Which laws are and are not valid?

[JaumeJ]

Does not the law of faith relate directly to Paul's teachng that faith establishes the law?

I have read in the Word that hople leads to faith, and of course our faith is in the Gospel of Jesus Christs.

Gospel means good news.

Paul goes on to teach of our being converted from children of disobedience to children of obedience..

Now having been made new by theHoly Spirit, we have teh law in our inward parts, on our hearts,.

This spiritual understanding, that is by the Holy Spirit witensses that teh law is holy and good when kept holy and applied lawfully.

The only application of the law I have learned is from the Teacher, and from His Example.

I no longer regard teh law is unchagenable, engraved in stone, no, It now is guided by faith and mercy, because Jesus teaches this.. He desires mercy, and not sacrifice, and He came to forgive, not to condemn.

This being the case we must observe the law as did He, with mercy and not requireing sacrifice, not that there is a ssacrifice for sin since Jesus Christ.. The curse of the law, and that curse includes many of the laws, is indeed dead on the Cross, Yet, all of the laws tha demonsstrate mercy and good behavior are quite active, for they have no curse. We are not to fear the law in this capacity, that is lawfully applied. We now have all the leeway and flexibility afforded by mercy.

If any here say they had the law as their tutor, then they do constantly refer to what the turor has taught them, just as does any professional who has been educatated by his professors. If you are a doctor, you must refer constantly to your education while keeping abreast of new developments in your field.

This is no different when dealing with acting in righteousness. How can we be righteous if we do not know the lessonns of the tutor with the corallary of our Lord, Jesus Christ? He has taught us how to use the law lawfully., and not as though it is immovable engravedin sstone. We refer to it from within all of the rest of our lives her in this age, while being perfected by our Father.

Those who claim the law "was" thier tutor while not knowing the first thing about how it is to be used lawfully in accordance with the teaching of the Master are deceiving themselves, and this is not good.

According to Jesus Christ, anyone teaching against the least of the laws will be lealst in heaven, and He teaches us how to obey and use the law, lawfully. Yes we live in grace, for sin no longer has power over us, but we do not sin deliberatley, for this is tramping the Blood of the Lamb. If it sounds complicate, it should not. Children understand this. How can we be children of obedience without know what to obey, and what we obey is now written within, confiremed by the Holy Spirit, and augmented by the teachings of our Lord ans Savior, Jesus Christ.

Faith in Christ is obedience to Him, not just lip service.

 

[just-me]

Reading through many of these latest comments, I can't help but think that folks need to revisit the "Law of Faith," and how it applies to the church today. Just saying

Thats' a good point.

"Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. Jesus' words in Matthew 23:23

 

[p_rehbein]

Does not the law of faith relate directly to Paul's teachng that faith establishes the law?

I have read in the Word that hople leads to faith, and of course our faith is in the Gospel of Jesus Christs.

Gospel means good news.

Paul goes on to teach of our being converted from children of disobedience to children of obedience..

Now having been made new by theHoly Spirit, we have teh law in our inward parts, on our hearts,.

This spiritual understanding, that is by the Holy Spirit witensses that teh law is holy and good when kept holy and applied lawfully.

.

Brother, I am currently working on a study of The Law of Faith, and it includes what the Apostle taught about it. When I'm fairly confident that I have properly represented it from Scripture and not conjecture, I will post it. Some may not be happy, many will probably not agree, but that's ok, it's just my study.

God bless.

 

[KohenMatt]

Hi there, I'll keep my question brief.

There are many laws in the Old Testament, how do we differentiate between the laws we follow, and those we do not?

i.e. Wearing Mixed Fibers etc.

Any answers from scripture will be very helpful,

Matthew.

All of the 613 should be kept physically and/or spiritually, according to Matthew 5 and 23.

 

[newlife7]

For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, “Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.” Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law, for “The righteous shall live by faith.” But the law is not of faith, rather “The one who does them shall live by them.” Galatians 3:10-13.

 

[newlife7]

Don't you guys see that the only way we can meet God's requirements is by living by the Spirit.

 

[JaumeJ]

Please finhd andshow us anywhere who here is saying we are saved by works of the law. No one here I know is making this claim.

 

[newlife7]

Keep in mind, the gospel was preached to Abraham. The gospel has always been known to those who were men of the Holy Spirit. Jesus is spoken of and prophesied throughout the Writings, the Prophets and the Torah. He fulfills all that is spoken of Him in His first advent.

Always remember, the first converts until after paul were taught from what you call the Old Testament.

Jesus being the Word, and He being God, gave us all of theWord. He being our Salvation and Teacher teaches us how to obey. I cannot say any other words than the law or the commandments of God ae what we are to obey after the pattern of Jesus Christ without those who still fear the law thinking this means being under the law.

Because of the grace given by Jesus Chrisst from the Cross, we no longer need to fear the curse of the law, for we do not need fear punishment and death for our transgression. This is not licese to sin, as taught through Paul quite clearly.

Again, as taught by Paul, the gift of our faith in Jesus Christ establishes teh law, but not th ecurse of it which has been destroyed.

The law is no longer engraved on stone, it is an intregal part of our new man. If you say the law was our tutor beforew we came to Jesus Chrisst, you are correct, but anyone who is learned of the lw knows teh law, and knowing Jesus Christ gives teh knowledge of using the law lawfully. We are not under the law for sin has not power over us now that we are renewed in Jesus Christ.

Does all of this mean we may disrespect our parents with impunity? Rob? Steal ? Lie? Covet all we see? Keep the garment we find of our enemy? Seek revenge? Move the landmarks of our neighbors? and so on and so on. If the law was your turor do you knowit well enough to make reference to it? If not, you never had the tutilege, and your claims to have had the tutor are vapour.

Knowing the law after coming to Christ does not take away our salvation, as long as we are aware sin no longer has any power over us, but saying you were convicted by the law before coming to Christ without having had it as your tutor is the worsst of falsehoods, fo rit is lying to onseelf.

Teaching aginst the law will not send anyone into the lake of fire, but it does diminish their stature in the Kingdom of God..

As for which laws we are to observe, if they do not hang on Love, and God is Love, they may be ignored. If they to no show mercy, they may be ignored. If they require a sacrifice for sin, of course they may be ignored for theere isbut ONE sacrifice for sin, our blessed Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. Thhik on this. You are no longer under the law, and breaking a law is not going to send you to hell, but we do not sin deliberately, and what is sin? It is breaking the law, or do you have a different adn new definition of sin?

Praise Jesus Christ, walkin in grace, and fear not the truth. god bless all in Jesus Christ, amen.

All I have been doing has been is trying to point out these two verses We know that the law is good if one uses it properly
understanding this, that the law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers, 1 Timothy 1:9
Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. Romans 3:19
And all I have been getting in return is name calling and and being accused of trying to get people to break the law. I'm sorry guys but for repeating scripture to help Matthew4Jesus I should have not been called a demon. When it says in 1 Timothy 1:8-9" that the law is good if one uses it properly, but know that the law is not laid down for the just" that is because the just live by faith.

 

[newlife7]

If no one sees anymore responses from me on this post it is because I got my point across. And all you people that responded to me with disagreements I want you to know that the only reason I responded back was to help anyone I can (including you) to understand scripture. Just because I believe scripture when it says that the law is not of faith and I do not have all 613 commandment memorized nor do I plan to, I know that I'm obeying every word of God when I love God with all my heart, and my neighbor as myself. That is Because scripture says The whole of the Law and the Prophets is summed up in these two Commandments."

 

[just-me]

All I have been doing has been is trying to point out these two verses We know that the law is good if one uses it properly
understanding this, that the law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers, 1 Timothy 1:9
Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. Romans 3:19
And all I have been getting in return is name calling and and being accused of trying to get people to break the law. I'm sorry guys but for repeating scripture to help Matthew4Jesus I should have not been called a demon. When it says in 1 Timothy 1:8-9" that the law is good if one uses it properly, but know that the law is not laid down for the just" that is because the just live by faith.

So is it your thoughts that if we revere the law as God's word, to assist in our understanding and growth by faith, that we become lawless and unjust, being forced to lose our faith?

The law was given because of transgression. So the sin came first and then through God's grace He gave the law so that sin could/can be identified.

It seems as if you are saying that the law is for the unsaved/lawless (which is true because it is a schoolmaster) but once we are saved, the law is seen as coming before the sin making the law's instructions an entity that causes us to sin because it's self works just to observe it after faith comes. The observance then puts us back "under the law." Is that it?

 

[just-me]

If no one sees anymore responses from me on this post it is because I got my point across. And all you people that responded to me with disagreements I want you to know that the only reason I responded back was to help anyone I can (including you) to understand scripture. Just because I believe scripture when it says that the law is not of faith and I do not have all 613 commandment memorized nor do I plan to, I know that I'm obeying every word of God when I love God with all my heart, and my neighbor as myself. That is Because scripture says The whole of the Law and the Prophets is summed up in these two Commandments."

