Not By Works

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
8,274
4,004
113
Psalm 34:



I get so confused about sinning.......don’t we lean on Jesus to help us to stop sinning?

I’ve been sinning today....what am I supposed to do about it?

Do I leave it at the cross?...what if I’m ignorant and not know I’m sinning what then?
Yes we lean on Jesus to help us.
That is part of the reason we have the Holy Spirit is.

What I do is generally confess sin straight away that I know of.
I start the day by asking Jesus to be more like him and help me to do so.

Then at the end of the day reflecting on the day I ask the Holy Spirit to reveal sin that I have committed but am not aware off.

I sit and wait. Then he lets me know. It can be tough to take because it reveals the parts of our nature that needs dealing with.

Prayer beware, when you ask he will answer.:):)
 
May 19, 2020
3,050
1,274
113
Yes we lean on Jesus to help us.
That is part of the reason we have the Holy Spirit is.

What I do is generally confess sin straight away that I know of.
I start the day by asking Jesus to be more like him and help me to do so.

Then at the end of the day reflecting on the day I ask the Holy Spirit to reveal sin that I have committed but am not aware off.

I sit and wait. Then he lets me know. It can be tough to take because it reveals the parts of our nature that needs dealing with.

Prayer beware, when you ask he will answer.:):)


Now I understand fully..wahooooo!...Praise God........you see I persevered,trusting God that he will answer....
And here is the answer...in simple terms...not complicated.

Patience is my problem.....thanks Bill...big hug!

I was gossiping yesterday Bill....he’s just brought that one up.
 
Mar 14, 2011
76,382
17,666
113
I see nothing in that scripture about things PRESENT or FUTURE.

Who’s delusional now?
You see nothing?

Even in the english, It says has (present tense)

but the actual words written is a verb which is present active indicate

there is no past in the passage at all

So yes. YOU are delusional if you think this means past sins. and delusional if you think you are sinless.. As John states. as fact.

Your argument is with him not me
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
8,274
4,004
113
Now I understand fully..wahooooo!...Praise God........you see I persevered,trusting God that he will answer....
And here is the answer...in simple terms...not complicated.

Patience is my problem.....thanks Bill...big hug!

I was gossiping yesterday Bill....he’s just brought that one up.
This is a true story.

I remember praying and asking God for a particular sin I was struggling with.

He said to me "Bill I don't want to deal with this now I want to deal with something else" My request was on the basis of a picture he gave me while praying.

I was a mansion with a open door, lots of windows in bedrooms. Some the curtain was open and closed, not fully but were blowing.

The open windows were areas that God dealt with the others were other areas where the Holy Spirit was in.

So as I said I asked to deal with particular room which he said no.

So I asked him what he wants to deal with.

He said "Your irritability" I was shocked and automatically replied with (and not making this up"

I said "What do you mean I'm irritable, I don't think so"
I actually thought I was not.

Then he we conversation. He took deeper than words said but also physical reactions.
Like eye rolling, huff puffs and sighs, he even said to me

On your way into work today someone did give right of way, as he passed by without looking you called him a twat"

Now tell me your not irritable.

He won I lost, I lost my irritability, or should I say before I am jumped on I am aware of it, and when I do I confess straight away.

I'm still a WIP
 
Feb 29, 2020
1,564
571
113
So yes. YOU are delusional if you think this means past sins
It refers to past sins.

Romans 3:25 Says so:
[25] Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God
 
May 19, 2020
3,050
1,274
113
It refers to past sins.

Romans 3:25 Says so:
[25] Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God

Our past sins were forgiven on our saving.....we were set free from our past sins......

That’s why Jesus died....he took the sin of all mankind.
 
Mar 14, 2011
76,382
17,666
113
It refers to past sins.

Romans 3:25 Says so:
[25] Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God
Just as I figured the words means NOTHING to you

Sorry but you are wrong. Romans 3 does not help you. John said we we say we have (active present indicative) no sin we deceive ourselves

To deny that is to deny the word Of God..
 

