What does this mean: "I have said, Ye are gods..."

[miknik5]

I didn't know what you were referring to, no. I was responding to what I thought heartofdavid said.

Why would it be your faith that would heal your parents? We all have our,personal mountains. I have faith for my children, because the promises state specifically you and your seed and your seeds seed.

I was being facetious. People here have said there are done who are holders to this WOF movement as if we state it we will receive it and if we don’t receive it it’s because there’s something wrong with our faith as some movements suggest in error

 

[Nehemiah6]

I was being facetious. People here have said there are done who are holders to this WOF movement as if we state it we will receive it and if we don’t receive it it’s because there’s something wrong with our faith as some movements suggest in error

This thread is not about WOF, but there is another one where you can discuss that to your heart's content.

 

[miknik5]

Mat 12:35 A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.

Not all treasure is good.

Store up TRUE TREASURE in heaven
for where your heart is there also will your treasure be


agreed

eternal treasures are quite different from temporal trinkets

 

[jaybird88]

jaybird,you should read Judges

whats in judges that i need to read?

 

[jaybird88]

the divine council is also mentioned in Psalm 89

[SUP]5 [/SUP]Let the heavens praise your wonders, O Lord,
your faithfulness in the assembly of the holy ones!
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For who in the skies can be compared to the Lord?
Who among the heavenly beings is like the Lord,
[SUP]7 [/SUP]a God greatly to be feared in the council of the holy ones,

the council takes place in the skies.
the holy ones are called heavenly beings.

are mortal men called heavenly beings?

 

[know1]

And you know this is a lie. We spoke of the truth of what the scripture is saying.

Jesus said about Himself, " I exist in equality with Father". Speaking that He and Father are one. Hevthen prayedvthat we would be one with them, but the words I exist were left out. His prayer was that we would be equal with Him as members of His body, and not without His power. Forbour goalnis to live, move, and have our very being in Jesus. Letting Him flow from us. It doesn't make us a god, but His helper on earth.

Look at the words in Greek. Do your own studies. There are those misinterpreting, true, but so are you all.

stupid ipad rolls words together but I think it's readable.

I don't know what translation that is, but I like how it's worded.
And thanks for pointing out the meaning of "I am" and "one"
I like the picture you painted for those who are one with them.

 

[know1]

We are not fenceposts with a gospel message nailed on,we are his body

I haven't heard it put that way before, but I like it.
It describes many on this forum to a tee.

 

[bluto]

i already said they where judges, you even added the quote where i say they are judges so what are you talking about. are you saying they are human judges like us? they walk in darkness means what exactly? fallen angels can not walk in darkness? they will die like men, yeah because men so often forget that they have a mortal life? these judges are obviousely being judged by the Almighty and your saying that His judgment is for them to die like men which according to you they are men so they are going to die anyway, that makes little sense.


im reading nothing into the text, the text says gods, i understand it to mean gods, its not an assumption, its right there in scripture. complicating things would be taking a word, such as "gods" and changing it to "men".

There you go again jaybird, misrepresenting what I have said because you lack the Holy Spirit (or should I say you don't have the Holy Spirit) to help you understand the Scriptures. I know you said they were judges but you keep saying why does the Scriptures say they are gods? It's because God has chosen them to represent Him as judges.

It's just like God told Moses at Exodus 7:1, "Then the Lord said to Moses, See, I make you as God to Pharaoh, and your brother shall be your prophet." Now we all know that Moses is not God but he represents God. This is all that it means and here your running around the landscape making a moutain out of mole hill.

Furthermore, when I said they will die like the men that they are which means they were so corrupt and wicked that they will die "LOST." And what do you do? You say this: "they walk in darkness means what exactly?" It means like I just stated, they will be lost to hell unless they repent.

Finally, you close your argument by saying this: "im reading nothing into the text, the text says gods, i understand it to mean gods, its not an assumption, its right there in scripture. complicating things would be taking a word, such as "gods" and changing it to "men". I did NOT change anything, the text itself says they are men and they are termed "gods" because they represent God. Good grief, what's so hard to understand about this?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

 

[know1]

Do you think if I believed a little bit harder my father and mother would not have died and would have been physically healed?

is it my lack of faith then which allowed my parents to pass away?

paul didn’t accuse GOD or himself when those whom he loved were taken from him. But when GOD spared him the sorrow of losing another brother, he thanked GOD for it

And why couldn’t Paul with CHRIST so powerfully at work in him, keep those whom he loved from suffering and death?

