Today’s church’s misunderstandings

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Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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I think you are mistaken about the purpose of the old covenant. It is simply leading the people to obey the Lord, and that obedience comes after they ask forgiveness of sin.
Obedience was the one thing at which Israel CONSISTENTLY failed, no matter how many times they asked for forgiveness.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
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"The New Jerusalem" (per Rev21:2,23-25) is like this:

23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.

25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.






[Isa66 - "that from one new moon to another"]
The scripture is very clear, the brightness of Jesus Christ "Surpasses" the need for the Sun/Moon

Nothing even hints or suggest that the Sun/Moon have been removed

How long will the countless many, fight against the simple teachings of God's words? :confused:

(Had No Need)

Revelation 21:23-24KJV
23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.
24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
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From one to another includes every day in between. Simple language basic reading comprehension no big interpretation needed.
Your justification for Sunday Observance, Everyday Is A Day Of Observance, "Wrong"

We will disagree, the observance will be from New moon to new moon, not every day is a new moon

From one Sabbath to another, not every day is a Sabbath,your teaching is contrary to scripture

God rested on the 7th day, not every day

Are those seen fishing and spreading nets in the (Eternal Kingdom) going to be doing so every day, (No) they will go up to worship the Lord in Mt Zion on the Sabbath, as scripture teaches in many places

Ezekiel 47:9-12KJV
9 And it shall come to pass, that every thing that liveth, which moveth, whithersoever the rivers shall come, shall live: and there shall be a very great multitude of fish, because these waters shall come thither: for they shall be healed; and every thing shall live whither the river cometh.
10 And it shall come to pass, that the fishers shall stand upon it from Engedi even unto Eneglaim; they shall be a place to spread forth nets; their fish shall be according to their kinds, as the fish of the great sea, exceeding many.
11 But the miry places thereof and the marishes thereof shall not be healed; they shall be given to salt.
12 And by the river upon the bank thereof, on this side and on that side, shall grow all trees for meat, whose leaf shall not fade, neither shall the fruit thereof be consumed: it shall bring forth new fruit according to his months, because their waters they issued out of the sanctuary: and the fruit thereof shall be for meat, and the leaf thereof for medicine.

In Love
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
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The decline of Rome began immediately after Constantine died, (337ad). Then in about 476 under Romulus Rome collapsed when he was deposed by a Germanic King.
However it was Theodosius who made Christianity the state religion of Rome, in about 380.
The Germanic kings that came after the fall of Rome were Arians theologically.
It would be my opinion that Constatines claim of conversion 312AD, the edict of Milan 313AD in tolerance of Christianity, that led to the donation of land for "Vatican City" and started building the St Peter's Basilica in 319AD, and Constantine calling the 1st Nicean Council in 325AD?

It's my observation and opinion that Christianity was the Roman State Religion Long Before Theodosius in 380AD

It was through Constantine that Easter, Christmas, And Sunday Observance Was Established In The Church, It Was These Actions That Paganism And Christianity Molded Together Into A Quasi State Religion

The Pagans Maintained Easter/Fertility Rites, Christmas Roman Saturnalia, "Sun"day pagan day of observance and rest
 
Sep 2, 2020
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Babylon
Your justification for Sunday Observance, Everyday Is A Day Of Observance, "Wrong"

We will disagree, the observance will be from New moon to new moon, not every day is a new moon

From one Sabbath to another, not every day is a Sabbath,your teaching is contrary to scripture

God rested on the 7th day, not every day

Are those seen fishing and spreading nets in the (Eternal Kingdom) going to be doing so every day, (No) they will go up to worship the Lord in Mt Zion on the Sabbath, as scripture teaches in many places

Ezekiel 47:9-12KJV
9 And it shall come to pass, that every thing that liveth, which moveth, whithersoever the rivers shall come, shall live: and there shall be a very great multitude of fish, because these waters shall come thither: for they shall be healed; and every thing shall live whither the river cometh.
10 And it shall come to pass, that the fishers shall stand upon it from Engedi even unto Eneglaim; they shall be a place to spread forth nets; their fish shall be according to their kinds, as the fish of the great sea, exceeding many.
11 But the miry places thereof and the marishes thereof shall not be healed; they shall be given to salt.
12 And by the river upon the bank thereof, on this side and on that side, shall grow all trees for meat, whose leaf shall not fade, neither shall the fruit thereof be consumed: it shall bring forth new fruit according to his months, because their waters they issued out of the sanctuary: and the fruit thereof shall be for meat, and the leaf thereof for medicine.

