how interesting.
because this is exactly what i found when i was disturbed by your writings and professions and set out to research you
in any case.....concerning Skinski:
i'm familiar with Stewart Best.
we needn't cover his work unless you want to.
Paul Washer? so you were influenced by him, and even though Paul Washer is insistent on holy living and immovable on continual vigilance and shunning sin....you eventually blamed him [and others] for your double-mindedness. ok.
you distracted yourself from your willful rebellion and sinfulness through political activism.
this is the church's fault, correct?
alright. so far we have Skinski sinning and roaming around searching....not saved yet, but actually online in...what by this time? the late 1990s? saying he is saved, and he is threatening everyone in which he comes into contact with the very same message as he does today.
anyway....we have Skinski, a rank sinner, claiming to be saved and living a holy life, but not saved ........so clearly deceiving himself and others, just as St. John said it would be. no surprise here.
then what?
when did Promise Keepers happen? what were you doing for/with them? what were you saying at that time?
why did you choose them?
and my question would be....why did you keep sinning when you clearly knew enough of what God had said about it to know Heb 6 applied to you (according to your theology)? i've read your online stuff since 1995...so i know you knew enough.
in any case....
so then you came across this guy, who convinced you, in spite of systemic sin, deception and lying in Christ's Name...that you didn't have a sin nature.
"We believe that Christians don't have to sin, have the power over sin and are commanded not to sin by a Holy God. A Christian can live a life of complete obedience to God, every moment of everyday. This is commonly called "Christian Perfection", "Biblical Perfection" or "Sinless Perfection"."
Kerrigan Skelly
PinPoint Evangelism Evangelists- Kerrigan Skelly & John McGlone < click
"We believe in a literal 1,000 year reign of Christ on Earth, which happens right after the seventh trumpet and the first resurrection. After the literal 1,000 reign of Christ on Earth, Satan will be released for a short period of time (Revelation 20:4-10).
We believe that "Judgment Day" comes at the very end, even after the 1,000 year reign. This is when all of the rest of the dead will rise from Hades via the second resurrection. The ones who have their names written in the lamb's book of life will spend eternity with Christ in His Kingdom. The rest will be cast into the Lake of Fire, where they will be punished forever and ever (Revelation 20:11-15). " *
* NB - zone
so this was the beginning of a complete depature from traditional/orthodox christianity of any kind. it's actually dispensational wesleyanism...but anyway.
that's fine. i get that you reject all of it. or rather you are building your own theological system.
no need to go on about it.
i'm now trying to figure out what theological system you have created for yourself....
so, around this time with Mr. Skelley begins the reverse-engineering of church history to blame others [Augustine, Cavlin, etc] for your inability to stop sinning. is that fair to say at this point?
i know you had the scriptures long before this time...i know you knew them well.
continuing.... you say this was your condition at that time :
"I was extremely disturbed by all this but also excited in that I was learning a lot. I also became extremely convicted about my worldliness and I truly began to realise how willfully rebellious and evil I actually was, and yet I knew that I had to make a CHOICE. Who was I going to serve, was I going to continue to walk my own way or was I going to surrender all and submit and trust in Christ."
what year was this? how far into the timeline are we of your pretending/believing you had been saved but were not since you were worldly and not sinless?
[where does Promise Keepers fall in the timeline?]
and then you came upon this fellow and his wife.
C.L. Ministries
Publications | C.L. Ministries < click
again, dispensationalists, and charismatics.*
who are part of this network:
Tree of Life Fellowship - Home < click *
*NB - zone
and did i understand you correctly that Chris Hill led you in some way to Mike DeSario?
Real Repentance < click
DeSario has taken you to this:
""But I say unto you," said he, "if after this great and holy calling any one, being tempted of the devil, shall commit sin, he has only one (opportunity of) repentance. But if he sin off-hand and repent, repentance is unprofitable for such a man; for he shall live with difficulty." Hermas (A.D. 150) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.1 pg.22"
"Well, do you think that the sins of those who repent are forgiven immediately? Certainly not; but the person who repents must torture his own soul, and must be thoroughly humble in his every action, and be afflicted with all the divers kinds of affliction; and if he endure the afflictions which come upon him, assuredly He Who created all things and endowed them with power will be moved with compassion and will bestow some remedy. Hermas (A.D. 150) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.1 pg.38"
Go, and tell all men to repent, and they shall live unto God; for the Lord in His compassion sent me to give repentance to all, though some of them, because of their deeds do not deserve to be saved. Hermas (A.D. 150) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.1 pg. 42
DeSario replies heavily on Clement.
"Forgiveness of past sins, then, God gives; but of future, each one gives to himself. And this is to repent, to condemn the past deeds, and beg oblivion of them from the Father, who only of all is able to undo what is done, by mercy proceeding from Him, and to blot out former sins by the dew of the Spirit. "For by the state in which I find you will I judge," Clement of Alexandria (A.D. 195) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.2 pg.602"
Clement of Alexandria
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Titus Flavius Clemens (c.150 – c. 215), known as Clement of Alexandria, was a Christian theologian who taught at the Catechetical School of Alexandria. A convert to Christianity, he was an educated man who was familiar with classical Greek philosophy and literature. As his three major works demonstrate, Clement was influenced by Hellenistic philosophy to a greater extent than any other Christian thinker of his time, and in particular by Plato and the Stoics.[1] His secret works, which exist only in fragments, attest that he was also familiar with pre-Christian Jewish esotericism and Gnosticism. *
Clement of Alexandria - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia < click
*NB - zone
Skinski, you go on to say:
"All this broke me as I realised that I was fully accountable for my sinful choices and that I truly did not love God or my neighbour. I became sick of this empty state I was in and I threw myself at the mercy of God and forsook my foolish ways.
"The light turned on. Suddenly an awareness of the Spirit of God came over me and everything changed. I became aware of what abiding in Jesus Christ actually meant, it is a conscious state of walking in agreement with God. A heart yielded to truth. Being submitted to the working of God through me as opposed to pushing God away through the act of walking my own way."
okay. so now your profile says you are saved.
how were you saved?
were you born again?
can you lose your salvation now that you have it?
i have been unable to find anything by DeSario on the new birth.
his site is disorderly and difficult to navigate.
if you could direct me to his teachings (text please, i can't stand his videos), i'd like to see his interpretation.
you also say, concerning yourself and your condition of a false/non-conversion for more than 15 years [which is Washer and The Promise Keepers' and everyone else's fault]:
"That problem is only an issue when one views salvation in an abstract manner where redemption is disconnected from the actual present conscious state of the redeemed person. When one views salvation in this manner there is no possible way to tell if one is saved or not because there is no actual "standard of measure" in the present walk in regards to what one has been actually saved from. This is because salvation is only in the context of being "saved from the PUNISHMENT due."
see, there is a standard of measure we have. it's in the NT epistles.
you were very familiar with them, and claimed to live by them.
what you are doing, is a classic case of PROJECTING.
because YOU thrashed around for nearly 2 decades pretending to be saved but not saved [you're STILL NOT SURE...let's be honest], and YOU didn't crucify the flesh and make every effort to lay aside sin....you've decided no one else has
"If, on the other hand, salvation is viewed as a present and active condition of actually being set free from the corruption that is in the world through lust and the bondage it induced, as well as having been reconciled to God and pardoned for previous rebellion then it is clearly evident that one can be "saved" at one time and not "saved" later on."
i see.
so you have NO assurance at all.
"You see when salvation is viewed in an abstract manner the "deliverance" is merely a mental abstraction instead of a present reality. This is why so many Christian self help books are aimed at "discovering who you are in Christ." Do a Google search on the phrase "who you are in Christ" and you will see what I mean."
there's your "ABSTRACT" salvation accusation again.
have you been born again or NOT?
there's nothing abstract when the Spirit testifies that we are the sons and daughters of God.
what IS abstract however, is the idea that DeSario and the others push - which is a devious combination of two errors, which leads to COGNITIVE DISSONANCE...and the person never has assurance; lives in constant fear; relying on their performance, inevitably falling into the heresy of Perfectionism; holds a warped view of the Atonement.........BOTH of these errors come from JUDAISM.
*NB - zone
you figure out what those TWO ERRORS are.
i would suggest you do it without delay.
bye Skinski.
