The Letter to the Romans...
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My prayers are for us both and all others trusting God to straighten out any and all errors, i have as well as everyone else knowing God will do this as God said he will, so i refrain from any judgments of others period thank you Father in advance knowing you will teach each of us about your unfathomable love to flesh, bringing each of us to life in your Spirit
You know after the cross all that he left is for us to either believe or not. Too simple beleive and be or try to and not, yet God will bring one that tries so hard to see it is by 100% belief of dependency on Father through Son, the same as Son already showed us in 100% dependency on Father to tell him what to say and or do, and so he did it by Faith and Father praises him for that, and Son praises Father back, and then they together sent the Same Holy spirit of Father to lead us, us praisinf Father and Son as the Holy Spirit does the same and thus they praise us back, we all being one in Spirit and truth, praising the other over us and them praising us over themselves get it
I think if you would check out the meaning of the word 'servant' it means deacon or deaconess . this is used for 'physical helps' such as washing the feet of the saints , preparing food , helping with hospitality needs ect . So this woman was a deaconess and was overseeing helps in the church. This word is never used for an elder role overseer ect. These two words are used with leaders of the church in spiritual matter as overseers of the church. As where deacon or deaconess is for the physical needs of the church. Please consider also no woman was ever picked as the spiritual head of a local body of believers. God Bless you
hi homward ...
new here but i was just looking at your convo w/ cfultz3 about roms 8 . or at least the predestination discussion ect . I think the important thing to think about is the meaning of the word ' Foreknow' for this word starts our understanding of how the elect became the elect. How did God foreknow us ? This word means to know prior ..why does he foreknew us . The understanding how God does this is in scripture . There are many assumed theories but scripture does eliminate many
take care.
rdde2
new here but i was just looking at your convo w/ cfultz3 about roms 8 . or at least the predestination discussion ect . I think the important thing to think about is the meaning of the word ' Foreknow' for this word starts our understanding of how the elect became the elect. How did God foreknow us ? This word means to know prior ..why does he foreknew us . The understanding how God does this is in scripture . There are many assumed theories but scripture does eliminate many
take care.
rdde2
H
cfuitz3, I know what "Exactly" means, you agree with the statement above; Acorrding to you both, God did not elect/predestine anyone "unconditionally" to be saved. This is what you both belief, "exactly", right? right!
I need to say, I disagree, and so does the whole Bible. Rom.9:11-14 ff "For the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil,(UNCONDITIONAL GRACE), that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works but of Him who calls, It was said to her, " The older shall serve the younger." As it is written, "Jacob I have loved, but Esau I have hated." What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? Certainly not!" Paul is talking to you ,both, who think your human thoughts and interpretation of the Bible, with false human logic, is better than the Scriptures themselves. Like you know more than GOD, so, you can change God's word any time you don't like it? Your unbelief system is condemned by God! BUT, your last words, were, amazingly true, God did not elect any one apart from a Bible belief "system": God chose them to the Bible belief system, to believe all the word of God.! Love to all, Hoffco
I need to say, I disagree, and so does the whole Bible. Rom.9:11-14 ff "For the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil,(UNCONDITIONAL GRACE), that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works but of Him who calls, It was said to her, " The older shall serve the younger." As it is written, "Jacob I have loved, but Esau I have hated." What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? Certainly not!" Paul is talking to you ,both, who think your human thoughts and interpretation of the Bible, with false human logic, is better than the Scriptures themselves. Like you know more than GOD, so, you can change God's word any time you don't like it? Your unbelief system is condemned by God! BUT, your last words, were, amazingly true, God did not elect any one apart from a Bible belief "system": God chose them to the Bible belief system, to believe all the word of God.! Love to all, Hoffco
H
To rdde2, I have never seen a preacher, yet, who understands the word "foreknowledge","foreknew" in Rom. 8:29-30. And "knew" in Mt.7:23. Jesus is saying, I never loved you to salvation. LIKE Adam "knew" his wife Eve and she gave birth to a son. Do you, really think a man can get his wife pregnant by just thinking about her,LOL. The setting and its use in other verses, lead us to "know" (intellectually) that God's knowledge of us is , God's loving us to salvation. UNCONDITIONALLY. COME ON people,! lets get with God.! Love to all, Hoffco
Thanks rdde2, appreciate insight, and welcome aboard where we all can learn form one another what others see as truth, then maybe not and all are in study to truth that sets us free right?
