Not By Works

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VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
8,079
2,143
113
Just a quick question - are any of you members of any other christian forums? If so, would you share? I know this question should be under another topic but this thread is about the only one I use on this site?

I agree with Magenta, there are none that can compare, now that Bible-Discussion closed it doors.

TOPIX Christian Forum, is an ABSOLUTE JOKE. The Atheist dominated that site, and there is NO SUPERVISION, as anything goes including vulgar cuss words.

HOWEVER, there may be one that is WORTH Checking Out. It is a Messianic Ministry, that has a similar chat service, and is based in Israel, and part of their Network is in the U. S.

Worthy Network
Worthy Ministries is a Christian organization based in Israel with a global outreach to more than 120 countries on a daily basis.

Though we are an internet ministry, we are also significantly involved in the land of Israel. Living in Southern part of Israel near the Dead Sea, we run Worthy News and minister full-time to the many spiritually hungry people in our region. Learn about our Project Hear O Israel. . . .

Worthy Ministries
106 Sheffield Place
Franklin, TN 37067-4437
One of my posts is here: https://www.worthychristianforums.c...-as-a-christian/?tab=comments#comment-2120703

I do not know much about them, but I have posted there a couple times. It does seem like they are Evangelical, Be sure to check out any Internet sites Statement of Faith. That site that I have posted on before, you will find there Statement of Faith above their Letterhead up top, and click on the menu bar WORTHY MINISTRIES. Click on that and scroll down to the second from the bottom, which is their Statement of Faith.
 

theanointedwinner

Well-known member
Nov 6, 2018
1,032
509
113
Expectations vs reality for bdf

Expectation: sounds like Bible answer man is here, all this can be organized into focal singularity-like concept where all is edified from it, like the ultimate concordance, like Bible's best friend. We can build a Bible AI, wonderful!

Reality: if the ignore button is a girl, can I marry her?
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
2,442
681
113
We are to identify with Jesus, the Victorious One. That’s our secure position with being found in Him through faith. We miss the mark as to our humanity, which is the meaning of sin. It’s never been what we do, but what we are. Fallen. So we need one greater than this which never missed the mark of godliness. That’s why He alone is our Saviour.
Judging is united with condemnation. Only God can judge righteous judgement for He not only sees our hearts desire to be like Him, but He sees His plan when He looks at us. He does not condemn, and rewards can be both here openly, or at the judgement seat of Christ.
But, there are kingdom laws and when it comes to sin, Holy Spirit draws back to allow reaping and sowing to work. Is one way we are chastened.
So Paul said we aren’t to judge another brothers walk. Nor would he judge himself but understood that Holy Spirit puts His light upon our hearts.
Renewing our mind is another thing.
So, being our position is in Him, we identify with Jesus because as we see Him, we become like Him.
No one can see clearly under condemnation.
One who is dead to an old life, but raised to another that is entirely different will respond according to new life. The new creation man or woman.
Clear or not.
We miss the mark as to our humanity, which is the meaning of sin. It’s never been what we do, but what we are. Fallen.

I hope I understand what you are saying above. Sin is missing the mark, being fallen.
What we do is not important, it is what we are. Fallen.
So Jesus is what we need.

The problem with this summary is it is not Gods perspective. What we do is what matters.
To a degree, what we do defines us. God shows without Him we only end up in sin and death.
The knowledge of good and evil led to death. Our actions, our defilement comes from the heart.

18 the things that come out of the mouth come from the heart, and these make a man 'unclean.'
19 For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander.
20 These are what make a man 'unclean';
Matt 15

5 This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all.
6 If we claim to have fellowship with him yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live by the truth.
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus,
his Son, purifies us from all sin.
1 John 1

We are purified by walking in the light.

7 He who does what is right is righteous, just as he is righteous.
8 He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning.
The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work.
9 No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in him; he cannot
go on sinning, because he has been born of God.
1 John 3

Our walk defines our spirituality, and our walk comes from our hearts, if purified and made holy, then
so will be our walk.

Some express concern that if we have a holy walk, then this will be our focus, the external rather than
the heart, except a holy walk comes only from a pure heart.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
2,442
681
113
Identity crisis

I am Jesus, so perfect, holy, free from my past, just by realising I am Jesus.

Unfortunately this sounds like an LSD trip. We are not Jesus, we are in Christ His workmanship,
the example of the Holy Spirit in a repentant, purified and redeemed believer.

But realising in Christ our hearts can be cleansed, purified and healed, through repentance, confession,
and walking in faith and victory, accepting the love of Christ to us, and knowing we are kept in His hands.
 

Macabeus

Well-known member
Dec 27, 2018
2,143
628
113
You are right. Looking at both words righteous and justify, it seems interchangeable with some scriptures, but not all. Or maybe it’s righteous as the base thought and justify or declared innocent for emphasis.

