Twinkling of an eye

[garee]

I agree that neither Enoch nor Elijah experienced physical death. However I would mention that, those in Christ who are alive at the time when the resurrection takes place, will not experience death either, but will simply be changed immortal and glorified and will be caught up. And I'm so looking forward to that day! Even so, come Lord Jesus!

It does not matter which way a persons tries to turn it. Corrupted flesh and blood could never enter the kingdom of God . That's a Catholic tradition to glory in the corrupted flesh. (no faith) The new incorruptible is not made up of the corrupted rudiments of this world. We do not know Christ after the corrupted rudiments of this world .

What would be the purpose of literal corrupted flesh and blood body other than to be poured out like all sacrifices to it can return to where it came from Just as well with the corrupted spirit of life. If it was corrupted why would it be poured out into the dust?

Believers receive new spirits that could never die they will be raised on the last day and receive their new bodies (neither flesh not blood ) male nor female .

What's the hope of glorying in dead flesh pronounced guilt in respect to sinful flesh

1 Corinthians 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

 

[calibob]

1 Thessalonians 4:17 17After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the LORD in the air. And so we will be with the LORD forever.
New International Version

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Consider this:

Jesus, in John 14 (UPPER ROOM Discourse), said, "I GO TO PREPARE a place for you..."

...but in Matthew 25:31-34 (which I believe is in the context of His Second Coming to the earth [parallel with many other passages speaking of the same]), it says (to those STILL-LIVING persons [particularly to the SHEEP/the RIGHTEOUS, not said to the goats/cursed], on the earth, at that time), "Come, ye BLESSED of My Father, INHERIT the kingdom HAVING BEEN PREPARED for you FROM [not 'BEFORE' as is used elsewhere of others] the FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD."

How can these two be speaking of the same thing? One is "I GO TO PREPARE," the other is "HAVING BEEN PREPARED for you FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD."



[note: I believe the Matt25:31-34 context is speaking specifically of "the kingdom of the heavens" (written in this way, in Matthew), which is entirely earthly-located, aka the earthly MK age; ALL "Son of man cometh/coming/shall come/etc" passages speak of this... and about TEN or so "BLESSED" passages speak of it (ex Dan12:12 "BLESSED is he that waiteth, and cometh to the 1335 days")... and that BOTH verses in John 11:25-26 speak to this issue, where Jesus had said, "I AM THE Resurrection AND THE LIFE..." (of the latter, He adds) "and he that LIVETH and believeth in Me SHALL NEVER DIE. Believest thou this?" IOW, I believe that because He will, upon His RETURN, be REIGNING, that HE is fully capable of maintaining the LIVES of those who enter the earthly MK age in mortal bodies, because He is God (The Resurrection AND THE LIFE" Himself!)--these will be the only ones capable of reproducing/bearing children... which "children/grandchildren" will not be "BORN automatically righteous/saved" and this is why we see what we do at the end of the MK age (those being susceptible to Satan's "deception" at that point in the chronology)]

 

[preston39]

I agree that neither Enoch nor Elijah experienced physical death. However I would mention that, those in Christ who are alive at the time when the resurrection takes place, will not experience death either, but will simply be changed immortal and glorified and will be caught up. And I'm so looking forward to that day! Even so, come Lord Jesus!

We will be in a different age then.........than church age/man's day now..........? I am not sure that is a major difference.

 

[Locoponydirtman]

I wanted to start a thread to ask a few simple questions about the rapture theory. What ive found in scripture is no wheres near what i hear from the Rapturist. Ive found that when we are changed in the twinkling of an eye, we are not going to heaven but are going to the kingdom, the thousand year period of rest, right here on this earth. The changing {rapture} takes place on the Day of the Lord, after the tribulation period. When the "rapture" takes place is there even 1 scripture that says we are taken to heaven. Ive looked. Cant find a one.

Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord.
1 THESSALONIANS 4:17 NASB

will be caught up
ἁρπαγησόμεθα (harpagēsometha)
Verb - Future Indicative Passive - 1st Person Plural
Strong's Greek 726: To seize, snatch, obtain by robbery. From a derivative of haireomai; to seize.

rap·ture
/ˈrapCHər/
Learn to pronounce
Origin
late 16th century (in the sense ‘seizing and carrying off’): from obsolete French, or from medieval Latin raptura ‘seizing’, partly influenced by rapt.

John 14:3
3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am.


And that's where it comes from.

Learn to p

 

[speculator]

Yes this is what i have read in scriptures also.. The rapture will happen on the day of the LORD and we will meet Him in the sky as He returns to earth.. And we shall be ruling with Him on earth in our perfected eternal bodies for 1000 years..

I agree but I am not so sure about the "we"

 

[dcontroversal]

depends; are we talking about ..

• 7 literal congregations that existed in 1st century AD and this is not applicable to anything but those time-and-place-specific churches?
• 7 specifically delineated church 'ages' such that each of the 7 is applies to the entire church all across the world for a certain time period and then no longer applies once the next 'age' is entered into?
• 7 'categories' of some kind within the entire church body, which may be concurrent - so that for example at any point in history the message to each of the 7 is applicable to the church as an whole?
• something else?

My view...the 7 churches represent the types of churches on the earth and any given time....they in no way, shape or form represent ages.....that is a man made construct that is not supported by scripture

 

[speculator]

Revelation 20:1 tells us an angel comes DOWN from heaven
Revelation 21:2 tells us the new Jerusalem comes DOWN from God out of heaven and we will go meet Him there.

Jacobs ladder showed angels ascending and descending from heaven. The kingdom is going to come down to earth.

I think that in the last day and hour there will be much descending of angels from heaven.

 

[dcontroversal]

We meet in the air and RETURN to Heaven. The sequence of events is as below:

1. The Resurrection/Rapture "in the twinkling of an eye".

2. The Lord meets all the saints in the air and returns with them to Heaven.

3. The Judgment Seat of Christ (for judging works and handing rewards) in Heaven

4. The Marriage of the Lamb in Heaven

5. The Second Coming of Christ with His saints and angels (giving the appearance of clouds) to earth for the battle of Armageddon.

false!!

 

[Ahwatukee]

We will be in a different age then.........than church age/man's day now..........? I am not sure that is a major difference.

Hi Preston39!

My point was/is that, at some point during the church age while still in our mortal bodies, the Lord is going to descend and call up both the dead and the living believers. Those who are still living will not be dead and therefore will not be resurrected, but will be changed into our immortal and glorified bodies in a moment and caught up with those who will have just been resurrected. This was my point about not physically dying, but being changed on the spot and caught up.

In short, our change to immortal and glorified will take place without physically dying. So, I'm not quite sure what you mean by "we will be in a different age." To be clear, the Lord could come while I'm sitting here typing this post and I would immediately be changed into my immortal and glorified body and caught without ever physically dying.

 

[Nehemiah6]

false!!

That's hilarious! But if you believe that things revealed in Scripture are false, there is nothing left to discuss.

 

[dcontroversal]

That's hilarious! But if you believe that things revealed in Scripture are false, there is nothing left to discuss.

No...I believe your view is false....the scriptures are true....nice try...no cigar pal!

 

[Adstar]

I agree but I am not so sure about the "we"

Well the We i was pointing to are the Saints..

If you have another POV please elaborate..

 

[Absolutely]

false!!

There is no white horse/s involved in the gathering of the bride(the rapture) nor any white horse/s in the gathering of the Jews in rev 14.

The horseless gathering was foretold
At the ascention in acts.
".....this Jesus shall return IN LIKE MANNER"
Tie all that in with mat 25 which is the rapture. No horses anywhere.

So many dynamics confirm a pretrib rapture.
Nothing,zero,pointing to a postrib rapture.

 

[Ahwatukee]

Yes this is what i have read in scriptures also.. The rapture will happen on the day of the LORD and we will meet Him in the sky as He returns to earth.. And we shall be ruling with Him on earth in our perfected eternal bodies for 1000 years..

Good day Adstar,

Understand this, prior to the Lord returning to the earth to end the age, the complete wrath of God must take place first and will do via the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments. Therefore, if you have 1 Thess.4:16, i.e. the changing and catching up of the living taking place at that time, this would mean that the living church would go through the entire wrath of God.

The on-going problem with a post tribulation gathering, is not recognizing the gathering of the church vs. the Lord's return to the earth as being two separate events.

The scripture states that when the Lord comes to gather His church, that the dead in Christ shall rise first. Immediately after that, those still living in Christ will be changed and caught up with those who will have just resurrected to meet the Lord in the air. At this event neither the Lord nor the church returns to the earth, but according to John 14:1-3 are taken back to the Father's house (heaven) to those places that Jesus went to prepare for us. John 14:1-3 is a promise from the Lord and must be fulfilled. In addition and as I continue to make known, Revelation 19:6-8 shows the bride/church already in heaven receiving her fine linen, white and clean at the wedding of the Lamb and this while God's wrath is being poured out upon the earth. Then in Rev.19:14, we see the armies of heaven following the Lord out of heaven and wearing that same fine linen, which identifies them as being the bride/church. In addition to that, in Rev.17:14 we have an excerpt of the Lord's return to the earth to end the age stating that those who are with Him will be His "called, chosen and faithful followers. In order to follow the Lord out of heaven, the church would already have to be in heaven.

The problem is based on not enough study of the scriptures relating to end-time events. People are not including the other scriptures in order to come to a right conclusion, but are only basing their conclusions on partial information.

The gathering of the church:
Jesus descends from heaven to the earths atmosphere, where the dead rise first, immortal and glorified. Then immediately after that, those in Christ who are still alive are changed immortal and glorified and caught up with the resurrection to meet the Lord in the air. At that time John 14:1-3 will be fulfilled with the Lord taking the entire church back to the Father's house to those places that He went to prepare for us. 1 Thess.4:16-17 is the fulfillment of John 14:1-3. During that time in heaven the Bema Seat of Christ and the wedding of the Lamb will take place. Once it is time for the Lord to return to the earth to end the age, the church will follow Him out of heaven riding on white horses.

These two events above and below, are separated by at least seven years.

The Lord's return to the earth to end the age (second coming):
The Lord descends to the earth with the church and the angels to put down the beast, the ten kings and all the kings and armies of the world who will have gathered against Him and His army (Rev.19:11-21). The beast and the false prophet will be captured and thrown alive into the lake of fire (Rev.19:20) and Satan and his angels will be cast into the Abyss (Rev.20:1-3). When the Lord returns to the earth to end the age, He will send out His angels and they will first gather the wicked (Matt.13:30) and bring them to the location where Armageddon is taking place where they, the kings and their armies will all be killed by that double-edged sword which proceeds from the Lord's mouth (Rev.19:15, 17-18, 21).

 

[dcontroversal]

There is no white horse/s involved in the gathering of the bride(the rapture) nor any white horse/s in the gathering of the Jews in rev 14.

The horseless gathering was foretold
At the ascention in acts.
".....this Jesus shall return IN LIKE MANNER"
Tie all that in with mat 25 which is the rapture. No horses anywhere.

So many dynamics confirm a pretrib rapture.
Nothing,zero,pointing to a postrib rapture.

False and I said nothing of horses....and even the parable of the wheat and tares SEES THE TARES BEING DEALT WITH before the wheat is gathered...and actually there is NOTHING that points to a pretrib ingathering farce

 

[preston39]

The new, new age religion teaching that the rapture is not scriptural has not been around long...per research to date. It has gained in popularity against scripture since the 1960's.
If anyone has evidence of it's popular presence prior to 1960....teachings, writings or major topic of high level discussions, please share your information.

 

[Gift1982]

The twinkle of a eye. just simply means at the last trump. thats when Christ returns. All who are alive on earth are changed to a different body. One that will last at least till they are judged either to eternity or the lake of fire at the end of the Lords day. The twinkle of the eye is the same as being caught up in the air. in 1st Thess 4. because its the same time frame .

The time being directly after the tribulation of Satan. so many have taken the mark. the dead of rev 20, are that way for the state of their soul is in serious question after having been effected by the mark of the beast. the deception.

I dont mention a rapture because that is not a biblical teaching from what i have studied.

 

[Gift1982]

The twinkle of a eye just simply means at the last trump ( thats when Christ returns) All who are alive on earth are changed to a different body. One that will last at least till they are judged either to eternity or the lake of fire at the end of the Lords day. The twinkle of the eye is the same as being caught up in the air. in 1st Thess 4. because its the same time frame . Its the same subject. We all meet the Lord in the spirit. The change into a spiritual body . Not a flesh one . If you got a English only handle of the Bible you'll miss a lot .

The time being directly after the tribulation of Satan and the arrival of the real Christ .so many have taken the mark. the dead of rev 20, This is why 1 Corinthians 15:52 says they raise incorruptible. They go through the change as well.

I don't mention a rapture because that is not anything Jesus taught .

 

[preston39]

The twinkle of a eye. just simply means at the last trump. thats when Christ returns. All who are alive on earth are changed to a different body. One that will last at least till they are judged either to eternity or the lake of fire at the end of the Lords day. The twinkle of the eye is the same as being caught up in the air. in 1st Thess 4. because its the same time frame .

The time being directly after the tribulation of Satan. so many have taken the mark. the dead of rev 20, are that way for the state of their soul is in serious question after having been effected by the mark of the beast. the deception.

I dont mention a rapture because that is not a biblical teaching from what i have studied.

Not everyone....note;....."those dead in Christ shall rise up and be met in the air by those living in Christ".

The word..... rapture..... is not in the text of the Bible. It is a word used by man to describe...being taken up....as stated in scriptures.