God plain and simply foreknows all, Gos plain and simply saw, foreknew what would happen in the Garden, foreknew Lucifer would do what Lucifer would do. Father saw Lucifer's pride that took over and was feeling oh so boastful and proud, the angels making fuss over him, as if the light that shined through him was his and was not.
God in his Mercy divine love, does not force, otherwise Love can not be claimed and he through Son redeemed us all, those before, those that were present at his time here on earth in the flesh and those that come after him, us here right now today. and all that Father left is for one to believe Father's love, and Mercy to all or not through Son's final sacrifice and final forgiveness to all and for all
And those that believe Father through Son are being taught by Father and not man. We listen to man in what they say, yet we take all said to Father to sift our any error over truth, and once we see it is all Father and none of self we are free indeed
Just some food for thought as you grow in God's unfathomable salvation to flesh. Only God can reveal mthis no flesh can as he said this to peter When Peter said Jesus is the Christ our Savior, no flesh could ever rev eal that onlky Father in the Spirit could and still does this very same thing today flesh out, Spirit of Father in.
God plain and simply foreknows all, Gos plain and simply saw, foreknew what would happen in the Garden, foreknew Lucifer would do what Lucifer would do. Father saw Lucifer's pride that took over and was feeling oh so boastful and proud, the angels making fuss over him, as if the light that shined through him was his and was not.
God in his Mercy divine love, does not force, otherwise Love can not be claimed and he through Son redeemed us all, those before, those that were present at his time here on earth in the flesh and those that come after him, us here right now today. and all that Father left is for one to believe Father's love, and Mercy to all or not through Son's final sacrifice and final forgiveness to all and for all
And those that believe Father through Son are being taught by Father and not man. We listen to man in what they say, yet we take all said to Father to sift our any error over truth, and once we see it is all Father and none of self we are free indeed
Just some food for thought as you grow in God's unfathomable salvation to flesh. Only God can reveal mthis no flesh can as he said this to peter When Peter said Jesus is the Christ our Savior, no flesh could ever rev eal that onlky Father in the Spirit could and still does this very same thing today flesh out, Spirit of Father in.
Everyone is called, and they are called by the gospel, 2 Thess 2:14. But only those that answer that gospel call by obeying the gospel will be saved, become Christians, make up the group "called".
The word "called" can be used to refer to those that have answered the call, that is, Christians can be described as "the called" Jude 1:1 since Christians are the ones who have already answered the call of the gospel.
-------------------------------------
Heb 5:9 "And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;"
2 Thess 1:8 "In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:"
The point I was making in my post to you is that God has made promises to man, as Heb 5:9; 2 Thess 1:8 where God has promised to save those that obey Him and have vengeance upon those that obey not.
Can God break His promises? No, it is impossible for God to lie.
This means that before the world began, God did not choose for man which individual men will or will not be saved. If God did that, then why would God make promises to man He could not keep, never meant to keep?
God allows man to use his own free will to choose to obey or not and God fulfills His promises through the choices men make. So if I choose of my own free will to obey, then God will fullfill His promise of Heb 5:9 upon me. Yet if I do not obey, then God will fulfill His promise of 2 Thess 1:8 upon me.
The word "called" can be used to refer to those that have answered the call, that is, Christians can be described as "the called" Jude 1:1 since Christians are the ones who have already answered the call of the gospel.
-------------------------------------
Heb 5:9 "And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;"
2 Thess 1:8 "In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:"
The point I was making in my post to you is that God has made promises to man, as Heb 5:9; 2 Thess 1:8 where God has promised to save those that obey Him and have vengeance upon those that obey not.
Can God break His promises? No, it is impossible for God to lie.
