Who Justifieth the Ungodly
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... no they're not ... that's just you spouting your erroneous dogma rather than take the time to ferret out what does God mean ... cuz you're a shameful workman who does not rightly divide the word of truth:2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
Again, that God worked out the redemption of mankind in eternity past does not negate the fact that faith on the part of mankind (whosoever believeth) is the means through which God imputes righteousness:
Romans 4:
20 He [Abraham] staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;
21 And being fully persuaded that, what he [God] had promised, he [God] was able also to perform.
22 And therefore it was imputed to him [Abraham] for righteousness.
23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him;
24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;
25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.
5:1 Therefore, being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ
.
... I deny your erroneous dogma ... you incessantly rip verses from the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed them in your futile attempt to support your erroneous dogma ... Exegesis and eisegesis are two conflicting approaches in Bible study. Exegesis is the exposition or explanation of a text based on a careful, objective analysis. The word exegesis literally means “to lead out of.” That means that the interpreter is led to his conclusions by following the text.
The opposite approach to Scripture is eisegesis, which is the interpretation of a passage based on a subjective, non-analytical reading. The word eisegesis literally means “to lead into,” which means the interpreter injects his own ideas into the text, making it mean whatever he wants.
Obviously, only exegesis does justice to the text. Eisegesis is a mishandling of the text and often leads to a misinterpretation. Exegesis is concerned with discovering the true meaning of the text, respecting its grammar, syntax, and setting. Eisegesis is concerned only with making a point, even at the expense of the meaning of words.
Ephesians 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive
.
... I deny your erroneous dogma ... you incessantly rip verses from the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed them in your futile attempt to support your erroneous dogma ... Exegesis and eisegesis are two conflicting approaches in Bible study. Exegesis is the exposition or explanation of a text based on a careful, objective analysis. The word exegesis literally means “to lead out of.” That means that the interpreter is led to his conclusions by following the text.
The opposite approach to Scripture is eisegesis, which is the interpretation of a passage based on a subjective, non-analytical reading. The word eisegesis literally means “to lead into,” which means the interpreter injects his own ideas into the text, making it mean whatever he wants.
Obviously, only exegesis does justice to the text. Eisegesis is a mishandling of the text and often leads to a misinterpretation. Exegesis is concerned with discovering the true meaning of the text, respecting its grammar, syntax, and setting. Eisegesis is concerned only with making a point, even at the expense of the meaning of words.
Ephesians 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive
.
... I deny your erroneous dogma ... you incessantly rip verses from the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed them in your futile attempt to support your erroneous dogma ... Exegesis and eisegesis are two conflicting approaches in Bible study. Exegesis is the exposition or explanation of a text based on a careful, objective analysis. The word exegesis literally means “to lead out of.” That means that the interpreter is led to his conclusions by following the text.
The opposite approach to Scripture is eisegesis, which is the interpretation of a passage based on a subjective, non-analytical reading. The word eisegesis literally means “to lead into,” which means the interpreter injects his own ideas into the text, making it mean whatever he wants.
Obviously, only exegesis does justice to the text. Eisegesis is a mishandling of the text and often leads to a misinterpretation. Exegesis is concerned with discovering the true meaning of the text, respecting its grammar, syntax, and setting. Eisegesis is concerned only with making a point, even at the expense of the meaning of words.
Ephesians 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive
.
... I deny your erroneous dogma ... you incessantly rip verses from the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed them in your futile attempt to support your erroneous dogma ... Exegesis and eisegesis are two conflicting approaches in Bible study. Exegesis is the exposition or explanation of a text based on a careful, objective analysis. The word exegesis literally means “to lead out of.” That means that the interpreter is led to his conclusions by following the text.
The opposite approach to Scripture is eisegesis, which is the interpretation of a passage based on a subjective, non-analytical reading. The word eisegesis literally means “to lead into,” which means the interpreter injects his own ideas into the text, making it mean whatever he wants.
Obviously, only exegesis does justice to the text. Eisegesis is a mishandling of the text and often leads to a misinterpretation. Exegesis is concerned with discovering the true meaning of the text, respecting its grammar, syntax, and setting. Eisegesis is concerned only with making a point, even at the expense of the meaning of words.
Ephesians 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive
.
1 John/Yahanan 1:8-10, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us."
This is all Jesus:
John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."
John 5:28-30, “Do not marvel at this, because the hour is coming in which all those in the tombs shall hear His voice, and shall come forth – those who have done* righteousness, to the resurrection of life, and those who have practiced* evil matters, to a resurrection of judgment. Of Myself I am unable to do any matter. As I hear, I judge, and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own desire, but the desire of the Father who sent Me.”
Revelation 14:12-13, “Here is the endurance of the set-apart ones, here are those guarding the commands of יהוה and the belief of יהושע. And I heard a voice out of the heaven saying to me, Write, Blessed are the dead who die in the Master from now on. Yes, says the Spirit, in order that they rest from their labors, and their works follow with them.”
This is all Jesus:
John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."
John 5:28-30, “Do not marvel at this, because the hour is coming in which all those in the tombs shall hear His voice, and shall come forth – those who have done* righteousness, to the resurrection of life, and those who have practiced* evil matters, to a resurrection of judgment. Of Myself I am unable to do any matter. As I hear, I judge, and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own desire, but the desire of the Father who sent Me.”
Revelation 14:12-13, “Here is the endurance of the set-apart ones, here are those guarding the commands of יהוה and the belief of יהושע. And I heard a voice out of the heaven saying to me, Write, Blessed are the dead who die in the Master from now on. Yes, says the Spirit, in order that they rest from their labors, and their works follow with them.”
Justified by His Grace!
Do men Christ died for have to believe in Jesus in order to get Justified? The answer is absolutely No! They were Justified freely by His Grace, through the Redemption that is in Christ Jesus Rom 3:24
Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
Do men Christ died for have to believe in Jesus in order to get Justified? The answer is absolutely No! They were Justified freely by His Grace, through the Redemption that is in Christ Jesus Rom 3:24
Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
Hi post 3870 did you understand it ? Care to discuss it ?
https://christianchat.com/bible-dis...ieth-the-ungodly.201619/page-194#post-5135770
https://christianchat.com/bible-dis...ieth-the-ungodly.201619/page-194#post-5135770
Of course. I do ask thet if ou disagree and reply that you discuss everything I post and not isolate certian parts. So 100% it is the Creator YHWH who justifies one or not, one can not claim they are themselves and YHWH suddenly stands down, or if one claims they will be forgiven for their sins or not is up to YHWH, not man. Also all need forgiveness because all have sinned, and there is nothing we can do to earn forgiveness. Earn means to righty obtain, yet there are pre-requsites to obtain, that does not mean earn, it is a mercy that is unmerited.
I see you have isolated some of Paul's writings, ignored the rest of the word and built a doctrine off of that. Everything must be established in the mouth of 2 or more witnesses and understood in unity especially with Yahshua's words, YHWH and Yahshua says His words are Spirit and life and singled out as:
Acts 3:19-23, “Repent therefore and turn back, for the blotting out of your sins, in order that times of refreshing might come from the presence of the Master, and that He sends יהושע Messiah, pre-appointed for you, whom heaven needs to receive until the times of restoration of all matters, of which the Mighty One spoke through the mouth of all His set-apart prophets since of old. For Mosheh truly said to the fathers, ‘יהוה your Mighty One shall raise up for you a Prophet like me from your brothers. Him you shall hear according to all matters, whatever He says to you. And it shall be that every being who does not hear that Prophet shall be utterly destroyed from among the people.” (quote from Deut 18:18-19)
In the same way Paul also has a unique comment about him:
2 Peter 3:15-17, “15 And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, 16 as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. 17 You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability.“
So the Word says
Messiah,.....Him you shall hear according to all matters, whatever He says to you
Paul also wrote, .....knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless
Now to the subject YHWH does not lie:
Exodus 23:7, “Keep thee far from a false matter; and the innocent and righteous slay thou not: for I will not justify the wicked.”
Yet how is this? Because repentance. To recieve mercy one must repent. Not earn, recieve.
Acts 2:38-39, “And Kĕpha said to them, “Repent, and let each one of you be immersed in the Name of יהושע Messiah for the forgiveness of sins. And you shall receive the gift of the Set-apart Spirit. “For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are far off, as many as יהוה our Elohim shall call.”
James 2:26, "For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so the faith without works is dead also."
Luke 13:3-5, “I say to you, no! But unless you repent you shall all perish in the same way. Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Shiloaḥ fell and killed them, do you think that they were greater offenders than all other men who dwelt in Yerushalayim? I say to you, no! But unless you repent you shall all perish in the same way.”
Mat 4:17, "From that time יהושע began to proclaim and to say, “Repent, for the reign of the heavens has drawn near.”
Acts 3:19-23, “Repent... He sends יהושע Messiah, pre-appointed...Him you shall hear according to all matters, whatever He says to you"
1 John/Yahanan 3:7, "Little children, let no man deceive you; he who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous."
1 John/Yahanan 5:17, "All unrighteousness is sin, and there is a sin not unto death."
1 John/Yahanan3:4, "Whoever commits sin, transgresses also the Law; for sin is the transgression of the Law."
John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."
James 1:12, “Blessed is the man who does endure trial, for when he has been proved, he shall receive the crown of life which the Master has promised to those who love Him.”
Hebrews 11:6, “But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to Yah has to believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who earnestly seek Him.”
Hebrews 5:9, “And having been perfected, He became the Causer of everlasting salvation to all those obeying Him.”
To sum it up, all have sinned and need mercy, no one can earn that mercy, it is unmerited mercy, yet it does have per-requisite, faith and repentance. A faith without repentance is impossible, humans can fool each other but none can fool YHWH. When Yahshua says " all who are in their graves will hear his voice and will come out—those who have done what is good to the resurrection of life, and those who have practiced what is evil to the resurrection of condemnation" I believe Him, He is not a liar, if anyone thinks that is incorrect it usually comes from 1 of two things 1 - not considering all of Scripture in forming doctrine and/or 2 - isolating something Paul said and rejecting everything else. One last note, when Yahshua says "those who have done what is good to the resurrection of life" they have repented in faith and thus have obtained unmerited mercy.
Jeremiah 17:10, “I, יהוה, search the heart, I try the kidneys, and give every man according to his ways, according to the fruit of his deeds.”
SO when Yahshua says this I believe Him, I don;t call the Son of YHWH a liar or disagree with Him. Also I know His words are forever.
Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”
John 5:28-30, “Don't be amazed at this, because the hour is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice and will come out—those who have done what is good to the resurrection of life, and those who have practiced what is evil to the resurrection of condemnation. I can do nothing on my own accord. As I hear, I judge, and my judgment is just, because I do not seek my own will but the will of the one who sent me.”
I see you have isolated some of Paul's writings, ignored the rest of the word and built a doctrine off of that. Everything must be established in the mouth of 2 or more witnesses and understood in unity especially with Yahshua's words, YHWH and Yahshua says His words are Spirit and life and singled out as:
Acts 3:19-23, “Repent therefore and turn back, for the blotting out of your sins, in order that times of refreshing might come from the presence of the Master, and that He sends יהושע Messiah, pre-appointed for you, whom heaven needs to receive until the times of restoration of all matters, of which the Mighty One spoke through the mouth of all His set-apart prophets since of old. For Mosheh truly said to the fathers, ‘יהוה your Mighty One shall raise up for you a Prophet like me from your brothers. Him you shall hear according to all matters, whatever He says to you. And it shall be that every being who does not hear that Prophet shall be utterly destroyed from among the people.” (quote from Deut 18:18-19)
In the same way Paul also has a unique comment about him:
2 Peter 3:15-17, “15 And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, 16 as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. 17 You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability.“
So the Word says
Messiah,.....Him you shall hear according to all matters, whatever He says to you
Paul also wrote, .....knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless
Now to the subject YHWH does not lie:
Exodus 23:7, “Keep thee far from a false matter; and the innocent and righteous slay thou not: for I will not justify the wicked.”
Yet how is this? Because repentance. To recieve mercy one must repent. Not earn, recieve.
Acts 2:38-39, “And Kĕpha said to them, “Repent, and let each one of you be immersed in the Name of יהושע Messiah for the forgiveness of sins. And you shall receive the gift of the Set-apart Spirit. “For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are far off, as many as יהוה our Elohim shall call.”
James 2:26, "For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so the faith without works is dead also."
Luke 13:3-5, “I say to you, no! But unless you repent you shall all perish in the same way. Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Shiloaḥ fell and killed them, do you think that they were greater offenders than all other men who dwelt in Yerushalayim? I say to you, no! But unless you repent you shall all perish in the same way.”