How can the law not include faith? "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law." Romans 3:31

 

[BS]

All I have been doing has been is trying to point out these two verses We know that the law is good if one uses it properly
understanding this, that the law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers, 1 Timothy 1:9
Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. Romans 3:19
And all I have been getting in return is name calling and and being accused of trying to get people to break the law. I'm sorry guys but for repeating scripture to help Matthew4Jesus I should have not been called a demon. When it says in 1 Timothy 1:8-9" that the law is good if one uses it properly, but know that the law is not laid down for the just" that is because the just live by faith.

Brother, no one tells you are under the law. No one!
Think about the next: 1. One is saved at the particular moment of time - see you have pointed 2014
2. Between that moment and the end of your life on the earth there is a time to pass. So what you will do during that time - how you will live. That is the point - God has shown He is loving you. Now - will you live in sins? If no - then where you will know from what is the sin? What means to love God and love people? What the freedom is? Will you do on the street breaking the rules - driving drunk? It is the same- will you breaking the rules of God driving your own life like drunk - lying, killing, stealing etc.? No one of us has said that the salvation is coming because we are keeping the rules.

If you love a woman you will show it, do not you? - not only at the weekends for two hours... Or? If you love God, you will show it also. Not because it is a condition of your love, but because of love itself. He asked Abram to sacrifice his son. Do you think He has not known Abram is faithful? God gave salvation to Abram after he has shown he is going to do it - to fire his own son. Now by New T. you had received salvation without condition. He has sacrificed His son for you. What you would do for Him? I am begging you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God

 

[JaumeJ]

It seems you have not been reading all of the posts to which y9ou are trying to answr. Had you done so, you would see the same content you have posted here in my posts, and in the posts of others.

If you cannot comply with at least reading whe is posted before responding, I am going to find it needful not to take anything you post seriously. God bless you with patience and blessings other, amen.

All I have been doing has been is trying to point out these two verses We know that the law is good if one uses it properly
understanding this, that the law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers, 1 Timothy 1:9
Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. Romans 3:19
And all I have been getting in return is name calling and and being accused of trying to get people to break the law. I'm sorry guys but for repeating scripture to help Matthew4Jesus I should have not been called a demon. When it says in 1 Timothy 1:8-9" that the law is good if one uses it properly, but know that the law is not laid down for the just" that is because the just live by faith.

 

[KohenMatt]

For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, “Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.” Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law, for “The righteous shall live by faith.” But the law is not of faith, rather “The one who does them shall live by them.” Galatians 3:10-13.

Don't you guys see that the only way we can meet God's requirements is by living by the Spirit.

No no one is claiming we meet God's requirements for salvation by the Law.

Next.

 

[JesusLives]

this thread is sad

I agree with you here have a cookie.....

 

[Grandpa]

No no one is claiming we meet God's requirements for salvation by the Law.

Next.

All of the 613 should be kept physically and/or spiritually, according to Matthew 5 and 23.

So should be kept means just do it for fun?

If it is not needful for salvation what is it needful for?

 

[JesusIsAll]

So should be kept means just do it for fun?

If it is not needful for salvation what is it needful for?

You don't understand. Nobody is saying it's necessary, except for it being necessary. Seeing a lot of these subtle posts, I've wondered if the Lord didn't sent a great prophet in William Jefferson Clinton, because it appears a lot of theology around here depends upon what "is is."

 

[just-me]

So should be kept means just do it for fun?

If it is not needful for salvation what is it needful for?

Try it and see if you are enlightened more on the grandeur of God Almighty. It makes the panoramic view grow in perspective. Think about the comparison of Mount Sinai and Pentecost and how God 's foreknowledge caused all things to happen in perfect chronology for us, because of a proven love that we can comprehend by the intricacy of those things.

 

[JesusIsAll]

Matthew 23:24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

Matthew 22:37-40 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Galatians 5:13-14 For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another. For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

1 John 3:23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

Galatians 4:9-11 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage? Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years. I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

Colossians 2:16-17 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

Galatians 5:1-6 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross.

Galatians 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Romans 3:20-24 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: for all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

Romans 7:4-6 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God. For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death. But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

 

[just-me]

Matthew 23:24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

Matthew 22:37-40 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Galatians 5:13-14 For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another. For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

1 John 3:23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

Galatians 4:9-11 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage? Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years. I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

Colossians 2:16-17 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

Galatians 5:1-6 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross.

Galatians 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Romans 3:20-24 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: for all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

Romans 7:4-6 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God. For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death. But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

You forgot to mention these. "Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone." Matthew 23:23

"Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the Lord." Leviticus 19:18

"And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might." Deuteronomy 6:5

It's law. It's Torah.