This means that before the world began, God did not choose for man which individual men will or will not be saved. If God did that, then why would God make promises to man He could not keep, never meant to keep?
God allows man to use his own free will to choose to obey or not and God fulfills His promises through the choices men make. So if I choose of my own free will to obey, then God will fullfill His promise of Heb 5:9 upon me. Yet if I do not obey, then God will fulfill His promise of 2 Thess 1:8 upon me.
H
We must learn the whole message of God's word. God is the sovereign almighty creator, ruler and savior of mankind. We do nothing outside of His decreed will, plan, and purpose. We are all sons God by Creation. Adam and Eve were first created in the image of God with pure knowledge of God their creator, a pure heart and pure obedience to God without sin or the knowledge of evil; But, for reasons ,know only to God, they did not eat of the tree of life to confirm them in this righteous state. For me, the reason was obvious, it was the PLAN of God to bring them to their ruin by their eating of the tree of the knowing of good and evil, as God's plan was to have Satan bring them to their ruin so He could save them by GRACE. For me, God was and is Sovereign over all, as the Word of God teaches. Eph.1:11 "being predestined according to the purpose of Him who works all things according to the counsel of His will,". It is very clear, to me, that most christians don't have a clue about the truth of God's Word. They worship a half true and a half false god, not the GOD of the Bible; So, their Belief system is all messed up. God did save Adam and Eve by GRACE, thru a blood sacrifice. Gen.3:21. "the LORD God made tunics of skin, and clothed them." They died spiritually to God, that "day" they ate the fruit, and hide themselves , but God sought them out and saved them by GRACE. God drove them, forced them out of the garden so they world not eat of the tree of Life and live forever in sin. God planned their phy. death to follow their fall into sinfulness and corruption of the image of God . God planned to recreate them spiritually back to the IMAGE which they lost in the Fall. This is God's "purpose" as seen in Rom.8:29-30, FIVE step plan: 1. LOVED, Foreknew. 2. PREDESTINATION TO eternal life, 3. CALLED by GRACE, Power and Mercy. 4JUSTIFIED by GRACE, 5. GLORIFIED by GRACE, GRACE and power. 1Thess.1:4 "Knowing, beloved brethren, your election by God." 2 Thess. "Because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctifiction by the Spirit and belief in the truth," God= 100%- man =100% Love to all, Hoffco
C
Now remember you can be good and still go to hell. You can have the Holy Spirit and still go to hell. The Word says that without faith it is impossible to please GOD. Also it states that we must rightly divide the Word. So just because I am good and know the Word doesnt mean I'm going to heaven. The word states the righteous will scarcely make it in. That is those who are doing all they can do. Also it says your works will praise you in. So everytime you dont do a work your chances get slimmer. So where are we as Saints?
C
You say that one can have the Spirit and yet go to hell, but what do we about Eph 1:13-14 which states that we were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise who is the pledge of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession....
Either His indwelling is a pledge to one's soul that they will be redeemed or that purpose of His indwelling gives no hope.....
Either His indwelling is a pledge to one's soul that they will be redeemed or that purpose of His indwelling gives no hope.....
C
The Holy Spirit is indwelling by choice. We dont have him by force. Many who have the Holy Spirit will suffer. It quickens you up to get judged. If you read what you wrote you will see that. Your judged on your works not if you have the Holy Spirit. Now in order to preform a work you must have the Holy Spirit. your not going to recieve the Holy Spirit and just sit. And if you dont use what you have when you recieve God will withdraw his spirit slowly. The scripture truly is Good when it states that God will pour out his spirit upon all flesh because all people must be quickened up to get judged. Also if you read the scripture you wrote you will see not everyone is sealed. The sealed are the 144000 mentioned in revelation. So read the Word carefully
C
The purpose of the Spirit is to set us up to get judged? So, He is not a pledge to those of the inheritance?
The wicked are judged (condemned) because of unbelief. The righteous are rewarded or not by their deeds. Yet, Eph 1:13-14 simply states that He is a SEAL for THOSE who will INHERIT.