More importantly, WHAT IS WRITTEN?

 

[DevotiontoBible]

There you go again jaybird, misrepresenting what I have said because you lack the Holy Spirit (or should I say you don't have the Holy Spirit) to help you understand the Scriptures. I know you said they were judges but you keep saying why does the Scriptures say they are gods? It's because God has chosen them to represent Him as judges.

It's just like God told Moses at Exodus 7:1, "Then the Lord said to Moses, See, I make you as God to Pharaoh, and your brother shall be your prophet." Now we all know that Moses is not God but he represents God. This is all that it means and here your running around the landscape making a moutain out of mole hill.

Furthermore, when I said they will die like the men that they are which means they were so corrupt and wicked that they will die "LOST." And what do you do? You say this: "they walk in darkness means what exactly?" It means like I just stated, they will be lost to hell unless they repent.

Finally, you close your argument by saying this: "im reading nothing into the text, the text says gods, i understand it to mean gods, its not an assumption, its right there in scripture. complicating things would be taking a word, such as "gods" and changing it to "men". I did NOT change anything, the text itself says they are men and they are termed "gods" because they represent God. Good grief, what's so hard to understand about this?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

I wouldn't say these "little god" people don't have the Holy Spirit. You may be right and they may not, but I had the Holy Spirit and was deceived by WOF teachings for years. I would defend them to my friends who knew it wasn't right but they attacked Ken Copeland and Hagin instead of opening the Scriptures with me. However, deep inside I felt a need to question what I had been taught. It took years for me to develop the hermeneutical tools I needed to get free. I would say if they are here engaging those of us who know better then they probably have the Holy Spirit in them. It's the vicious WOF people who resort to personal attacks when their delusion is challenged are the ones I would say are devoid of eternal life.

 

[know1]

Store up TRUE TREASURE in heaven
for where your heart is there also will your treasure be


agreed

eternal treasures are quite different from temporal trinkets

Whatever you like thinking about, that is where your heart is.
Example of good and evil treasures.
Good treasure of the heart- believing and acting on what is written.
Evil or corrupt treasure of the heart- doubting the word of God or believing the natural over what is written.

 

[Magenta]

no worries, maybe i am understanding it all wrong. please explain to me how the Most High passes judgment on beings that do not exist.

​

Hello Jay. I believe you are understanding it all wrong, for many of the things people idolize most certainly DO exist. Maybe if you try to take it right back to the beginning in the garden with the fall of all creation following the disobedience of Adam and the deception of Eve, it would help. Judgment is passed on all who refuse His sovereignty. They have prioritized the pride of life and the lusts of the flesh above living by the Word of God. In so doing, they place themselves on the throne, to become a god, a god that lives in opposition to and rebellion against the One true God. Another example is atheists, who idolize their intelligence. They have made a god of the natural man. Natural men certainly do exist, and they shall certainly have judgment passed upon them. They shall pass out of life as a result of their refusal to acknowledge God as God, while they were busy admiring the image of the god they see in themselves.​

​

 

[jaybird88]

There you go again jaybird, misrepresenting what I have said because you lack the Holy Spirit (or should I say you don't have the Holy Spirit) to help you understand the Scriptures. I know you said they were judges but you keep saying why does the Scriptures say they are gods? It's because God has chosen them to represent Him as judges.

they are judges/rulers, these judges however are sons of the Most High, not men like you and me.

