SHOULD WE CHECK OUR DENOMINATIONS FOR TRUTH?

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Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
1,724
500
113
#1
We know many of our churches today are not giving us truth because there is only one truth, yet many differences in our church’s teaching.

In my search for the true church, I went back to the beginning of our church denominations. There is very little information about the denomination Christ set up except it was called The Way. It only lasted about 500 years. I found only one document about it outside of scripture, it was a report given to Rome by a man sent to research it for an Emperor. The reporter said that members cared and supported each other and he found no fault in it.

The next information on our church’s history was also a history of Constantine. Much of what Constantine wrote is preserved so we can know about this man. He was not a Christian for he had his wife killed and had coins printed of his God who was the sun. Yet, with politics in mind he established our church of today. His goal was to unify the Christian church, make it the state religion, and to do that he felt it needed to exclude any Jewish ideas, he calling Jews demons. Christians are told not to do this.

Every year after this council met in about 325 that set up the church there was a council of the Catholic church under the pope. The decisions of these councils are still felt today and each one was in opposition of the ways of the Jews. The Jews did not recognize the new covenant so many things the Jews practiced are not following God’s plan for us. But this opposition to the Jews means they threw out much of God’s instruction. All our holidays that Jews practiced were tossed and secular holidays replaced them, with a twist to them to make them sound Christian. Fleshly circumcision and diet restrictions was tossed, and these fleshly instructions were rightly tossed. Prayers the Jews had that had been God inspired were all tossed. The idea of scripture all being in agreement was tossed. The people who God used to explain His principles lived so many centuries ago, with different understandings and language so it is hard to understand God principles in the OT. God hid ancient writings that bridge that gap in the deep-sea scrolls, and our scholars are digging this information out. It has resulted in some changes in today’s church, now it listens closer to scripture as the OT gives us God principles.

Just as in Christ’s day, Christ was not accepted by many, today much of the idea of listening to OT scripture is not accepted. I think that should change. When we read in the NT of God using water to teach us, we need to go to the OT to understand this use of water. God said we were to always, forever, honor Passover and we tossed it, I think in error. As examples. We need a better understanding of the new covenant, OT scripture must agree with it.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
16,072
3,004
113
#2
All who listen to Jesus, Yeshua, only, and out of belief, are of the Way yet today. Also, it seems to me He taught the way of the faith of Abraham...………..that is the faith given us by the Honored Father of Nations., if you will receive this.

Jesus is able to raise up sons of Abraham from the stones. God be with all in Jesus, Yeshua...amen
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
3,036
585
113
#3
We know many of our churches today are not giving us truth because there is only one truth, yet many differences in our church’s teaching.

In my search for the true church, I went back to the beginning of our church denominations. There is very little information about the denomination Christ set up except it was called The Way. It only lasted about 500 years. I found only one document about it outside of scripture, it was a report given to Rome by a man sent to research it for an Emperor. The reporter said that members cared and supported each other and he found no fault in it.

The next information on our church’s history was also a history of Constantine. Much of what Constantine wrote is preserved so we can know about this man. He was not a Christian for he had his wife killed and had coins printed of his God who was the sun. Yet, with politics in mind he established our church of today. His goal was to unify the Christian church, make it the state religion, and to do that he felt it needed to exclude any Jewish ideas, he calling Jews demons. Christians are told not to do this.

Every year after this council met in about 325 that set up the church there was a council of the Catholic church under the pope. The decisions of these councils are still felt today and each one was in opposition of the ways of the Jews. The Jews did not recognize the new covenant so many things the Jews practiced are not following God’s plan for us. But this opposition to the Jews means they threw out much of God’s instruction. All our holidays that Jews practiced were tossed and secular holidays replaced them, with a twist to them to make them sound Christian. Fleshly circumcision and diet restrictions was tossed, and these fleshly instructions were rightly tossed. Prayers the Jews had that had been God inspired were all tossed. The idea of scripture all being in agreement was tossed. The people who God used to explain His principles lived so many centuries ago, with different understandings and language so it is hard to understand God principles in the OT. God hid ancient writings that bridge that gap in the deep-sea scrolls, and our scholars are digging this information out. It has resulted in some changes in today’s church, now it listens closer to scripture as the OT gives us God principles.