A work is something we do and are judged on. If the wicked has the Holy Spirit and by which perform works, then it is the Holy Spirit who performs those wicked deeds. But, we know that not to be true. But, there are deeds of the Spirit we call fruits of the Spirit that those who are indwelt by the Spirit will perform in conjunction with the Spirit and it is those works which are eternally rewarded.
True.
If everyone has the Spirit then all have the pledge of being sealed until the redemption of the possession Jesus brought with His blood. Yet, you say here that all have the Spirit of Promise, but then you say:
Also if you read the scripture you wrote you will see not everyone is sealed.
So, only the 144,000 Jews will inherit the promises of inheritance Jesus leaved behind?
The wicked are judged (condemned) because of unbelief. The righteous are rewarded or not by their deeds. Yet, Eph 1:13-14 simply states that He is a SEAL for THOSE who will INHERIT.
A work is something we do and are judged on. If the wicked has the Holy Spirit and by which perform works, then it is the Holy Spirit who performs those wicked deeds. But, we know that not to be true. But, there are deeds of the Spirit we call fruits of the Spirit that those who are indwelt by the Spirit will perform in conjunction with the Spirit and it is those works which are eternally rewarded.
True.
If everyone has the Spirit then all have the pledge of being sealed until the redemption of the possession Jesus brought with His blood. Yet, you say here that all have the Spirit of Promise, but then you say:
Also if you read the scripture you wrote you will see not everyone is sealed.
So, only the 144,000 Jews will inherit the promises of inheritance Jesus leaved behind?
25 gospel principles from Ro 1:1-6:4:
1) Grace was given to Paul to (call, thereby bringing about in others) obedience of faith. (1:5)
2) The gospel is the power of God to salvation to everyone that believes, because
a) salvation is the forgiveness of sin (Lk 1:77), which saves from God's wrath (Ro 5:9)
at the final judgment,
b) it reveals a righteousness from God (Ro 1:17, 3:21), a free gift (5:17), that is through faith
by grace, not by obedience.
This righteousness = justification = declared guiltless, position of right standing before God.
The cause of justification (position of right standing) is faith only.
The result of justification (position) is actual sanctification, through the obedience of faith. (1:16-17).
3) God's wrath is shown by giving men over to their sin, by judging (punishing) sin
with increased sin. (1:18)
4) God judges
according to truth (2:2), for those who hold the truth in unrighteousness,
according to deeds (2:6-11), for those who possess the Mosaic law, and
according to the light one has (2:12-15), for Gentiles who do not possess the Mosaic law. (2:2-16)
5) Jews had the advantage of the word of God and the law, but they were not
the saving advantage of true faith. (3:1-2)
6) Though Israel was unfaithful to God, God is faithful to his promise to punish sin
and unbelief. (3:3-5)
7) God cannot be unjust in bringing his wrath on unbelief, even if unbelief benefits
God by bringing out his righteousness more clearly, for Scripture states that he is
the just judge of the world who can do no wrong
(Dt 32:4; 2Ch 19:7; Job 8:3, 34:10-11, 36:23; Ps 119:137; Eze 18:25; Da 4:37, 9:14).
If he were unjust, how could he be the just judge of the world? (3:6)
8) God has shut up all men in sin. (3:19)
9) God is both just in requiring penalty for sin, and the justifier in providing the payment
of the penalty. (3:26)
10) Righteousness through faith, apart from the law, has always been the teaching
of the OT (Ge 15:6). (3:28)
11) We do not "establish the law" by being made righteous according to it. That is anti-gospel.
We "establish the law" in the NT by establishing the right use of the law,
we don't overthrow the law, we establish its standing by setting it on the right basis;
i.e., although we cannot be saved by it as a covenant, we submit to it in Christ's two
commandments (Mt 22:37-39), which are subject to the law of grace. (3:31)
12) Salvation is the forgiveness of sin (Lk 1:77),
which removes our guilt and God's wrath on it at the final judgment.
We are saved from the wrath of God at the final judgment, by forgiveness of our sin,
not by works of obedience. (4:8)
13) Circumcision was not an action (work) required to confirm faith.
