The problem of the statement of “never saved to begin with”

[GWH]

Yes.

Of course, if I use it to print out the passages I cite, you might need to ask CC for a speed reading course :^)

 

[PaulThomson]

(I envision my role to be that of editing everyone's translation and commentary into a conflated version that makes everyone happy :^)

That is a somewhat problematic intention.

 

[bluejean_bible]

Isn't it obvious to you that even some who read that someone can fall away does not mean they think that all will?

For me, it is concerning that any reborn sinner would interpret,as a Christian, that what God said is irrevocable, eternal salvation, actually is so. And that is so by either man or God's free will choice.

 

[Kroogz]

I would wonder how anyone could ever insist,but they do none the less, that their will to return to damnation is always in all ways going to be mightier than Gods will to eternally redeem and save them to life.

Well, the loss of salvation crowd is typically focused on others and their failings.They have it all figured out for themselves.

But yeah, if we lost salvation, it's game over. We are now a sinner in need of salvation again, the Spirit is foreign to us, and we need to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ again to be saved. Crucify Him again and start from scratch.

Loss of salvation would mean we lost EVERYTHING we know about God and we would be completely natural again.

Believing on the Lord Jesus Christ would once again be a revolutionary idea to us.

Not happening. We never perish. We have eternal life.

 

[Kroogz]

For me, it is concerning that any reborn sinner would interpret,as a Christian, that what God said is irrevocable, eternal salvation, actually is so. And that is so by either man or God's free will choice.

just imagine, if we lost salvation....... We would be asking the evangelist, "who is this Jesus you speak of?"

Loss of salvation means loss of EVERYTHING.

 

[bluejean_bible]

just imagine, if we lost salvation....... We would be asking the evangelist, "who is this Jesus you speak of?"

Loss of salvation means loss of EVERYTHING.

And,where would the peace in Christ be?

Think of that school of thought that insists we must work to retain our salvation. Which discounts the work Jesus did for us on the cross.

Both ideologies, salvation insecurity,works salvation, vacate any chance for peace in Christ. Because both ideologies are egocentric. Man's authority.

Which lead to thinking , am I doing enough to keep myself saved?

 

[Kroogz]

And,where would the peace in Christ be?

Think of that school of thought that insists we must work to retain our salvation. Which discounts the work Jesus did for us on the cross.

Both ideologies, salvation insecurity,works salvation, vacate any chance for peace in Christ. Because both ideologies are egocentric. Man's authority.

Which lead to thinking , am I doing enough to keep myself saved?

Matt 11:30
“For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.”

 

[bluejean_bible]

Matt 11:30
“For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.”

Note the text not there in the continuation of that verse?
"For My yoke is easy and My burden is light if you choose to don the yoke and decide to keep it and labor to hold it in place."

 

[GWH]

That is a somewhat problematic intention.

Let me amend it to say "or at least disagree agreeably, as you and I do at times".

 

[FRB72]

I am not familiar with Bob Wilkin.

My question and reference to our resource website was prompted by FRB72 saying "I am neither a Calvinist or an Arminian".

Are these verses from Philippians 2 Calvinist or Arminian?

12Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; 13for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure.

My answer would be both and neither.

Both positions are simply man-made interpretations of a selection of verses which taken to their conclusions mishandle the text, the revealed character of God and clear theology on the nature of our blood-bought salvation.