THE CALLING OUT OF THE BRIDE, to go to The Wedding of the Lamb

[VCO]

Are you saying the church is not sealed also ? Why or Why not ?

OH YES WE ARE SEALED!
HE SEALED US, HIS BRIDE, WITH THE BETROTHAL GIFT DOWN PAYMENT OF THE HOLY SPIRIT IN OUR HEARTS. We go into His Kingdom in our Immortal Bodies, the Descendants of ISRAEL go into His Kingdom in their Mortal Bodies with all the aches and pains and eventual death still ahead of them. That is why it BAFFLES me why any Christian wants to be numbered among the 144,000. WE REALLY HAVE A BETTER COVENANT.

2 Corinthians 1:22 (HCSB)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] He has also sealed us and given us the Spirit as a down payment in our hearts.

 

[popeye]

the 144 k are either raptured or martyred,and are in heaven DURING THE GT. They attend the marriage supper.

Here are the verses (the 144k before the throne and the 4 beasts...IN HEAVEN)
2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:
3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
5 And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.


Note Redeemed FROM THE EARTH and now in heaven !! also note that after these verses the scene shifts to earthangels preach to heathen)
"........ having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,...."


Note that angels begin to preach the gospel,as if there is now NOBODY born again on the planet.
This is strengthened by this;
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth:

IOW,death,martyrdom,are in the final few moments,and ALL,including the 144k are now in heaven.
Now,watch this!!! The very next sentence,"14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.
"the earth is ripe" IOW the last of the last are gathered.
Almost undebatable that this time of the 144k is over and so it is with the stragglers,the final martyrs......all to attend the marriage supper. ALL WILL BE THERE,even the postribs that about 99% of them are martyred at the hand of the AC.

Now look at this just a couple verses later;;

2 And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God.3 And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints.4 Who shall not fear thee, O Lord, and glorify thy name? for thou only art holy: for all nations shall come and worship before thee; for thy judgments are made manifest.

Harpers singing a song before the throne. 144k??? Certainly appears so.;


Now,all are in heaven and wrath is in full swing and it says "no man repented" in the next chapters.
We only have a weak reference to some straggler Jews..."come out of her my pple" (babylon)

It even says "the voice of the bride is heard no more"

Nothing more to do with earth. All God's pple are in heaven.
Postrib is poorly,poorly thought out. Truly a mass duping of false doctrine and a total fail of reading comprehension.
Leave out the pretrib verses and poooof!!! we have postrib.

 

[JesusIsAll]

the 144 k are either raptured or martyred,and are in heaven DURING THE GT. They attend the marriage supper.

The 144,000 are sealed by God from harm, then murdered by Antichrist? Later in the tribulation,

Revelation 14:1-4 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads. And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps: And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lam

The 144,000 are firstfruits from among tribulation men, and the passage goes on to describe the further end times harvest of the earth. John is looking at a scene on Mount Zion, and hearing a voice from heaven. Presenting a problem is to spiritualize away Mount Zion as being in heaven. But whatever the case, there is no basis to state they aren't taken out of harms way alive, as a special group, and you neglect to mention the chapter goes on to warn of taking the mark of the beast, between the scene on Mount Zion and the harvest. I know those of you who are post-tribbers (not addressing you, Popeye) can't stand the idea of any Christian not being beheaded, and I suppose the innocent bride suffering all the wrath of God with the devil's own, but the Bible just doesn't teach this.

 

[JesusIsAll]

It has always made a lot of sense, all the scholars who've concluded the 144,000 are evangelists during the tribulation, as they'd be pure servants of God, and preaching the gospel is God's work on earth. A preacher once said, "It will be like 144,000 apostle Paul's on the loose," the tribulation the greatest revival in history, even, multitudes coming to Christ. There is nothing like seeing the devil up close to want something better.

 

[VCO]

the 144 k are either raptured or martyred,and are in heaven DURING THE GT. They attend the marriage supper.

Here are the verses (the 144k before the throne and the 4 beasts...IN HEAVEN)
2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:
3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
5 And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.


Note Redeemed FROM THE EARTH and now in heaven !! also note that after these verses the scene shifts to earthangels preach to heathen)
"........ having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,...."


Note that angels begin to preach the gospel,as if there is now NOBODY born again on the planet.
This is strengthened by this;
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth:

IOW,death,martyrdom,are in the final few moments,and ALL,including the 144k are now in heaven.
Now,watch this!!! The very next sentence,"14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.
"the earth is ripe" IOW the last of the last are gathered.
Almost undebatable that this time of the 144k is over and so it is with the stragglers,the final martyrs......all to attend the marriage supper. ALL WILL BE THERE,even the postribs that about 99% of them are martyred at the hand of the AC.