Just as in Christ’s day, Christ was not accepted by many, today much of the idea of listening to OT scripture is not accepted. I think that should change. When we read in the NT of God using water to teach us, we need to go to the OT to understand this use of water. God said we were to always, forever, honor Passover and we tossed it, I think in error. As examples. We need a better understanding of the new covenant, OT scripture must agree with it.
Can the truth be known? Where do we find this truth?
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
1,724
500
113
#4
Can the truth be known? Where do we find this truth?
I think the truth CAN be known, the truth is in scripture. Much of that scripture uses what was clear to man many thousands of years ago, we need to work to understand, now. We are given tools to work with to gain that understanding, we needed some history of those times. Much history has come to light for us.

Lots of our understanding has been messed with to add confusion by the attitude against learning what the OT has to say about God's principles. People say the new covenant cancelled much, and that is wrong. The new covenant added a depth of spiritual understanding, nothing of God's principles was changed in any way by this covenant. God is eternal, God is the I Am.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
6,610
4,421
113
65
lawton ok
#5
We know many of our churches today are not giving us truth because there is only one truth, yet many differences in our church’s teaching.

In my search for the true church, I went back to the beginning of our church denominations. There is very little information about the denomination Christ set up except it was called The Way. It only lasted about 500 years. I found only one document about it outside of scripture, it was a report given to Rome by a man sent to research it for an Emperor. The reporter said that members cared and supported each other and he found no fault in it.

The next information on our church’s history was also a history of Constantine. Much of what Constantine wrote is preserved so we can know about this man. He was not a Christian for he had his wife killed and had coins printed of his God who was the sun. Yet, with politics in mind he established our church of today. His goal was to unify the Christian church, make it the state religion, and to do that he felt it needed to exclude any Jewish ideas, he calling Jews demons. Christians are told not to do this.

Every year after this council met in about 325 that set up the church there was a council of the Catholic church under the pope. The decisions of these councils are still felt today and each one was in opposition of the ways of the Jews. The Jews did not recognize the new covenant so many things the Jews practiced are not following God’s plan for us. But this opposition to the Jews means they threw out much of God’s instruction. All our holidays that Jews practiced were tossed and secular holidays replaced them, with a twist to them to make them sound Christian. Fleshly circumcision and diet restrictions was tossed, and these fleshly instructions were rightly tossed. Prayers the Jews had that had been God inspired were all tossed. The idea of scripture all being in agreement was tossed. The people who God used to explain His principles lived so many centuries ago, with different understandings and language so it is hard to understand God principles in the OT. God hid ancient writings that bridge that gap in the deep-sea scrolls, and our scholars are digging this information out. It has resulted in some changes in today’s church, now it listens closer to scripture as the OT gives us God principles.

Just as in Christ’s day, Christ was not accepted by many, today much of the idea of listening to OT scripture is not accepted. I think that should change. When we read in the NT of God using water to teach us, we need to go to the OT to understand this use of water. God said we were to always, forever, honor Passover and we tossed it, I think in error. As examples. We need a better understanding of the new covenant, OT scripture must agree with it.
I saw a book today in fact it was a Bible that claimed to be a first century New Testament/commentary that made references to The Way. I couldn't afford it plus what I went to get. I'm kind of curious though.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
27,599
6,075
113
#6
In Acts we are told they were first called Christians at Antioch.

“The Way” is mentioned several times in the book of Acts (Acts 9:2; 19:9, 23; 22:4; 24:14, 22) in connection with early followers of Christ. It was to take prisoner men and women who “belonged to the Way” (Acts 9:2; 22:4) that Saul of Tarsus went to Damascus. After Saul was converted, he became a missionary and went by the name of Paul. In Ephesus, Paul met some in the synagogue who “became obstinate; they refused to believe and publicly maligned the Way” (Acts 19:9). Paul left the synagogue and continued to preach the gospel where it would be heard rather than remain with those who denigrated the Way.

During his trial before Felix, Paul said, “I admit that I worship the God of our ancestors as a follower of the Way, which they call a sect” (Acts 24:14). We are also told that Felix knew about the Way (verse 22). It seems that the Romans considered the Way to be a sect of Judaism rather than a separate religion.

Presumably, the early followers of Christ referred to themselves as followers of the Way because of Jesus’ statement in John 14:6 that He is “the way and the truth and the life.” Luke says that Aquila and Priscilla explained to Apollos “the way of God” more fully (Acts 18:26). Peter refers to Christianity as “the way of truth” (2 Peter 2:2). And the writer of Hebrews says that Jesus’ broken body is the “new and living way” for us to enter the Most Holy Place (Hebrews 10:19–20).

Today there are various Bibles that include The Way in their titles. There is also a book by Josemaria Escriva, founder of the Catholic Opus Dei, titled The Way. Additionally, there is a cult called The Way or The Way International. source
 

JamOn

Well-known member
Jun 10, 2019
1,290
475
83
#7
I think the truth CAN be known, the truth is in scripture. Much of that scripture uses what was clear to man many thousands of years ago, we need to work to understand, now. We are given tools to work with to gain that understanding, we needed some history of those times. Much history has come to light for us.

Lots of our understanding has been messed with to add confusion by the attitude against learning what the OT has to say about God's principles. People say the new covenant cancelled much, and that is wrong. The new covenant added a depth of spiritual understanding, nothing of God's principles was changed in any way by this covenant. God is eternal, God is the I Am.
but where can it really be found?
 

JamOn

Well-known member
Jun 10, 2019
1,290
475
83
#8
From the bottom of my heart, y’all have great evening/morning where ever it’s late.

Peace out
 

Mii

Well-known member
Mar 23, 2019
701
451
63
#9
I'm pretty critical of most things I hear. Possibly that is discernment in practice...not quite sure yet.

I sincerely don't believe that people have just been "doing it wrong" for the past 1500 years. Certainly there have always been wolves...


Each believer can only follow what they are guided toward with scripture as the "standard" for their assent or dissent. I have taken quite a long time to pass judgement (for myself) on what each precept means...Some precepts have a majority of what is meant. I am mostly open to changing a belief I have held about a particular thing in scripture, but the argument must be compelling and should be factored in unilaterally over the whole of scripture.

This open-mindedness and "intellectual honesty" toward scripture is somewhat oppositionary to my childlike faith but at the same time it has led to such a deeper awareness of the falsehoods we see in the world today that I cannot at this time state whether this is good or bad. My relationship was so personal with the Lord for a long time and then it was like by "the opposition" showing up, I learned what the body even was...pretty interesting to me.


I had at one point considered calling myself a follower of the way and I was excited that it seemed so "old school" like Acts style and then I had someone tell me that there was a church that used this title and people might think that's what I was meaning and I was dejected a bit. Does definitely sound like a great name for a church.


Do appreciate learning what that was from this thread. ty. although I didn't really want to know...BUT when it comes up despite my avoidance I typically presume that the information may be appropriate to know.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
1,724
500
113
#10
but where can it really be found?
I searched for a biblical scholar who had studied ancient history. I found that the latest true findings of that history was in the deep sea scrolls. I looked for men who had worked with these scrolls. These scholars are teaching in our prestigious colleges, now, and have written ancient Hebrew histories. I read four of them. Then I searched the net until I found biblical scholars who could explain the OT because they had learned how the people lived and thought in those times. These scholars are out there, available for us to study under. I picked one of them because he doesn't seem to report from what he personally believes but simply reports what he has learned about the Lord's true principles as is stated in scripture and is a Christian who includes how the NT expands on the OT teaching.

I feel it is truth I discovered. It seemed to open up how the truth works in our world. But to accept truth you first need to clear your mind of anything the church teaches that is not clearly stated in scripture--all scripture including the OT.
 

Mii

Well-known member
Mar 23, 2019
701
451
63
#11
I feel it is truth I discovered. It seemed to open up how the truth works in our world. But to accept truth you first need to clear your mind of anything the church teaches that is not clearly stated in scripture--all scripture including the OT.
Oh I would be curious to see if you feel like the Lord is speaking through that. When I first read this it sounded like "clear your mind of all scripture" lol.


I find few things in the churches I go to that are entirely unbiblical (if any), but that there are many that do not seem to be followed. There are some people that celebrate rosh hashanah and passover at least, which is exciting to me.
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
1,370
178
63
#12
it doesn't matter what you say to someone that is fully convinced in their own minds. The truth is found in the Bible and all doctrines need to be tested. Spiritual things are spiritually discerned. Pray for the Spirit and open the Bible. God will lead you if you are open and ready to hear the truth. Isa_8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
2Co 11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
2Co 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
test all things.
 

morefaithrequired

Well-known member
Sep 28, 2019
1,022
596
113
#13
At the TRUTH Oscars:
"And the winner is........you will never guess. A real dark horse. Jehovahs went real close. Mormons did surprisingly well. Catholics surprisingly bad..and the winner is .........The Calvinists!
Can I say this? Oh my God!
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
1,724
500
113
#14
it doesn't matter what you say to someone that is fully convinced in their own minds. The truth is found in the Bible and all doctrines need to be tested. Spiritual things are spiritually discerned. Pray for the Spirit and open the Bible. God will lead you if you are open and ready to hear the truth. Isa_8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
2Co 11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
2Co 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
test all things.
Scripture tells us to hear the word. …16But not all of them welcomed the good news. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our message?” 17 Consequently,faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.

Scripture tells us scripture instructs. 2 Tim. 3:15 and how from infancy you have known the holy writings, which are able to give you wisdom for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. 16 Every scripture is inspired by God and useful for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, 17 that the person dedicated to God may be capable and equipped for every good work.

We must put good food in our minds for the Holy Spirit to use. Christ is the word, and that word needs to be put in our minds. Scripture and study is necessary.
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
3,006
336
83
#16
We know many of our churches today are not giving us truth because there is only one truth, yet many differences in our church’s teaching.

In my search for the true church, I went back to the beginning of our church denominations. There is very little information about the denomination Christ set up except it was called The Way. It only lasted about 500 years. I found only one document about it outside of scripture, it was a report given to Rome by a man sent to research it for an Emperor. The reporter said that members cared and supported each other and he found no fault in it.

The next information on our church’s history was also a history of Constantine. Much of what Constantine wrote is preserved so we can know about this man. He was not a Christian for he had his wife killed and had coins printed of his God who was the sun. Yet, with politics in mind he established our church of today. His goal was to unify the Christian church, make it the state religion, and to do that he felt it needed to exclude any Jewish ideas, he calling Jews demons. Christians are told not to do this.

Every year after this council met in about 325 that set up the church there was a council of the Catholic church under the pope. The decisions of these councils are still felt today and each one was in opposition of the ways of the Jews. The Jews did not recognize the new covenant so many things the Jews practiced are not following God’s plan for us. But this opposition to the Jews means they threw out much of God’s instruction. All our holidays that Jews practiced were tossed and secular holidays replaced them, with a twist to them to make them sound Christian. Fleshly circumcision and diet restrictions was tossed, and these fleshly instructions were rightly tossed. Prayers the Jews had that had been God inspired were all tossed. The idea of scripture all being in agreement was tossed. The people who God used to explain His principles lived so many centuries ago, with different understandings and language so it is hard to understand God principles in the OT. God hid ancient writings that bridge that gap in the deep-sea scrolls, and our scholars are digging this information out. It has resulted in some changes in today’s church, now it listens closer to scripture as the OT gives us God principles.

Just as in Christ’s day, Christ was not accepted by many, today much of the idea of listening to OT scripture is not accepted. I think that should change. When we read in the NT of God using water to teach us, we need to go to the OT to understand this use of water. God said we were to always, forever, honor Passover and we tossed it, I think in error. As examples. We need a better understanding of the new covenant, OT scripture must agree with it.
Jesus set up the true church which teaches the same doctrine that Jesus taught in his day. The history that I have read from a small book titled 'The trail of tears", to me, is more believable than most. The RCC did not exist when the church was set up. Early on in the church two of the elders were in disagreement over adding to the original principles of preaching, praying and making melody in your heart by singing songs. There was a split in the church, one elder holding only to the three principles and the other elder adding several more principles to attract the interest of the masses. The larger number of membership followed adding principles and this division grew so great in number that it became a threat to the Roman government, so they incorporated it to be the RCC. The 3 principle division continued to practice as a small group compared to the population as a whole and were a target of the RCC to wipe them out. Paul participated in this attempt, before his conversion on the road to Damascus. This, in history was called the dark ages. The true church was never a part of the RCC and therefore was never a part of the reformation period in the 1500's. The true church will always exist as a small group, the remnant, the few, etc.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
9,411
3,099
113
#17
God said we were to always, forever, honor Passover and we tossed it, I think in error. As examples. We need a better understanding of the new covenant, OT scripture must agree with it.
Obviously you do not understand the meaning of FULFILLMENT. Christ said that He came to fulfil the Law. And because He fulfilled numerous types, shadows, and prophecies, they are no longer to be maintained. AND THAT IS WHAT GOD EXPECTS.

So first of all you need to get a grip on who Christ is and what He accomplished before you revert to types and shadows. Because when you do that you are telling God and Christ that you do not really believe them. Just like the unbelieving Jews.

For Christ is the end of the Law for righteousness to every one that believeth. (Rom 10:4)
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
10,990
5,442
113
#18
Jesus set up the true church which teaches the same doctrine that Jesus taught in his day. The history that I have read from a small book titled 'The trail of tears", to me, is more believable than most. The RCC did not exist when the church was set up. Early on in the church two of the elders were in disagreement over adding to the original principles of preaching, praying and making melody in your heart by singing songs. There was a split in the church, one elder holding only to the three principles and the other elder adding several more principles to attract the interest of the masses. The larger number of membership followed adding principles and this division grew so great in number that it became a threat to the Roman government, so they incorporated it to be the RCC. The 3 principle division continued to practice as a small group compared to the population as a whole and were a target of the RCC to wipe them out. Paul participated in this attempt, before his conversion on the road to Damascus. This, in history was called the dark ages. The true church was never a part of the RCC and therefore was never a part of the reformation period in the 1500's. The true church will always exist as a small group, the remnant, the few, etc.
Wow... revisionist history at its finest!

You are claiming that the RCC existed prior to 40 AD, as Paul underwent his conversion experience prior to 40 AD.

Any other counter-historical claims you want to make? How about you go ahead and reveal your true identity, Dan Brown!
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
16,072
3,004
113
#19
Jesus, Yeshua, is the Passover Lamb of God. He does for all who believe the same as He did for the original children of Israel in Mitzraim(Egypt). He saves us from death.

He fulfills the prophecy made by Abraham to Isaac of God making Himself a sacrifice.

Christians, most that is, have changed the name of Passover to Easter, also they have changed all of the date.

We c elebrate Pasover when we remember the Sacrifice for us of Jesus, Yeshua, every year, though the date is not correct. The changing of the date was by men, not by God, and not b Rabbis.

I will not go so far as to say anyone "does not understand" for no one truly undersstands all, especially anyone who constantkt deckare -"wrongm" "correct,," or "you don not understand" without thinking of another's given understaning. It is the product of pride and pomposity to conduct onceself so. Forgive my understanding of this should it offend, but I am satisfied in our Father's presence that we are sound in remembering Pesach, Passover, in memory of God's personal sa crifice for us all. God bless all who love our blessed Redeemer, amen.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
10,990
5,442
113
#20
I think the truth CAN be known, the truth is in scripture. Much of that scripture uses what was clear to man many thousands of years ago, we need to work to understand, now. We are given tools to work with to gain that understanding, we needed some history of those times. Much history has come to light for us.

Lots of our understanding has been messed with to add confusion by the attitude against learning what the OT has to say about God's principles. People say the new covenant cancelled much, and that is wrong. The new covenant added a depth of spiritual understanding, nothing of God's principles was changed in any way by this covenant. God is eternal, God is the I Am.
You confuse "God's principles" with the Law as given to Moses. They are NOT the same thing. If you understood the OT you would understand the distinction. The Law was given TO ISRAEL, not to the whole world. It was God's requirement FOR ISRAEL, not for the whole world. It was PART of God's plan of salvation, intended to bring about the Messiah, and intended to be set aside upon the arrival of the New covenant.

Imagine your daily transportation is a derelict 1960's motor-assisted bicycle. Sometimes the engine starts, and when it does, usually you have to nurse it carefully to keep it running. Many times you have had to get off an push your way up the hills because the motor has failed. Then, you learn that you have inherited an almost-new sedan that is still under warranty. Upon delivery, you lovingly clean it inside and out, park it in the garage, and continue trying to get to work on your derelict motorized bicycle.

That's what you have done with the OT Law. You're still trying to make an obsolete system work for you, when you have all the "vehicle" that you would ever need right at your fingertips.