It's just like God told Moses at Exodus 7:1, "Then the Lord said to Moses, See, I make you as God to Pharaoh, and your brother shall be your prophet." Now we all know that Moses is not God but he represents God. This is all that it means and here your running around the landscape making a moutain out of mole hill.

its actually nothing like the Ex passage, most every translation has "as" elohim or "like" eohim. very different than the psalms passage where the Most High says "I say you are gods". gods meaning elohim/of the heavens, elohim dont live down here.
psalms passage takes place in a divine council, Ex takes place where we know Moses is here in this world.
Moses is a man, the judges in psalms are sons of the Most High

Furthermore, when I said they will die like the men that they are which means they were so corrupt and wicked that they will die "LOST." And what do you do? You say this: "they walk in darkness means what exactly?" It means like I just stated, they will be lost to hell unless they repent.

you seem to be implying that "walk in darkness" means they can only be men, fallen angels are just as capable of walking in darkness as any man.

Finally, you close your argument by saying this: "im reading nothing into the text, the text says gods, i understand it to mean gods, its not an assumption, its right there in scripture. complicating things would be taking a word, such as "gods" and changing it to "men". I did NOT change anything, the text itself says they are men and they are termed "gods" because they represent God. Good grief, what's so hard to understand about this?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

the text never says they are men. the text says they are sons of the Most High, the Most High says they are gods. men are never mentioned. when you take a word like god, and change it to men, you are in fact changing the text.

the idea that they are men make no sense at all. why would men be in a divine council with the Most High?
when did the Most High ever divide the nations among men?
why would mortal men be judged to die like mortal men, they already are mortal men????
psalm 89 even calls them them heavenly beings.
the mortal men theory just does not hold water sorry.

also gods does not mean they are the same as the Most High, it just means they are of the heavens.

 

[DiscipleDave]

In another thread this Scripture was discussed and there seemed to be some confusion about its meaning. Got Questions has nicely clarified the meaning of this phrase.

God is immortal. Angels are immortal. satan is immortal. demons are immortal. The Spirit that is in you is immortal. That is why it is written you, that is to say the spirit that is in you, will either go to heaven for all eternity or separated from Heaven for all eternity.

We are children of God. Children of God are immortal.

God is our Father, we are His children.

Now granted the flesh that we currently reside in, is not of God but of the Earth. The flesh that we currently reside in is mortal and is appointed for death once. The Spirit that is in you can't die, can't be killed, can't age, can't hunger, can't thirst, it is immortal. What is considered a spiritual death is merely a separation from God.

Children of God are Gods. We are children of God. Now not all of His children are going to return back to Heaven to be with Him. We are put on this Earth in the flesh earthly bodies that we have now to be tested to see who we freely choose to follow and obey. Whether following and obeying satan who wants us to live in sin, or follow and obey Jesus who wants us not to obey His enemy and live in sins. Jesus will not allow satan to tempt any person above that they are able to handle, and with every single temptation that satan tries to tempt us with, Jesus allows us a path out of it. So you choose whether to obey satan or chose the path that Jesus gives you out of it. That is the test.

Those who Love One Another will be those who are accepted into the Kingdom of LOVE.
Those who Fail to Love One Another will be rejected to enter into the Kingdom of LOVE.

^i^

††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††

DiscipleDave

 

[jaybird88]

Hello Jay. I believe you are understanding it all wrong, for many of the things people idolize most certainly DO exist. Maybe if you try to take it right back to the beginning in the garden with the fall of all creation following the disobedience of Adam and the deception of Eve, it would help. Judgment is passed on all who refuse His sovereignty. They have prioritized the pride of life and the lusts of the flesh above living by the Word of God. In so doing, they place themselves on the throne, to become a god, a god that lives in opposition to and rebellion against the One true God. Another example is atheists, who idolize their intelligence. They have made a god of the natural man. Natural men certainly do exist, and they shall certainly have judgment passed upon them. They shall pass out of life as a result of their refusal to acknowledge God as God, while they were busy admiring the image of the god they see in themselves.​

so when the Most High says He is passing judgment on gods, what He really means is passing judgment on men who think they are gods, even though the text does not say this? and why would the Most High call them gods when they are in fact not gods. i know people that are always saying one thing and meaning something else and i can never trust anything they say to be true.

so how do we know when reading scripture the text are accurate or really mean something else, and why does the text not just say what it really means in the first place?