Now look at this just a couple verses later;;

2 And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God.3 And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints.4 Who shall not fear thee, O Lord, and glorify thy name? for thou only art holy: for all nations shall come and worship before thee; for thy judgments are made manifest.

Harpers singing a song before the throne. 144k??? Certainly appears so.;


Now,all are in heaven and wrath is in full swing and it says "no man repented" in the next chapters.
We only have a weak reference to some straggler Jews..."come out of her my pple" (babylon)

It even says "the voice of the bride is heard no more"

Nothing more to do with earth. All God's pple are in heaven.
Postrib is poorly,poorly thought out. Truly a mass duping of false doctrine and a total fail of reading comprehension.
Leave out the pretrib verses and poooof!!! we have postrib.

Wow, do you ever have your theology all mixed up, what did you use an Eggbeater to scramble the events and what it means by what it says?

NO, the 144,000 are ALL MORTAL JEWS, not part of the Bride of Christ, and they are SEALED AGAINST HARM throughout the entire Tribulation here on earth and NEVER LEAVE EARTH. YES they are invited to the Wedding Supper, because the Wedding Supper ALWAYS takes place in the BRIDES OLD DWELLING PLACE, and that IS HERE ON EARTH. Have you NEVER studied the Wedding Traditions of the JEWS, and the Seven Feasts of ISRAEL. How on Earth do you ever expect to get your facts straight when the events of that final Seven Years is based on those Jewish facts, because it is the 70th Week of DANIEL and the fulfillment of the rest of the Feasts.

Here do the studies, before you get more mixed up than you are:

ZLM Video Series: “The Seven Feasts of Israel”

Jewish Wedding Customs and the Bride of Messiah

 

[PlainWord]

Rome impletes the mark not Islam

No, I'm sorry, you are so wrong. While the Catholic Church does not have the best theology and there are plenty of problems with the concept of the Pope and how Catholics seek forgiveness, etc, the Catholic Church does not deny the deity of Christ and they do not attempt to replace God with Allah or Christ with Muhammad.

If there is one lesson that should be clear from reading the entire Bible it is that God is a jealous God. He does not like those who worship other gods before Him.

Exodus 34:14
(for you shall worship no other god, for the Lord, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God),

Jeremiah 25:6
Do not go after other gods to serve them and worship them, and do not provoke Me to anger with the works of your hands; and I will not harm you.’

If you go back and read the 10 commandments, what is the first one? The first of any rule or law is usually the most important, wouldn't you agree?

20 And God spoke all these words, saying:
[SUP]2 [/SUP]“I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]“You shall have no other gods before Me.

ISLAM places another god before our true God. ISLAM is the largest false religion in the world with 1/4 of the world following this false religion. I'm obviously not God (far from it) but knowing my God and hearing His word, I would think God would take a dimmer view concerning Islam than He would against Catholicism.

Revelation is 90% about ISLAM and the BEAST comes from them and we are seeing it now.

 

[PlainWord]

It has always made a lot of sense, all the scholars who've concluded the 144,000 are evangelists during the tribulation, as they'd be pure servants of God, and preaching the gospel is God's work on earth. A preacher once said, "It will be like 144,000 apostle Paul's on the loose," the tribulation the greatest revival in history, even, multitudes coming to Christ. There is nothing like seeing the devil up close to want something better.

You started out good with the 144,000, sorta. But the wheels completely fell off when you said the Tribulation is the Greatest Revival in history. The Tribulation is Satan's wrath unleashed against Israel and the Church - basically against anyone who worships the true God. Jews and Christians will be slaughtered en mass. The 144K are sealed and protected. When Christ returns most of His believers will have been killed or converted to Islam to avoid death.

Luke 18 is pretty clear about this.

[SUP]7 [/SUP]And shall God not avenge His own elect who cry out day and night to Him, though He bears long with them? [SUP]8 [/SUP]I tell you that He will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless, when the Son of Man comes, will He really find faith on the earth?”

There is no rapture return of Christ prior to the above.

 

[popeye]

The 144,000 are sealed by God from harm, then murdered by Antichrist? Later in the tribulation,

Revelation 14:1-4 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads. And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps: And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lam

The 144,000 are firstfruits from among tribulation men, and the passage goes on to describe the further end times harvest of the earth. John is looking at a scene on Mount Zion, and hearing a voice from heaven. Presenting a problem is to spiritualize away Mount Zion as being in heaven. But whatever the case, there is no basis to state they aren't taken out of harms way alive, as a special group, and you neglect to mention the chapter goes on to warn of taking the mark of the beast, between the scene on Mount Zion and the harvest. I know those of you who are post-tribbers (not addressing you, Popeye) can't stand the idea of any Christian not being beheaded, and I suppose the innocent bride suffering all the wrath of God with the devil's own, but the Bible just doesn't teach this.

The 144,000 are sealed by God from harm, then murdered by Antichrist? Later in the tribulation,

Could be murdered,could simply be raptured.

Presenting a problem is to spiritualize away Mount Zion as being in heaven

Could be. Not my intention,nor does it alone place them in heaven. However,The description ,later,does place them in heaven

and you neglect to mention the chapter goes on to warn of taking the mark of the beast, between the scene on Mount Zion and the harvest

I understand.However,the warning of the mark is followed 3 sentences later with Jesus gathering this "ripe" (stragglers IMO)
from the earth.
This second look I did really verifies that the 144 k are in heaven.

 

[JesusIsAll]

Could be. Not my intention,nor does it alone place them in heaven. However,The description ,later,does place them in heaven

I understand.However,the warning of the mark is followed 3 sentences later with Jesus gathering this "ripe" (stragglers IMO)
from the earth.

This second look I did really verifies that the 144 k are in heaven.

That's a fact, Jack! They definitely are in heaven, ultimately. Yeah, I think I poorly worded all that, was trying to gather some details that enhance comprehension of a difficult picture of a tribulation harvest and, as you point out, clear stages and redemptive groups arriving in heaven.

 

[popeye]

You started out good with the 144,000, sorta. But the wheels completely fell off when you said the Tribulation is the Greatest Revival in history. The Tribulation is Satan's wrath unleashed against Israel and the Church - basically against anyone who worships the true God. Jews and Christians will be slaughtered en mass. The 144K are sealed and protected. When Christ returns most of His believers will have been killed or converted to Islam to avoid death.

Luke 18 is pretty clear about this.

[SUP]7 [/SUP]And shall God not avenge His own elect who cry out day and night to Him, though He bears long with them? [SUP]8 [/SUP]I tell you that He will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless, when the Son of Man comes, will He really find faith on the earth?”

There is no rapture return of Christ prior to the above.

The 144K are sealed and protected

The word only says they are protected from the flying scorpions.
The believers slaughtered by the millions by AC are also "sealed and protected".....nonetheless they are dead and resurrected.

When Christ returns most of His believers will have been killed or converted to Islam to avoid death.

sorry,no scriptural basis for this statement.
ALL,ALL,ALL.....ALL are beheaded w/o the mark. It even says all,every man woman,and child,bond or free ALLLLL DIE.
He knew somebody would try to make it "some die",therefore the clarification for no room to mess it up

 

[popeye]

Wow, do you ever have your theology all mixed up, what did you use an Eggbeater to scramble the events and what it means by what it says?

NO, the 144,000 are ALL MORTAL JEWS, not part of the Bride of Christ, and they are SEALED AGAINST HARM throughout the entire Tribulation here on earth and NEVER LEAVE EARTH. YES they are invited to the Wedding Supper, because the Wedding Supper ALWAYS takes place in the BRIDES OLD DWELLING PLACE, and that IS HERE ON EARTH. Have you NEVER studied the Wedding Traditions of the JEWS, and the Seven Feasts of ISRAEL. How on Earth do you ever expect to get your facts straight when the events of that final Seven Years is based on those Jewish facts, because it is the 70th Week of DANIEL and the fulfillment of the rest of the Feasts.

Here do the studies, before you get more mixed up than you are:

ZLM Video Series: “The Seven Feasts of Israel”

Jewish Wedding Customs and the Bride of Messiah

SEALED AGAINST HARM throughout the entire Tribulation here on earth and NEVER LEAVE EARTH

Conjecture. Show me the basis for this in the word.

the 144,000 are ALL MORTAL JEWS

never said otherwise

not part of the Bride of Christ

They are indeed. as are the 2 witnesses,and the "innumerable martyers", or the 5 foolish virgins. ( the foolish are still virgins and get in later via martyrdom)

Have you NEVER studied the Wedding Traditions of the JEWS

Have you never read the dialog of the last supper? "......till I drink it anew with you IN MY FATHERS KINGDOM"?

Sample ServiceRabbi opening
Bride is escorted to the canopy
The Bride circles the groom seven or three times, as the custom may be
The wedding Address
Benedictions
Sharing of the cup of wine
The Ring Service
The Ketuba is read
Second cup of wine is offered
Bride and groom share the wine

[h=2]Yichud[/h]The couple is then escorted to a private "yichud room" and left alone for a few minutes. These moments of seclusion signify their new status of living together as husband and wife.
Since the couple has been fasting since the morning, at this point they will also have something to eat.
[Sefardim do not have the custom of the yichud room; the chatan and kallah immediately proceed to the wedding hall after the chuppah ceremony.]

 

[popeye]

Here do the studies, before you get more mixed up than you are:

From your site;

The coming of the Bridegroom and the Wedding Begins

Since the time of his arrival was a surprise - the bride and her bridal party were always to be ready - this is the background of Yeshua's parable (Mat. 25:1-13). It was customary for one of the grooms party to go ahead of the bridegroom, leading the way to the bride's house - and shout - "Behold, the bridegroom comes." This would be followed by the sounding of the shofar. At the sounding of the shofar the entire wedding processional would go through the streets of the city to the bride's house. The groomsmen would again set up the huppah:

Under your wedding 'description" you now have the wedding(not the feast,but the wedding) at the brides house.....not heaven

What you evidently did was bend some verses to fit a wedding template. Cart before the horse.

the Wedding Supper ALWAYS takes place in the BRIDES OLD DWELLING PLACE, and that IS HERE ON EARTH

OK,show us.

 

[popeye]

Wow, do you ever have your theology all mixed up, what did you use an Eggbeater to scramble the events and what it means by what it says?

NO, the 144,000 are ALL MORTAL JEWS, not part of the Bride of Christ, and they are SEALED AGAINST HARM throughout the entire Tribulation here on earth and NEVER LEAVE EARTH. YES they are invited to the Wedding Supper, because the Wedding Supper ALWAYS takes place in the BRIDES OLD DWELLING PLACE, and that IS HERE ON EARTH. Have you NEVER studied the Wedding Traditions of the JEWS, and the Seven Feasts of ISRAEL. How on Earth do you ever expect to get your facts straight when the events of that final Seven Years is based on those Jewish facts, because it is the 70th Week of DANIEL and the fulfillment of the rest of the Feasts.

Here do the studies, before you get more mixed up than you are:

ZLM Video Series: “The Seven Feasts of Israel”

Jewish Wedding Customs and the Bride of Messiah

How on Earth do you ever expect to get your facts straight when the events of that final Seven Years is based on those Jewish facts

Your conjecture has you placing the marriage supper outside "those 7 years"...... Hmmmm

Could be you are confused over the "feast of tabernacles".Maybe you transposed it or something. not sure since you are not specific in your rant.

@ 22;00 of your vid I think you will find that very thing.(from your Zola Levit site)

 

[Marian29]

I know that there will be a lot of Christians who do not agree with me on this subject. However, when one studies the Jewish Wedding Traditions and how the apply to Christ Calling Out His Bride to go to the Wedding of the Lamb, it becomes obvious that it will happen prior to the beginning of the Great Tribulation.

Because of false teachers like Harold Camping and many others who have misrepresented and even changed the meaning of the term, I do not even like to use the term Rapture. Instead I prefer to call it what it really is, "The Calling Out of the Bride" for the Wedding of the Lamb, and I have found that most Conservative Evangelicals have pretty much the same beliefs about:

THE CALLING OUT OF THE BRIDE (THE CHURCH - The sum total of all true believers, OT and NT):

To fully understand the significance of expressions, such as: "I go to prepare a place for you", or "a thief in the night", or "with the voice of an archangel", or "only the Father knows", you have to know the Jewish Wedding traditions. I can highly recommend the booklet "A Christian Love Story" by Zola Levitt that may still be available at his website. Or it can be found on Amazon.com, in Kindle format for less than two dollars.

If a man was seeking a bride 2000 years ago, he had to first go to the father and make a contract or covenant with the father for what price he wanted for the bride. The Father's price to redeem the Bride the Church, was a Holy Blood Sacrifice; 1 Cor. 6:20.

The price for the Bride would be payable immediately after the bride accepted the proposal (if she accepted); the man would be invited to a family sitdown supper, where he would propose. The proposal was NEVER VERBAL. He would pour a cup of wine and set it down in front of the woman he wanted to be his Bride. If she took the cup and drank from it, she was accepting his proposal. Jesus on the night of the Last Supper poured the cup of wine and passed it to the Disciples the Foundation of the Church, choosing the Church as his intended Bride. The Disciples drank from the Cup accepting the Proposal of Jesus Christ to the Church; Mat. 26:27.

Once she had taken the cup and drank from it, they immediately became known as Bride and Bridegroom for the entire betrothal period. Before the Bridegroom would leave the dwelling place of the Bride, he would stand and make a verbal announcement, "I go to prepare a place for you." YES, the very words of Jesus, come from the traditional Jewish Wedding Proposal; John 14:2-3.

When the Bridegroom left the old dwelling place of the Bride, he would never set foot in it again until after the Wedding Ceremony in the new dwelling place. Jesus has left the old dwelling place of the Bride, Earth; and He will not set foot on it again until after the Marriage of the Lamb to the Church, which takes place in New City Jerusalem He is building for his Bride; 1 Th. 4:17, Rev. 21:2, Mat. 24:30.

ONLY his father could decide, "The new dwelling place is finished, go get your Bride." He would periodically come and inspect the progress and make the son add this and that until the new dwelling place met his father's standards, because the young man may be too anxious to go get his Bride and cut corners to get done quickly. So literally NO ONE but the father knew when the Wedding would be. Jesus said that very thing, in Mark 13:32.

When the Bride would see signs that the new dwelling place was nearly finished, she would gather her wedding party at her place, and they all had to bring lamps with oil in them, because the traditional time for the Bridegroom to come and steal the Bride away was at night, usually around midnight. They would sleep over because they were not sure which night, just that it could be soon, and very soon. Hence the parable of Ten Virgins is telling a very familiar Wedding Story that every Jew would recognize, as their Wedding traditions; Mat. 25:1-13, 1 Th. 5:2.

When the father finally told his son, "The new dwelling place is finished, go get your bride." The Bridegroom would quickly gather his Wedding party, choosing one of them to Shout and call the Bride out of her old dwelling place. They would stop just outside the old dwelling place, NOT setting foot in it, while the chosen one would Shout and call the bride out. Jesus has already chosen the Archangel to Shout and call us out of our old dwelling place, Earth; 1 Th. 4:16-18.

The entire wedding party, would all go back to the new dwelling place for the 7 day Wedding Ceremony. Most Evangelicals, believe that the One Week Wedding Ceremony, and the 70th Week of Daniel is the Same Week of Years. After the Ceremony, the entire Wedding party would return to the old dwelling place of the Bride for the Wedding Feast. Then for the first time since the Proposal the bridegroom sets foot in the Old Dwelling Place of the Bride.

What about the Old Testament Saints? I believe the Bride is the some total of all true believers of all time.
We NT saints are those who believe Jesus is the Messiah and received HIM as Lord.
The OT saints are those who believed Messiah would come and received HIM as Lord.
See it, it is the same faith, the Faith of Abraham.

Jeremiah 2:2 (NIV)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] "Go and proclaim in the hearing of Jerusalem: "'I remember the devotion of your youth, how as a bride you loved me and followed me through the desert, through a land not sown.

Isaiah 62:5 (ASV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] For as a young man marrieth a virgin, so shall thy sons marry thee; andas the bridegroom rejoiceth over the bride, so shall thy God rejoice over thee.


Ephesians 5:23 (HCSB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] for the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church. He is the Savior of the body.

Matthew 9:15 (NKJV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] And Jesus said to them, "Can the friends of the bridegroom mourn as long as the bridegroom is with them? But the days will come when the bridegroom will be taken away from them, and then they will fast.

2 Peter 3:3-4 (HCSB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] First, be aware of this: Scoffers will come in the last days to scoff, living according to their own desires,
[SUP]4 [/SUP] saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? Ever since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they have been since the beginning of creation.”

Matt 25:1 (NKJV)
1 "Then the kingdom of heaven shall be likened to ten virgins who took their lamps and went out to meet the Bridegroom.

The New Dwelling Place that HE promised build us in John 14:2, is the dwelling place every bridegroom built for his bride, in his father's house. And it will remain there, until after the Millennial Kingdom when it is lowered to the new earth still decorated from the like a bride from the Wedding of the Lamb that took place there. How do we get back and forth if we are to reign with him for that thousand years? It does not specifically say, but maybe that is why the story of Jacob's Ladder is in the Bible, to validate that those of us in our glorified bodies, that we will find that there is a way for us to reign as Priests (teachers of the children born in the KINGDOM to the 144,000 Jews), and still have our dwelling place in Heaven where our citizenship already is.

Thank you for this so special thread, with the perspective from jewish wedding, I didn't know yet so much details about it. =)

God Bless!

 

[VCO]

Could be murdered,could simply be raptured.


Could be. Not my intention,nor does it alone place them in heaven. However,The description ,later,does place them in heaven



I understand.However,the warning of the mark is followed 3 sentences later with Jesus gathering this "ripe" (stragglers IMO)
from the earth.
This second look I did really verifies that the 144 k are in heaven.

NO, not when you understand who and what they are. THEY ARE MORTALS and THEY ARE JEWS chosen by GOD, who are going to repopulate ISRAEL in the KINGDOM, to CONTINUE GOD's promise confirmed to JACOB, that the descendants of Israel will inhabit the land of Canaan forever. What part of EVERLASTING Covenant do you not understand? THEY are the fulfillment of the 70th WEEK OF DANIEL and that is a WEEK of YEARS. THEY WILL BE the MORTALS, HERE on earth the ENTIRE Seven Years of Tribulation, who will repopulate the land of ISRAEL during the 1000 year Kingdom of JESUS CHRIST ruling over HIS CHOSEN PEOPLE FROM THE THRONE OF DAVID. Every Jew not numbered in the 144,000, who receives JESUS as LORD during the Tribulation WILL BE beheaded, like the rest of the TRIBULATION SAINTS, but not one of the 144,000 SEALED BY GOD, will be harmed.

1 Corinthians 15:50 (HCSB)
[SUP]50 [/SUP] Brothers, I tell you this: Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, and corruption cannot inherit incorruption.

1 Chronicles 16:13-18 (NIV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] O descendants of Israel his servant, O sons of Jacob, his chosen ones.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] He is the LORD our God; his judgments are in all the earth.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] He remembers his covenant forever, the word he commanded, for a thousand generations,
[SUP]16 [/SUP] the covenant he made with Abraham, the oath he swore to Isaac.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] He confirmed it to Jacob as a decree, to Israel as an everlasting covenant:
[SUP]18 [/SUP] "To you I will give the land of Canaan as the portion you will inherit."
ONLY MORTAL JEWS CAN INHERIT THE LAND OF CANAAN, FOREVER. GOD WILL ALWAYS HAVE HIS REMNANT.

THEY DO NOT DIE, they escape or flee Jerusalem, IT SAYS SO:

Zechariah 14:3-7 (GW)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] Then the LORD will go out and fight against those nations as he does when he fights a battle.
[SUP]4 [/SUP] On that day his feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, just east of Jerusalem. The Mount of Olives will be split in two, forming a very large valley from east to west. Half of the mountain will move toward the north, and the other half will move toward the south.
[SUP]5 [/SUP] Then you will flee to the valley of my mountains, {That is the 144,000, all of the Tribulation Saints are DEAD, before CHRIST come to do Battle with the NATIONS, Rev. 19.} because this valley between the mountains will go as far as Azel. You will flee as you did from the earthquake at the time of King Uzziah of Judah. The LORD my God will come, and all the holy ones will be with him. {That is the sum total of the Bride of Christ = the O.T. Saints, the Church-age Saints, and the Tribulation Saints.}
[SUP]6 [/SUP] On that day there will be neither heat nor freezing cold.
[SUP]7 [/SUP] There will be one day—a day known to the LORD—with no difference between day and night. It will be light even in the evening. {The next day the 1000 Year Kingdom Begins.}
Zechariah 14:7-9 (HCSB)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] It will be a day known ⌊only⌋ to Yahweh, without day or night, but there will be light at evening.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] On that day living water will flow out from Jerusalem, half of it toward the eastern sea and the other half toward the western sea, in summer and winter alike.
[SUP]9 [/SUP] On that day Yahweh will become King over all the earth—Yahweh alone, and His name alone. {God has prepared a place of safety for the 144,000 in the mountains, east of Jerusalem, some theologians think they escape to Petra, which is south of the Dead Sea. I think it will be a protective valley in the Mountains east of the Mt. of Olives, revealed only by the splitting of the Mt. of Olives, when HE sets foot on Earth again. Clearly after the Battle of Armageddon, He takes His rightful place on the THRONE OF DAVID.}

That is how we are supposed to use Scripture to interpret Scripture:

Acts 17:11 (NIV)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.

 

[VCO]

Your conjecture has you placing the marriage supper outside "those 7 years"...... Hmmmm

Could be you are confused over the "feast of tabernacles".Maybe you transposed it or something. not sure since you are not specific in your rant.

@ 22;00 of your vid I think you will find that very thing.(from your Zola Levit site)[/COLOR]

I was hoping you would watch ALL SEVEN of Zola Levitt's videos, and read the link to the JEWISH WEDDING CUSTOMS.

The Wedding Supper in a Jewish Wedding is ALWAYS held the LAST evening of the seventh Day of the Wedding Ceremony. The Wedding of Christ, I believe will be a week of years. The Entire WEEK is spent in the New Dwelling Place, the Bridegroom built in HIS FATHER's House, that FINAL EVENING, the ENTIRE Wedding Party goes back to the BRIDE's OLD DWELLING PLACE, for the Wedding Supper. In our CASE THAT IS EARTH.