(i'm not going back to check for typos, so please excuse any).
because this is exactly what i found when i was disturbed by your writings and professions and set out to research you
in any case.....concerning Skinski:
i'm familiar with Stewart Best.
we needn't cover his work unless you want to.
Paul Washer? so you were influenced by him, and even though Paul Washer is insistent on holy living and immovable on continual vigilance and shunning sin....you eventually blamed him [and others] for your double-mindedness. ok.
you distracted yourself from your willful rebellion and sinfulness through political activism.
this is the church's fault, correct?
alright. so far we have Skinski sinning and roaming around searching....not saved yet, but actually online in...what by this time? the late 1990s? saying he is saved, and he is threatening everyone in which he comes into contact with the very same message as he does today.
anyway....we have Skinski, a rank sinner, claiming to be saved and living a holy life, but not saved ........so clearly deceiving himself and others, just as St. John said it would be. no surprise here.
then what?
when did Promise Keepers happen? what were you doing for/with them? what were you saying at that time?
why did you choose them?
and my question would be....why did you keep sinning when you clearly knew enough of what God had said about it to know Heb 6 applied to you (according to your theology)? i've read your online stuff since 1995...so i know you knew enough.
in any case....
so then you came across this guy, who convinced you, in spite of systemic sin, deception and lying in Christ's Name...that you didn't have a sin nature.
"We believe that Christians don't have to sin, have the power over sin and are commanded not to sin by a Holy God. A Christian can live a life of complete obedience to God, every moment of everyday. This is commonly called "Christian Perfection", "Biblical Perfection" or "Sinless Perfection"."
Kerrigan Skelly
PinPoint Evangelism Evangelists- Kerrigan Skelly & John McGlone < click
"We believe in a literal 1,000 year reign of Christ on Earth, which happens right after the seventh trumpet and the first resurrection. After the literal 1,000 reign of Christ on Earth, Satan will be released for a short period of time (Revelation 20:4-10).
We believe that "Judgment Day" comes at the very end, even after the 1,000 year reign. This is when all of the rest of the dead will rise from Hades via the second resurrection. The ones who have their names written in the lamb's book of life will spend eternity with Christ in His Kingdom. The rest will be cast into the Lake of Fire, where they will be punished forever and ever (Revelation 20:11-15). " *
* NB - zone
so this was the beginning of a complete depature from traditional/orthodox christianity of any kind. it's actually dispensational wesleyanism...but anyway.
that's fine. i get that you reject all of it. or rather you are building your own theological system.
no need to go on about it.
i'm now trying to figure out what theological system you have created for yourself....
so, around this time with Mr. Skelley begins the reverse-engineering of church history to blame others [Augustine, Cavlin, etc] for your inability to stop sinning. is that fair to say at this point?
i know you had the scriptures long before this time...i know you knew them well.
continuing.... you say this was your condition at that time :
"I was extremely disturbed by all this but also excited in that I was learning a lot. I also became extremely convicted about my worldliness and I truly began to realise how willfully rebellious and evil I actually was, and yet I knew that I had to make a CHOICE. Who was I going to serve, was I going to continue to walk my own way or was I going to surrender all and submit and trust in Christ."
what year was this? how far into the timeline are we of your pretending/believing you had been saved but were not since you were worldly and not sinless?
[where does Promise Keepers fall in the timeline?]
and then you came upon this fellow and his wife.
C.L. Ministries
Publications | C.L. Ministries < click
again, dispensationalists, and charismatics.*
who are part of this network:
Tree of Life Fellowship - Home < click *
*NB - zone
and did i understand you correctly that Chris Hill led you in some way to Mike DeSario?
Real Repentance < click
DeSario has taken you to this:
""But I say unto you," said he, "if after this great and holy calling any one, being tempted of the devil, shall commit sin, he has only one (opportunity of) repentance. But if he sin off-hand and repent, repentance is unprofitable for such a man; for he shall live with difficulty." Hermas (A.D. 150) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.1 pg.22"
"Well, do you think that the sins of those who repent are forgiven immediately? Certainly not; but the person who repents must torture his own soul, and must be thoroughly humble in his every action, and be afflicted with all the divers kinds of affliction; and if he endure the afflictions which come upon him, assuredly He Who created all things and endowed them with power will be moved with compassion and will bestow some remedy. Hermas (A.D. 150) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.1 pg.38"
Go, and tell all men to repent, and they shall live unto God; for the Lord in His compassion sent me to give repentance to all, though some of them, because of their deeds do not deserve to be saved. Hermas (A.D. 150) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.1 pg. 42
DeSario replies heavily on Clement.