 

[Magenta]

so when the Most High says He is passing judgment on gods, what He really means is passing judgment on men who think they are gods, even though the text does not say this? and why would the Most High call them gods when they are in fact not gods. i know people that are always saying one thing and meaning something else and i can never trust anything they say to be true.

so how do we know when reading scripture the text are accurate or really mean something else, and why does the text not just say what it really means in the first place?

Little "g" gods are not just men, Jay. I have already explained this to you, but you seem to have ignored it. Anything that a person idolizes becomes as a god to them. It rules them, like fame and fortune rule some people. Take a look at Romans one, also, verses 21-23 in particular.

 

[bluto]

they are judges/rulers, these judges however are sons of the Most High, not men like you and me.


its actually nothing like the Ex passage, most every translation has "as" elohim or "like" eohim. very different than the psalms passage where the Most High says "I say you are gods". gods meaning elohim/of the heavens, elohim dont live down here.
psalms passage takes place in a divine council, Ex takes place where we know Moses is here in this world.
Moses is a man, the judges in psalms are sons of the Most High


you seem to be implying that "walk in darkness" means they can only be men, fallen angels are just as capable of walking in darkness as any man.



the text never says they are men. the text says they are sons of the Most High, the Most High says they are gods. men are never mentioned. when you take a word like god, and change it to men, you are in fact changing the text.

the idea that they are men make no sense at all. why would men be in a divine council with the Most High?
when did the Most High ever divide the nations among men?
why would mortal men be judged to die like mortal men, they already are mortal men????
psalm 89 even calls them them heavenly beings.
the mortal men theory just does not hold water sorry.

also gods does not mean they are the same as the Most High, it just means they are of the heavens.

Ok jaybird, let's do it your way. You just said, "they are judges/rulers, these judges however are sons of the Most High, not men like you and me." So who specifically are these sons of the Most High that are men like you and me?

I ask because I would like to know from you who are they judging at Psalm 82 verses 2-5?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

 

[stonesoffire]

I don't know what translation that is, but I like how it's worded.
And thanks for pointing out the meaning of "I am" and "one"
I like the picture you painted for those who are one with them.

KJV looking at the Greek.

 

[jaybird88]

Little "g" gods are not just men, Jay. I have already explained this to you, but you seem to have ignored it. Anything that a person idolizes becomes as a god to them. It rules them, like fame and fortune rule some people. Take a look at Romans one, also, verses 21-23 in particular.

Magenta i hope your having a good weekend.

im not ignoring it i promise. i think there is a difference between gods/elohim and idols. i think there was a time men went crazy with idols and even started making idols to gods that didnt exist.
the ones in Psalm 82 IMO cant be men, these judges are rulers over the nations, there is no scripture where the Most High divided the nations among men. there were judges in Israel but they judged in Israel only, not the other nations.

 

[bluto]

they are judges/rulers, these judges however are sons of the Most High, not men like you and me.


its actually nothing like the Ex passage, most every translation has "as" elohim or "like" eohim. very different than the psalms passage where the Most High says "I say you are gods". gods meaning elohim/of the heavens, elohim dont live down here.
psalms passage takes place in a divine council, Ex takes place where we know Moses is here in this world.
Moses is a man, the judges in psalms are sons of the Most High


you seem to be implying that "walk in darkness" means they can only be men, fallen angels are just as capable of walking in darkness as any man.



the text never says they are men. the text says they are sons of the Most High, the Most High says they are gods. men are never mentioned. when you take a word like god, and change it to men, you are in fact changing the text.

the idea that they are men make no sense at all. why would men be in a divine council with the Most High?
when did the Most High ever divide the nations among men?
why would mortal men be judged to die like mortal men, they already are mortal men????
psalm 89 even calls them them heavenly beings.
the mortal men theory just does not hold water sorry.

also gods does not mean they are the same as the Most High, it just means they are of the heavens.

Ok jaybird, let's do it your way. You just said, "they are judges/rulers, these judges however are sons of the Most High, not men like you and me." Well then can you please explain who these men are that are not like you and me judging at Psalm 82 verses 2-5? Are they men or not men? Whatever answer you give can you tell me on what basis these are not men like you and me so who are they judging if they are not men as well?? In other words, how do you know all of this?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto