So if you are not under the Law, does that mean you are in lawelessness?

Jason0047 · Apr 21, 2015

No. Again, corruption is not a beautiful thing. Just because something is beautiful does not mean it is corrupted. A mountain can be beautiful, but that does not mean it is corrupted. Yes, Satan was corrupted by having pride in his own beauty. Yet, God made Satan beautiful. So was it God's fault that Satan was beautiful? No. Satan chose to lift his own natural beauty (that the Lord created) above God. So no. Corruption is not a beautiful thing. Something that is corrupt is an ugly thing. Satan took something that was a natural part of God's creation and twisted it to serve his own ends. He thought he could be like the most high God.

So no. Corruption is not a beautiful thing. It is an ugly thing.

WheresEnoch · Apr 21, 2015

Jason0047 said:

I would define faith as that which is produced by our beliefs.
If I believe in God and I base my actions off that belief, that is faith.

Jason0047 · Apr 21, 2015

WheresEnoch said:

Yes, I agree. It is sort of like saying... if one confesses that they have faith in their old rocking chair to hold them up (being heavier now), they will no doubt sit in that chair to prove their faith is true in it (Which lines up with what they believe mentally about it).

WheresEnoch · Apr 21, 2015

Jason0047 said:

Yes, if God says not to worry and we worry all the time, I would call that a lack of faith.

If we say, "I believe that old chair will hold me up". Yet we choose not to sit on it just in case it breaks, then I would call that a lack of faith

Jason0047 · Apr 21, 2015

WheresEnoch said:

Yes, if God says not to worry and we worry all the time, well I would call that a lack of faith.

If we say, "I believe that old chair will hold me up". Yet we choose not to sit on it just in case it breaks, well then I would call that a lack of faith

Yes, I agree.

kodiak · Apr 21, 2015

WheresEnoch said:

If you truly believe something your actions will show it. We are still saved under grace though, works cannot save us, only Jesus' forgiveness. Jesus' followers showed that they believed through their actions. Here is a Charles Colson quote that shows this. So I believe we are saved by grace, but through our actions others can see we are God's people.

eyesonly · Apr 21, 2015

Jason0047 said:

The law of faith. Good. Well, how do you define faith? Well, faith without works is a dead faith. So yes, we are not saved by works, but we are saved by grace thru faith that brings forth works. So while we are not saved by doing works in and of themselves, a true saving faith will always result in proving itself to be true by it having works.

AMEN brother, AMEN!

God bless

Jeff_56 · Apr 21, 2015

WheresEnoch said:

i really really thought you knew the BIBLE well enough to know that that is not even close to true.

Stick with what the BIBLE says faith is. simply.

it never says we can produce faith in yahweh (GOD), anywhere, anytime, any how.

unless i have lost my mind, which might happen some day,

it is written that FAITH IS A GIFT, A SHEER GIFT, from YAHWEH .

dcontroversal · Apr 21, 2015

Jason0047 said:

Your contradictions never cease to amaze me....

God made Satan (Lucifer) beautiful. So was it God's fault the Satan (Lucifer) was Beautiful? NO.

Dude you are so blind to your contradicitons that you cannot even tell when you post one.....!

God made him beautiful, but it was not God's fault that he was beautiful...you have got the be kidding right?

Jason0047 · Apr 21, 2015

Dear Jeff:

Faith comes by hearing and hearing the Word of God. When we believe the Word of God, and act upon it by faith by repenting of our sins and accepting Jesus as our Savior, we get the free gift of salvation. So.... faith is always something that will always involve some type of action. Just read Hebrews 11.

Jason0047 · Apr 21, 2015

dcontroversal said:

You love to see things that I did not actually write. Nowhere did I say it was God's fault that Satan was beautiful. I asked it as a question and then replied with a .... "No."

dcontroversal · Apr 21, 2015

Jason0047 said:

I think you need to go back and read what you wrote....You clearly said.....YET GOD made Satan beautiful. Was it God's fault that Satan was beautiful? NO.

I can read just fine...You made a clear statement about God making Satan beautiful and then Asked a question about it being God's fault that Satan was beautiful? and SAID NO......are you seriously that blind.......!

God made ALL things including the beauty found in Lucifer before his fall.......you have serious interpretational errors.....serious!

Jason0047 · Apr 22, 2015

dcontroversal said:

Well, there is no contradiction in what I said. You are seeing something that is not there (yet again). I said, I quote:

Yet, God made Satan beautiful. So was it God's fault that Satan was beautiful? No. Satan chose to lift his own natural beauty (that the Lord created) above God.