In Love
From one new moon to another, does not mean all those nights are new moons. Come on man, you have gone into cognitive shut down. From one to another means exactly that starting at one and going all the way through to the other. It includes all of the in between. From one new moon to another means the whole month. New moon to new moon. I can't teach you basic reading comprehension. The passage in Isaiah 66 is simply saying that in the new heaven and new earth all will come before him everyday.
“For as the new heavens and the new earth that I make shall remain before me, says the Lord , so shall your offspring and your name remain. From new moon to new moon, and from Sabbath to Sabbath, all flesh shall come to worship before me, declares the Lord .
Isaiah 66:22‭-‬23 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/isa.66.22-23.ESV
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,024
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From one new moon to another, does not mean all those nights are new moons. Come on man, you have gone into cognitive shut down. From one to another means exactly that starting at one and going all the way through to the other. It includes all of the in between. From one new moon to another means the whole month. New moon to new moon. I can't teach you basic reading comprehension. The passage in Isaiah 66 is simply saying that in the new heaven and new earth all will come before him everyday.
“For as the new heavens and the new earth that I make shall remain before me, says the Lord , so shall your offspring and your name remain. From new moon to new moon, and from Sabbath to Sabbath, all flesh shall come to worship before me, declares the Lord .
Isaiah 66:22‭-‬23 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/isa.66.22-23.ESV
We Will Disagree, We Have Explained Our Positions.

A Fact (10) Commandments Applies To The Christian Today, And That Includes The 7th Day Sabbath

It's not Hard To Justify Observing Not Killing, Committing Adultery, Stealing

But when it comes to the Sabbath, Many Want To Remove This As If Its No Longer Valid :)

Thou Shalt Not Kill

Thou Shalt Not Commit Adultery

Thou Shalt Not Steal

Remember The Sabbath Day To Keep It Holy
 
Sep 2, 2020
2,165
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Babylon
It would be my opinion that Constatines claim of conversion 312AD, the edict of Milan 313AD in tolerance of Christianity, that led to the donation of land for "Vatican City" and started building the St Peter's Basilica in 319AD, and Constantine calling the 1st Nicean Council in 325AD?

It's my observation and opinion that Christianity was the Roman State Religion Long Before Theodosius in 380AD

It was through Constantine that Easter, Christmas, And Sunday Observance Was Established In The Church, It Was These Actions That Paganism And Christianity Molded Together Into A Quasi State Religion

The Pagans Maintained Easter/Fertility Rites, Christmas Roman Saturnalia, "Sun"day pagan day of observance and rest
We have written record of Christians celebrating the resurrection as early as the second century. The council of Nicaea established a uniform date, being the first Sunday after the first full moon after the spring equinox.
 
Sep 2, 2020
2,165
943
113
Babylon
We Will Disagree, We Have Explained Our Positions.

A Fact (10) Commandments Applies To The Christian Today, And That Includes The 7th Day Sabbath

It's not Hard To Justify Observing Not Killing, Committing Adultery, Stealing

But when it comes to the Sabbath, Many Want To Remove This As If Its No Longer Valid :)

Thou Shalt Not Kill

Thou Shalt Not Commit Adultery

Thou Shalt Not Steal

Remember The Sabbath Day To Keep It Holy
How about the making of and possession of images? The 10 commandments express forbid the making of and possession of images of anything under heaven or in heaven.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
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all those Commands were repeated in the N.T. for gentiles who began to follow Christ.

but, no Sabbath repeated for gentiles.

Christians met on the Lord's Day, sun. morning , long before rome banned Sabbath keeping. ( which, again was wrong).
 
Feb 6, 2014
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We Will Disagree, We Have Explained Our Positions.

A Fact (10) Commandments Applies To The Christian Today, And That Includes The 7th Day Sabbath

It's not Hard To Justify Observing Not Killing, Committing Adultery, Stealing

But when it comes to the Sabbath, Many Want To Remove This As If Its No Longer Valid :)

Thou Shalt Not Kill

Thou Shalt Not Commit Adultery

Thou Shalt Not Steal

Remember The Sabbath Day To Keep It Holy
Jesus say love your God and your neighbor are cover all the law and prophet.

After Jesus, no more animal sacrifice, because Jesus sacrificed replace it, no more physical sabbath, because Jesus is the real sabbath.
Sabbath mean rest. Real rest only in Jesus.
We may not work on Saturday, but our mine may not rest, a lot of problem on our family or job.
Only in Jesus we have real sabbath or rest
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
8,716
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We have written record of Christians celebrating the resurrection as early as the second century. The council of Nicaea established a uniform date, being the first Sunday after the first full moon after the spring equinox.
roman governor pliny the younger wrote in a letter to trajan that Christians met before dawn on the same day each week to celebrate Christ,
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,024
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Jesus say love your God and your neighbor are cover all the law and prophet.

After Jesus, no more animal sacrifice, because Jesus sacrificed replace it, no more physical sabbath, because Jesus is the real sabbath.
Sabbath mean rest. Real rest only in Jesus.
We may not work on Saturday, but our mine may not rest, a lot of problem on our family or job.
Only in Jesus we have real sabbath or rest
The scripture below doesn't "Replace" the 10 commandments, but enforces them, putting them into two categories, God & Neighbor

If you love God you wont use his name in vain, commit idolatry, you'll keep his sabbath etc

If you love your neighbor, you wont kill him, steal from him, covet his wife or possessions, etc

The 10 commandments are alive and well, and have never been replaced

Luke 10:27-28KJV
27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.
28 And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,024
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How about the making of and possession of images? The 10 commandments express forbid the making of and possession of images of anything under heaven or in heaven.
A "Graven Image" to be worshipped

Your suggestions that to maintain a picture image of whatever violates the 10 commandments is false

Exodus 20:4-5KJV
4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

Isaiah 44:15KJV
15 Then shall it be for a man to burn: for he will take thereof, and warm himself; yea, he kindleth it, and baketh bread; yea, he maketh a god, and worshippeth it; he maketh it a graven image, and falleth down thereto.
 
Jun 30, 2015
17,478
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The scripture below doesn't "Replace" the 10 commandments, but enforces them, putting them into two categories, God & Neighbor

If you love God you wont use his name in vain, commit idolatry, you'll keep his sabbath etc

If you love your neighbor, you wont kill him, steal from him, covet his wife or possessions, etc

The 10 commandments are alive and well, and have never been replaced

Luke 10:27-28KJV
27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.
28 And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.
Either you keep the Sabbath according to everything written about it in the Law, or you don't keep it. If you don't keep the Sabbath, you are just as much a lawbreaker as if you had broken every commandment. That you may not have murdered, stolen, or committed adultery becomes irrelevant.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
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Either you keep the Sabbath according to everything written about it in the Law, or you don't keep it. If you don't keep the Sabbath, you are just as much a lawbreaker as if you had broken every commandment. That you may not have murdered, stolen, or committed adultery becomes irrelevant.
Jesus Christ was the example of keeping the sabbath, he picked and ate corn, healed on the Sabbath, it was observed in Grace

Perhaps you missed the generation of Jesus, with the scribes and Pharisees :giggle:

Luke 6:5-11KJV
5 And he said unto them, That the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.
6 And it came to pass also on another sabbath, that he entered into the synagogue and taught: and there was a man whose right hand was withered.
7 And the scribes and Pharisees watched him, whether he would heal on the sabbath day; that they might find an accusation against him.
8 But he knew their thoughts, and said to the man which had the withered hand, Rise up, and stand forth in the midst. And he arose and stood forth.
9 Then said Jesus unto them, I will ask you one thing; Is it lawful on the sabbath days to do good, or to do evil? to save life, or to destroy it?
10 And looking round about upon them all, he said unto the man, Stretch forth thy hand. And he did so: and his hand was restored whole as the other.
11 And they were filled with madness; and communed one with another what they might do to Jesus.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
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Jesus is my Savior, and NOT the seventh day of the week designated as a Sabbath. I put on Jesus and think through Him, that leads me to scripture. I have no, nil, nothing of authority. If I report wrong then Christians should correct me and give the correct scripture.
make HIm your Lord
 
Sep 2, 2020
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Babylon
A "Graven Image" to be worshipped

Your suggestions that to maintain a picture image of whatever violates the 10 commandments is false

Exodus 20:4-5KJV
4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

Isaiah 44:15KJV
15 Then shall it be for a man to burn: for he will take thereof, and warm himself; yea, he kindleth it, and baketh bread; yea, he maketh a god, and worshippeth it; he maketh it a graven image, and falleth down thereto.
Verse 4 you shall not MAKE any graven images or any likeness of anything is on heaven above or in the earth below is the first part.
Making an image is forbidden. I see you made red the image part but did not make red the making part. Step one don't even make an image, step two don't bow down to images.
 
May 6, 2017
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So what do you believe about the Sabbath? Do you believe Genesis 2:3 is an error or the truth?
I believe that some form of Sabbath rest is important. In my view, it could be on a Saturday or a different day that you don’t do work. I believe Sabbath may help prevent burnout.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,024
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Verse 4 you shall not MAKE any graven images or any likeness of anything is on heaven above or in the earth below is the first part.
Making an image is forbidden. I see you made red the image part but did not make red the making part. Step one don't even make an image, step two don't bow down to images.
We will disagree once again, "Graven Image" is the key, the intent to make an idol for worship

Jeremiah 50:38KJV
38 A drought is upon her waters; and they shall be dried up: for it is the land of graven images, and they are mad upon their idols.

Isaiah 44:15KJV
15 Then shall it be for a man to burn: for he will take thereof, and warm himself; yea, he kindleth it, and baketh bread; yea, he maketh a god, and worshippeth it; he maketh it a graven image, and falleth down thereto.