What Laws are still valid to christians

[just-me]

How is this being lawless?

This is [GOD's] commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. 1 John 3:23​

Just stating a crux as I see it. I was thinking the other day that God has less than 700 laws, and our country has thousands. Anyway, I was joshing somewhat, but if we want to kick out the law, and not obey them, we go to jail, eventually and that makes us 'lawless'.
I agree wholeheartedly that Jesus paid it all, but then if people believe they are not responsible for their actions, there remains no more sacrifice for sins.
Hebrews 10:26 (KJV)
[SUP]26 [/SUP]For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

I’m not advocating that you do this, for I’m not the judge. I think about the weak and the unlearned in the Word, that they also may believe we are not accountable for our actions in the sight of God. When we advocate that the law isn't worth looking into because it's a thing of the past, we can easily offend one of these little ones.

Matthew 18:5-6 (KJV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP]And whoso shall receive one such little child in my name receiveth me.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.

After all, loving is the law, and the law tells us the attitude we should have toward God and our fellow man. It is Old Testament. It is instruction. If we do not advocate going to school to learn it, how are we supposed to do it? How can we lead one to Christ without using the schoolmaster as Paul told the Galatians to use it?

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

which is now written on the heart (Heb 8:10) instead of tablets of stone.

Because it is written on the hearts, the Decalogue has become the way which NT believers' loving hearts live.

The letter of the law was written on tablets of stone.

The spirit of the law is 'written' in our hearts.

 

[Elin]

I always looked at it slightly different. Yes I agree that the law is of 3 categories, even related to Father, Son and Holy Ghost. 1. the Levitical law, 2. the moral law, and 3 the judgmental law. So basically we see it the same way, just different terms. I agree that the morals still applies, as you said. Yet I believe the judgmental part does also because that's New Testament. Of course that's my term and not yours.

Leviticus 18:4 (KJV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Ye shall do my judgments, and keep mine ordinances, to walk therein: I am the LORD your God.

Romans 12:19 (KJV)
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

John 7:24 (KJV)
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.

As far as the Levitical part, I think I have defined that previously. In summary, it is all in tact for Jesus didn't take any of it away. Not one speck. All the I'z are dotted, and all the T's are crossed. I like the pun on the T's thing.

Matthew 5:18 (KJV)
[SUP]18 [/SUP]For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

I use the terms Ceremonial (Leviticus), Moral (Decalogue + some Lev laws) and Governmental (cultural ?).

 

[Elin]

Are you saying that the Church today is to obey all of the Mosaic Laws?

Matt, you have it right, because the law is the teacher, and the commandment is the doing of what is taught. If love is the greatest commandment, we are taught by the Spirit of the law how to love. What did Jesus say, "if you love Me obey my commandments." Now if Jesus created all things according to Paul's writing to the Colossians, then Jesus gave the commandments to Moses. Right?

And Jesus also gave the revelation to Paul and to the writer of Hebrews (Heb 1:1-2)
that the Mosaic law has been set aside because it was weak and useless to obtain righteousness
(Heb 7:18-19),
and replaced with the law of Christ (Gal 6:2), which is now God's law for the NT (1Co 9:21),
and is the law of love (Mt 22:37-40: Jn 13:34; Ro 13:8-10)
written on our hearts instead of tablets of stone (Heb 8:10),
and which fulfills (accomplishes) the whole law (Mt 22:40; Ro 13:8, 10).

Love is the fulfillment of the whole law, which the NT presents as the Decalogue in this regard
(Mt 22:37-38; Ro 13:8-10).

 

[KohenMatt]

However, the Decalogue has now been written on our hearts (Heb 8:10; Ro 13:8-10), and is now the way we live in love from our hearts on which it is written (Mt 22: 37-40; Ro 13:8-10).

Law keeping is not the cause of salvation, it is the result of salvation.

Exactly. You and I agree completely here.

 

[Elin]

That's true that Jesus didn't mention the law. He had made it clear previously that He didn't come to do away with it. I think that we agree. The mistake so many people make is they have been taught that Jesus abolished the Mosaic law because He fulfilled it. . .He didn't come to abolish the law, but to fulfill it. Therefore the law is of extreme importance for God's plan, through Christ Jesus, to be complete.

Well, Jesus did fulfill the Mosaic law, and because God, to fulfill Ps 110:4,
changed the priesthood in the order of Aaron to the priesthood in the order of Melchizedek,
he also changed the law given on the basis of the Aaronic priesthood (Heb 7:9-12),
setting aside the Mosic law because it was weak and useless to obtain righteousness or salvation
(Heb 7:18-19),
and replacing it with the law of Christ (Gal 6:2), which is the law of God for the NT (1Co 9:21),
and which fulfills (accomplishes) the law (Mt 22:40; Ro 13:8, 10).

God's law for the NT is the law of Christ, which fulfills (accomplishes) the law,
which law in the NT is presented as the Decalogue (Mt 22:37-38; Ro 13:8-10).

 

[Elin]

The law is only meant for disobedient and lawless people, not righteous ones

... the law is not given for a righteous person but for the lawless and rebellious, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and totally worldly, for the one who kills his father and the one who kills his mother, for murderers, sexually immoral people, homosexuals, kidnappers, liars, perjurers, and whatever else is opposed to sound teaching, 1 Timothy 1:9-10

Great post!

Just a reminder that Paul was referring to Roman law above, not the Mosaic law.

Only disobedient people are under the law of Moses

If you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. Galatians 5:18

For all those who are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. Romans 8:14​

Believers in Christ are dead to the law of Moses

But now we have been released from the law, because we have died to that by which we were bound, so that we may serve in newness of the Spirit and not in oldness of the letter of the law. Romans 7:6

For through the law I died to the law, in order that I might live to God. I have been crucified with Christ, Galatians 2:19​

Those who seek to be justified by law in any way are cursed

For as many as are of the works of the law are under a curse, for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not abide by all the things that are written in the book of the law to do them.” Galatians 3:10​

The law of GOD is love which is shed abroad in our hearts through faith

For the whole law is fulfilled in one statement, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” Galatians 5:14

And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us. Romans 5:5​

 

[KohenMatt]

Well, Jesus did fulfill the Mosaic law, and because God, to fulfill Ps 110:4,
changed the priesthood in the order of Aaron to the priesthood in the order of Melchizedek,
he also changed the law given on the basis of the Aaronic priesthood (Heb 7:9-12),
setting aside the Mosic law because it was weak and useless to obtain righteousness or salvation
(Heb 7:18-19),
and replacing it with the law of Christ (Gal 6:2), which is the law of God for the NT (1Co 9:21),
and which fulfills (accomplishes) the law (Mt 22:40; Ro 13:8, 10).

God's law for the NT is the law of Christ, which fulfills (accomplishes) the law,
which law in the NT is presented as the Decalogue (Mt 22:37-38; Ro 13:8-10).

Yet Jesus still says to follow the Mosaic Law and to teach others to do so.

He told the Pharisees to practice mercy while not neglecting the specific tithing required by the Law.

 

[Elin]

If this is restrictive only with regard to a woman assuming the role of a Pastor then why does Paul command her to be silent? Teaching and having authority over a man is represented as two different things. Not only is she commanded not to assume a role of authority over the man, not only is she commanded to not teach but, Paul goes even further. She is commanded to be silent.

Teaching and having authority were both functions of the pastor in the NT churches.

She is not to preach or teach, nor offer opinions and answers in their assembly discussions.
She is to be silent. If she has questions or opinions, she is to give them to her husband at home.

 

[danschance]

The law can be broken down into 3 parts:
1) God's moral law and these stand forever.
2) God's Ceremonial or Ritual Law.
3) God's Dietary law.

Why the Law then? It was added because of transgressions, having been ordained through angels by the agency of a mediator, until the seed would come to whom the promise had been made. Gal 3:19

Christ fulfilled the The Mosaic laws (Ritual law and dietary law) (Matt. 5:17). They were shadows of things to come...which is Christ himself Col. 2:17). The law of Circumcision of the penis is becomes that of a circumcised heart (new man) (Gal. 5:1-12). The law of not wearing mixed fibers becomes being clothed in righteousness and so on.

No one was ever saved by the Mosaic laws (Roms. 3:20) and thankfully to Christ we are now saved through faith (Rom. 6:14, Eph. 2:8-9). A horse can only wear one yoke at a time, but the Judaizers teach would should put on the yoke of the Mosaic law and the Yoke of Christ. This is shear stupidity and spiritual cyanide (Gal. 5:4). Only a fool would put the new wine of Christ into the old wineskin of the Mosaic law.

 

[just-me]

Great post!

Just a reminder that Paul was referring to Roman law above, not the Mosaic law.

Really, wow, I didn't have any idea. Do you have something that is in scripture to confirm that. It would be very interesting to me to read up on that Paul is not referring to the law Mosaic Law. Never heard that before. That would put a different slant on everything that I have ever heard.

 

[Elin]

I present to all a crux of sorts.

If we have the law, and revere it, some will say that we are under the law. If by grace we are no longer under the law, and by that, reject it as condemnation, then we are minus the law, meaning "lawless". Can't win for losing.

Well, actually it's not the crux that it seems.

We are no longer under the Mosaic law as the way to righteousness and to salvation,
because it is weak and useless to do either (Heb 7:18-19).

However, the Decalogue is written on our hearts in the NT as Christ's law of love
(Mt 22:37-40; Ro 13:8-10),
and therefore living in NT love will fulfill (accomplish) the whole law,
which is presented in the NT as the Decalogue (Mt 22:40; Ro 13:8, 10).

 

[just-me]

Well, actually it's not the crux that it seems.

We are no longer under the Mosaic law as the way to righteousness and to salvation,
because it is weak and useless to do either (Heb 7:18-19).

However, the Decalogue is written on our hearts in the NT as Christ's law of love
(Mt 22:37-40; Ro 13:8-10),
and therefore living in NT love will fulfill (accomplish) the whole law, which is presented as the Decalogue
(Mt 22:40; Ro 13:8, 10).

It is weak because of human nature, not because the Word of God is weak. I don't fear weak gods. LOL

 

[KohenMatt]

The law can be broken down into 3 parts:
1) God's moral law and these stand forever.
2) God's Ceremonial or Ritual Law.
3) God's Dietary law.



Christ fulfilled the The Mosaic laws (Ritual law and dietary law) (Matt. 5:17). They were shadows of things to come...which is Christ himself Col. 2:17). The law of Circumcision of the penis is becomes that of a circumcised heart (new man) (Gal. 5:1-12). The law of not wearing mixed fibers becomes being clothed in righteousness and so on.

No one was ever saved by the Mosaic laws (Roms. 3:20) and thankfully to Christ we are now saved through faith (Rom. 6:14, Eph. 2:8-9). A horse can only wear one yoke at a time, but the Judaizers teach would should put on the yoke of the Mosaic law and the Yoke of Christ. This is shear stupidity and spiritual cyanide (Gal. 5:4). Only a fool would put the new wine of Christ into the old wineskin of the Mosaic law.

Again, this isn't about salvation. If it were, you'd be right on.

just keep in mind that Jesus told His followers to follow the Mosaic Law and to teach others to do as long as we're here. Sure, Jesus told His followers to follow the spiritual understanding and application of the Law, but He also told us to follow the physical.

 

[just-me]

The law can be broken down into 3 parts:
1) God's moral law and these stand forever.
2) God's Ceremonial or Ritual Law.
3) God's Dietary law.



Christ fulfilled the The Mosaic laws (Ritual law and dietary law) (Matt. 5:17). They were shadows of things to come...which is Christ himself Col. 2:17). The law of Circumcision of the penis is becomes that of a circumcised heart (new man) (Gal. 5:1-12). The law of not wearing mixed fibers becomes being clothed in righteousness and so on.

Very good! The law is the same as it always has been, but then today we see the Spiritual significance of the truth that has always been there since the beginning. Great analogy.

 

[Elin]

Here are some of the requirements as to how we should love the Lord.
Deuteronomy 6:1-6 (KJV)
Luke 10:25-28 (KJV)
Leviticus 19:11-18 (KJV)

In the heart where the law of God is written, the work of the Holy Spirit in the heart
gives the NT believer to know what it means to love.

 

[just-me]

In the heart where the law of God is written, the work of the Holy Spirit in the heart
gives the NT believer to know what it means to love.

So are you saying we do not need the Word of God to understand the Holy Spirit?

 

[just-me]

Let’s see. God gave the Law to Moses, Jesus is the creator of all things, and Jesus said His witness alone was not true unless His Father that gave the Law to Moses backed it up. So without the Mosaic Law Jesus’ ministry is insufficient? I think He is indicating that. I believe that, how about you?

Exodus 24:12 (KJV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And the LORD said unto Moses, Come up to me into the mount, and be there: and I will give thee tables of stone, and a law, and commandments which I have written; that thou mayest teach them.
Colossians 1:12-19 (KJV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
[SUP]14 [/SUP]In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
[SUP]15 [/SUP]Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
[SUP]16 [/SUP]For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
[SUP]17 [/SUP]And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
John 5:30-32 (KJV)
[SUP]30 [/SUP]I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.
[SUP]31 [/SUP]If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.
[SUP]32 [/SUP]There is another that beareth witness of me; and I know that the witness which he witnesseth of me is true.

 

[Elin]

The letter of the law was written on tablets of stone.

The spirit of the law is 'written' in our hearts.

Thanks.

You might be interested to know there is no "letter of the law" and "spirit of the law" in Scripture.

In 2Co 3:6, there is the letter, the tablets of stone (v.3) on which the letter of the law was written,
and there is the Spirit, the writing of the law by "the Spirit of the living God on tablets of human hearts" (v.3).

"The letter (the law) kills, but the Spirit gives life. (2Co 3:6)

The letter kills, the law as an external standard before which all people stand guilty
and condemned to death as lawbreakers (Dt 27:26; Gal 3:10), is the ministry that
brought death (v.7) and condemns (v.9).

The Spirit gives life, by writing the letter (law) on tablets of human hearts (v.3),
and providing the believer with love for God's law, and with power to keep it,
neither of which he had before.

Just sayin'.

 

[Elin]

Yet Jesus still says to follow the Mosaic Law and to teach others to do so.

He told the Pharisees to practice mercy while not neglecting the specific tithing required by the Law.

Well, don't you think there are several things to consider here?

First of all, that we don't have all Jesus' NT revelation in the gospels, for he did not give revelation concerning his inauguration of the New Covenant, which made the Old (Sinaitic) Covenant obsolete.
(Heb 8:13)

Secondly, during the life of Jesus, God's people were still under the Mosaic Covenant and Law.
He would not be giving them at that time the terms of the New Covenant and the New Law of Christ
(1Co 9:21; Gal 6:2) which would not be put into effect until the completion of his sacrificial propitiation.

Remember, he also said at that time, ". . .because they sit in the seat of Moses, you must obey
and do everything that the teachers of the law and the Pharisees tell you." (Mt 23:2-3)

But that no longer applies in the NT under the New Covenant.

We are now under the law of Christ (1Co 9:21; Gal 6:2),
which is the law of love (Mt 22:37-40; Ro 13:8-10), written on our hearts (Heb 8:10),
and which fulfills (accomplishes) the law (Mt 22:37:40; Ro 13:8, 10)
because the Holy Spirit gives the believer to know how to love.

And so thirdly, we must consider the whole revelation of the NT (Mt 22:37-40; 1Co 9:21; Ro 13:8-10)
to correctly understand any of it.