Circumcision was a sign only, given as a seal to guarantee one's righteousness by faith,
apart from works. (4:11)
14) Those under the law cannot be heirs to the promise because
inheritance by law keeping makes faith worthless, and
law keeping effectively voids the promise, by disqualifying everyone and producing
only wrath. (4:14-15)
15) The promise can be guaranteed only if it is based on faith, because basing it on
law keeping can result only in wrath (Gal 3:10), it cannot result in fulfillment of the promise.
Righteousness by faith was guaranteed by the sign of circumcision (4:11), and the
promise is guaranteed by grace through faith (4:16).
16) True saving faith is the conviction of belief, which obeys. (4:20)
17) Jesus rose from the dead as the firstfruits of the resurrection of all believers,
as proof that he was who he said he was, Christ the Redeemer, of his people
from the wrath of God (Ro 5:9) by forgiveness of their sin (Lk 1:77),
through faith in him (Jn 3:16, 18, 36).
The resurrection shows that Jesus' sacrifice (death) was accepted as atonement for sin (Ro 3:25) and,
therefore, we have, indeed, been justified (declared guiltless, position of right standing before God)
by his atoning death.
Christ's blood was poured out (Lk 22:20) on the ground at the base of the cross (Jn 19:34, 36-37),
just as the animals' blood was poured out on the ground at the base of the altar
(Lev 4:7, 18, 25, 30, 34).
Christ was physically resurrected, not so he could take his physical blood into a physical sanctuary
to physically sprinkle it on physical things (no physical blood, it had been poured out on the ground).
The heavenly things (gospel graces for the redeemed) of Heb 9:23-24 were purified by his Spirit,
the Holy Spirit, when
his work was finished,
his Spirit departed at his death (Jn 19:30),
returned to God, and
established the gospel graces of his atoning death for the redeemed.
And those graces are now applied by him in his living resurrected body, through his Spirit (Ro 8:27)
in the presence of God (Heb 9:24), where he ever lives to intercede for us (Ro 8:34; Heb 7:25).
Christ's death atoned for sin (Ro 3:25),
and his resurrected life now applies that atonement to the redeemed in justification (position of
right standing) by faith alone. (4:25)
18) We are justified (position of right standing) by faith, apart from any other actions of obedience,
as was Abraham (Ge 15:6). (5:1)
19) We are saved. . .from the wrath of God at the final judgment, because we have been
justified (declared guiltless, position of right standing before God) through faith in Christ's
blood (Ro 3:25), which is his atoning death. (5:9)
20) Since God saved us from his wrath through justification (declared guiltless, position of
right standing before God) by Christ's atoning death, he shall also save (sanctify, glorify) us
through Christ's resurrected life, who ever lives to intercede for us (Heb 7:25; Ro 8:34). (5:10)
21) Although sin was not taken into account between Adam and Moses
when there was no Mosaic law to transgress,
yet all mankind died as the result of sin (Ro 6:23).
So for what sin were all men held guilty and subject to death, when sin was not taken into account?
They were all held guilty of Adam's sin. (5:12-17).
22) Just as the one act of trespass and disobedience of the first Adam made the many sinners
and resulted in their condemnation,
so the one act of obedience and righteousness of the second Adam made righteous and justified
(position of right standing, guiltless before God) the many.
Man was both made a sinner and made righteous, not because of what man did, but because of
what Adam and Christ did.
Man is born a sinner and unrighteous, because of Adam's sin "imputed" to him at conception (Ps 51:5).
Man is justified, made righteous (position of right standing, guiltless) because of Christ's righteousness
"imputed" to him at rebirth. (5:18-19)
23) Just as sin was increased by the law, so grace was increased by sin (5:20-21).
24) So in 5:12-21:
a) our own sin/sinfulness is not the ground for our condemnation,
it is our guilt of Adam's sin that condemns us (Ps 51:5),
the very nature with which we are born (sinful) condemns us (Eph 2:3); and
b) our own obedience/sanctification is not the ground for our justification (position of right
standing, guiltless), it is the righteousness of Jesus Christ's obedience to death that
justifies us, through faith alone, which is the burden of Ro 4 and Ro 5. (5:12-21)
25) Baptism is the when and how of our death to sin.
When: in our union with Christ in baptism, which is a union in the benefits of his death.
How: by entering into the purpose of his death - to redeem us from sin,
- - - -by living according to the model of his death - who died for sin,
- - - -by being raised with Christ - to die to sin. (6:1-4)[/QUOTE]
1) Grace was given to Paul to (call, thereby bringing about in others) obedience of faith. (1:5)
2) The gospel is the power of God to salvation to everyone that believes, because
a) salvation is the forgiveness of sin (Lk 1:77), which saves from God's wrath (Ro 5:9)
at the final judgment,
b) it reveals a righteousness from God (Ro 1:17, 3:21), a free gift (5:17), that is through faith
by grace, not by obedience.
This righteousness = justification = declared guiltless, position of right standing before God.
The cause of justification (position of right standing) is faith only.
The result of justification (position) is actual sanctification, through the obedience of faith. (1:16-17).
3) God's wrath is shown by giving men over to their sin, by judging (punishing) sin
with increased sin. (1:18)
4) God judges
according to truth (2:2), for those who hold the truth in unrighteousness,
according to deeds (2:6-11), for those who possess the Mosaic law, and
according to the light one has (2:12-15), for Gentiles who do not possess the Mosaic law. (2:2-16)
5) Jews had the advantage of the word of God and the law, but they were not
the saving advantage of true faith. (3:1-2)
6) Though Israel was unfaithful to God, God is faithful to his promise to punish sin
and unbelief. (3:3-5)
7) God cannot be unjust in bringing his wrath on unbelief, even if unbelief benefits
God by bringing out his righteousness more clearly, for Scripture states that he is
the just judge of the world who can do no wrong
(Dt 32:4; 2Ch 19:7; Job 8:3, 34:10-11, 36:23; Ps 119:137; Eze 18:25; Da 4:37, 9:14).
If he were unjust, how could he be the just judge of the world? (3:6)
8) God has shut up all men in sin. (3:19)
9) God is both just in requiring penalty for sin, and the justifier in providing the payment
of the penalty. (3:26)
10) Righteousness through faith, apart from the law, has always been the teaching
of the OT (Ge 15:6). (3:28)
11) We do not "establish the law" by being made righteous according to it. That is anti-gospel.
We "establish the law" in the NT by establishing the right use of the law,
we don't overthrow the law, we establish its standing by setting it on the right basis;
i.e., although we cannot be saved by it as a covenant, we submit to it in Christ's two
commandments (Mt 22:37-39), which are subject to the law of grace. (3:31)
12) Salvation is the forgiveness of sin (Lk 1:77),
which removes our guilt and God's wrath on it at the final judgment.
We are saved from the wrath of God at the final judgment, by forgiveness of our sin,
not by works of obedience. (4:8)
13) Circumcision was not an action (work) required to confirm faith.
Circumcision was a sign only, given as a seal to guarantee one's righteousness by faith,
apart from works. (4:11)
14) Those under the law cannot be heirs to the promise because
inheritance by law keeping makes faith worthless, and
law keeping effectively voids the promise, by disqualifying everyone and producing
only wrath. (4:14-15)
15) The promise can be guaranteed only if it is based on faith, because basing it on
law keeping can result only in wrath (Gal 3:10), it cannot result in fulfillment of the promise.
Righteousness by faith was guaranteed by the sign of circumcision (4:11), and the
promise is guaranteed by grace through faith (4:16).
16) True saving faith is the conviction of belief, which obeys. (4:20)
17) Jesus rose from the dead as the firstfruits of the resurrection of all believers,
as proof that he was who he said he was, Christ the Redeemer, of his people
from the wrath of God (Ro 5:9) by forgiveness of their sin (Lk 1:77),
through faith in him (Jn 3:16, 18, 36).
The resurrection shows that Jesus' sacrifice (death) was accepted as atonement for sin (Ro 3:25) and,
therefore, we have, indeed, been justified (declared guiltless, position of right standing before God)
by his atoning death.
