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B
To do with the issue of whether God commanded Israel - and specific people - to kill?
You'll notice, anyone God wanted killed, any group of people God said to destroy, were people who were against His people or against His Word. He has a written Word, He also has a spoken Word. The spoken Word became the written. God is a God of love... but He is also a God of judgment, as He has shown in the OT.
When you say things like "God commanded people to kill." ... Yes He did. For very specific reasons. Why? Because He is God and He can. David is just one instance of where God allowed the enemy of His people - who were mocking and oppressing them - to be killed. The Pharaoh and his army had surrounded God's people and ... God destroyed them. So many instances where it says it.
Jesus Christ, on the other hand, showed mercy and grace when men's hearts were stony and wanted the law to be followed. So who is right? God or Jesus? Understand that all the attributes of God, to be a Saviour, Healer, Comforter, etc etc all had to be expressed somehow. And men and women will not appreciate the good (which is a very weak word to use here) attributes of God unless the negative was experienced. God gave the law to show man cannot fulfill it, and because of the hardness of men's hearts. Jesus Christ came to show grace, and that it isn't anything man can do that saves him, but simply the blood of Jesus. It is all about God. It is all about Him expressing His love to His people. In doing so, He does what He likes.
God and Jesus do not contradict each other. To me, God is Love. But He is a God of judgement and He may be allowing things to play out now - but His written Word shows what He has promised will happen to His enemies.
And also, Cain is the first one to commit murder. Coincidentally, he didn't want to follow God's instructions of sacrificing like Abel did and got jealous that God accepted Abel's offering and not his own. In his anger, he slew. But he was against God.
Anyway, thats my two cents worth
You'll notice, anyone God wanted killed, any group of people God said to destroy, were people who were against His people or against His Word. He has a written Word, He also has a spoken Word. The spoken Word became the written. God is a God of love... but He is also a God of judgment, as He has shown in the OT.
When you say things like "God commanded people to kill." ... Yes He did. For very specific reasons. Why? Because He is God and He can. David is just one instance of where God allowed the enemy of His people - who were mocking and oppressing them - to be killed. The Pharaoh and his army had surrounded God's people and ... God destroyed them. So many instances where it says it.
Jesus Christ, on the other hand, showed mercy and grace when men's hearts were stony and wanted the law to be followed. So who is right? God or Jesus? Understand that all the attributes of God, to be a Saviour, Healer, Comforter, etc etc all had to be expressed somehow. And men and women will not appreciate the good (which is a very weak word to use here) attributes of God unless the negative was experienced. God gave the law to show man cannot fulfill it, and because of the hardness of men's hearts. Jesus Christ came to show grace, and that it isn't anything man can do that saves him, but simply the blood of Jesus. It is all about God. It is all about Him expressing His love to His people. In doing so, He does what He likes.
God and Jesus do not contradict each other. To me, God is Love. But He is a God of judgement and He may be allowing things to play out now - but His written Word shows what He has promised will happen to His enemies.
And also, Cain is the first one to commit murder. Coincidentally, he didn't want to follow God's instructions of sacrificing like Abel did and got jealous that God accepted Abel's offering and not his own. In his anger, he slew. But he was against God.
Anyway, thats my two cents worth
I
Certainly, but "throw rocks at them until they die" has a certain timeless quality to it. For example, how does your interpretation of stoning as "freeing from sin" deal with Ex. 21:28-29?
Does this really sound like oxen need to be gently absolved of sin?
28 And if an ox gore a man or a woman to death, the ox shall be surely stoned, and its flesh shall not be eaten; but the owner of the ox shall be quit.
29 But if the ox was wont to gore in time past, and it hath been testified to its owner, and he hath not kept it in, but it hath killed a man or a woman, the ox shall be stoned, and its owner also shall be put to death.
29 But if the ox was wont to gore in time past, and it hath been testified to its owner, and he hath not kept it in, but it hath killed a man or a woman, the ox shall be stoned, and its owner also shall be put to death.
Does this really sound like oxen need to be gently absolved of sin?
B
I liked that Bea. I agree only Jesus can save us, but at the same time, we need to show ourselves, in our actions, to be actually worthy of saving, don't you think?
Something to meditate on perhaps
Something to meditate on perhaps
An oxen is an animal. If one knows languages, one may know that many use the male, the female, and the neutral tenses. Some have many different words with the same meaning, or a word with three or four meanings, just as English words can similarly have three or four different meanings, or more so depending on tense and grammatical implication. Philosophers of all kinds speak in riddles and in metaphors more-so than their everyday counterparts (generally), and their linguistic talent is regularly above normal standard. So their use of different phrases and words may be very extensive.
I do not, nor have I ever professed to be a hundred percent right on every aspect of the bible, simply because I am not. But I can contend with the fact that New Testament teachings of Jesus, (which apply to us now, as he had fulfilled the law of sin and death and therefore the need for physical punishment for sin, was indeed, taken away (at least while on Earth)), show us that killing for sin, is undisputedly, not required in the post-Jesus age.
So stoning to death, well, hyperbole or not, is an irrelevant matter for us today, and as such, so is the need to argue it. (from a biblical point of view)
I do not, nor have I ever professed to be a hundred percent right on every aspect of the bible, simply because I am not. But I can contend with the fact that New Testament teachings of Jesus, (which apply to us now, as he had fulfilled the law of sin and death and therefore the need for physical punishment for sin, was indeed, taken away (at least while on Earth)), show us that killing for sin, is undisputedly, not required in the post-Jesus age.
So stoning to death, well, hyperbole or not, is an irrelevant matter for us today, and as such, so is the need to argue it. (from a biblical point of view)
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I always also have trouble with the issue, well, that if an 'unsaved and unprofessed' person, does actually believe in God and Jesus, When they do kind acts out of their own giving spirit, to me, it doesn't matter whether they actively attend a 'church' or go to mass, or profess from the rooftops or know every nook and cranny. To me they are being examples of what God wants humanity to behave like towards each other and that can only be productive and positive.
B
Yeh I know what you mean. There are a lot of loving, good people in the world. It doesn't make them right with God though. That's the sad thing...
I think there are two different kinds of loves. God is Love - overall - the complete definition of His attributes.. but also, Corinthians further defines love, and love is corrective - well God's love.
Like I heard many people say before, if you loved your child, you would correct them, because THAT is real love, not the kind that would leave them do something dangerous (which is sin) simply because you forget what the wages of sin is.
Like it says within the Bible, the man's love - phileo - and God's Love - agape. Different definitions. One is caught up with emotions and feelings and has rights.
The other has no rights, is not wishy-washy with feelings or emotions and is patient, kind, etc etc.
But still, even if people have this love that is described in Corinthians, if they do not follow all of God's Word - then they do not have Love. Because He is Love.
I've heard the argument that Jesus came and knocked over tables and such in the temple and how could that be an act of love then? Well, He had his reasons for doing that, as they were trying to sell and exchange the things that were to be sacrificed to God - making it of no worth to sacrifice.
Anyway, I get sidetracked with a lot of detail.
But yes, it's the same as with the women preachers argument. Just because someone claims they are doing something which is God's will, doesn't mean it is God's will. And just because things are happening in the world (Realities, as Green says) doesn't mean it is God's will.
In order to please God, you must obey Him and love Him first, and you do this by keeping His Word. All the rest, of loving thy neighbour etc, should naturally come in line when the first is in place.
I think there are two different kinds of loves. God is Love - overall - the complete definition of His attributes.. but also, Corinthians further defines love, and love is corrective - well God's love.
Like I heard many people say before, if you loved your child, you would correct them, because THAT is real love, not the kind that would leave them do something dangerous (which is sin) simply because you forget what the wages of sin is.
Like it says within the Bible, the man's love - phileo - and God's Love - agape. Different definitions. One is caught up with emotions and feelings and has rights.
The other has no rights, is not wishy-washy with feelings or emotions and is patient, kind, etc etc.