SoulWeaver

Senior Member
Oct 25, 2014
4,891
2,530
113
I know atheists who quit and never returned. There are alcoholics who quit too, no involvement of God. Logically, I only need supply one to show man can quit addictions without God. So yes, if they never return it’s real success.
By that logic atheists can resist temptation by themselves and therefore they don't need God. But Jesus said, when the evil spirit returns, because the house was empty, he will bring 7 friends worse than him to dwell in that man, and since that man has no indwelling of God in him, it becomes worse than the first condition. What's the use if they don't return to smoking if their infirmity was not cured? The cause did not go away. It will doubtless express itself in other areas of life. Smoking is a symptom, not the disease. It is not deliverance if evil spirits are just moving around or take shifts to finish the man off. Not sure where you're going with that argument.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
38,123
15,061
113
By that logic atheists can resist temptation by themselves and therefore they don't need God. But Jesus said, when the evil spirit returns, because the house was empty, he will bring 7 friends worse than him to dwell in that man, and since that man has no indwelling of God in him, it becomes worse than the first condition. What's the use if they don't return to smoking if their infirmity was not cured? The cause did not go away. It will doubtless express itself in other areas of life. Smoking is a symptom, not the disease. It is not deliverance if evil spirits are just moving around or take shifts to finish the man off. Not sure where you're going with that argument.
Not to mention the fact that just because atheists do not believe in God does not mean God does not work in their lives :)
 

SoulWeaver

Senior Member
Oct 25, 2014
4,891
2,530
113
Not to mention the fact that just because an atheist does bot believe in God does not mean God does not work in their lives.
That too and yes thank you. I thought of it too, just didn't feel like going into a big elaborate post.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
38,123
15,061
113
That too and yes thank you. I thought of it too, just didn't feel like going into a big elaborate post.
By virtue (?) of their lack of belief they really rather have to deny God had anything to do with it, whereas we can know better :)
 

star

Senior Member
Nov 8, 2017
1,571
2,033
113
North Carolina
Just finished my devotion. What a great one. This discussion was about how "self absorbed" we humans can be. How we think the Christian life is all about us. However, Psalm 144 pulls us back to the center and truth. It's all about God, not about "us." God's strength and shelter, deliverance and protection and not about our "puny efforts." No works or "things we can do for God" amounts to a heel of beans. It's all about God
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,262
4,202
113
So only those who believe as you do are Christians?

WOW, you certainly do NOT KNOW MUCH about OSAS, and most of what you believe about Our Theology, IS NOT THE TRUTH.

John 14:6-7 (HCSB)
6 Jesus told him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.
7 “If you know Me {Born Again}, you will also know My Father. From now on you do know Him and have seen Him.”

John 3:3 (HCSB)
3 Jesus replied, I assure you: Unless someone is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”
John 3:5-7 (ESV)

5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water {This is not a reference to Water Baptism, but to the Breaking of water at natural Childbirth.} and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit {Human Spirit must be Birthed by the Holy Spirit}.
7 Do not marvel that I said to you, You must be born again.’


Matthew 7:13-23 (HCSB)
13 Enter through the narrow gate. {This parable is about People who call themselves Christians, the Many and the Few.) For the gate is wide and the road is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who go through it.
14 How narrow is the gate and difficult the road that leads to life, and few find it.
15 “Beware of false prophets who come to you in sheep’s clothing but inwardly are ravaging wolves.
16 You’ll recognize them by their fruit. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes or figs from thistles?
17 In the same way, every good tree produces good fruit, but a bad tree produces bad fruit.
18 A good tree can’t produce bad fruit; neither can a bad tree produce good fruit.
19 Every tree that doesn’t produce good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
20 So you’ll recognize them by their fruit.
21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord!’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but ⌊only⌋ the one who does the will of My Father in heaven.
22 On that day many {same MANY that are on the broad road, verse 13.} will say to Me, Lord, Lord, didn’t we prophesy in Your name, drive out demons in Your name, and do many miracles in Your name?’
{They put there Trust in their deeds, NOT 100% in what JESUS did on the Cross for SALVATION.}

