Not By Works

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BenjaminN

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Oct 7, 2020
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For sure she sinned again, until her deathbed - but if she were saved, God would have granted her the gift of sanctifying the rest of her life, so she could be living in repentance and righteousness, whenever her works do not represent her faith.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
The text do not mention that, but I am sure that she TRIED HER BEST to obey the commands of her rescuer.
If she sinned again I guess she did not do what Jesus commanded her

You can’t not sin by trying your best. You do it by relying on the power of Christ
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Should we try and justify our persistence in sins, or should we let God's Spirit sanctify our works?
I was not saying we should try to justify anything. I was just responding to your post. Most people throw that verse around to support their works based gospel
 

BenjaminN

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Oct 7, 2020
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I was not saying we should try to justify anything. I was just responding to your post. Most people throw that verse around to support their works based gospel
I think you are barking up the wrong tree - I do not have a works based gospel. What I am trying to get on common ground with you is:

1. Saved by God's grace alone
2. God's salvation through grace, finds its way to justification of the sinner
3. We are justified to righteousness through the chosen's God-given faith and God-given works
 

BenjaminN

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Oct 7, 2020
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There is only one command, sit still, do nothing, and LET ME SAVE YOU
this is what Jesus said when he said blessed are those who are poor in spirit (spiritually bankrupt) for,theirs is the kingdom
I am trying to warn, that just like the false teaching of "works based salvation", is the false teaching of "faith only" salvation. Salvation is not by either one of these. Salvation is by the grace of God only - given to God's elect. If the fruits of works is missing, salvation is also missing. If a person has a resistance in obeying God's commandments, and think the only command is to do "nothing", he is resisting the Spirit of God that draws him closer to God. Unfortunately it will be too late to found out that it was not enough, when you stand before the One that grants his grace of salvation, for those who obey his commandments and are not of the workers of lawlessness.


Matthew 7 (ESV)


1"Judge not, that you be not judged. 2 For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you. 7 "Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. 15 "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. 16 You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?' 23 And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.'


2 Thessalonians 2 (ESV)


3 Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, 4 who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God.

The spirit of lawlessness is the spirit of the anti-Messiah. Obey God's commandments as much as you can - where you fall short, Yeshua ha'Maschiach / Jesus the Messiah paid the price; if you do not / want not / do nothing, have a little doubt in your believe of "salvation", as God may have a lot.
 

CherieR

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
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I am trying to warn, that just like the false teaching of "works based salvation", is the false teaching of "faith only" salvation. Salvation is not by either one of these. Salvation is by the grace of God only - given to God's elect. If the fruits of works is missing, salvation is also missing. If a person has a resistance in obeying God's commandments, and think the only command is to do "nothing", he is resisting the Spirit of God that draws him closer to God. Unfortunately it will be too late to found out that it was not enough, when you stand before the One that grants his grace of salvation, for those who obey his commandments and are not of the workers of lawlessness.


Matthew 7 (ESV)


1"Judge not, that you be not judged. 2 For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you. 7 "Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. 15 "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. 16 You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?' 23 And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.'


2 Thessalonians 2 (ESV)


3 Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, 4 who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God.

The spirit of lawlessness is the spirit of the anti-Messiah. Obey God's commandments as much as you can - where you fall short, Yeshua ha'Maschiach / Jesus the Messiah paid the price; if you do not / want not / do nothing, have a little doubt in your believe of "salvation", as God may have a lot.
Please explain what fruit of works means to you. Thank you.
 

BenjaminN

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2020
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Psalms 84 (ESV)


8 O Lord God of hosts, hear my prayer; give ear, O God of Jacob! Selah 9 Behold our shield, O God; look on the face of your anointed! 10 For a day in your courts is better than a thousand elsewhere. I would rather be a doorkeeper in the house of my God than dwell in the tents of wickedness. 11 For the Lord God is a sun and shield; the Lord bestows favor and honor. No good thing does he withhold from those who walk uprightly. 12 O Lord of hosts, blessed is the one who trusts in you!
 

BenjaminN

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Oct 7, 2020
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Please explain what fruit of works means to you. Thank you.
For judgement, it would matter what it means to God.

For God's spiritual fruit of discernment on one's own part, it would mean if someone follows Yeshua ha'Maschiach / Jesus the Messiah, and try and obey God's commandments, and try to do God's will in his fallible way - on his way to sanctification, because Yeshua / Jesus did, and ask us to do so also. Then one should be able to discern the Spiritual working in his fellow man.
 

BenjaminN

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Oct 7, 2020
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True Israel = True Church = Assembly of God's covenant people

Jeremiah 31 (ESV)


31 "Behold, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah, 32 not like the covenant that I made with their fathers on the day when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, my covenant that they broke, though I was their husband, declares the Lord. 33 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my law within them, and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 34 And no longer shall each one teach his neighbor and each his brother, saying, 'Know the Lord,' for they shall all know me, from the least of them to the greatest, declares the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more." 35 Thus says the Lord, who gives the sun for light by day and the fixed order of the moon and the stars for light by night, who stirs up the sea so that its waves roar— the Lord of hosts is his name: 36 "If this fixed order departs from before me, declares the Lord, then shall the offspring of Israel cease from being a nation before me forever." 37 Thus says the Lord: "If the heavens above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth below can be explored, then I will cast off all the offspring of Israel for all that they have done, declares the Lord."
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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I have just heard a Sermon on JUDE. And Pastor made a statement that I need to remember.

He said: "A Christian without Forgiveness is an OXYMORON."
 

CherieR

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
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I have just heard a Sermon on JUDE. And Pastor made a statement that I need to remember.

He said: "A Christian without Forgiveness is an OXYMORON."
Please explain this further.
 

BenjaminN

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Oct 7, 2020
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We should warn, when we are called upon to warn. And we should answer God's calling in all things, and obey Him (and his commandments).

Ezekiel 33 (ESV)


2 "Son of man, speak to your people and say to them, If I bring the sword upon a land, and the people of the land take a man from among them, and make him their watchman, 3 and if he sees the sword coming upon the land and blows the trumpet and warns the people, 4 then if anyone who hears the sound of the trumpet does not take warning, and the sword comes and takes him away, his blood shall be upon his own head. 5 He heard the sound of the trumpet and did not take warning; his blood shall be upon himself. But if he had taken warning, he would have saved his life. 6 But if the watchman sees the sword coming and does not blow the trumpet, so that the people are not warned, and the sword comes and takes any one of them, that person is taken away in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at the watchman's hand. 7 "So you, son of man, I have made a watchman for the house of Israel. Whenever you hear a word from my mouth, you shall give them warning from me.
 

BenjaminN

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Oct 7, 2020
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Please explain this further.

Matthew 6 (ESV)


9 Pray then like this: "Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name. 10 Your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven. 11 Give us this day our daily bread, 12 and forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors. 13 And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil. 14 For if you forgive others their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you, 15 but if you do not forgive others their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
 

CherieR

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
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We should warn, when we are called upon to warn. And we should answer God's calling in all things, and obey Him (and his commandments).

Ezekiel 33 (ESV)


2 "Son of man, speak to your people and say to them, If I bring the sword upon a land, and the people of the land take a man from among them, and make him their watchman, 3 and if he sees the sword coming upon the land and blows the trumpet and warns the people, 4 then if anyone who hears the sound of the trumpet does not take warning, and the sword comes and takes him away, his blood shall be upon his own head. 5 He heard the sound of the trumpet and did not take warning; his blood shall be upon himself. But if he had taken warning, he would have saved his life. 6 But if the watchman sees the sword coming and does not blow the trumpet, so that the people are not warned, and the sword comes and takes any one of them, that person is taken away in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at the watchman's hand. 7 "So you, son of man, I have made a watchman for the house of Israel. Whenever you hear a word from my mouth, you shall give them warning from me.
I agree that we should obey God's commandments. I believe motivation is important. Do we obey out of love for God and a desire to please him? Are we obeying out of fear of punishment or to be accepted by God?