Pentecostal and Charismatic

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JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,195
6,508
113
#21
Not sure why this was put down as my post but i never said this jimmy did
And i am a firm beleiver that you do not have to be saved to speak in tongues, it's one of the nine gifts, just like not all are called to be pastors or teachers also not all speak in tongues
Before anyone jumps on this, I believe you mean you do not have to speak in tongues to be saved. Correct me please if I am wrong.
 
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libertygirl

Guest
#24
First of all, I'd like to say, I am not here to debate with anyone, I'm just simply sharing my experience with the OP as he has asked.

When I got saved I started attending a p/c church. And no, we don't teach you have to speak in tongues to be saved. The reason why I believe gifts of the spirit are for today is mainly because of my interpretation of 1 Corinthians 13:8-10

"Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away. For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away."

Well, I believe the perfect is referring to Jesus. I understand some believe it refers to the bible and I'm okay with others having a different view point than me,
There are more scriptures but I'll share one more:

"And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions." Joel 2:28

Now time for experiences, I read a true story of a Vietnamese man who was a type of marxist-leninism. He decided to go to a church to mock the believers. When he got there, they were speaking in tongues, he heard one man speak in Russian. After the service was over, the Vietnamese man went up to the Russian speaking man and asked, "Where did you learn Russian?" and the man replied he didn't know Russian.

Another story, former Pastor at my church was flying on a plane and felt compelled by God to speak in tongues, so he did. And the man that sat next to him said, "How do you know how to speak in my language? I come from an island of only 50 people." So the man heard the pastor say something like, "Believe in God." I've heard more stories like this too.

Being in the p/c church for a while now, I've received prophetic words and visions from other people and it has encouraged me and strengthened my faith very much. I just cannot see how God is not in it. I know unbelievers that have become believers because of it.
 
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rauleetoe

Guest
#25
Im sorry did i say you HAD to speak in tongues??
No i didn't, and it's only babbling to the unsaved
Bible says that not me
I spoke of my experience
How dare you say i look for signs and wonders, do you know me???
Can you see more clearly into my heart than God??
I would be perfectly fine not seeing a single miracle in my lifetime, but the truth is God has chosen to reveal Himself in such a way that there is no denying Him and all He has to give us, His gifts are beautiful and i do not take them for granted. You are obviously pissed at pentacostals and your anger leads me to believe you have run into those that do not practice what they preach, im sorry for that, but you really should not group all pentacostals in that same light
Blessings and peace
If it ruffled your feathers .that was not the intent behind whatvi said,i was a leader in a foursqua ree church..i akso went to bible school.at a pentecostal church years ago..all of which i did when i did not dive into the word to see what God has to..all do not soeak.in tongues,yet many seek after this gift or orophecy and i do believe many dake it or force it to belong...i am not angry .but i do soeak as a person who. came oht of charismatic pentecostal ways after being in them.for over a decade.. sure there are sincere folks in tgese churches, yet im looking at your fruit..not your gifts...do you have fruit that proves you are a christian? then do not worry about 'the gifts'....btw, watch your choice of vocabulary here..no need for that.read 1 corinthians 14..you will see God is a God or order,not chaos....
 
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jimmydiggs

Guest
#26
I think what was said that one does not have to do so :)
Notice that I said "like". She said that Pentecostal tongues is only babbling to the unsaved.

Im sorry did i say you HAD to speak in tongues??
No i didn't, and it's only babbling to the unsaved
As JaumeJ rightly points out, and was indeed my thinking as well... without an interpreter, iti s all babbling. Thus, anyone listening would have to be unsaved. Hence, you have to be the speaker who "understands" the supposed language in order to be considered saved.
 
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ContrarySynthesis

Guest
#27
Thank you libertygirl and others who have shared why your experience with and understanding of P/C beliefs.

As libertygirl stated, I'd much appreciate keeping to your own experience and reasons and not arguing with others' reasons. I have no problem with another thread that is more of a debate or discussion that goes back and forth--and I might even contribute--but my reasoning for this was to understand the people and not necessarily the logic back-and-forth. I appreciate everyone who has posted, and I understand that my original post could be taken as an invitation to debate, but I think there IS value in simply sharing and understanding--especially BEFORE debate.

I guess I envisioned it as a collection of stories. Like a "Voices of Pentecostalism and Charismatics" vignette series, if that makes sense. :D

Thanks, and God bless.
 
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carey

Guest
#28
Notice that I said "like". She said that Pentecostal tongues is only babbling to the unsaved.