If you are truly going to try to align Biblical Prophecy verses about the End Times you HAVE TO read them all, in both the N.T. and in the O.T. THEN you will find out that the LAST day of Antichrist's RULE, and the First Day of Christ becoming King of the World IS the exact same DAY. The Wedding Supper is the Evening of that very same day:

Zechariah 14:3-9 (HCSB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] Then the LORD will go out to fight against those nations as He fights on a day of battle. {SEE REV. 19.}
[SUP]4 [/SUP] On that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, which faces Jerusalem on the east. The Mount of Olives will be split in half from east to west, forming a huge valley, so that half the mountain will move to the north and half to the south.
[SUP]5 [/SUP] You will flee by My mountain valley {that is the 144,000 Descendants of Israel.}, for the valley of the mountains will extend to Azal. You will flee as you fled from the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Then the LORD my God will come and all the holy ones with Him.
[SUP]6 [/SUP] On that day there will be no light; the sunlight and moonlight will diminish.
[SUP]7 [/SUP] It will be a day known ⌊only⌋ to Yahweh, without day or night, but there will be light at evening.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] On that day living water will flow out from Jerusalem, half of it toward the eastern sea and the other half toward the western sea, in summer and winter alike. {That is a STRONG indication that He is talking about a Week of YEARS, not a week of literal days. Therefore that Seventh year of the WEEK of Years that the Antichrist makes a Peace Treaty with ISRAEL, is the DAY HE is talking about.}
[SUP]9 [/SUP] On that day Yahweh will become King over all the earth—Yahweh alone, and His name alone.
Daniel 9:27 (HCSB)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] He will make a firm covenant with many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and offering. And the abomination of desolation will be on a wing of the temple until the decreed destruction is poured out on the desolator.”


You all are trying to make this complicated and hard to understand, when it really is simple, if you read all the pertinent verses and study the Jewish Feasts and Jewish Wedding Traditions.

Why didn't GOD put it all together in one book in chronological order? Perhaps, because HE likes to see you really digging through His WORD to find the answers.

 

[PlainWord]

To Popeye,

The word only says they are protected from the flying scorpions.
The believers slaughtered by the millions by AC are also "sealed and protected".....nonetheless they are dead and resurrected.

Let me turn your attention to Rev 7:

[SUP]2 [/SUP]Then I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God. And he cried with a loud voice... saying, “Do not harm the earth, the sea, or the trees till we have sealed the servants of our God on their foreheads.” And I heard the number of those who were sealed. One hundred and forty-four thousand...

The above 144,000 are compared and contrasted with the Great Multitude in heaven. This contrast is also found in Isa 65. Further, the 144,000 are seen with the Lamb on Mt. Zion after the Lamb returns (Rev 14). In Rev 17 they are called, "Faithful and Chosen." They were redeemed from men being "Firstfruits" to the Lamb and to God. These 144K are the ELECT mentioned in Mat 24 for which the days are shortened.

Nothing that I am aware of says that the Great Multitude in Heaven are "sealed and protected." They are certainly not protected from death. They are the Saints whom the BEAST (Islam) makes war with and overcomes. The Lamb with the 144K are not overcome, they defeat Islam (Rev 17:14).

sorry,no scriptural basis for this statement.
ALL,ALL,ALL.....ALL are beheaded w/o the mark. It even says all,every man woman,and child,bond or free ALLLLL DIE.
He knew somebody would try to make it "some die",therefore the clarification for no room to mess it up

No, all are not beheaded w/o the mark. There are two concepts being discussed here. First, let's examine the passage that I think you are referencing.

[SUP]15 [/SUP]He was granted power to give breath to the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak and cause as many as would not worship the image of the beast to be killed.

This reference does not contain the "mark." This passage deals with worship of the image of Islam. There is no use of the word, "all" here. The reference is to "as many as would not worship the image of (Islam) to be killed." You have to understand the context of this passage. Do you see the phrase "granted power" which starts this passage? This power is not over the entire world, this power is limited to 1/4 of the "earth" which is the Islamic world. Compare with Rev 6, the Fourth Seal, which deals with Radical Islam - the Power which exists today. Notice the scope of the power.

And power was given to them over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword, with hunger, with death, and by the beasts (Islamic Nations) of the earth.

Therefore, the "Beast" or ISLAM will kill those who do not align with their new mandate to worship the "Image of the Beast." There is a big change coming within Islam. The traditional way of worship at Mecca with those circling the Kaaba Stone, trying to kiss the stone as if it were a woman, then falling down and worshiping the stone will be forced to an end. Instead, the Northern Islamic Beast headed by Turkey with its ruler will place himself above their god, ALLAH and all that is called God. The Southern Muslims headed by Saudi Arabia will not go along with this new worship and they will wage war with each other. Mecca (Mystery Babylon - the WOMAN, the HARLOT) will be utterly destroyed by the Northern Beast. Those who do not swear allegiance to the Northern Islamic group and who refuse to take their "mark" or their name or number of their name will not be allowed to engage in trade - Buy or Sell. ISIS is talking about launching their own currency now. If you don't have their currency and accept their mark, name or number of their name, within the areas they control, you will not be allowed to engage in trade - buy and sell.

[SUP]16 [/SUP]He causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads, [SUP]17 [/SUP]and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

Again, the "ALL" here deals with the Islamic region of which Israel is in the middle. The King of the North (AKA Man of Sin, who you call "AntiChrist") does not worship the god of his fathers - ALLAH. He worships a foreign god - a god of fortresses (military power) and of wealth. He also blasphemes the true God and puts himself above everything. Daniel 11 describes this "king" of Turkey.

[SUP]37 [/SUP]He shall regard neither the Godof his fathers (ALLAH) nor the desire of women, nor regard any god; for he shall exalt himself above them all. [SUP]38 [/SUP]But in their place he shall honor a god of fortresses (MILITARY POWER); and a god which his fathers did not know he shall honor with gold and silver, with precious stones and pleasant things (WEALTH). [SUP]39 [/SUP]Thus he shall act against the strongest fortresses (MECCA/JERUSALEM/SAUDI/EGYPT, etc) with a foreign god, which he shall acknowledge, and advance its glory; and he shall cause them to rule over many (not all), and divide the land for gain (He will conquer and take over much of the southern Islam empire).

You need to understand that Radical Islam, which preaches death to anyone who will not convert to their radical agenda, will consolidate power in the North where 10 "kingdoms" will unite and follow "the Man of Sin." This Man of Sin (who I believe will come from Turkey) will hate and attack fellow Muslims who disagree with their agenda. Of course they hate Israel and Christians and will behead them whenever and wherever they can, but they also hate traditional Islam. They hate the Saudis and they especially hate the current form of worship of traditional Islam.

This hatred that ISIS has for the Saudis, applies to Egypt as well because Egypt has rejected the Muslim Brotherhood in favor of secularism, like the Saudis. ISIS is calling for the destruction of Saudi Arabia now. We know they eventual succeed and that the destroy MECCA = the HARLOT because it is foretold everywhere.

 

[PlainWord]

This is the region discussed in Revelation. It is in this area that most of the action will take place. This is also the historic area where the former Beast kingdoms were located.

It is all about the above region where ISLAM will slug it out. MECCA will be nuked (likely by Turkey or Iran). The "Sea" mentioned in the 2nd Trumpet is either the Red Sea (where the Harlot Mecca sits) or the Persian Gulf. Saudi oil, which enabled the kings of the earth to live luxuriously, ships from both "seas." Saudi Arabia is still the single largest producer of oil in the world (13%). Saudi Arabia is in bed with everyone, including the west. The fact that the Saudis whore with everyone angers the extremists elements of the Islamic world. They hate the Harlot and will burn her with fire and make her desolate.

Three major ports are used for the shipping Saudi oil. Ras Tanura in the Persian Gulf is the world's largest offshore oil loading facility with 6 million barrels per day capacity. The Ras al-Ju'aymah facility, on the coast of the Persian Gulf loads nearly 75% of the exports. The last of the three largest terminals is the Yanbu terminal located on the Red Sea. The enormous sea shipping capacity is vital to Saudi Arabia given the absence of international pipelines. This area is most likely the area affected by the 2nd Trumpet where 1/3 of the ships will be destroyed.

 

[Straightshot]

Your map is the focus of the prophets for certain

.... not sure that Saudi Arabia is the "woman" though .... might be a bigger one

At any rate the Lord will call His true ecclesia [bride] out of this "woman" [Revelation 3:10; 18:4]

.... just before the beginning of the tribulation [Revelation 8:6-12; 14:8]

 

[PlainWord]

Ezekiel gives a great description of the war to come. But let's be clear, it isn't just about Israel. It is also very much about Saudi Arabia and her allies. But let's examine Ezek 38 for a moment.

Now the word of the Lord came to me, saying, [SUP]2 [/SUP]“Son of man, set your face against Gog, of the land of Magog, the prince of Rosh,Meshech, and Tubal, and prophesy against him, [SUP]3 [/SUP]and say, ‘Thus says the Lord God: Behold, I am against you, O Gog, the prince of Rosh, Meshech, and Tubal. [SUP]4 [/SUP]I will turn you around, put hooks into your jaws, and lead you out, with all your army, horses, and horsemen, all splendidly clothed, a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords. [SUP]5 [/SUP]Persia, Ethiopia,and Libyaare with them, all of them with shield and helmet; [SUP]6 [/SUP]Gomer and all its troops; the house of Togarmah from the far north and all its troops—many people are with you.