When Is It NOT Okay To Go To Church?
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Define greater ministries since it has been prophesied that many shall fall away from the faith in giving heed to seducing spirits & doctrines of devils.
Luke 6:26Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets.
I really have to wonder why they would be so spotlighted so much as a result of it.
1 Corinthians 3:[SUP]5 [/SUP]Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man? [SUP]6 [/SUP]I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. [SUP]7 [/SUP]So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.
John 3:[SUP]28 [/SUP]Ye yourselves bear me witness, that I said, I am not the Christ, but that I am sent before him. [SUP]29 [/SUP]He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, which standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is fulfilled. [SUP]30 [/SUP]He must increase, but I must decrease.
Since their fame is synonymous with what has happened to the town, I would say they got the glory more than God did. Who testified to that effect? Or did they put words in the followers' mouths to say that?
Proverbs 25:[SUP]27 [/SUP]It is not good to eat much honey: so for men to search their own glory is not glory.
John 7:[SUP]18 [/SUP]He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.
1 Corinthians 4:[SUP]5 [/SUP]For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake. [SUP]6 [/SUP]For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. [SUP]7 [/SUP]But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.
Obviously this christian urban legend has served them quite well.
Luke 6:26Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets.
I really have to wonder why they would be so spotlighted so much as a result of it.
1 Corinthians 3:[SUP]5 [/SUP]Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man? [SUP]6 [/SUP]I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. [SUP]7 [/SUP]So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.
John 3:[SUP]28 [/SUP]Ye yourselves bear me witness, that I said, I am not the Christ, but that I am sent before him. [SUP]29 [/SUP]He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, which standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is fulfilled. [SUP]30 [/SUP]He must increase, but I must decrease.
Since their fame is synonymous with what has happened to the town, I would say they got the glory more than God did. Who testified to that effect? Or did they put words in the followers' mouths to say that?
Proverbs 25:[SUP]27 [/SUP]It is not good to eat much honey: so for men to search their own glory is not glory.
John 7:[SUP]18 [/SUP]He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.
1 Corinthians 4:[SUP]5 [/SUP]For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake. [SUP]6 [/SUP]For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. [SUP]7 [/SUP]But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.
Obviously this christian urban legend has served them quite well.
There was a time that when I was on my way to Church, I had with me the youth group kids and on our way there was a car stalled on the side of the road. Well I pulled over and we all helped that person get back on the rode. Guess what we were late to church and yes repromanded, it did not matter what caused us to be late.
Also I once ran the youth group and when we had bible study, I would have each kid read a verse in that chapter we were studying and when they read a verse they would giuve comment on what they interpreted it to say to them and when we finished we would all discuss what came up. I tell you there was great learning from this.
But the Church leaders shut this down saying this is not good, in other words they could not direct them in the way they believe, the youth group could not be free. Also the youth group gathered up a lot of money through car washes and had earmarked that money for people they new were in need and,but the church leaders took it away from them and used iton what they saw fit. I know of a youth that came to join the youth group and was told in a youth session hat she was going to hell. This youth kid knew nothing of God at that time and was scared to death from this adult that was the deacon's wife. Yes Watch out for the hypocrisy. I was comingthrough a door at a time when the pastor was talking to the deacon and as I was coming through the door I overheard the pastor as he was turning toward the door I was comiing in from saying I am going to go fleece the flock now!!!
I know what goes on behind closed doors and know it is all about money masquerading as a beliver. For many will say Lord Lord for I did this and that, but God will say go away for I never knew you, you who work iniquity.
There is a lot of heresy out in the world today, and it is not always easy to keep my mouth shut, Iam learning when to keep quiet and when to not to, waiting on God to tell me which way to turn
Also I once ran the youth group and when we had bible study, I would have each kid read a verse in that chapter we were studying and when they read a verse they would giuve comment on what they interpreted it to say to them and when we finished we would all discuss what came up. I tell you there was great learning from this.
But the Church leaders shut this down saying this is not good, in other words they could not direct them in the way they believe, the youth group could not be free. Also the youth group gathered up a lot of money through car washes and had earmarked that money for people they new were in need and,but the church leaders took it away from them and used iton what they saw fit. I know of a youth that came to join the youth group and was told in a youth session hat she was going to hell. This youth kid knew nothing of God at that time and was scared to death from this adult that was the deacon's wife. Yes Watch out for the hypocrisy. I was comingthrough a door at a time when the pastor was talking to the deacon and as I was coming through the door I overheard the pastor as he was turning toward the door I was comiing in from saying I am going to go fleece the flock now!!!
I know what goes on behind closed doors and know it is all about money masquerading as a beliver. For many will say Lord Lord for I did this and that, but God will say go away for I never knew you, you who work iniquity.
There is a lot of heresy out in the world today, and it is not always easy to keep my mouth shut, Iam learning when to keep quiet and when to not to, waiting on God to tell me which way to turn
K
I don't remember them all anymore. This was years ago.
There is no Christian urban legend. I posted one line, and you kept asking questions looking for more information to prove that what I said cannot be true. This information is nowhere else. No one has put it online. Even in my website, I mention nothing of this story. No one is telling this story but me answering your questions.
There is no Christian urban legend. I posted one line, and you kept asking questions looking for more information to prove that what I said cannot be true. This information is nowhere else. No one has put it online. Even in my website, I mention nothing of this story. No one is telling this story but me answering your questions.
I do wonder if tithing isn't proof that the church is more in it for the money than God's words when tithing is not taught to the early churches to do?
2 Corinthians 9:6 But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully.
I take that verse 6 as meaning that since it is God that is ministering, He will provide exactly what He needs for what He is doing through that assembly.
7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.
Verse 7 means tithing is not in place because tithing mean a necessity to give. That would avoid forcing anyone to give grudgingly, especially in these hard economic times.
8 And God is able to make all grace abound toward you; that ye, always having all sufficiency in all things, may abound to every good work:
Again, in connecting to verse 6, it is God that is providing and the church should not be looking to members in needing them to give.
9 (As it is written, He hath dispersed abroad; he hath given to the poor: his righteousness remaineth for ever.
Since it is His righteousness and not our righteousness, believers need to see that He is faithful in providing for the poor.
10 Now he that ministereth seed to the sower both minister bread for your food, and multiply your seed sown, and increase the fruits of your righteousness
God is the One giving seed to the sower and water to the waterer that ministers to our growth in bearing fruit as His disciples.
11 Being enriched in every thing to all bountifulness, which causeth through us thanksgiving to God.
Herein is the true motivation for giving from any church member, but again, as he desire to as the Lord loves a cheerful giver.
12 For the administration of this service not only supplieth the want of the saints, but is abundant also by many thanksgivings unto God;
So the church needs to focus on the Word of God to edify the body of believers so that they will have a desire & cheerful heart to give, and not rely on "tithing" and thus looking to believers to give out of necessity.
I reckon that if a church had alot of members, they would become complacent and soft pedal everything to not offend anyone, looking the other way when believers are knowingly living in sin or in error, and rests in their laurels as if they do not need anything from God as long as the members are under the necessity to tithe., and thus becoming Laodiceans.
I reckon by doing away with tithing, they may look to Him to help them minister properly so that God would raise up cheerful givers whom are bearing fruit as His disciples.
If the ministers lead by examples, then so would the congregation in that reference below.
1 Timothy 6erverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself. 6 But godliness with contentment is great gain. 7 For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. 8 And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.
9 But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition.
How many members are tithing but have no exorbibant pension & retirement plan as the pastor does? How is that trusting God for tomorrow & yet at the expense of the poor?
Seems an awful lot of churches need a reality check here in these latter days.
Something worth considering here with His help in discernment, brother, nathan3.
2 Corinthians 9:6 But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully.
I take that verse 6 as meaning that since it is God that is ministering, He will provide exactly what He needs for what He is doing through that assembly.
7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.
Verse 7 means tithing is not in place because tithing mean a necessity to give. That would avoid forcing anyone to give grudgingly, especially in these hard economic times.
8 And God is able to make all grace abound toward you; that ye, always having all sufficiency in all things, may abound to every good work:
Again, in connecting to verse 6, it is God that is providing and the church should not be looking to members in needing them to give.
9 (As it is written, He hath dispersed abroad; he hath given to the poor: his righteousness remaineth for ever.
Since it is His righteousness and not our righteousness, believers need to see that He is faithful in providing for the poor.
10 Now he that ministereth seed to the sower both minister bread for your food, and multiply your seed sown, and increase the fruits of your righteousness
God is the One giving seed to the sower and water to the waterer that ministers to our growth in bearing fruit as His disciples.
11 Being enriched in every thing to all bountifulness, which causeth through us thanksgiving to God.
Herein is the true motivation for giving from any church member, but again, as he desire to as the Lord loves a cheerful giver.
12 For the administration of this service not only supplieth the want of the saints, but is abundant also by many thanksgivings unto God;
So the church needs to focus on the Word of God to edify the body of believers so that they will have a desire & cheerful heart to give, and not rely on "tithing" and thus looking to believers to give out of necessity.
I reckon that if a church had alot of members, they would become complacent and soft pedal everything to not offend anyone, looking the other way when believers are knowingly living in sin or in error, and rests in their laurels as if they do not need anything from God as long as the members are under the necessity to tithe., and thus becoming Laodiceans.
I reckon by doing away with tithing, they may look to Him to help them minister properly so that God would raise up cheerful givers whom are bearing fruit as His disciples.
If the ministers lead by examples, then so would the congregation in that reference below.
1 Timothy 6
erverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself. 6 But godliness with contentment is great gain. 7 For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. 8 And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.9 But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition.
How many members are tithing but have no exorbibant pension & retirement plan as the pastor does? How is that trusting God for tomorrow & yet at the expense of the poor?
Seems an awful lot of churches need a reality check here in these latter days.
Something worth considering here with His help in discernment, brother, nathan3.
read Hebrews 8 worship with God directly in his place of worship that he built not man
8 Now this is the main point of the things we are saying: We have such a High Priest, who is seated at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens, [SUP]2 [/SUP]a Minister of the sanctuary and of the true tabernacle which the Lord erected, and not man. Then read all scripture that God will lead you to discerning with the Holy Ghost in your heart being sealed by the Holy Ghost of promise as in Ephesians 1:13, under the new covenant of grace as shown in Hebrews 9:15-17 no longer under the curse where sin took occasion by the commandmment under grace where God in you leads you to all truth the truth that sets one free from the cares of this world knowing that God somehow will supply all your needs, for he promised those that seek the kingdom of Heaven not of this world, shall all their actuall real needs be supplied. God himself brother knows your heart, and will reveal to you truth as long as you really do want to know God above anything else, and it can be a long trip to come to understanding for the evil force of this world does not want you or anyone to know the truth
in Love Homwardbound
8 Now this is the main point of the things we are saying: We have such a High Priest, who is seated at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens, [SUP]2 [/SUP]a Minister of the sanctuary and of the true tabernacle which the Lord erected, and not man. Then read all scripture that God will lead you to discerning with the Holy Ghost in your heart being sealed by the Holy Ghost of promise as in Ephesians 1:13, under the new covenant of grace as shown in Hebrews 9:15-17 no longer under the curse where sin took occasion by the commandmment under grace where God in you leads you to all truth the truth that sets one free from the cares of this world knowing that God somehow will supply all your needs, for he promised those that seek the kingdom of Heaven not of this world, shall all their actuall real needs be supplied. God himself brother knows your heart, and will reveal to you truth as long as you really do want to know God above anything else, and it can be a long trip to come to understanding for the evil force of this world does not want you or anyone to know the truth
in Love Homwardbound
D
I agree with Kenisyes. Pastors must be able to hear God to be effective. I guess that is true for all believers.
I know of a church that a young pastor (who was my father), accepted a call in a small town. With in this church was a core group of occultists. They cursed the pastor, his marriage and his children. With in a short period of time, his marriage started to fall apart and eventually got a divorce. After the divorce he left the ministry. Yet from these ashes God used things for His own glory.
I know there are some who will say this can't be because curses are ineffective against Christians because we have the armor of God on, etc. This is true in part and also incredibly naive. If you have a sin issue that is not resolved with God, your godly armor will have gaps even holes to allow the arrows of our enemy slid in.
I know of a church that a young pastor (who was my father), accepted a call in a small town. With in this church was a core group of occultists. They cursed the pastor, his marriage and his children. With in a short period of time, his marriage started to fall apart and eventually got a divorce. After the divorce he left the ministry. Yet from these ashes God used things for His own glory.
I know there are some who will say this can't be because curses are ineffective against Christians because we have the armor of God on, etc. This is true in part and also incredibly naive. If you have a sin issue that is not resolved with God, your godly armor will have gaps even holes to allow the arrows of our enemy slid in.
D
I do not attend a formal church. I searched high and low for a church and asked God to show me the right one He wants me to attend. In the end, God did not want me to attend any of them. Instead I maintain daily or weekly contact with a group of core Christians.
I believe it is dangerous to attend a church with less than godly leadership...and there are many of these types of churches. My sister was on the board of elders at large contemporary church. The pastor who founded it was stepping down and a new man voted in. They chose the youth pastor to become the senior pastor.
God told me and a prayer partner to expose the sin in the church. Two weeks later and just before he was to be the senior pastor, a woman, the worship leader, came forward and said she was sexually involved with the youth pastor. Then another woman came forward, a married woman, and said she was having an adulterous affair with him as well. He was forced to resign. What a pity. He was well liked and knew how to deliver a good sermon.
Then the elders found a replacement and he was confirmed as pastor. This man had a demonic issue with the spirit of Jezebel. He told the elders that they are not going to tell him what to do. He started to hire and fire with out the knowledge or consent of the elders. My sister quickly resigned and for 3 days after she felt the peace of Christ around her. Today that church is losing members, loosing tithes and gaining debt.
I believe it is dangerous to attend a church with less than godly leadership...and there are many of these types of churches. My sister was on the board of elders at large contemporary church. The pastor who founded it was stepping down and a new man voted in. They chose the youth pastor to become the senior pastor.
God told me and a prayer partner to expose the sin in the church. Two weeks later and just before he was to be the senior pastor, a woman, the worship leader, came forward and said she was sexually involved with the youth pastor. Then another woman came forward, a married woman, and said she was having an adulterous affair with him as well. He was forced to resign. What a pity. He was well liked and knew how to deliver a good sermon.
Then the elders found a replacement and he was confirmed as pastor. This man had a demonic issue with the spirit of Jezebel. He told the elders that they are not going to tell him what to do. He started to hire and fire with out the knowledge or consent of the elders. My sister quickly resigned and for 3 days after she felt the peace of Christ around her. Today that church is losing members, loosing tithes and gaining debt.
Only because you were putting so much stock into it and that message being of God as if God was building His kingdom on earth which was contrary to scripture.
You had exalted them by citing how they went on to greater ministries after the town got burned.... and yet you do not remember them at all?
Sometimes we carry things without ascertaining one way or another if we have truly fully discerned the matter. Like Martin Luther when he posted that thesis for a debate on the churc's door. He wasn't citing a conclusion on the matter, but wanting to discuss this to come to a fully discerned conclusion with other educated & trained believers in Christ like himself.
The problem here is that there was no debate or discussion on the matter. Believers lined up behind him as if those matters of cointentions were fully addressed with the assumption also that there were no other matters of faith that needs addressed.
Like using the term "sacrament" or "Eucharist" at all for believers to have communion in remembrance of Him so that they and their faith in Christ may be identified further away from the system of works known as catholicism in teh eyes of the world and not just in the eyes of other Catholics.
We all go through prunings including me. We are to bear more fruit when He does prune us.
I trust Jesus as my Good Shepherd to correct me from those things that do not testify of the Son in seeking the glory of the Son and by Him the glory of God the Father, because by His help, I am to be His disciple, and not a disciple of something else in His name in seeking the glory of anyone else, even the Spirit's.
All believers boast of how, for them & their house, they will serve the Son, Lord Jesus Christ, but that means not serving any other glory of a person, a church, or a movement in doing so because there is no other way to glorify God the Father.
We and the Spirit have to deacrese when bearing testimony of the Son so that He may increase. That is the Spirit's role and our role as we are led by the Spirit of God to do.
In any event, your broaching the topic of helping believers build his kingdom on earth. has Him enabling me in reaching this conclusion that He was not behind those six couples at all and so may He help you prune such endeavors to thinking on the things above by building the kingdom of God within us by His grace & by His help as the Son is the author & finisher of our faith.
You had exalted them by citing how they went on to greater ministries after the town got burned.... and yet you do not remember them at all?
Sometimes we carry things without ascertaining one way or another if we have truly fully discerned the matter. Like Martin Luther when he posted that thesis for a debate on the churc's door. He wasn't citing a conclusion on the matter, but wanting to discuss this to come to a fully discerned conclusion with other educated & trained believers in Christ like himself.
The problem here is that there was no debate or discussion on the matter. Believers lined up behind him as if those matters of cointentions were fully addressed with the assumption also that there were no other matters of faith that needs addressed.
Like using the term "sacrament" or "Eucharist" at all for believers to have communion in remembrance of Him so that they and their faith in Christ may be identified further away from the system of works known as catholicism in teh eyes of the world and not just in the eyes of other Catholics.
We all go through prunings including me. We are to bear more fruit when He does prune us.
I trust Jesus as my Good Shepherd to correct me from those things that do not testify of the Son in seeking the glory of the Son and by Him the glory of God the Father, because by His help, I am to be His disciple, and not a disciple of something else in His name in seeking the glory of anyone else, even the Spirit's.
All believers boast of how, for them & their house, they will serve the Son, Lord Jesus Christ, but that means not serving any other glory of a person, a church, or a movement in doing so because there is no other way to glorify God the Father.
We and the Spirit have to deacrese when bearing testimony of the Son so that He may increase. That is the Spirit's role and our role as we are led by the Spirit of God to do.
In any event, your broaching the topic of helping believers build his kingdom on earth. has Him enabling me in reaching this conclusion that He was not behind those six couples at all and so may He help you prune such endeavors to thinking on the things above by building the kingdom of God within us by His grace & by His help as the Son is the author & finisher of our faith.
One can give the benefit of the doubt that they had actually believed that, because they only considered it as when applied to giving to a church as a way of giving to God, but by kicking you out, you could have shown your sincerity on the matter by showing how if they had kicked you out on the basis for misrepresenting Him, then how do they know that the church is not misrepresenting Him when people that do give, do not get ten fold back in return? Just as they had kicked you out, who is to say that God will not do the same when He comes to judge His House first at the pre tribulational rapture event?
Course, I say that not for you to seek their destruction for saying so, but as they judge, they should consider that they will be judged in return so that they may stop misrepresenting Him also and speak of truly relying on God to provide for their ministry by seeking Him to raise up cheerful givers and not use covetousness as a means to tempt people to gamble to give.
Charity is that which seeks nothing in return nor seeking one's own gain.
1 Corinthians 13;[SUP]4 [/SUP]Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, [SUP]5[/SUP]Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; [SUP]6 [/SUP]Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; [SUP]7 [/SUP]Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
God in no way would mimick covetousness of which some believers err by gambling for more money. That is hardly being content with what things we have and certainly leading to rejoicing in iniquity if fortune did fall by gambling away money or in that case of your quote: giving away money in the hopes of getting more money.
If God worked out such a system like that, then what does God have need of money for anyone to give to Him when He is able to provide ten fold more in return for doing so? That would be rewarding the mentality and spirit of gambling and covetousness when godliness with contentment is great gain.
Course, I say that not for you to seek their destruction for saying so, but as they judge, they should consider that they will be judged in return so that they may stop misrepresenting Him also and speak of truly relying on God to provide for their ministry by seeking Him to raise up cheerful givers and not use covetousness as a means to tempt people to gamble to give.
Charity is that which seeks nothing in return nor seeking one's own gain.
1 Corinthians 13;[SUP]4 [/SUP]Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, [SUP]5[/SUP]Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; [SUP]6 [/SUP]Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; [SUP]7 [/SUP]Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
God in no way would mimick covetousness of which some believers err by gambling for more money. That is hardly being content with what things we have and certainly leading to rejoicing in iniquity if fortune did fall by gambling away money or in that case of your quote: giving away money in the hopes of getting more money.
If God worked out such a system like that, then what does God have need of money for anyone to give to Him when He is able to provide ten fold more in return for doing so? That would be rewarding the mentality and spirit of gambling and covetousness when godliness with contentment is great gain.
Trusting Jesus Christ as our Good Shepherd to help us continue in His words to be His disciples in serving Him by testifying of the Son in seeking His glory is pretty much the call of any believer in hearing Him in running that race.
He had no business having fellowship with unrepentant occultists. They should have been excommunicated.
That would be validating that your father had sin in his life that caused the effectiveness of these occultists to curse which if it wasn't for not excommunicating the occultists from the assembly, then this might be the reason below....
1 Timothy 3:1This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work. [SUP]2 [/SUP]A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach; [SUP]3 [/SUP]Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous; [SUP]4 [/SUP]One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity; [SUP]5 [/SUP](For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?) [SUP]6 [/SUP]Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil. [SUP]7 [/SUP]Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
Now this was addressed for an elder in the church, but I cannot help but see this as applying to a "young pastor" as well.
Not that no young believer cannot serve Him.
1 Timothy 4:[SUP]12 [/SUP]Let no man despise thy youth; but be thou an example of the believers, in word, in conversation, in charity, in spirit, in faith, in purity. [SUP]13 [/SUP]Till I come, give attendance to reading, to exhortation, to doctrine.
But if he was not solid in the word at that time, I would consider that as being a novice.
Matthew 13:[SUP]20 [/SUP]But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it; [SUP]21 [/SUP]Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
Truly, that can and is happening to alot of young believers in Christ not rooted in the word in being His disciples.
I do not know the whole story, but only on what has been shared and so I can only "guess" as to why your father had fallen by what has been provided by the scripture why one would fall away, but I am glad to see that the Lord has matured him back into abiding in Him again, or so I hope by what report you have shared anyway .
He had no business having fellowship with unrepentant occultists. They should have been excommunicated.
That would be validating that your father had sin in his life that caused the effectiveness of these occultists to curse which if it wasn't for not excommunicating the occultists from the assembly, then this might be the reason below....
1 Timothy 3:1This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work. [SUP]2 [/SUP]A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach; [SUP]3 [/SUP]Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous; [SUP]4 [/SUP]One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity; [SUP]5 [/SUP](For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?) [SUP]6 [/SUP]Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil. [SUP]7 [/SUP]Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
Now this was addressed for an elder in the church, but I cannot help but see this as applying to a "young pastor" as well.
Not that no young believer cannot serve Him.
1 Timothy 4:[SUP]12 [/SUP]Let no man despise thy youth; but be thou an example of the believers, in word, in conversation, in charity, in spirit, in faith, in purity. [SUP]13 [/SUP]Till I come, give attendance to reading, to exhortation, to doctrine.
But if he was not solid in the word at that time, I would consider that as being a novice.
Matthew 13:[SUP]20 [/SUP]But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it; [SUP]21 [/SUP]Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
Truly, that can and is happening to alot of young believers in Christ not rooted in the word in being His disciples.
I do not know the whole story, but only on what has been shared and so I can only "guess" as to why your father had fallen by what has been provided by the scripture why one would fall away, but I am glad to see that the Lord has matured him back into abiding in Him again, or so I hope by what report you have shared anyway .
The cost of relying on a corrupted educational system run by man to dole our degrees to qualify a person to lead an assembly in a church that has set herself up to serve covetousness and inspiring hirelings that seek that position as a career or like a political office.
If a church is not producing disciples serving Christ, then they are producing attendees in serving the image of their church.
If a church is not producing disciples serving Christ, then they are producing attendees in serving the image of their church.
It's just a guess, but it sounds as though a certain group (unnamed) infiltrated the leadership of those two churches in order to bring a spiritual stronghold over the city. Once they capture positions on their boards, they basically run the church. No one makes waves about it because no one else knows how the church should be run. This isn't the first time I've heard of this. No one believes these groups actually do this, but I know better.