Not By Works

[NoNameMcgee]

1 John 5:16

16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.


James 2:10

“For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.”



if even commiting 1 sin....
youre guilty of all

how could any sin a "brother" (not neighbor) commits
not be a sin unto death


honest question

not here to argue

ignore me if im not making sense

 

[willybob]

It's interesting how virtually everyone who reads this passage in the church today can't see the part that says "who do not walk according to the flesh". Why is that? Is it because we have been trained to skip right over it by this 'just believe' doctrine over taking the church?

True again PHART; Plus the new age bibles based on the corrupted Alexandrian manuscripts have committed it,,,keep declaring the whole council of God, its so refreshing............be blessed

 

[BillG]

greetings Fran

i find what you said here mentally stimulating, in that it caused me to reflect of what Jesus said, He didn't instruct the 12 to go out and get people saved, but rather told them to "go ye forth and make disciples".. if we become disciples of Christ being baptized in the Holy Ghost we can walk after the Spirit of the law... the church concentrates on getting people saved while still in there sins, in order to enhance nickels, numbers, and noses, as one brother said........the focus should be first the baptism of repentance, and making disciples, then salvation takes care of itself..

Evening willybob

I am not sure what you mean by baptism of repentance, I thought that was Johns baptism about repentance which Paul dealt with

Acts 19:3-5


And he said to them, “Into what then were you baptized?”
So they said, “Into John's baptism.”
Then Paul said, “John indeed baptized with a baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.”
When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

if we become disciples of Christ being baptized in the Holy Ghost we can walk after the Spirit of the law.

So given your quote above I can't see how that corresponds with baptism of repentance.



I think to me when Jesus said "Go make disciples" he is saying to us as disciples

Matthew 28:19-20
Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen.

As disciples we have this in common

A disciple is one who repents of sin, trusts in Jesus for salvation, and obeys his teachings.

So to me to go make disciples is to lead people to Jesus which as you say "salvation takes care of itself"
Which is where the Holy Spirit comes in.

Truth is people are saved whilst still in their sin. I say sin and not sins as you say.

Jesus said that the Holy Spirit will come to convict the world of its sin, that sin is unbelief in Jesus.
If one repents of that and places their trust in Jesus then the Holy Spirit indwells in them.
He then works in them to conform them to the image of Jesus. And yes we have a part to play as well.

Does that make sense?

 

[UnderGrace]

????

Hmmmm...

So this guy wasn't you four days ago?

I agree I am a little confused, can you please clarify?

Do you need further evidence that being born again to eternal life is a singular event?

 

[Gabriel2020]

Salvation cannot be lost since salvation is given to all that are spirit filled. not spirit filled, then you don't belong to Jesus. He will lose non back to the world that belong to him,and that is his promise. Now if you are under the law ,then you are in big trouble.The sin that is unto death for the believer is to turn against God in the manner Satan did it,and blaspheme against the Holy Spirt. All other sin is forgivable.

 

[willybob]

Why can't you understand that various Bible scholars from different countries & different centuries all agree?

Is it because you are more educated than them?

You are better versed in Greek?

Did you spend a lifetime in Biblical studies?

Or..... it because you want to hang on to what you believe?

You wouldn't be the first on CC to think you knew more truth than they did.

its because the heresy of Penal Substitution gospel has blinded them for 500 years,,,,sadly, even most so-called scholars were under the myth as well....But today the myth has been magnified to its greatest levels of apostasy

 

[UnderGrace]

Yes please clarify?

I never said this..I have always stated that I do not believe one can keep or lose their own salvation.

 

[willybob]

1 John 5:16

16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.


James 2:10

“For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.”



if even commiting 1 sin....
youre guilty of all

how could any sin a "brother" (not neighbor) commits
not be a sin unto death


honest question

not here to argue

ignore me if im not making sense

John speaks of both willful rebellion, and sins of ignorance, there is a big difference between the two, as the day of atonement in the OT was for sins of ignorance....Job had some sins of ignorance, but not the vile sins of the flesh that disqualify one from the kingdom, thus he was perfect and righteous before God....be blessed

 

[dcontroversal]

its because the heresy of Penal Substitution gospel has blinded them for 500 years,,,,sadly, even most so-called scholars were under the myth as well....But today the myth has been magnified to its greatest levels of apostasy

You should go look in the mirror......the level of apostasy you embrace man exceeds the word itself.....a sinless, perfectionist dogma that you yourself cannot live up to....like the lawyers of Jesus' day.......so sponge.....do you keep the law, do right, never break one of the least of the commandments ad always walk according to the word of God 24/7/365 days a year....

Of course not....so see....your fallacy and what you espouse and push is known to all honest people as a farce and false dogma......

 

[dcontroversal]

John speaks of both willful rebellion, and sins of ignorance, there is a big difference between the two, as the day of atonement in the OT was for sins of ignorance....Job had some sins of ignorance, but not the vile sins of the flesh that disqualify one from the kingdom, thus he was perfect and righteous before God....be blessed

The bolded is false and not of God nor found in the word of God....All who trust JESUS have been forgiven and EVERY SIN they would ever commit is nailed to the cross and his righteousness has been applied unto the believer....you will find out one day....albeit too late......!