So I said God made Satan beautiful. This is true. Because God made him to be a very beautiful angel. Then I asked the question was it God's fault that Satan was beautiful so as to reply to a false statement made by the person I was replying to. For they said, "Corruption is lovely and beautiful." I replied with a question that negates that line of thinking. Was it God's fault that Satan was beautiful? Meaning, did God create Lucifer in such a way that would make him fall into sin? I replied with a.... "No." to that question. I then said Satan chose to lift up his beauty (that the Lord created) above God. So it was Satan's pride in his own beauty that made him to fall. That is what I was saying. Not sure what you are seeing differently.

Jeff_56 · Apr 22, 2015

the relationship of faith to actions in no way changes that yahweh says faith is a gift. sheer gift of grace.

the fact that some people have faith in the devil and don't know it,
and
the fact that billions of people have faith in a man controlled by the devil,
and
it
shows
by
their actions, their words, and seemingly their never-ending posts on this forum that
faith has results ---
faith in the devil, and faith in the man controlled by the devil, results in serving the devil.

faith in yahweh, granted only by grace, in yahshua according to HIS WORD and HIS PURPOSE and HIS PLAN,
results in HIS WORK being accomplished; and the works HE PLANNED before the creation of the world also
for
those
who
serve yahweh by grace through faith in yahshua.

a very very very compete difference seen in the world: faith in the devil>> serving the devil.

FAITH IN YAHWEH IN YAHSHUA >> serving YAHWEH .

there is no in between as
yahshua
said
clearly --- he who is not against me is for me; he who is not for me is against me.

dcontroversal · Apr 22, 2015

Jason0047 said:

There is no use in talking to you, addressing you and or replying to you as your blindness to what you said goes beyond perplexing.....God made Lucifer beautiful......It is God's working and power that made Lucifer beautiful and to turn around and say it was not his fault that Lucifer was beautiful contradicts your first statement ....Lucifer's sin was not his beauty...it was pride and self.....He was PERFECT in the day he was CREATED until INIQUITYwas found in HIM for he said within HIS HEART I WILL.....that was his sin...not his BEAUTY!

Jason0047 · Apr 22, 2015

dcontroversal said:

If you will slow down and just read a little more slowly in what I had written, I said exactly what you are saying. I said in my previous post that it was Satan's pride in his own beauty that made him to fall.

Jason0047 · Apr 22, 2015

Word_Swordsman said:

Dear BH:

When confronted with a question of overcoming sin by Word Swordsman, your response was not in agreement that a believer should overcome the old man. Instead, you asked a question of him implying that he is not without sin. For you asked, "are you without sin"? Meaning, you don't appear to believe a believer can stop sinning. If this is what you believe, then you are believing against what the Bible teaches. For the Bible teaches that we can cease from sin (1 Peter 4:1). For they that are Christ's have crucified the affections and lusts (Galatians 5:24). Peter identifies those false prophets as those who have not ceased from sin (2 Peter 2:1, 14). In other words, when someone believes they cannot stop sinning and yet they believe they are saved, then that essentially is saying they believe in a sin and still be doctrine. However, Jesus told the woman caught in the act of adultery to sin no more. Jesus' first words in his ministry to people was for them to... "repent."

Jason0047 · Apr 22, 2015

For the Ninevites shall rise up in Judgment against this generation because they repented at the preaching of Jonah. If we were to look at Jonah 3, we can see that their repentance involved the forsaking of their evil ways. In other words, they stopped sinning. Yet, if we as believers think we can just continue in sin and just confess of sin with the thinking we will never overcome sin, then that is basically no different then what some Catholics believe or practice. For many RCC proponents sin during the week and then at the end of the week, they then go their priest to be forgven. Yet, there is no actual change in their life, though. They are not a new creature in Christ. There is no forsaking of sin. Which means they are justifying a sin and still be saved type belief.

Jason0047 · Apr 22, 2015

Yes, the Tax Collector was more justified for crying to God to have mercy on him in being a sinner than the Pharisee who thought he was better than the Tax Collector, but we have to look at all Scripture from a balanced viewpoint. Jesus surely does not want us to remain as sinners because he calls to be perfect as our Heavenly Father is perfect. So the Parable of the Tax Collector is in view of a believer who honestly is seeking the Lord's mercy with their wanting to stop. For if someone who does not desire to stop in their sin is not really going to express any real sorrow to God that they are truly sorry. For is a man who has cheated on his wife really sorry if he tells her she is sorry and yet he continues to keep cheating on her? No. So there has to come a point where a believer will turn from their wicked ways. If not, then they are making allowance for a sin and still be saved type belief.

Jason0047 · Apr 22, 2015

The point of the Parable is to show that God gives grace to the humble and that He resists the proud. The point of the parable is that God does indeed extend mercy to those who do honestly struggle with sin (and who seek to overcome it). But in no way is the Parable of the Tax Collector an allowance for anyone to think they can sin and still be saved, though. Believers have to repent and turn from their wicked ways.

So if you are not under the Law, does that mean you are in lawelessness?

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