Where does Jesus Speak about the Millennium?

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Feb 7, 2015
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I do believe the Holy Spirit leads us. But where does he lead us? To God or to the future of humans? If we back up everything we believe by saying "the Holy Spirit has led me," I'd still be believing that speaking in tongues is proof of salvation.

Some things, in things about God, crept into my thinking, and now that I know I've been wrong before, I no longer accept anyone saying "the Holy Spirit led me," just because they think that's the end of the argument they couldn't produce on their own.
This is exactly the way I feel about the word, "discernment", that so many people throw around. I think 9% of Christians might possess a measure of it, but close to 85% claim (no, "swear") they have it, in spades........ when they probably wouldn't recognize "discernment" if it suck up and bit them on the rear end.
 
G

GaryA

Guest
This is exactly the way I feel about the word, "discernment", that so many people throw around. I think 9% of Christians might possess a measure of it, but close to 85% claim (no, "swear") they have it, in spades........ when they probably wouldn't recognize "discernment" if it suck up and bit them on the rear end.
Based on my "discernment", I have determined that you have lost an 'n'... :D
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
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I do believe the Holy Spirit leads us. But where does he lead us? To God or to the future of humans? If we back up everything we believe by saying "the Holy Spirit has led me," I'd still be believing that speaking in tongues is proof of salvation.

Some things, in things about God, crept into my thinking, and now that I know I've been wrong before, I no longer accept anyone saying "the Holy Spirit led me," just because they think that's the end of the argument they couldn't produce on their own.
What I have noticed is that those who feel threatened by concepts they do not understand or ideas that do not fit into their narrow mold of reasoning from the biblical text tend to immediately try to discredit the other person by either challenging academics, marginalizing their level of education, or attacking their level of intelligence, and then claiming that their own view is the correct one because the H.S has led them to this view, even when it stands diametrically opposed to the language of scripture. This is nothing but an attempt to assign credibility to ideas, theories, or concepts that scripture clearly will not support. Anyone who makes the claim that the H.S is directing them to accept something as truth that stands contrary to the the scriptures definition of language is simply lying in attempt to establish credibility for themselves by extending credit for their ideas to the H.S. A word of advise, don't blame what you believe on the H.S.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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My discernment was able to figure out what Willie was saying.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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Probably abducted by an M & M..
 

shrume

Senior Member
Jun 26, 2017
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It depends. Is that the beginning and the end of your beliefs?
Of course not. The topic is eschatology.

Because if that's it, unless the Lord saves you in the future, yes. That's what will happen.
The Lord saves people when they believe on Jesus Christ (Rom 10:9; Eph 1:13).

Or is it just one of many beliefs you have and this is just one of the smaller things? In which case, don't worry about it
It is one of the "smaller" things, and I am not worried about it at all.

because you aren't like Ahwatukee. That is the sum total of what he believes.
I don't believe you.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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Ezek 12:22 Son of man, what is that proverb that ye have in the land of Israel, saying, The days are prolonged, and every vision faileth?

Ezek 12:23 Tell them therefore, Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will make this proverb to cease, and they shall no more use it as a proverb in Israel; but say unto them, The days are at hand, and the effect of every vision.

These time draggers that claim "at hand" and "shortly come pass" in prophecy can mean 6 days, 2 hours or 2000 years are doing exactly what the people in the land of Israel were claiming in Ezekiel - "The days are prolonged"...
 

shrume

Senior Member
Jun 26, 2017
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I do believe the Holy Spirit leads us. But where does he lead us? To God or to the future of humans? If we back up everything we believe by saying "the Holy Spirit has led me," I'd still be believing that speaking in tongues is proof of salvation.

I still believe it. What happened to you that changed your mind?

Some things, in things about God, crept into my thinking, and now that I know I've been wrong before, I no longer accept anyone saying "the Holy Spirit led me," just because they think that's the end of the argument they couldn't produce on their own.
I agree with you here. People frequently use the excuse "the Holy Spirit led me" for beliefs they hold. Someone saying that does not mean that what they believe is true.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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I guess there's not much shrume for debate here is there.??

 

shrume

Senior Member
Jun 26, 2017
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Suggestion: How about reading Revelation without the assumption it was written for our future?
Because the book of Revelation was written late in the first century and concerns "the Lord's Day" (Rev 1:10).

Think about what was happening to the Christians of the first century. If your nation was being destroyed by Rome, after your own family shunned you, and everyone was out to kill you, exactly how important is a letter for people 2000 years later?

If that was for the future when I've already lost everything and I'm now hiding in fear for my life, I would give myself up and die. Why would I want to hear my descents face the same wrath far into the future too?
The persecutions Christians experienced in the first century, and the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD are not the topics of Revelation. Revelation primarily concerns Daniels 70th week and beyond.
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
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Because the book of Revelation was written late in the first century and concerns "the Lord's Day" (Rev 1:10).


The persecutions Christians experienced in the first century, and the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD are not the topics of Revelation. Revelation primarily concerns Daniels 70th week and beyond.
There is no reliable evidence to which you can point that indicates that Rev was written beyond AD 64.
 
Feb 7, 2015
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Because the book of Revelation was written late in the first century and concerns "the Lord's Day" (Rev 1:10).


The persecutions Christians experienced in the first century, and the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD are not the topics of Revelation. Revelation primarily concerns Daniels 70th week and beyond.
Boy, have you ever missed the whole point of the book.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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The persecutions Christians experienced in the first century, and the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD are not the topics of Revelation.
Of course it is, if you have identified the whore of Babylon as anything other than 1st century apostate Judah and it's temple leadership then your understanding of the book will be wrong.
 

shrume

Senior Member
Jun 26, 2017
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What I have noticed is that those who feel threatened by concepts they do not understand or ideas that do not fit into their narrow mold of reasoning from the biblical text tend to immediately try to discredit the other person by either challenging academics, marginalizing their level of education, or attacking their level of intelligence...

You mean like this?
Wow, what a jumble of confusion. Clearly you do not know the difference between pre-exilic prophesies, post-exilic prophesies, and Messianic prophesies; nor do you seem to know their meaning.
People hold different eschatological views because they believe the Bible supports their view. If everything was crystal clear, we would all believe the same thing.

At this point, I am firmly pre-mill, pre-trib.

and then claiming that their own view is the correct one because the H.S has led them to this view, even when it stands diametrically opposed to the language of scripture. This is nothing but an attempt to assign credibility to ideas, theories, or concepts that scripture clearly will not support. Anyone who makes the claim that the H.S is directing them to accept something as truth that stands contrary to the the scriptures definition of language is simply lying in attempt to establish credibility for themselves by extending credit for their ideas to the H.S. A word of advise, don't blame what you believe on the H.S.
Agree. Our beliefs should come from the Bible, and not contradict it.
 
Feb 7, 2015
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Of course it is, if you have identified the whore of Babylon as anything other than 1st century apostate Judah and it's temple leadership then your understanding of the book will be wrong.
I would say, even more specifically, possibly even the city of Jerusalem.
 

shrume

Senior Member
Jun 26, 2017
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oldhermit said:
There is no reliable evidence to which you can point that indicates that Rev was written beyond AD 64.
Willie said:
Boy, have you ever missed the whole point of the book.
locutus said:
Of course it is, if you have identified the whore of Babylon as anything other than 1st century apostate Judah and it's temple leadership then your understanding of the book will be wrong.
You guys hold a Preterist (or partial Preterist), a-millennial view of things, so it is understood that you do not agree. :)