Anyway, it’s as our lifestyle that shows the work of God within us. Is this correct?

Would make a good study.
There is a positional righteousness which is instantaneous upon believing and a practical righteousness that is progressive and a life long work of the Spirit in us.
 

star

Senior Member
Nov 8, 2017
868
767
93
I used to be a member of the Bible-discussion website before it shut down a little while back. That website had reached the point to where it had become completely hijacked by false teachers, which resulted in a toxic environment and the mods there did nothing about it. That website turned into the Jerry Springer show! :eek:
I was a member for a very long time of that site. Paid $$ to help it keep going. Owner then decided to close it. I do agree with you, it became the "Jerry Springer" show. As well, I'm pretty sure some of those characters that used to be on there are now on here.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
8,079
2,143
113
There is a positional righteousness which is instantaneous upon believing and a practical righteousness that is progressive and a life long work of the Spirit in us.


That seems like an unusual way to put it, but if you mean what I think you mean, I would have to agree.

We put it this way:

Their is a human spiritual righteousness that is positional, that is instantaneous upon Believing, called SALVATION.

Their is a physical righteousness, that is progressive and a life long work of the Holy Spirit in us, that will be complete at the Resurrection, called SANCTIFICATION.



DO WE AGREE?

That first one is the BORN AGAIN EXPERIENCE, and actually comes from these verses.

John 3:3-7 (HCSB)
3 Jesus replied, “I assure you: Unless someone is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”
4 “But how can anyone be born when he is old?” Nicodemus asked Him. “Can he enter his mother’s womb a second time and be born?”
5 Jesus answered, “I assure you: Unless someone is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
6 Whatever is born of the flesh is flesh, and whatever is born of the Spirit is [the human] spirit.
7 Do not be amazed that I told you that you must be born again.

The life-long process that We Call Sanctification, is the HOLY SPIRIT IN OUR HEART conforming us to Walk Like Christ. In fact in some circles it is simply know as the WALK.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
25,609
4,037
113
Me thinks you are correct. I just left one I had been on for a long time although I never posted much. Left it because of un-Christian bias
I started doing Christian apologetics three years into my Christian walk. The first site I posted on, over a period of close to four years, was a secular site with very little moderation. My focus was speaking to non-believers in the Religion forum, which was really busy then. That was right around when Facebook came on the scene... and when that site was sold, and shut down to be reclaimed for its original purpose, I moved on to CARM, and again focused on speaking to non-believers in the Atheism, Agnosticism, and Secular Humanism section. They also had a lot of different Christian sub-categories, including what we would call cults. I learned a lot in those eight years! :) Now I have been here for close to another four years :D
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
8,079
2,143
113
I was a member for a very long time of that site. Paid $$ to help it keep going. Owner then decided to close it. I do agree with you, it became the "Jerry Springer" show. As well, I'm pretty sure some of those characters that used to be on there are now on here.

I thought I recognized you. I used to be on Bible-Discussion too. Look about, I found a Site that I tried before I actually came here back in the summer of 2014. They seem to be Evangelical, and non-charismatic. I have a link to one of my posts there, if you want to check it out, it is Post #100,241 .
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
8,079
2,143
113
I was a member for a very long time of that site. Paid $$ to help it keep going. Owner then decided to close it. I do agree with you, it became the "Jerry Springer" show. As well, I'm pretty sure some of those characters that used to be on there are now on here.
They certainly are, like uninvited offensive guests, that keep showing up. The only thing that makes it bearable, is we were warned they would be here.

Matthew 24:23-28 (HCSB)
23 “If anyone tells you then, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or, ‘Over here!’ do not believe it!
24 False messiahs and false prophets will arise and perform great signs and wonders to lead astray, if possible, even the elect.
25 Take note: I have told you in advance.
26 So if they tell you, ‘Look, He’s in the wilderness!’ don’t go out; ‘Look, He’s in the inner rooms!’ do not believe it.
27 For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes as far as the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.
28 Wherever the carcass is, there the vultures will gather.


Titus 3:2-3 (NKJV)
2 to speak evil of no one, to be peaceable, gentle, showing all humility to all men.
3 For we ourselves were also once foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving various lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful and hating one another.

2 Timothy 3:12-13 (NJB)
12 But anybody who tries to live in devotion to Christ is certain to be persecuted;
13 while these wicked impostors will go from bad to worse, deceiving others, and themselves deceived.

Matthew 7:20 (NJB)
20 I repeat, you will be able to tell them by their fruits.


AND the PRIMARY FRUIT IS LOVE, Gal. 5:22.
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
6,319
2,071
113
I agree salvation is having faith in Jesus, believing in Him.
Everything is about the heart. Out of the heart flows our walk.

