WHO IS THIS NATURAL MAN OF WHOM YOU SPEAK?

[BaptistBibleBeliever]

But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Paul here is contrasting man’s / worldly wisdom over godly wisdom. Man’s wisdom elevates excellency of speech and enticing of words (v1, v4) whereas the godly wisdom does the opposite. It is demonstration of Spirit and of power. The natural man refers to those who have heard the preaching of the gospel but do not want to receive the truth. In other words the preaching of the words of God is an utter foolishness to him and for this reason he cannot recognize spiritual things.

The natural man refers to those who have heard the preaching of the gospel but do not want to receive the truth

"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness" (Romans 1:18).

the preaching of the words of God is an utter foolishness

"Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools" (Romans 1:21-22).[/quote]

 

[BaptistBibleBeliever]

It's wonderful that you came to Christ, by any route. There is a danger in thinking that because "I" came to Christ a certain way, that it is "the right way". We each have our own testimony; mine is very different from yours and no less valid. Some people are turned off by one kind of messenger (and therefore don't hear the message) but hear it clearly from a different person with a different approach.

I came to Christ in only one way as shown here . . .

"Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures" (I Corinthians 15:1-4).

Of course we all have different testimonies . . . we are not all produced from the same born-again products factory. The Word of God is still the Word of God and it will not return again void. It will accomplish what it is set forth to do. Whether that be to simply plant a seed for another to come along and water, or whether it is to result in a new birth. It's God's business.

This is the Millennial generation with kids clutching teddy bears and security blankets . . . I don't suppose they can handle much in the way of truth. I really don't hold out much hope for this group. Maybe you can reach them . . . who knows.

 

[1ofthem]

I came to Christ in only one way as shown here . . .

"Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures" (I Corinthians 15:1-4).

Of course we all have different testimonies . . . we are not all produced from the same born-again products factory. The Word of God is still the Word of God and it will not return again void. It will accomplish what it is set forth to do. Whether that be to simply plant a seed for another to come along and water, or whether it is to result in a new birth. It's God's business.

This is the Millennial generation with kids clutching teddy bears and security blankets . . . I don't suppose they can handle much in the way of truth. I really don't hold out much hope for this group. Maybe you can reach them . . . who knows.

And this is why it pays to wait on the Lord and say what he wants us too...not just shoot off the lip and say whatever we want and treat and deal with people however we want to...

Jude 1: 20-25
But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:

23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

 

[BaptistBibleBeliever]

"And of some have compassion, making a difference: And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh" (Jude 22-23).

Helps to read the passage before posting . . .

 

[1ofthem]

"And of some have compassion, making a difference: And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh" (Jude 22-23).

Helps to read the passage before posting . . .

Read it and posted it...So what's your point...

My point is, it is plainly saying you don't deal with everyone in the same way.

God knows the hearts and how to deal with everyone and if we get in our selves we ain't helping anyone...just saying...

 

[BaptistBibleBeliever]

So you deal with people in whatever way you believe the Lord approves; and I'll deal with people as I am led of the Lord. And we'll both give an account to the Lord for our efforts.

 

[1ofthem]

So you deal with people in whatever way you believe the Lord approves; and I'll deal with people as I am led of the Lord. And we'll both give an account to the Lord for our efforts.

Cool, but it might pay to take the Natural Man Glasses off when you read that scripture...just saying...

 

[Hevosmies]

Romans 1 describes the one that worships the creature rather than the creator- creatures are created, the world was created... what do you worship with your worldly music?

Finally. Someone who realizes that worldly music DOES NOT belong to any churches!
The contemporary christian trashmusic is not of God. Im sick and tired of many modern churches having s0domite looking boybands that sound like the backstreet boys. You guys know that song "refiner's fire... my onlyyy desireee" compare that to a backstreet boys song about fire and it sounds EXACTLY the same. One preacher did it (compared the two), its on youtube. I saw one apostate church had a dance-show with Britney Spears' song "circus" playing on the background. What an accurate description. One church played highway to hell by AC/DC in church.... Dont tell me the Lord isn't returning any time now

That kind of whispering/moaning to the microphone style would not be possible to do in the past. Only with modern equipment you can do it. In the past if you would sing like that nobody would hear it.
WE SING LOUD AND CLEAR, AMEN!? Not sensual and whispering.

 

[BaptistBibleBeliever]

We are in the Laodicean age and the church has rejected not only it's foundation, but also the Book. There is no longer any conviction of sin or desire to live holy, separated lives. The church has become the world.

"And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God; I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked: I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see. As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne. He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches" (Revelation 3:14-22).

Exciting times to be alive if you know the truth are are anticipating that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ - Titus 2:13.

 

[1ofthem]

We are in the Laodicean age and the church has rejected not only it's foundation, but also the Book. There is no longer any conviction of sin or desire to live holy, separated lives. The church has become the world.

"And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God; I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked: I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see. As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne. He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches" (Revelation 3:14-22).

Exciting times to be alive if you know the truth are are anticipating that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ - Titus 2:13.

I do not disagree, but what I am saying is simple...We had better wait on the Lord for all things and do what he says to do. We better have a spiritual ear to hear and not get in ourselves or the Natural Man...or we will definitely mess up.

Romans 12

6. Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;

7 Or ministry, let us wait on our ministering: or he that teacheth, on teaching;

8 Or he that exhorteth, on exhortation: he that giveth, let him do it with simplicity; he that ruleth, with diligence; he that sheweth mercy, with cheerfulness.

9 Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.

10 Be kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love; in honour preferring one another;

11 Not slothful in business; fervent in spirit; serving the Lord;

 

[1ofthem]

So yeah, have compassion on some and save others with fear. This isn't an I'll do it my way you do it your way thing....This is we better be listening to the Lord and doing it his way thing. Whether it is with fear or compassion, depends on the person and like I said before the Lord knows the heart so we better wait on him before just shooting off the Lip. That's my thoughts on it, anyhow.

 

[1ofthem]

And as far as the Natural Man goes...I do not believe Paul was speaking about reprobates there. We all can mess up and get in the Natural Man (our own self).

The Natural man is just the flesh, not a reprobate. We are instructed to walk in the Spirit...when we step out and let the flesh take over then we are walking in the Natural Man (flesh)… Doesn't mean God has turned his back on us and there is no hope, but it does mean we need to pray and ask God to help us to get back in the Spirit, and not the flesh.

 

[trofimus]

It would be good to define the difference between "psychikos" ("animal, soulish") in the OP and "sarkikos" that means "fleshy".

Also between natural and worldly. I think many people (also here) use all these terms as synonyms.

 

[1ofthem]

That would probably be a good place to start. I, for one, am not drawing much difference between the two words. In my opinion, the flesh is animal"ish". It's all about it's self...wants what it wants, and doesn't want to listen to or follow anything else.

As for soulish to be honest, I really don't know what that means. I looked it up and found an article on it and here are some other verses that use it.

“But the natural [psuchikos, soulish] man receives not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.”

• 1 Corinthians 2:14​

“It [the body] is sown a natural [psuchikos, soulish] body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural [psuchikos, soulish] body, and there is a spiritual body. And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul [psuche, soul]; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit [pneuma, spirit]. Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural [psuchikos, soulish]; and afterward that which is spiritual.”

• 1 Corinthians 15:44–46​

“Who is a wise man and endued with knowledge among you? let him show out of a good conversation his works with meekness of wisdom. But if you have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth. This wisdom descends not from above, but is earthly, sensual [psuchikos, soulish], devilish.”

• James 3:13–15​

 

[LPT]

I apologize to anyone that I may have offended.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

The natural man is he whom God has rejected . . . given up on him.

Excellent post but the part I underlined didn’t sound true to me,weren’t we all natural men before salvation.

I thought adam walked away from GOD but GOD did not walk away from the natural man.

 

[Dino246]

Finally. Someone who realizes that worldly music DOES NOT belong to any churches!
The contemporary christian trashmusic is not of God. Im sick and tired of many modern churches having s0domite looking boybands that sound like the backstreet boys. You guys know that song "refiner's fire... my onlyyy desireee" compare that to a backstreet boys song about fire and it sounds EXACTLY the same. One preacher did it (compared the two), its on youtube. I saw one apostate church had a dance-show with Britney Spears' song "circus" playing on the background. What an accurate description. One church played highway to hell by AC/DC in church.... Dont tell me the Lord isn't returning any time now

That kind of whispering/moaning to the microphone style would not be possible to do in the past. Only with modern equipment you can do it. In the past if you would sing like that nobody would hear it.
WE SING LOUD AND CLEAR, AMEN!? Not sensual and whispering.

While I can see your point about sensuality, your post reminds me of something I read a decade or so back... some all-knowing wisdom-dispensing preacher was declaring with all sincerity that the music God enjoys is quiet, slow-paced and gentle (or something like that). It's interesting how the music "I" enjoy becomes the music "God approves".

 

[Nehemiah6]

...weren’t we all natural men before salvation.

Exactly. But according to the OP God rejected everyone -- "given up on him". ABSURD!

 

[LPT]

Finally. Someone who realizes that worldly music DOES NOT belong to any churches!
The contemporary christian trashmusic is not of God. Im sick and tired of many modern churches having s0domite looking boybands that sound like the backstreet boys. You guys know that song "refiner's fire... my onlyyy desireee" compare that to a backstreet boys song about fire and it sounds EXACTLY the same. One preacher did it (compared the two), its on youtube. I saw one apostate church had a dance-show with Britney Spears' song "circus" playing on the background. What an accurate description. One church played highway to hell by AC/DC in church.... Dont tell me the Lord isn't returning any time now

That kind of whispering/moaning to the microphone style would not be possible to do in the past. Only with modern equipment you can do it. In the past if you would sing like that nobody would hear it.
WE SING LOUD AND CLEAR, AMEN!? Not sensual and whispering.

 

[LPT]