"Forgiveness of past sins, then, God gives; but of future, each one gives to himself. And this is to repent, to condemn the past deeds, and beg oblivion of them from the Father, who only of all is able to undo what is done, by mercy proceeding from Him, and to blot out former sins by the dew of the Spirit. "For by the state in which I find you will I judge," Clement of Alexandria (A.D. 195) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.2 pg.602"
Clement of Alexandria
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Titus Flavius Clemens (c.150 – c. 215), known as Clement of Alexandria, was a Christian theologian who taught at the Catechetical School of Alexandria. A convert to Christianity, he was an educated man who was familiar with classical Greek philosophy and literature. As his three major works demonstrate, Clement was influenced by Hellenistic philosophy to a greater extent than any other Christian thinker of his time, and in particular by Plato and the Stoics.[1] His secret works, which exist only in fragments, attest that he was also familiar with pre-Christian Jewish esotericism and Gnosticism. *
Clement of Alexandria - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia < click
*NB - zone
Skinski, you go on to say:
"All this broke me as I realised that I was fully accountable for my sinful choices and that I truly did not love God or my neighbour. I became sick of this empty state I was in and I threw myself at the mercy of God and forsook my foolish ways.
"The light turned on. Suddenly an awareness of the Spirit of God came over me and everything changed. I became aware of what abiding in Jesus Christ actually meant, it is a conscious state of walking in agreement with God. A heart yielded to truth. Being submitted to the working of God through me as opposed to pushing God away through the act of walking my own way."
okay. so now your profile says you are saved.
how were you saved?
were you born again?
can you lose your salvation now that you have it?
i have been unable to find anything by DeSario on the new birth.
his site is disorderly and difficult to navigate.
if you could direct me to his teachings (text please, i can't stand his videos), i'd like to see his interpretation.
you also say, concerning yourself and your condition of a false/non-conversion for more than 15 years [which is Washer and The Promise Keepers' and everyone else's fault]:
"That problem is only an issue when one views salvation in an abstract manner where redemption is disconnected from the actual present conscious state of the redeemed person. When one views salvation in this manner there is no possible way to tell if one is saved or not because there is no actual "standard of measure" in the present walk in regards to what one has been actually saved from. This is because salvation is only in the context of being "saved from the PUNISHMENT due."
see, there is a standard of measure we have. it's in the NT epistles.
you were very familiar with them, and claimed to live by them.
what you are doing, is a classic case of PROJECTING.
because YOU thrashed around for nearly 2 decades pretending to be saved but not saved [you're STILL NOT SURE...let's be honest], and YOU didn't crucify the flesh and make every effort to lay aside sin....you've decided no one else has
"If, on the other hand, salvation is viewed as a present and active condition of actually being set free from the corruption that is in the world through lust and the bondage it induced, as well as having been reconciled to God and pardoned for previous rebellion then it is clearly evident that one can be "saved" at one time and not "saved" later on."
i see.
so you have NO assurance at all.
"You see when salvation is viewed in an abstract manner the "deliverance" is merely a mental abstraction instead of a present reality. This is why so many Christian self help books are aimed at "discovering who you are in Christ." Do a Google search on the phrase "who you are in Christ" and you will see what I mean."
there's your "ABSTRACT" salvation accusation again.
have you been born again or NOT?
there's nothing abstract when the Spirit testifies that we are the sons and daughters of God.
what IS abstract however, is the idea that DeSario and the others push - which is a devious combination of two errors, which leads to COGNITIVE DISSONANCE...and the person never has assurance; lives in constant fear; relying on their performance, inevitably falling into the heresy of Perfectionism; holds a warped view of the Atonement.........BOTH of these errors come from JUDAISM.
*NB - zone
you figure out what those TWO ERRORS are.
i would suggest you do it without delay.
bye Skinski.
(i'm not going back to check for typos, so please excuse any).
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