In Christ we are filled with the Holy Spirit, made holy, purified, brought into the Kingdom.
It sounds like you want to find something deeper, what is that?
The following was the concourse between you and gb.

the truth is that when one comes to Christ, that person is forgiven and saved the moment they truly believe and accept Jesus as Lord and Savior.

agree or disagree??
FollowHisSteps said:
I agree, as soon as someone start walking with Jesus.
You took salvation as a result of faith out of the equation.
I was trying to dig a little deeper because you came accross disagreeing that faith saves and it's the walk that saves.

That was my interpretation.
Maybe not others.

Thanks for clarifying.

And yes it's all about the heart.
As a result of faith we have been given a new heart out of which we want to walk with Jesus. Not to be saved but because we are saved.

God bless.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
9,319
1,176
113
We miss the mark as to our humanity, which is the meaning of sin. It’s never been what we do, but what we are. Fallen.

I hope I understand what you are saying above. Sin is missing the mark, being fallen.
What we do is not important, it is what we are. Fallen.
So Jesus is what we need.

The problem with this summary is it is not Gods perspective. What we do is what matters.
To a degree, what we do defines us. God shows without Him we only end up in sin and death.
The knowledge of good and evil led to death. Our actions, our defilement comes from the heart.

18 the things that come out of the mouth come from the heart, and these make a man 'unclean.'
19 For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander.
20 These are what make a man 'unclean';
Matt 15

5 This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all.
6 If we claim to have fellowship with him yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live by the truth.
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus,
his Son, purifies us from all sin.
1 John 1

We are purified by walking in the light.

7 He who does what is right is righteous, just as he is righteous.
8 He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning.
The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work.
9 No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in him; he cannot
go on sinning, because he has been born of God.
1 John 3

Our walk defines our spirituality, and our walk comes from our hearts, if purified and made holy, then
so will be our walk.

Some express concern that if we have a holy walk, then this will be our focus, the external rather than
the heart, except a holy walk comes only from a pure heart.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
9,319
1,176
113
No, your conclusion isn’t right FHS. I never said it doesn’t matter what we do.

But, your post has much truth that I agree with. Yet, you say nothing about the soul of man. The new creation man/woman is Spirit. Yet we still have our old personality, soul, and we live in a body subject to corruption. Our soulish part which includes our mind, has to be renewed to kingdom thought, and ways of the Lord. Our soul yet is in need of being saved. We are saved. We are being saved. We will be saved.

Rom 2:1 Therefore, you have no excuse—every one of you who judges. For when you pass judgment on another person, you condemn yourself, since you, the judge, practice the very same things.

None of us are perfect in Holiness yet. So here comes into play the scripture if you break 1 commandment, you break them all.

The end of that chapter in Romans says that God will judge righteous judgement at the end of all things. Only He can.

But, this doesn’t mean that correction isn’t needed in the body. We need yet the 5 fold ministry as Paul laid out in scripture.
 

theanointedwinner

Well-known member
Nov 6, 2018
1,032
509
113
I started doing Christian apologetics three years into my Christian walk. The first site I posted on, over a period of close to four years, was a secular site with very little moderation. My focus was speaking to non-believers in the Religion forum, which was really busy then. That was right around when Facebook came on the scene... and when that site was sold, and shut down to be reclaimed for its original purpose, I moved on to CARM, and again focused on speaking to non-believers in the Atheism, Agnosticism, and Secular Humanism section. They also had a lot of different Christian sub-categories, including what we would call cults. I learned a lot in those eight years! :) Now I have been here for close to another four years :D
Magenta, how was apologetics in CARM
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
25,609
4,037
113
Magenta, how was apologetics in CARM
Like banging your head against a brick wall :D

Pretty much the same as here in that respect :giggle::giggle::giggle:

However, overall, I like this site better still the same :)

Perhaps it was simply time for me to move on after eight years ;)

Four years (approximately) on each site speaking to non-believers :geek:

Athough on CARM promoting Catholic doctrine was tolerated in the Catholic forums.
 

theanointedwinner

Well-known member
Nov 6, 2018
1,032
509
113
Like banging your head against a brick wall :D

Pretty much the same as here in that respect :giggle::giggle::giggle:

However, overall, I like this site better still the same :)

Perhaps it was simply time for me to move on after eight years ;)

Four years (approximately) on each site speaking to non-believers :geek:

Athough on CARM promoting Catholic doctrine was tolerated in the Catholic forums.
Let's see, by what standard do atheist ... Unicorns and cuss words, does that sum up the atheist part?

And how do we explain why the gate is so narrow, or how did you answer to "tolerance advocate"

Your biggest struggle in CARM?