Mat 4:17, "From that time יהושע began to proclaim and to say, “Repent, for the reign of the heavens has drawn near.”
Acts 3:19-23, “Repent... He sends יהושע Messiah, pre-appointed...Him you shall hear according to all matters, whatever He says to you"
1 John/Yahanan 3:7, "Little children, let no man deceive you; he who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous."
1 John/Yahanan 5:17, "All unrighteousness is sin, and there is a sin not unto death."
1 John/Yahanan3:4, "Whoever commits sin, transgresses also the Law; for sin is the transgression of the Law."
John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."
James 1:12, “Blessed is the man who does endure trial, for when he has been proved, he shall receive the crown of life which the Master has promised to those who love Him.”
Hebrews 11:6, “But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to Yah has to believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who earnestly seek Him.”
Hebrews 5:9, “And having been perfected, He became the Causer of everlasting salvation to all those obeying Him.”
To sum it up, all have sinned and need mercy, no one can earn that mercy, it is unmerited mercy, yet it does have per-requisite, faith and repentance. A faith without repentance is impossible, humans can fool each other but none can fool YHWH. When Yahshua says " all who are in their graves will hear his voice and will come out—those who have done what is good to the resurrection of life, and those who have practiced what is evil to the resurrection of condemnation" I believe Him, He is not a liar, if anyone thinks that is incorrect it usually comes from 1 of two things 1 - not considering all of Scripture in forming doctrine and/or 2 - isolating something Paul said and rejecting everything else. One last note, when Yahshua says "those who have done what is good to the resurrection of life" they have repented in faith and thus have obtained unmerited mercy.
Jeremiah 17:10, “I, יהוה, search the heart, I try the kidneys, and give every man according to his ways, according to the fruit of his deeds.”
SO when Yahshua says this I believe Him, I don;t call the Son of YHWH a liar or disagree with Him. Also I know His words are forever.
Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”
John 5:28-30, “Don't be amazed at this, because the hour is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice and will come out—those who have done what is good to the resurrection of life, and those who have practiced what is evil to the resurrection of condemnation. I can do nothing on my own accord. As I hear, I judge, and my judgment is just, because I do not seek my own will but the will of the one who sent me.”
I agree with that, howeer it does not make void the rest of the Scriptures.
1 John/Yahanan 2:6, "He who says he abides in Him, is himself also obligated to walk as He walked."
1 John 3:24, “And the one guarding His commands stays in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He stays in us, by the Spirit which He gave us.”
Being in Him we can do His will;
John/Yahanan 15:5-16, "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, produces much fruit; but without Me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away like a branch, and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. If you abide in Me, and letting My words; abide in you, you will ask what you will, and it will be done for you. In this is My Father glorified: when you produce much fruit; and in this way you become My disciples. Just as the Father has loved Me, so have I loved you; continue in My love. If you keep My Commands, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's Commands, and abide in His love. These things I have spoken to you, that My joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be complete. This is My Command: Love one another as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this: that one would lay down his life on behalf of his brothers. You are My brothers, if you do whatever I command you."
1 John/Yahanan 2:6, "He who says he abides in Him, is himself also obligated to walk as He walked."
1 John 3:24, “And the one guarding His commands stays in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He stays in us, by the Spirit which He gave us.”
Being in Him we can do His will;
John/Yahanan 15:5-16, "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, produces much fruit; but without Me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away like a branch, and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. If you abide in Me, and letting My words; abide in you, you will ask what you will, and it will be done for you. In this is My Father glorified: when you produce much fruit; and in this way you become My disciples. Just as the Father has loved Me, so have I loved you; continue in My love. If you keep My Commands, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's Commands, and abide in His love. These things I have spoken to you, that My joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be complete. This is My Command: Love one another as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this: that one would lay down his life on behalf of his brothers. You are My brothers, if you do whatever I command you."
Exodus 23:7,from a false matter thou dost keep far off, and an innocent and righteous man thou dost not slay; for I do not justify a wicked man."
John/Yahanan 15:5-16, "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, produces much fruit; but without Me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away like a branch, and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned."
John/Yahanan 15:5-16, "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, produces much fruit; but without Me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away like a branch, and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned."