So I want honest answers....

[Magenta]

Have you ever seen the ads in those glossy magazines that lay around in your doctor's, dentist's, or chiropractor's waiting room, with the super happy, healthy, slim, good looking person enjoying life to the fullest, ostensibly because they pop some pill on a regular basis? Turn the page to see the small print: one full page of disclaimers and warnings.

Or, have you seen the ads on TV? The announcer says something like, "If you have taken this drug -(obviously previously government approved after being fully tested)- and have suffered any of the following side effects: abnormal organ function or failure, migraines, faintness, vertigo, muscle aches and pains/spasms, digestive tract infection, blindness, paralysis, or death, please call this number...???" Yes, they actually say, if you have experienced death as a result of taking this drug, please call the number on your screen!

Funny for us perhaps but surely not so funny for those who have lost loved ones to prescription deaths, which apparently outnumber motor vehicular accidental deaths. People using their drugs as prescribed die in high numbers taking approved drugs. Prescription pain and anxiety drugs are potent, highly addictive and especially dangerous when combined with one another or with other drugs or alcohol; public health experts have drawn attention to the American nation's growing prescription drug problem, which they characterize as an epidemic.

 

[jenniferand2]

Lets get this straight:
ANY drug that actually works has side-effects.
You are right that those side effects can be fatal.
Paracetamol and the combined contraceptive pill can and do kill people!

This is why it is so important that for both the doctor and the patient that they are aware of what can happen.
I have had stop a fortune of drugs in my career lifetime that I prescribed because of side-effects.
I have also had to look after a lot of patients in intensive care who were desperately ill because of the side-effects of drugs.

However to claim that the whole thing is just a money grab is plain wrong!
A bit of perspective is required here - the truth is that the most useful drugs in medicine are usually the ones that are the most potentially dangerous when things go wrong.

A little off topic here sense you mentioned your a physician. You know if the huge heroin problem that is obviously killing people like crazy. Do you feel that the prescribes opiods to patients who really need them should have to suffer? Do you think prescribed opiods are even a. Huge part of the problem as government is now a saying? I have read up on this a lot and I see the problem being with people in there 20 to 30 getting drugs off the street and going on from there. I was just wondering what a dr. Thinks you can plead the fifth if you wish I understand

 

[Adstar]

Basically, I live in sin and am constantly going back and forth to God and to sin. I understand many things. I have Marijuana and scripture shows me that it's wrong to possess it and to smoke it. I could sell my weed and my pipe or I could throw it away and try not to do that again. What is the Godly thing to do?

The right think is to throw it away and try not to do it gain and thank God for forgiving you for the times that you did use it.. Then if you ever use it again wash and repeat the process again.. Simple..

 

[laura_charlotte]

Many prescribed drugs are approved with such horrible side effects (up to and including death) that it is obvious they are a pharmaceutical, government approved money grab.

I wish everyone had this appreciation. They don't solve problems, they might provide some short relief or nothing at all, but have many long term consequences, so they come with a barrage of problems. It sounds like rhetoric but it doesn't take away from its truth. The best medicine is God, organic natural food, exercise and the natural supplementation which God provides through nature.

 

[jenniferand2]

Have you ever seen the ads in those glossy magazines that lay around in your doctor's, dentist's, or chiropractor's waiting room, with the super happy, healthy, slim, good looking person enjoying life to the fullest, ostensibly because they pop some pill on a regular basis? Turn the page to see the small print: one full page of disclaimers and warnings.

Or, have you seen the ads on TV? The announcer says something like, "If you have taken this drug -(obviously previously government approved after being fully tested)- and have suffered any of the following side effects: abnormal organ function or failure, migraines, faintness, vertigo, muscle aches and pains/spasms, digestive tract infection, blindness, paralysis, or death, please call this number...???" Yes, they actually say, if you have experienced death as a result of taking this drug, please call the number on your screen!

Funny for us perhaps but surely not so funny for those who have lost loved ones to prescription deaths, which apparently outnumber motor vehicular accidental deaths. People using their drugs as prescribed die in high numbers taking approved drugs. Prescription pain and anxiety drugs are potent, highly addictive and especially dangerous when combined with one another or with other drugs or alcohol; public health experts have drawn attention to the American nation's growing prescription drug problem, which they characterize as an epidemic.

Yes we hear everyday about the growing epidemic but in the mean time people that need medication and use it properly are now being told no or we can't help or are gettin very little relief from major pain so what are the people who follow the rules supposed to do now?

 

[Magenta]

Lets get this straight:
ANY drug that actually works has side-effects.
You are right that those side effects can be fatal.
Paracetamol and the combined contraceptive pill can and do kill people!

This is why it is so important that for both the doctor and the patient that they are aware of what can happen.
I have had stop a fortune of drugs in my career lifetime that I prescribed because of side-effects.
I have also had to look after a lot of patients in intensive care who were desperately ill because of the side-effects of drugs.

However to claim that the whole thing is just a money grab is plain wrong!
A bit of perspective is required here - the truth is that the most useful drugs in medicine are usually the ones that are the most potentially dangerous when things go wrong.

Please re-read what I said. When I talk about drugs that have side effects that include killing people, obviously something has gone horribly wrong in the approval process. I did not say "the whole thing" was a money grab. But, since we are on the topic, let's be honest: many doctors are fairly ignorant of the full range of side effects of the drugs they prescribe. They are simply puppets passing out pills like good little robots doing what the pharmaceutical companies want them to.

 

[jenniferand2]

I wish everyone had this appreciation. They don't solve problems, they might provide some short relief or nothing at all, but have many long term consequences, so they come with a barrage of problems. It sounds like rhetoric but it doesn't take away from its truth. The best medicine is God, organic natural food, exercise and the natural supplementation which God provides through nature.

Uh what about people who have bone on bone activity in their neck and back so bad they are in horrible pain and are practically forced to suffer?

 

[Magenta]

I wish everyone had this appreciation. They don't solve problems, they might provide some short relief or nothing at all, but have many long term consequences, so they come with a barrage of problems. It sounds like rhetoric but it doesn't take away from its truth. The best medicine is God, organic natural food, exercise and the natural supplementation which God provides through nature.

Yes, it really does seem that our whole medical approach/system is skewed to favor prescriptions over prevention. Nutrition and healthy lifestyle choices should be prerequisites in school.

 

[Magenta]

Yes we hear everyday about the growing epidemic but in the mean time people that need medication and use it properly are now being told no or we can't help or are gettin very little relief from major pain so what are the people who follow the rules supposed to do now?

If you are getting very little relief from major pain what can you do? People who live with chronic pain do various things to help themselves depending on what is causing the pain. It is true that medications are not always effective. I have experienced such severe back pain that it was difficult just to lay in bed, and turning over or standing up was definitely problematic to a point where I missed many days of work over a period of years (been in chiropractic care since I was about 25 years old). Muscle relaxants hardly helped. I don't recall ever being prescribed anything for my back "being out." Overall the situation has improved but I need to be careful and also watch my posture and activity levels which I must admit I am not the best at

 

[graceNpeace]

Have you ever seen the ads in those glossy magazines that lay around in your doctor's, dentist's, or chiropractor's waiting room, with the super happy, healthy, slim, good looking person enjoying life to the fullest, ostensibly because they pop some pill on a regular basis? Turn the page to see the small print: one full page of disclaimers and warnings.

Or, have you seen the ads on TV? The announcer says something like, "If you have taken this drug -(obviously previously government approved after being fully tested)- and have suffered any of the following side effects: abnormal organ function or failure, migraines, faintness, vertigo, muscle aches and pains/spasms, digestive tract infection, blindness, paralysis, or death, please call this number...???" Yes, they actually say, if you have experienced death as a result of taking this drug, please call the number on your screen!

Funny for us perhaps but surely not so funny for those who have lost loved ones to prescription deaths, which apparently outnumber motor vehicular accidental deaths. People using their drugs as prescribed die in high numbers taking approved drugs. Prescription pain and anxiety drugs are potent, highly addictive and especially dangerous when combined with one another or with other drugs or alcohol; public health experts have drawn attention to the American nation's growing prescription drug problem, which they characterize as an epidemic.

Magenta, your concerns are well noted!

I have often caught a lot flak for stopping drugs that were clearly causing harm.
Sometimes it was the patient criticising my actions and sometimes another clinician and sometimes both!
I would stick to my guns nonetheless.

However, the issue of harm from prescribed drugs, is a multifactorial one.
Firstly, some side-effects are not predictable - no clinician can know that a patient will have that side effect until it happens.
Then, there are those side-effects that are more predictable - not to say that they will happen, but the risk is known.
Does that automatically mean that the drug is not prescribed?
The answer is no!
It depends on why the drug is being prescribed.
If one is diagnosed with acute myeloid leukaemia then a haematologist will prescribe drugs which are very dangerous with horrible side effects (including the risk of death)!
Those drugs however, can cure one completely, of acute myeloid leukaemia.
Is a cure a guarantee?
No.
Does everyone getting these chemotherapeutic agents suffer severe side-effects?
No, but a lot do.
Is taking the chemotherapeutic drugs worth it?
Yes, because a cure is possible (likely even) and not getting treatment is certain death!

So, again perspective is called for!

BTW if there are issues with advertising drugs in the USA then the solution is a political one.
In Australia it is illegal to advertise prescription only drugs to the public and there are plenty of rules governing how drugs are advertised to the medical profession.

 

[jenniferand2]

If you are getting very little relief from major pain what can you do? People who live with chronic pain do various things to help themselves depending on what is causing the pain. It is true that medications are not always effective. I have experienced such severe back pain that it was difficult just to lay in bed, and turning over or standing up was definitely problematic to a point where I missed many days of work over a period of years (been in chiropractic care since I was about 25 years old). Muscle relaxants hardly helped. I don't recall ever being prescribed anything for my back "being out." Overall the situation has improved but I need to be careful and also watch my posture and activity levels which I must admit I am not the best at

I have bad faucet joints in my neck being nothing really holding my vertebrae in place so they are constantly slipping around. I also have bad degenerate disc in my lowback l4 to s 2 I am basically a walking swiveling spine. It is either massive surgeriesor pain medication.my Dr tells menot to do surgery but won't give me enough pain medication to keep me out of pain so I suffer often. Sometimes praying for God to let me die.

 

[posthuman]

I don't know why people always jump to that conclusion, especially when I did not say that.

because using the argument that our word "pharmaceutical" comes from the Greek word that is used for sorcery indicates drug use is sorcery makes that an obvious & inescapable conclusion.
throw out your aspirin, your insulin, your antibiotics too, if the bottom line is that "drugs" are sorcery.

in fact, by definition, a drug is any substance that chemically alters the composition of the body. so throw out your chocolate, and your salt from your diet, too.

if this is the argument, then towards the bottom of the footloose-slope we end up with 'doctors are evil' and 'healthcare is witchcraft' and under our arms we're bringing a box of cobras to chapel on sunday instead of a Bible. i think we can agree that's absurd.

[HR][/HR][HR][/HR]
obviously ((i hope)), you can take this too far. but theorem is tested at its extremities, and if it fails there, it fails altogether.

this is because ((in my opinion)) the reasoning is wrong. we're looking at this from the point of view of human-made laws and regulation that have only 'a shew of wisdom' but cannot, and do not address the heart.

the reason this argument associating pharmaceuticals with sorcery fails, which i think you start to touch on in the rest of the post i quoted, is that "use" and "abuse" are different things. God has made all the things on the earth for a purpose, and has given man dominion over them. all things are to be received with thankfulness, and are clean when they are received this way. man also has sin in his nature, and is thankful in his wicked heart for abusing things to satisfy his own lusts. is marijuana useful to man aside from hemp products? is there any situation where a man might truly thank God for it that does not constitute abuse or sin? i'm not going to throw away the possibility just because the majority of men abuse it. it's not a curse from God that it exists just because it alters the mind and body.

the problem with pot, alcohol, cocaine, chocolate, anti-anxiety pills, tobacco, or whatever - isn't the fact that it's a chemical we take into our bodies by eating, drinking inhaling or even injecting directly. if that's the problem, then every food, drink and otherwise ingestible substance is a problem too. the problem isn't use, it's abuse. it's these things interfering with what God would have you do, and eventually interfering with your relationship to Him at a basic level, so that they become 'god' to you and are more important than goodness, charity and reverence.

the thing about these things that is harmful is the thing that causes them to interfere with the good things God has prepared for us to do and to become. that includes their effect on judgement and soundness of mind ((sobriety)) and their addictive properties, that lead to them becoming idols in our lives. it can also include the effects on our health - but i don't believe that means it's sinful to not be on some kind of strict kosher organic raw vegan smoothie purging garden-of-eden lion/lamb straw-eating diet. making all kinds of human commandments about diet is just as much idolatry - and for that matter, we could just as easily be talking about playing video games or disc-golf, preening in front of a mirror or watching football on tv as smoking pot.

it's feeding our lusts that is sin, IMHO. it placing these things on a pedestal and bowing to them.

one of our brothers put it this way, in a song:

the problem ain't havin' a Benz:
unless you can't give it away,
then it is​

we must love the Lord with all our heart. no one is worthy of being his disciple unless he hates his family, and even his own self. there is no greater love then to set down your life for your friend. we need to be able to set everything in our lives down for Him.

for us, as Christians, the problem with pot is the same problem with mammon, and the same problem whatever it is in your own life that you might 'tune out' the Spirit in order to do.


[HR][/HR][HR][/HR]

so i believe this argument that gets made about 4 times for every 1 conversation that gets started among Christians about any kind of drug, that pharmaceuticals = sorcery therefore eating a mushroom makes you share a bunk in hell next to Alastair Crowley, is a step in the wrong direction, away from the heart of the issue, and is a pretty questionable association to make as a prejudicial generality, for exactly the slippery slope argument i'm responding to with this post - that argument makes all drugs equally evil no matter how they are used, because usually, you just make that pharmacy connection and never mention how or why any substance is being used and/or abused.

we don't need to consider His creation 'evil' to come to this conclusion, and we don't need to talk about "poisons" to come to this conclusion either; nor do we need call everyone that eats chocolate or takes an antacid a sorcerer. we just need to recognize what idolatry really is ((lust, evil desires and greed, Colossians 3:5)), and repent of it.

 

[posthuman]

No Willie I was seriously asking a question. From what I read of the original post of the witchcraft topic. It sounded like all medicine was witch craft which has me confused

yes, because that's exactly what that argument is saying.
((& i don't think it's wise to keep using it as an argument))

the response to your critical question is that,

"oh i only mean a group of certain drugs that i arbitrarily call 'pharmaceuticals' even though i wouldn't actually call those drugs 'pharmaceuticals' - in fact, i mean other drugs are 'pharmaka' but actual pharmaceuticals are actually not pharmaceutical. nevermind that THC comes in pill form and is available in pharmacies even in states where the plant it is derived from is illegal."
​

but not everyone who smokes meth is doing witchcraft. oh, i agree - some are. maybe many are. but not even most. even then, in my eyes, it's the witchcraft that's wicked, not the meth. and i'm saying that hating meth and what it does to people; post has seen it eat a lot of people he called friend.

like i said in a very long-winded way in the post post posted above this post, though, everyone addicted to meth has an idol.
and IMHO, that's the issue.

the OP demonstrated with by making the thread that the idol in her life fell to the ground before Christ in her heart like dagon before the ark. whatever action she has strength to take afterwards, in her heart Christ has overcome it. coming to terms with the relationship between God and all other things, and calling sin 'sin' and calling idols 'idolatry' in your heart is being through with it.

and that's what matters, i believe; that's the issue. not whether some poor soul who knows better ever lives to overcome an addiction to junk 100% - praise God if He shows him the mercy to do so! but it's in the heart where we repent, and in the heart where the Lord alone judges and knows.

amen, show that heart by our actions!
but y'all, looking the outside of a thermos doesn't tell you if the water inside is clean or not. who can look inside my thermos?

 

[Seekingfamily]

I did the surgery for L4 L5 fusion on May 30th, immediately after surgery..I lost 50 to 60% of pain. A month now post op, my pain is around 10 to 5%. I went to Neuro Spine Institute. I am feeling wonderful, but know that I must still watch myself of over doing things. Was told 6 months to a year. My therapist came yesterday, she was surprised at how well I am healing.

 

[graceNpeace]

I did the surgery for L4 L5 fusion on May 30th, immediately after surgery..I lost 50 to 60% of pain. A month now post op, my pain is around 10 to 5%. I went to Neuro Spine Institute. I am feeling wonderful, but know that I must still watch myself of over doing things. Was told 6 months to a year. My therapist came yesterday, she was surprised at how well I am healing.

Good to know!

 

[jaybird88]

do you wake up, grab your pipe, get high and stay high all day and every day?

 

[vnoheni]

do you wake up, grab your pipe, get high and stay high all day and every day?

No. I tried it for a while. It's in the trash now. I'm not going to do that anymore. I bought some just because I could.

 

[jaybird88]

No. I tried it for a while. It's in the trash now. I'm not going to do that anymore. I bought some just because I could.

so basically you bought some weed just to try it?

 

[WingsOfFidelity]

Keep looking at the WORD of GOD and the WORD of GOD will deliver you.
It does you no good to be religious and your heart Is not changed.
GOD looks at the heart,man looks at how you act outwardly.

God don't only look at the heart, for the heart is exceedingly wicked, He CHANGES the heart.

 

[WingsOfFidelity]

Does everything have to be about you? Marijuana can be used for hemp, which has nothing at all to do with using it to get high... Hemp can replace wood pulp in making paper, or be used to make clothing etc.

e
There are actually two different kinds of hemp. You are speaking of both as one here.