 

[willybob]

Salvation cannot be lost since salvation is given to all that are spirit filled. not spirit filled, then you don't belong to Jesus. He will lose non back to the world that belong to him,and that is his promise. Now if you are under the law ,then you are in big trouble.The sin that is unto death for the believer is to turn against God in the manner Satan did it,and blaspheme against the Holy Spirt. All other sin is forgivable.

what does Spirit filed mean according to the bible? AND, is it possible for the Spirit to enter an unclean vessel, and even more so, CAN the Spirit ever remain in an unclean vessel? .....be blessed in your search

 

[dcontroversal]

what does Spirit filed mean according to the bible? AND, is it possible for the Spirit to enter an unclean vessel, and even more so, CAN the Spirit ever remain in an unclean vessel? .....be blessed in your search

The exact question a lost man would ask while being oblivious to the words "sealed" and "grieve" when it comes to the Holy Spirit and all who acknowledge Jesus by biblical saving faith void of works and sinless perfectionism!

 

[willybob]

The bolded is false and not of God nor found in the word of God....All who trust JESUS have been forgiven and EVERY SIN they would ever commit is nailed to the cross and his righteousness has been applied unto the believer....you will find out one day....albeit too late......!

You sir are completely deluded.....Trust all through the bible implies faith proven by deeds...and only past sins are said to be forgiven in the bible via repentance, NEVER future sins..look it up.

 

[JoDel]

The bolded is false and not of God nor found in the word of God....All who trust JESUS have been forgiven and EVERY SIN they would ever commit is nailed to the cross and his righteousness has been applied unto the believer....you will find out one day....albeit too late......!

Amen, AMEN and AMEN!!!

 

[willybob]

Evening willybob

I am not sure what you mean by baptism of repentance, I thought that was Johns baptism about repentance which Paul dealt with

Acts 19:3-5


And he said to them, “Into what then were you baptized?”
So they said, “Into John's baptism.”
Then Paul said, “John indeed baptized with a baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.”
When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.



So given your quote above I can't see how that corresponds with baptism of repentance.



I think to me when Jesus said "Go make disciples" he is saying to us as disciples

Matthew 28:19-20
Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen.

As disciples we have this in common

A disciple is one who repents of sin, trusts in Jesus for salvation, and obeys his teachings.

So to me to go make disciples is to lead people to Jesus which as you say "salvation takes care of itself"
Which is where the Holy Spirit comes in.

Truth is people are saved whilst still in their sin. I say sin and not sins as you say.

Jesus said that the Holy Spirit will come to convict the world of its sin, that sin is unbelief in Jesus.
If one repents of that and places their trust in Jesus then the Holy Spirit indwells in them.
He then works in them to conform them to the image of Jesus. And yes we have a part to play as well.

Does that make sense?

The baptism of repentance is when one comes clean with God in repentance, 2 Cor. 7-10,11, whereas he becomes justified, and returned to God's favor (reconciliation), as he is bow baptized with the Holy Ghost and fire, becoming worthy of being in the kingdom.,,,be blessed

 

[dcontroversal]

You sir are completely deluded.....Trust all through the bible implies faith proven by deeds...and only past sins are said to be forgiven in the bible via repentance, NEVER future sins..look it up.

Keep thinking that...my bible teaches the grace of God outruns my sins pal...and it states clearly he is the propitiation for the sins of the WHOLE WORLD.....every one except a refusal to belief into the works of Christ as being from GOD....Blasphemy of the Spirit

At the end of the day pal...you are the one who walks with eyes shut and deluded by your sinless perfectionist dogma.....!

 

[Zmouth]

No I cannot out-will sin and death...it is a gift I received via Adam. I would love to return this gift but try as I might I cannot.

So the only begotten, born not of flesh and blood nor the will of man but of God gave you the gift of sin and death.

Oh, so poor little caterpillar going to put their trust in the spider cause she in the king's palace.

 

[UnderGrace]

"who hath bewitched you"..... Wow did they have commentators back then too?

Why can't you grasp this passage if it is so simple and self explanatory?

gal 3:1 ¶ O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain.
5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

Keep it in context. Why if you are united to Christ through grace would you now through the flesh go your own way and leave Christ behind? Saved by grace and kept by grace. You cannot merit salvation and you cannot by your own effort maintain salvation.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[willybob]

The exact question a lost man would ask while being oblivious to the words "sealed" and "grieve" when it comes to the Holy Spirit and all who acknowledge Jesus by biblical saving faith void of works and sinless perfectionism!

about half a billion people believe in the same said heresies you believe in..... in matters of truth the majority is NEVER right...knowing this first: truth is not a driving force in the world...

 

[dcontroversal]

about half a billion people believe in the same said heresies you believe in..... in matters of truth the majority is NEVER right...knowing this first: truth is not a driving force in the world...

HAHAHHAHAHHA you just condemned yourself and your false beliefs...the majority within the ranks of so-called Christianity believe in a working for sinless heretical I can lose salvation message......

Thanks....I am glad you can finally admit your wrong....that is the 1st step in getting right pal...now surrender to JESUS and accept his saving grace and mercy by faith instead of your own self works and sinless farce.....