As JaumeJ rightly points out, and was indeed my thinking as well... without an interpreter, iti s all babbling. Thus, anyone listening would have to be unsaved. Hence, you have to be the speaker who "understands" the supposed language in order to be considered saved.
Then how is it in the book of acts men from different regions heard the apostles praising God in their own tongue, and after peter spoke they asked how they could be saved, and even today there are many instances where someone will hear his own language from someone that doesn't know what their saying, but the listener understands?
Throws that theory out the window
But i agree that to the unsaved that does not understand the language it may seem like babbling
Again i never stated that you have to speak in tongues in order to be saved, that is clearly unscriptual

Back to my original question:
What is wrong with being pentecostal??
 
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carey

Guest
#29
Oh, and please stop adding words that were not written
Never said "Pentecostal tongues"
Only said tongues
Thanks
 
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carey

Guest
#30
And i did say
"So long as it's spoken ACCORDING to Gods word"

Sorry for so many posts, doing this by phone
;)
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,195
6,508
113
#31
Oh, and please stop adding words that were not written
Never said "Pentecostal tongues"
Only said tongues
Thanks
It has always been my understanding that people always speak in a foreign language, and sometimes in the language of angels. At the time the Holy Spirit came down on the apostles in the upper room, there were people in the city from many countries, and when they heard the apostles, they were speaking in various tongues (languages) and people present from those countries understood them. Now, knowing the power of our Father is limitless, it could be they were all simply understood because the Holy Spirit made them to understand. Those who understood were not believers as yet, at least not most of them.
The gift of tongues can be any language, again, or the language of angels. When someone has the gift, if there is no one present to interpret, either by gift, or happening to understand the foreign language being spoke, then it is best to refrain from speaking.
There is no conflict between the time the apostles spoke and were understood, and an individual with the gift of tongues and having someone gifted to interpret, either by birth or by rebirth, no difference at all.
Our Father really is all capable, and all He does is good, amen.
 

damombomb

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2011
3,801
68
48
#32
As a generally cessationist individual, I've been quite surprised by the great number of Pentecostals and Charismatics ("P/C" from here-on-out) on this forum. It isn't that I'm angry about it, just that I find it interesting that so many people of the same theological outlook find their way to the same page. Maybe there are others who do not fall under those categories and leave, but anecdotally I still see an overwhelming body of people on these forums with those outlooks.

I'm really interested to know how everyone came to this specific faith--or, if you left it, why you did so. Were you in another church but decided that P/C was the correct view? Were you raised in the tradition? Did you join a P/C church first on your own volition? Or did others invite you?

I would really enjoy hearing any stories or Biblical arguments anyone might have which led them to the P/C faith. I don't mean to trivialize your faith as data, but P/C churches are likely the most-quickly growing religious group in the world, and I'm very interested to hear how that has played out in the personal lives of our brothers and sisters in Christ. Plus, a nice conversation between Christ's children seems like an appropriate way to further bring us together.

But maybe I should explain first what I'm thinking of when I say P/C. While it is obviously not the ONLY statement of their faith or even necessarily the most important, I have perceived many individuals discussing demons/possession, the devil, specific and concrete inspiration by the Holy Spirit, and some sort of dramatic and spiritual conversion experience. I understand this is not a definitive picture of the P/C churches, but I feel that they serve as reasonable indicators for them. I hope I haven't implied anything cross or offended anyone; I just thought I should explain my thinking.

Thanks.
I was raised baptist. As I got older i was invited to a pentecostal church and it was all new to me.
They teach Jesus name baptsim acts 2:38
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call. I thank God for everything I have learned. I am not ashamed of the gospel
of Christ. I prefer this kind of church , but that is just my experience.This scripture says the gift of the
Holy Ghost is still for today
 
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PETAMYMIK

Guest
#33
I mean no offense to the OP and those responding, but it appears to me that threads such as this, while seemingly benign on the surface, are created with the intent of creating argument and discord.

If you convinced me
And I convinced you
Would there not still be
Two points of view?

I am a new member and perhaps it is evidence of my naivete with this site, but such discussion appears more accusatory than constructive to our faith.

Ephesians 4:2-6
 
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rauleetoe

Guest
#34
i have to disagree with the previous post..people,seek.to discuss..not sow discord..some are sensiyive regardibg this topic .my experiences are from an insider,not an outsider..i used to attend these kind of churches, i was held onto by two men of my church and they refused to let me go until i prayed in tongues...so, no..not all tongues are genuine..i merely did so theyd let me go..it was not sincere,and i was very young in the faith back then...there is a sort of spiritual peer pressure in some of these churcges to go with the flow,if you do not you are rejected or,seen as less spiritual....
 
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ContrarySynthesis

Guest
#35
PETAMYMIK, I completely understand what you are saying, and I knew that my topic would create some discord--whether it is healthy or not is not for me to say at the moment. I didn't want the post to be about that, but I knew it would arrive in some form. I still found it valuable and, personally, interesting and so wanted to pose the question regardless. But I appreciate your concern and, I think, accurate observation. I just regret that that is the case.
 

damombomb

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2011
3,801
68
48
#36
i have to disagree with the previous post..people,seek.to discuss..not sow discord..some are sensiyive regardibg this topic .my experiences are from an insider,not an outsider..i used to attend these kind of churches, i was held onto by two men of my church and they refused to let me go until i prayed in tongues...so, no..not all tongues are genuine..i merely did so theyd let me go..it was not sincere,and i was very young in the faith back then...there is a sort of spiritual peer pressure in some of these churcges to go with the flow,if you do not you are rejected or,seen as less spiritual....[/quot
Your right that is rediculous! the apostles never did such things, they simply preached Jesus Christ
and him crucified and baptised in his name. Those people you are talking about i have also seen and I
would no go there either. It is the simplicity of the gospel of Christ
 

jb

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2010
4,940
586
113
#37
I got saved when I said the sinner's prayer at my bedside, attended a Pentecostal church, got baptised in water (full immersion) and shortly afterwards was Baptised in the Holy Spirit, all in the first year of my salvation, 30 years ago...

For me to have fellowship with another brother or sister (in Christ) all I look for is that they know the Lord Jesus as their Saviour (by being washed in His Blood), whether or not they are baptised in water or the Holy Spirit does not come into it, for (for me) it is faith in the Lord Jesus that makes an individual a Christian and so a member of the Body of Christ, which constitutes 'The Church'.

I have attended many different denominations and hence fellowshipped with Christians from those Churches in different countries, some of these being: Elim, AoG, Church of God, Independant Pentecostals, Methodist, Anglician, Presbyterian, (different) Brethren, Roman Catholics, United Reformed Church...I even have a cousin who is a Presbyterian minister. I may not agree with some of their non-essential (Christian) doctrines, but that does not stop me from fellowshipping with them and they with me, I see them as sisters and brothers (in Christ)...

Yahweh Shalom...
 

Elizabeth619

Senior Member
Jul 19, 2011
6,397
109
48
#38
What is wrong with being a pentacostal??
I am
I believe tongues and prophecy is still here, so long as it's spoken in accordance with Gods word
I have seen first hand demonic possession, and deliverance from it
the sick have been healed through the laying of hands
I have been a part of spontaneous worship,
And danced in the spirit
Church is not ment to be a funeral procession but a celebration, after all Jesus is not dead
I would rather attend a church where the pastor is obviously being moved by the spirit and my attention is captured than a pastor that just puts me to sleep


My opinion, like it or not
;)
That might work well for you, but for some people going to church and listening to the preacher is necessary. Dancing, moving around, screaming and making noise could be a distraction to some people, and prevent them from hearing the word.

I am obviously of a non charismatic faith, and I have never fallen asleep during a sermon. As a matter of fact I have laughed quietly, and even cried. Let me tell ya, sobbing silently was me being moved by the HS. The message the preacher was speaking moved me. It wasn't the preachers words, but the words he spoke from the word of God. I didn;t have to speak in tongues, watch an exorcism, dance, pass out or even be physically healed to know the HS was there. I also don't have to put on a show either.
 
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carey

Guest
#39
That might work well for you, but for some people going to church and listening to the preacher is necessary. Dancing, moving around, screaming and making noise could be a distraction to some people, and prevent them from hearing the word.

I am obviously of a non charismatic faith, and I have never fallen asleep during a sermon. As a matter of fact I have laughed quietly, and even cried. Let me tell ya, sobbing silently was me being moved by the HS. The message the preacher was speaking moved me. It wasn't the preachers words, but the words he spoke from the word of God. I didn;t have to speak in tongues, watch an exorcism, dance, pass out or even be physically healed to know the HS was there. I also don't have to put on a show either.
As l like to say
To each his own
God bless you sister
God knows what we need, when we need it
Some are reserved
Some are loud
But i do have to say, while pentecostals do get a bit loud, there is always order
If there wasn't order i believe it would be offensive to the Holy Spirit
I do believe in doing all things in accordance to Gods word;
;)
 

Elizabeth619

Senior Member
Jul 19, 2011
6,397
109
48
#40
As l like to say
To each his own
God bless you sister
God knows what we need, when we need it
Some are reserved
Some are loud
But i do have to say, while pentecostals do get a bit loud, there is always order
If there wasn't order i believe it would be offensive to the Holy Spirit
I do believe in doing all things in accordance to Gods word;
;)
I have never been diagnosed with ADD, but I will admit I have the attention span of a gnat. So a "lively" church service would be way too distracting for a chick like me lol.

You should see me in the chat room here on CC. I get on the mic to speak and can barely finish a sentence due to the pretty colors of the chat room texts. Seriously.