the likeness of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.
Rom 8:29

To him who overcomes, I will give the right to sit with me on my throne, just as I overcame and sat down with my Father on his throne.
Rev 3:21

Do not be down cast, or defeated, but rise in faith knowing Jesus went to the
cross to make this victory a reality in those who will believe in Him.
 
U

UnderGrace

Guest
Believe what you will UG.
Your'e too far off for me to deal with.
I'm really sorry.
So you can not offer a rebutta with scripture, it must be then that the truth of what I stated is irrefutable, is this why you are sorry?

Scripture refutes completely that one is not saved unless they have fruit.

We are saved by grace through faith not by fruit, not by the evidence of fruit and not by the lack of evidence.

Scripture is clear, to bear fruit we should is to remain in a close personal relationship with the Lord, following the prompting of the Holy Spirit, and working in the strength of the Lord.
 
U

UnderGrace

Guest
right.

no fruit- no salvation.

but, that is where the conversation needs to end.
when you start talking about how much fruit one bears, what time frame does one bear it, in then the focus turns from faith to works, which do NOT save.

your salvation is not maintained by bearing fruit, fruit tress bear fruit BECAUSE they are fruit trees, not to prove that they are fruit trees.
Wow a little surprised by this??

Do you think we are forced to bear fruit?

Jesus plainly teaches we need to abide to bear fruit, and what does He do to those branches that do not bear fruit?
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,198
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So you can not offer a rebutta with scripture, it must be then that the truth of what I stated is irrefutable, is this why you are sorry?
Scripture refutes completely that one is not saved unless they have fruit.
We are saved by grace through faith not by fruit, not by the evidence of fruit and not by the lack of evidence.
Scripture is clear, to bear fruit we should is to remain in a close personal relationship with the Lord, following the prompting of the Holy Spirit, and working in the strength of the Lord.
The thief on the cross showed fruit of life.
The fruit God is speaking of is His word, being processed by the believer and
their version of it being spoken out.

He saw his guilt, he saw Jesus and His innocence, he saw need and that Jesus
could save him. He wanted a different future, to be with Jesus in heaven.
His works was speaking out this faith to others around him.

So your belief in fruit is miss-placed. No unbeliever can bear the fruit of a believer,
the words of life. There is no such thing as a silent believer.
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
113
Looks like we have newly conscripted trolls infesting the board. CHALISofbenediction and a few others. Clearly spamming and obstructing. Soon to be reported.
What's the problem?
What do you come here for?
Some like to read along but don't post....
I don't believe this is against forum rules.....
Could you answer my post about Moses instead?

Do any of you guys against works ever answer posts?

Maybe you can't ........?
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
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Light and darkness

Where light shines the darkness goes away.

The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it.
John 1:5

Therefore judge nothing before the appointed time; wait till the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of men's hearts. At that time each will receive his praise from God.
1 Cor 4:5

But everything exposed by the light becomes visible,
for it is light that makes everything visible. This is why it is said: "Wake up, O sleeper, rise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you."
Eph 5:13-14

We are people of the light, but if our hearts are full of darkness and sin, there is nothing
to shine and rejoice about.

The eye is the lamp of the body. If your eyes are good, your whole body will be full of light.
But if your eyes are bad, your whole body will be full of darkness. If then the light within you is darkness, how great is that darkness!
Matt 6:22-23

I have come into the world as a light, so that no one who believes in me should stay in darkness.
John 12:46

The good man brings good things out of the good stored up in him, and the evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in him.
Matt 12:34
 
U

UnderGrace

Guest
Looks like we have newly conscripted trolls infesting the board. CHALISofbenediction and a few others. Clearly spamming and obstructing. Soon to be reported.
This has been an ongoing problem on this thread for quite a while, we have a silent troller, with obvious issues.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,198
113
I have come into the world as a light, so that no one who believes in me should stay in darkness.
John 12:46

Does this sound like Jesus expects us to remain with a slop bucket or be Holy vessels
of the Holy Spirit?

How could the Kingdom of heaven come to earth unless we are cleansed and purified.
Else we have a theology of the Holy Spirit dwelling in none sanctified people.

Not surprising how some believe a believer can be possessed by a demon.
If they have never been cleansed, God dwells within unholy people.
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
113
So you can not offer a rebutta with scripture, it must be then that the truth of what I stated is irrefutable, is this why you are sorry?

Scripture refutes completely that one is not saved unless they have fruit.

We are saved by grace through faith not by fruit, not by the evidence of fruit and not by the lack of evidence.

Scripture is clear, to bear fruit we should is to remain in a close personal relationship with the Lord, following the prompting of the Holy Spirit, and working in the strength of the Lord.
Yes. UG.
Your truth is irrefutable.
I never post scripture.
There is no evidence of salvation...we just all do what we want to do.
We are to remain close to Jesus to bear fruit....
but fruit bearing means nothing.

And Yes. I'm sorry
because you have your own special gospel that you believe and hold dear to.
I pray for you to come to the realization of what God's Word teaches.