Paul Son of God!!?

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iymus

Junior Member
Feb 15, 2016
108
15
18
#61
That doesn't answer my question.
You intimated that Paul's words would lead people to destruction.

Peter did not say that.

2 Peter 3:15-16
15 and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

We know from Pauls teaching that he taught the opposite.

Yet we know that Peter who obviously agreed with what Paul was saying that those who heard the message of Paul were unstable, unlearned.

He never said that Paul was leading people to destruction.
Paraphrasing a bit, but Peter said that, "our beloved brother Paul in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction."

2Pe 3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
2Pe 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#62
I mostly study the Hebrew alphabet. You would think we would learn this stuff in kindergarten. They say that we can not begin to understand Kabbalah until we have studied religion for 40 years. The Rabbi's that teach this stuff have a beard that they do not trim. They call themselves Hasidic.
Well I am not sure if you are actually studying Kabbalah ... if you are I am concerned for you.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,778
113
#63
People should be aware that Kabbalah and occultism are related, and any involvement with demons is extremely dangerous. Here is what is noted in the Jewish Encyclopedia:

Noxious Influences.
These beneficial influences of the Cabala are, however, counterbalanced by several most pernicious ones. From the metaphysical axiom, that there is nothing in the world without spiritual life, the cabalists developed a Jewish Magic. They taught that the elements are the abode of beings which are the dregs or remnants of the lowest spiritual life, and which are divided into four classes; namely, elemental beings of fire, air, water, and earth; the first two being invisible, while the last two may easily be perceived by the senses.


While the latter are generally malicious imps who vex and mock man, the former are well disposed and helpful. Demonology, therefore, occupies an important position in the works of many cabalists; for the imps are related to those beings that are generally designated as demons (), being endowed with various supernatural powers and with insight into the hidden realms of lower nature, and even occasionally into the future and the higher spiritual world. Magic () may be practised with the help of these beings, the cabalists meaning white magic in contrast to ("the black art"). [Note: those who practice black magic generally call it white magic to give it a veneer of respectablity]

Natural magic depends largely on man himself; for, according to the Cabala, all men are endowed with insight and magical powers which they may develop. The means especially mentioned are: "Kawwanah" () = intense meditation, in order to attract the higher spiritual influence; a strong will exclusively directed toward its object; and a vivid imagination, in order that the impressions from the spiritual world may enter profoundly into the soul and be retained there. From these principles many cabalists developed their theories on casting of lots, Necromancy, Exorcism, and many other superstitions. Bibliomancy and the mysticism of numbers and letters were developed into complete systems.

Cabalistic Superstition.
The metaphysical conception of the identity of the real with the ideal gave rise to the mystical conception that everything beheld by our senses has a mystical meaning; that the phenomena may instruct man as to what takes place in the divine idea or in the human intellect. Hence the cabalistic doctrine of the heavenly alphabet, whose signs are the constellations and stars. Thus Astrology was legitimized, and bibliomancy found its justification in the assumption that the sacred Hebrew letters are not merely signs for things, but implements of divine powers by means of which nature may be subjugated. It is easy to see that all these views were most pernicious in their influence on the intellect and soul of the Jew. But it is equally true that these things did not originate in the Cabala, but gravitated toward it. In a word, its works represent that movement in Judaism which attempted to Judaize all the foreign elements in it, a process through which healthy and abnormal views were introduced together.
 
Dec 30, 2019
1,266
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#64
Well I am not sure if you are actually studying Kabbalah ... if you are I am concerned for you.
Take a look for yourself. The "videos" are on Youtube. I have been told that people do not understand this teaching until they have studied the Torah or Bible for 40 years.

 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,778
113
#66
Better to take a look at the article in Wiki and not something that is 100 years old.
The older the better. In any event, you have to decide whether you wish to be entangled in Satan's kingdom of darkness (and suffer the eternal consequences) or come out of that kingdom by rejecting and denouncing Satan and all his evil works.

Kabbalism is simply another manifestation of SATANIC DECEPTION. Only the Gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ can help you.
 
Dec 30, 2019
1,266
290
83
#67
The older the better. In any event, you have to decide whether you wish to be entangled in Satan's kingdom of darkness (and suffer the eternal consequences) or come out of that kingdom by rejecting and denouncing Satan and all his evil works.

Kabbalism is simply another manifestation of SATANIC DECEPTION. Only the Gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ can help you.
Do you know what it means to sit in Moses seat???

Woes to Scribes and Pharisees
“The scribes and Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. So practice and observe everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. They tie up heavy, burdensome loads and lay them on men’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them" (Matthew 23:3,)

The Bible is very clear that God does not give us the ability to judge others. You can ONLY judge yourself. So I would advise you to pay very close attention to what you are telling people because your advise applies to YOU not them. In psychology they call this projecting.

Do Not Judge: “Do not judge, or you will be judged. For with the same judgment you pronounce, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. Why do you look at the speck in your brother’s eye, but fail to notice the beam in your own eye?" (Matthew 7:1,2,3)

People can not help others until they get themselves right with God first.

Do you even realize you are calling devoted men of God messengers of Satan? I am use to this sort of anti-seminism because I know so many people that survived the holocaust. I have noticed on the news that the Hasidic faith is under a lot of attach right now. It is just sad when people that call themselves Christians are attacking people in the "Jewish" faith.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,969
13,625
113
#68
Everything seems to be carnal with no foundational building blocks leading to a volume of the book or End of The Matter type conclusion.
do you reckon rejecting the divinity of Christ is a good foundation?
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
5,516
113
Anaheim, Cali.
#69
Following personal observations ad opinions:

It would be much easier if some people admit confess that they believe that Paul is the Son of God directly instead of passively and indirectly: With the words of Paul not conforming to the words of Christ but the other way around.

Everything seems to be carnal with no foundational building blocks leading to a volume of the book or End of The Matter type conclusion.

Dividing faith from works.
Dividing righteousness from faith.
Dividing Salvation from Obedience and Overcoming the world.
etc.
Dividing Commandments from Love and Obedience


1Co 3:1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
1Co 3:2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
1Co 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
--------------
2Pe 3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
2Pe 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
--------------
Paul was chosen directly by Jesus to be the primary deciple to us Gentiles. Luke wrote about in Acts, or do you reject that too?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,969
13,625
113
#70
What verse are you talking about in the Old Testament?
Numbers 27, probably.

a group of women came to Moses, daughters of a man who passed away with no sons. they said, why should our father's name pass away from their family because he had no sons? so Moses brought this before the LORD. the LORD ((in vv. 7-8)) said they are right, and that if a man dies without sons, his daughters should be assigned the inheritance.

at least, this is what came to my mind when i read @Magenta's post :)
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,969
13,625
113
#71
There is neither Jew nor Greek, male nor female, in Christ Jesus. You seem to agree but then do not :unsure:

Joshua 17:3 However, Zelophehad, the son of Hepher, the son of Gilead, the son of Machir, the son of Manasseh, had no sons, only daughters; and these are the names of his daughters: Mahlah and Noah, Hoglah, Milcah and Tirzah. 4 They came near before Eleazar the priest and before Joshua the son of Nun and before the leaders, saying, “The LORD commanded Moses to give us an inheritance among our brothers.” So according to the command of the LORD he gave them an inheritance among their father’s brothers. 5 Thus there fell ten portions to Manasseh, besides the land of Gilead and Bashan, which is beyond the Jordan, 6 because the daughters of Manasseh received an inheritance among his sons. And the land of Gilead belonged to the rest of the sons of Manasseh.

Also Numbers 36:2 They said, "When the LORD commanded my LORD to give the land as an inheritance to the Israelites by lot, he ordered you to give the inheritance of our brother Zelophehad to his daughters.

^ ^ Those are the OT verses you asked for :)
well in previous post i replied before finishing reading the thread lol

anyhow, both Joshua 17 & Numbers 36 are referring back to the command God gave in Numbers 27, when this issue first came up ;)
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#72
Do you know what it means to sit in Moses seat???

Woes to Scribes and Pharisees
“The scribes and Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. So practice and observe everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. They tie up heavy, burdensome loads and lay them on men’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them" (Matthew 23:3,)

The Bible is very clear that God does not give us the ability to judge others. You can ONLY judge yourself. So I would advise you to pay very close attention to what you are telling people because your advise applies to YOU not them. In psychology they call this projecting.

Do Not Judge: “Do not judge, or you will be judged. For with the same judgment you pronounce, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. Why do you look at the speck in your brother’s eye, but fail to notice the beam in your own eye?" (Matthew 7:1,2,3)

People can not help others until they get themselves right with God first.

Do you even realize you are calling devoted men of God messengers of Satan? I am use to this sort of anti-seminism because I know so many people that survived the holocaust. I have noticed on the news that the Hasidic faith is under a lot of attach right now. It is just sad when people that call themselves Christians are attacking people in the "Jewish" faith.

ensnared

oh we sure can judge

did you know God told Israel to KILL all witches and not mourn them even if it was your beloved?

witchcraft is the religion of mankind without God

you don't know much about religious Jews if you think they have wisdom from God to share

the OT should confirm to even the most careless reader that Israel was a nation that could not continue along the path God had for them no matter the punishment for their many sins and following after gods...demonic gods

Kabbalah is a demonic bypath

Moses would have had you stoned if you are into this type of thing
 

stillness

Senior Member
Jan 28, 2013
1,257
211
63
69
Walk trough the valley
#73
Following personal observations ad opinions:

It would be much easier if some people admit confess that they believe that Paul is the Son of God directly instead of passively and indirectly: With the words of Paul not conforming to the words of Christ but the other way around.

Everything seems to be carnal with no foundational building blocks leading to a volume of the book or End of The Matter type conclusion.

Dividing faith from works.
Dividing righteousness from faith.
Dividing Salvation from Obedience and Overcoming the world.
etc.
Dividing Commandments from Love and Obedience


1Co 3:1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
1Co 3:2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
1Co 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
--------------
2Pe 3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
2Pe 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
--------------
Paul has been missunderstood Peter mentioned that. I would give you the reference but unless you read you would not understand. "Let him that reads understand."
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,969
13,625
113
#74
well in previous post i replied before finishing reading the thread lol

anyhow, both Joshua 17 & Numbers 36 are referring back to the command God gave in Numbers 27, when this issue first came up ;)
@Magenta @JohnR7

why does God tells us this 3 times in scripture?
_____:unsure: