SAVED BY WORKS

Mitspa · Mar 2, 2015

well, leave it to me to be unclear.

the Lord Jesus. He began the good work in me; He will be faithful to complete it.
His Perfect life, His atoning sacrifice, His resurrection.
the Lord Jesus paid it all; did it all, so that i may rely on all the promises of God summed
up in Him. and He spoke the most lovely words: It is finished. ♥

My hope is built on nothing less than Jesus' blood and righteousness
i dare not trust the sweetest frame, but wholly lean on Jesus' Name...

You sing so nice

WheresEnoch · Mar 2, 2015

I don't think anyone here truly believes they are being saved by their works.
But there is nothing wrong with wanting and striving to please God through obedience.
We should also be teaching and encouraging every brother and sister in Christ to uphold the laws of God.
Not out of fear, but out of love for God and His good and perfect ways which bring forth life.

So tired of people thinking that by practicing righteousness, we are being legalistic.
If you teach other people to relax even the slightest of God's standards, than you will be least in the Kingdom of God.
For that is not what Christ wants us to do.

Does anyone, anyone at all, truly believe they are earning their salvation by works?
Faith in Christ justifies us before God. Our works prove our faith is true.
People are not saved by "accepting Christ" with their mouths and rejecting Christ with their thoughts, words and actions!
Don't be afraid to do some good works, it doesn't make you a legalist or teacher of false doctrine.
It makes you a lover of God and of people.
Not practicing righteousness proves you are a child of the devil.
Quit your sinning and start loving!

1 John 3
Little children, let no one deceive you. Whoever practices righteousness is righteous, as he is righteous. 8 Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil. 9 No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God. 10 By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother.

Mitspa · Mar 2, 2015

WheresEnoch said:

That is not what the bible says...and righteousness is the righteousness of faith (even as He is righteous)...the righteousness of the law is not righteousness.

1Jo 3:4 ¶ Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

Mitspa · Mar 2, 2015

Mitspa said:

Ro 10:3 For being ignorant of God's righteousness, and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law unto righteousness to every one that believeth.

WheresEnoch · Mar 2, 2015

Mitspa said:

Well I have two options then.

1 John 3
Little children, let no one deceive you. Whoever practices righteousness is righteous, as he is righteous. 8 Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning.

I can either let you deceive me or I can listen to God. Those who practice righteousness are righteous, those who make a practice of sinning are of the devil = false conversion/fake faith.
By their fruit I will know them.

I will gladly kick anyone out of a church (if i was a part of one) if they unrepentantly make a practice of sinning. For the love of God is not in them and a little leaven, leavens the whole batch. Rather than lie to that unborn again person and ensure his destruction, I will hand him over to Satan to live out the lusts of his flesh, so that at some point he may grow tired of his sin and truly repent.

Acts 5:32
And we are witnesses to these things, and so is the Holy Spirit, whom God has given to those who obey him.”

God gives the Holy Spirit to those who desire to obey Him, not those who say a sinner's pray to escape destruction.

Mitspa · Mar 2, 2015

WheresEnoch said:

Well if righteousness is by the law...then you have to reject the rest of the New Testament ...Clearly John is speaking of the righteousness of faith...as those who practice righteousness.

Ro 10:3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Ro 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

So do you believe righteousness is by the law?

And the passage says anyone who sins has never seen Him or known Him...you have a problem!

1Jo 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

WheresEnoch · Mar 2, 2015

Righteousness is not from the law, unrighteousness is from the law.
We strive for every action, thought and word to be above the law.
Done out of love for God and others, not out of self love and fleshly motivations

1joseph · Mar 2, 2015

Faith in Jesus Christ is our salvation and righteousness. Once we repent and accept Christ as our Lord and Savior the Spirit of God (Holy Spirit) comes into us and abides with us. This abiding of His Spirit in us removes our desire to sin in the flesh and replaces it with a spiritual desire to submit to Him, His laws and His statutes and reject sinful living and practices.

This results in us loving God and others and producing good fruit (doing good things) to God's glory.

Mitspa · Mar 2, 2015

WheresEnoch said:

Your right and what John is saying is those under the law are not practicing righteousness. They are rejecting the gospel and are in their sin.

1Jo 3:5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.

6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

WheresEnoch · Mar 2, 2015

You can either be a slave to righteousness or a slave to sin.
A slave to the flesh or a slave to the Spirit.
A child of God or a child of the devil.
It is up to each individual to decide with their thoughts and actions whom they wish to serve.
Whatever they do, is what they have chosen.
A sinner's prayer does not mean anything without backing it up with your whole life

The Holy Spirit is more than enough to sanctify man from willful sin. Even into their thoughts

mailmandan · Mar 2, 2015

SeaBass said:

You mean submit to YOUR gospel of "water and works" salvation. Here is Paul's point clearly made in Romans 10:3 - For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who BELIEVES. Believes plus what? *Romans 1:16 - For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who BELIEVES.. What other commands or works do you see mentioned along with BELIEVES?

Romans 10:16 - But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, "Lord, who has believed our report?" Choosing to believe the gospel by trusting in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ as the all sufficient means of our salvation is obeying the gospel. The gospel is the "good news" of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ and is not a set of rituals to perform, a code of laws to be obeyed or a check list of good works to accomplish as a prerequisite for salvation.

WheresEnoch · Mar 2, 2015

mailmandan said:

You "believe" with your life. Not only with your mouth.
What did Jesus say to the prostitute?

John 8
10 When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?

11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.

12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

Be careful that you do not lose your saltiness or that your eye becomes dark. For if the light that is in you is darkness... How great is that darkness!

Mitspa · Mar 2, 2015

WheresEnoch said:

Ro 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

The strength of sin, is the law.

Mitspa · Mar 2, 2015

WheresEnoch said:

What did Jesus do? He first delivered the woman from the condemnation of the law...

Ro 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

WheresEnoch · Mar 2, 2015

Unfortunately, the cost of discipleship is not considered anymore because we are taught to only confess Christ with our mouths and enjoy eternal security. Jesus had something else in mind when He told us to "believe" in Him.

Luke 14
Now great crowds accompanied him, and he turned and said to them, 26 “If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple. 27 Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple. 28 For which of you, desiring to build a tower, does not first sit down and count the cost, whether he has enough to complete it? 29 Otherwise, when he has laid a foundation and is not able to finish, all who see it begin to mock him, 30 saying, ‘This man began to build and was not able to finish.’ 31 Or what king, going out to encounter another king in war, will not sit down first and deliberate whether he is able with ten thousand to meet him who comes against him with twenty thousand? 32 And if not, while the other is yet a great way off, he sends a delegation and asks for terms of peace. 33 So therefore, any one of you who does not renounce all that he has cannot be my disciple.

Mitspa · Mar 2, 2015

WheresEnoch said:

Unfortunately, the cost of discipleship is not considered anymore because we are taught to only confess Christ with our mouths and enjoy eternal security. Jesus had something else in mind when He told us to "believe" in Him.

Luke 14
Now great crowds accompanied him, and he turned and said to them, 26 “If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple. 27 Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple. 28 For which of you, desiring to build a tower, does not first sit down and count the cost, whether he has enough to complete it? 29 Otherwise, when he has laid a foundation and is not able to finish, all who see it begin to mock him, 30 saying, ‘This man began to build and was not able to finish.’ 31 Or what king, going out to encounter another king in war, will not sit down first and deliberate whether he is able with ten thousand to meet him who comes against him with twenty thousand? 32 And if not, while the other is yet a great way off, he sends a delegation and asks for terms of peace. 33 So therefore, any one of you who does not renounce all that he has cannot be my disciple.

Did Christ just say to hate father and mother? Do you think He is teaching the law of Moses?

and

Ro 2:4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?

WheresEnoch · Mar 2, 2015

How can you tell if you preach a watered down gospel?

Have you ever been persecuted or hated for righteousness sake?

Matthew 5
10 “Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness' sake, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

11 “Blessed are you when others revile you and persecute you and utter all kinds of evil against you falsely on my account. 12 Rejoice and be glad, for your reward is great in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

Does the world hate you as it hated Christ?

John 15
“If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first. 19 The world would love you as one of its own if you belonged to it, but you are no longer part of the world. I chose you to come out of the world, so it hates you. 20 Do you remember what I told you? ‘A slave is not greater than the master.’ Since they persecuted me, naturally they will persecute you. And if they had listened to me, they would listen to you. 21 They will do all this to you because of me, for they have rejected the one who sent me. 22 They would not be guilty if I had not come and spoken to them. But now they have no excuse for their sin.

Mitspa · Mar 2, 2015

WheresEnoch said:

How can you tell if you preach a watered down gospel?

Have you ever been persecuted or hated for righteousness sake?

Matthew 5
10 “Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness' sake, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

11 “Blessed are you when others revile you and persecute you and utter all kinds of evil against you falsely on my account. 12 Rejoice and be glad, for your reward is great in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

Does the world hate you as it hated Christ?

John 15
“If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first. 19 The world would love you as one of its own if you belonged to it, but you are no longer part of the world. I chose you to come out of the world, so it hates you. 20 Do you remember what I told you? ‘A slave is not greater than the master.’ Since they persecuted me, naturally they will persecute you. And if they had listened to me, they would listen to you. 21 They will do all this to you because of me, for they have rejected the one who sent me. 22 They would not be guilty if I had not come and spoken to them. But now they have no excuse for their sin.

Ro 10:2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. 3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

Mitspa · Mar 2, 2015

Talking about obedience is not obedience ...talking about service to God is not service to God....anyone can come on here and lecture others with words....It don't mean anything, its just words!

Ro 3:27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.

WheresEnoch · Mar 2, 2015

Mitspa said:

Sorry Mitspa, I didn't see your posts. I think Jesus fulfilled the law of Moses and much more.
The 10 commandments were made for a people who did not have the Holy Spirit.
They apply to mainly outward actions. The Holy Spirit writes the laws in our hearts, and we obey them from the heart through the power of the Holy Spirit.

So when the 10 commandments say "Do not murder", Jesus instead says, "Do not even think a hateful thought"
And when the 10 commandments say "Do not commit adultery", Jesus teaches us "Do not even lust after a woman or you have committed adultery"

We are held to a higher standard, because we have a helper that conforms us to Christ and the love of Christ.

We no longer try to keep the commandments, because the commandments are made for criminals and sinners.

We begin to embody love, and love is above the law. The law does not apply to those who walk by the Spirit, for they will not break the commandments

The pharisees and saducees were good at keeping the law and finding loopholes to fulfill their lusts.
Christ said that inside, they were like tombs full of bones.
Jesus says that our righteousness needs to exceed that of the pharisees. We do that by cleaning the inside of the cup, not just the outside

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