Christ's blood was poured out (Lk 22:20) on the ground at the base of the cross (Jn 19:34, 36-37),
just as the animals' blood was poured out on the ground at the base of the altar
(Lev 4:7, 18, 25, 30, 34).
Christ was physically resurrected, not so he could take his physical blood into a physical sanctuary
to physically sprinkle it on physical things (no physical blood, it had been poured out on the ground).
The heavenly things (gospel graces for the redeemed) of Heb 9:23-24 were purified by his Spirit,
the Holy Spirit, when
his work was finished,
his Spirit departed at his death (Jn 19:30),
returned to God, and
established the gospel graces of his atoning death for the redeemed.
And those graces are now applied by him in his living resurrected body, through his Spirit (Ro 8:27)
in the presence of God (Heb 9:24), where he ever lives to intercede for us (Ro 8:34; Heb 7:25).
Christ's death atoned for sin (Ro 3:25),
and his resurrected life now applies that atonement to the redeemed in justification (position of
right standing) by faith alone. (4:25)
18) We are justified (position of right standing) by faith, apart from any other actions of obedience,
as was Abraham (Ge 15:6). (5:1)
19) We are saved. . .from the wrath of God at the final judgment, because we have been
justified (declared guiltless, position of right standing before God) through faith in Christ's
blood (Ro 3:25), which is his atoning death. (5:9)
20) Since God saved us from his wrath through justification (declared guiltless, position of
right standing before God) by Christ's atoning death, he shall also save (sanctify, glorify) us
through Christ's resurrected life, who ever lives to intercede for us (Heb 7:25; Ro 8:34). (5:10)
21) Although sin was not taken into account between Adam and Moses
when there was no Mosaic law to transgress,
yet all mankind died as the result of sin (Ro 6:23).
So for what sin were all men held guilty and subject to death, when sin was not taken into account?
They were all held guilty of Adam's sin. (5:12-17).
22) Just as the one act of trespass and disobedience of the first Adam made the many sinners
and resulted in their condemnation,
so the one act of obedience and righteousness of the second Adam made righteous and justified
(position of right standing, guiltless before God) the many.
Man was both made a sinner and made righteous, not because of what man did, but because of
what Adam and Christ did.
Man is born a sinner and unrighteous, because of Adam's sin "imputed" to him at conception (Ps 51:5).
Man is justified, made righteous (position of right standing, guiltless) because of Christ's righteousness
"imputed" to him at rebirth. (5:18-19)
23) Just as sin was increased by the law, so grace was increased by sin (5:20-21).
24) So in 5:12-21:
a) our own sin/sinfulness is not the ground for our condemnation,
it is our guilt of Adam's sin that condemns us (Ps 51:5),
the very nature with which we are born (sinful) condemns us (Eph 2:3); and
b) our own obedience/sanctification is not the ground for our justification (position of right
standing, guiltless), it is the righteousness of Jesus Christ's obedience to death that
justifies us, through faith alone, which is the burden of Ro 4 and Ro 5. (5:12-21)
25) Baptism is the when and how of our death to sin.
When: in our union with Christ in baptism, which is a union in the benefits of his death.
How: by entering into the purpose of his death - to redeem us from sin,
- - - -by living according to the model of his death - who died for sin,
- - - -by being raised with Christ - to die to sin. (6:1-4)[/QUOTE]
C
Now remember the numbeless number..when you are sealed by God, the 144000 you are the ones God called to be an Apostle, Prophet, Evangelist, Pastor and Teacher. All others are in that numberless number......also same Spirit diffrent functions....everybody who has the Holy Ghost isnt sealed....if I recieve and sin am I dtill sealed? No.....you must have the Holy Ghost to be quickens dup....We will be judged in the Spirit throuh the Holy Ghost....you are judge based on works not having the Holy Ghost....
K
You are wrong here about the144,000. The 144,000 are from the twelve Jewish tribes. Plus the multitude that nobody could number that is mentioned n the same chapter in Revelations is the gentile nations which have also has teachers, preachers, evangelists, prophets, and many other positions of the church.