23 Then I will announce to them, I never knew you! {a reference to Born Again.} Depart from Me, you lawbreakers!’


Matthew 10:42 (ESV)
42 And whoever gives one of these little ones even a cup of cold water because he is a disciple, truly, I say to you,
he will by no means lose his reward.” {The motive for giving the cup of Cold Water, or whatever the NEED, has to be AGAPE LOVE for that person, or it is worthless to GOD, including you only gave it to receive a reward, it Filthy Rags.}


Luke 12:8-10 (HCSB)
8 “And I say to you, anyone who acknowledges Me before men, the Son of Man will also acknowledge him before the angels of God,
9 but whoever denies Me before men will be denied before the angels of God.
10 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but the one who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.

{One of the main responsibilities is to work on the HEART of mankind, to Get Them to BELIEVE in Jesus the Messiah, how paid for 100% of our SINS on the Cross. REJECT THAT TRUTH and you have Blasphemed the Holy Spirits work on our hearts or Human Spirit. That is the ONLY unforgivable SIN there is. Yes, I believe I am teaching the TRUTH, and I have the Holy Spirit in me that CONVINCES me it is Absolutely TRUE. But if you believe SOMETHING ELSE, that I believe is FALSE DOCTRINE, which could be a SIGN something Worse, or NOT; you are certainly flirting with disaster. I CANNOT TELL if YOU are Born Again or Not. I see all kinds of doctrinal errors in THEOLOGY, But are you Saved or Not, THAT IS CHRIST's Call. I really do not think you understand what Born Again is all about.}
 
May 19, 2020
3,050
1,274
113
Just finished my devotion. What a great one. This discussion was about how "self absorbed" we humans can be. How we think the Christian life is all about us. However, Psalm 144 pulls us back to the center and truth. It's all about God, not about "us." God's strength and shelter, deliverance and protection and not about our "puny efforts." No works or "things we can do for God" amounts to a heel of beans. It's all about God

Amen....excellent post...all the Glory goes to our Lord!!
 
Feb 29, 2020
1,564
571
113
No works or "things we can do for God" amounts to a heel of beans.
They sure do amount to something after being born again.

That’s one of the reasons he gave himself for us:

Titus 2:14
[14] Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

Romans 6:13
[13] Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,262
4,202
113
No. I’m not accusing those who follow the Lord, those that take his words to heart; Like when he said “go, and do not sin anymore”.

Those sheep hear his voice.

OSAS don’t hear it. They hear another voice that tells them something else. It tells them to not “practice a particular sin”.


Or is it you who are listening to the wrong voice?

I am sure you understand this, but ENGLISH IS A VERY PORE LANGUAGE to Translate the BIBLE INTO. We only have 3 Primary Verb Tenses in ENGLISH, where as GREEK has 6 Primary Verb Tenses.

Take for example:

1 John 2:4-5 (HCSB)
4 The one who says, “I have come to know Him,” yet doesn't keep His commands, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
5 But whoever keeps His word, truly in him the love of God is perfected {spiritually mature in the Greek}. This is how we know we are in Him:


Some think if I cannot keep ALL His Commands, then I am a liar. That is not what it says at all. The Keep, is in the GREEK Present Tense, and it is UNLIKE our present tense, in that it implies a continuous action of striving to keep HIS commands. It is a Life Style, and NOT PERFECTION, that He is talking about. We are the one ones who will continuously strive to keep HIS commands, and when we FAIL, we are the one who want to CONFESS that Sin according to 1 John 1:9. Yes, unbelievers never Try to KEEP HIS commands, but we are the ones who will always strive to keep His commands, IT NEVER IMPLIES PERFECTION.
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
9,173
4,974
113
That’s a good attitude.

It’s a good example of not being high minded, but fearing; continuing in the goodness of the gospel.
How can a good attitude mean anything in your gospel, since future sins will condemn you?

Let's boil this down to one singular question: Will any future sin condemn a Christian? Yes or no.