But still, even if people have this love that is described in Corinthians, if they do not follow all of God's Word - then they do not have Love. Because He is Love.
I've heard the argument that Jesus came and knocked over tables and such in the temple and how could that be an act of love then? Well, He had his reasons for doing that, as they were trying to sell and exchange the things that were to be sacrificed to God - making it of no worth to sacrifice.
Anyway, I get sidetracked with a lot of detail.
But yes, it's the same as with the women preachers argument. Just because someone claims they are doing something which is God's will, doesn't mean it is God's will. And just because things are happening in the world (Realities, as Green says) doesn't mean it is God's will.
In order to please God, you must obey Him and love Him first, and you do this by keeping His Word. All the rest, of loving thy neighbour etc, should naturally come in line when the first is in place.
I understand.
The issue I have is, when does one suddenly become, 'saved', a believer. I know the scripts but I don't see this (nor interpret it) as a lot of people seem to. It annoys people, but here goes;
If someone knows God and Jesus exist. They believe that with all their hearts. And they believe that because of God's love, and Jesus love, and what they did for us, that they should also have that very same self-sacrificing attitude toward others, is THAT not exactly what the Holy Spirit is?
Similarly a woman or man who does not know the bible inside out but believes simply that Jesus died for us and they should do good and avoid sin to please Him. Is that not what a follower of Christ is? there are people who will not understand the whole bible. Whose mental capacity just can't. But in teh simplest of terms, I truly do believe that this is what a follower of Jesus is. A person who self sacrifices for the good of others.
When we realise that love is the only way. Is THAT not what being in Christ is?
I don't believe that you say' come to me Jesus' or 'invite Jesus into your heart' or something spiritual, and He just enters, I believe that the passage saying about the work being a fruit of the faith, is more to do with realising the truth and putting it into action as a charitable and loving person. It's a logical next step once one realises the Truth.
The issue I have is, when does one suddenly become, 'saved', a believer. I know the scripts but I don't see this (nor interpret it) as a lot of people seem to. It annoys people, but here goes;
If someone knows God and Jesus exist. They believe that with all their hearts. And they believe that because of God's love, and Jesus love, and what they did for us, that they should also have that very same self-sacrificing attitude toward others, is THAT not exactly what the Holy Spirit is?
Similarly a woman or man who does not know the bible inside out but believes simply that Jesus died for us and they should do good and avoid sin to please Him. Is that not what a follower of Christ is? there are people who will not understand the whole bible. Whose mental capacity just can't. But in teh simplest of terms, I truly do believe that this is what a follower of Jesus is. A person who self sacrifices for the good of others.
When we realise that love is the only way. Is THAT not what being in Christ is?
I don't believe that you say' come to me Jesus' or 'invite Jesus into your heart' or something spiritual, and He just enters, I believe that the passage saying about the work being a fruit of the faith, is more to do with realising the truth and putting it into action as a charitable and loving person. It's a logical next step once one realises the Truth.
But I believe it is your actions that make you worthy of being saved. If I only profess my faith but don't actually do anything to help anyone, then how can I be worthy of saving?
It's like saying, 'I'm saved so I'm going to sit around'. I believe I should ACT as a follower before professing as a follower. That's my view. Jesus didn't simply tell people they were saved. He gave them physical instructions about spreading the word, about helping those in need. He didn't tell them to sit around.
He gave people instruction on how to live righteously, not just on the fact that He would die for their sins. In fact, the dying for the sins talks made up a very small proportion of what Jesus said in all his time on Earth. That's why I think that, personally, you become 'in the spirit', when your actions and thoughts are focused on the self-sacrificing of oneself for the sake of others.
Jesus preached and gave in equal measure really, didn't He?
It's like saying, 'I'm saved so I'm going to sit around'. I believe I should ACT as a follower before professing as a follower. That's my view. Jesus didn't simply tell people they were saved. He gave them physical instructions about spreading the word, about helping those in need. He didn't tell them to sit around.
He gave people instruction on how to live righteously, not just on the fact that He would die for their sins. In fact, the dying for the sins talks made up a very small proportion of what Jesus said in all his time on Earth. That's why I think that, personally, you become 'in the spirit', when your actions and thoughts are focused on the self-sacrificing of oneself for the sake of others.
Jesus preached and gave in equal measure really, didn't He?
I guess I just take issue with the idea that someone should be saved and 'wait for their works'. I don't like that idea at all. (not saying that you are saying that explicitly, I don't think you are, but some do).
But I find that the actual love I have for others now is reward enough in itself. So I want to share it with others. And I want to show it to others. I don't really NEED to whole 'I'm going to heaven' thing. I just want to do my best while I'm here. Y'know
But I find that the actual love I have for others now is reward enough in itself. So I want to share it with others. And I want to show it to others. I don't really NEED to whole 'I'm going to heaven' thing. I just want to do my best while I'm here. Y'know
B
And what is Truth?
And is THAT all that Christ is, love as perceived by mens definition? Christ is the Word made flesh. In the beginning was the Word and the Word is God. So God spoke Word, wrote Word, and manifested Word in flesh. They all are the same Word. So to just follow Christ, and discount the Bible, is not following the whole Word of God. Likewise, to just follow the Bible and not follow Christ, is not following the whole Word of God. Nothing contradicts, but everything flows perfectly. Love is God, and God is Love and if you love God you will keep His commandments, and it all ties in. Just to claim you love like Jesus, and do not keep the Word is not good enough.
And so then, how can any man keep the whole Word of God and be saved? Every one of us fails in one way or another. Then none of us are saved by our deeds but by His grace. And these scriptures, I think are beautiful in summing it up
Romans 9
6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.
14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
And is THAT all that Christ is, love as perceived by mens definition? Christ is the Word made flesh. In the beginning was the Word and the Word is God. So God spoke Word, wrote Word, and manifested Word in flesh. They all are the same Word. So to just follow Christ, and discount the Bible, is not following the whole Word of God. Likewise, to just follow the Bible and not follow Christ, is not following the whole Word of God. Nothing contradicts, but everything flows perfectly. Love is God, and God is Love and if you love God you will keep His commandments, and it all ties in. Just to claim you love like Jesus, and do not keep the Word is not good enough.
And so then, how can any man keep the whole Word of God and be saved? Every one of us fails in one way or another. Then none of us are saved by our deeds but by His grace. And these scriptures, I think are beautiful in summing it up
Romans 9
6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.
14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
A
there is love as the world loves and love as Jesus loves...the world loves family and those who help them,,, Jesus loved those who could never pay back His kindness and acts of Love for the sake of loving them... not in order to get them to care for Him,,, unbelievers would be baffled at that kind of unconditional love....
B
Sorry, Romans 7
And it doesn't make an excuse then for people to sin. It is a justification for the mistakes and failings we sometimes make because we are human. There are more verses - I can't find right now - which speak clearly about people making that an excuse then, say for living any way they want because .. aren't we all justified?
But once again, if you love God, you're not going to deliberately set out against Him. You're going to want to show it and keep His Word to the best of your understanding. To much is given, much is required, especially with revelation. To willingly commit iniquity and not repent - there's the trouble. But His grace is sufficient, in our weakness, He is strong. I'm glad He gets us weak - no power of our own, no glory of our own - to show we can do all things through Him
And it doesn't make an excuse then for people to sin. It is a justification for the mistakes and failings we sometimes make because we are human. There are more verses - I can't find right now - which speak clearly about people making that an excuse then, say for living any way they want because .. aren't we all justified?
But once again, if you love God, you're not going to deliberately set out against Him. You're going to want to show it and keep His Word to the best of your understanding. To much is given, much is required, especially with revelation. To willingly commit iniquity and not repent - there's the trouble. But His grace is sufficient, in our weakness, He is strong. I'm glad He gets us weak - no power of our own, no glory of our own - to show we can do all things through Him
G
God's actions in you through your faith and obedience. Consequently, when Christ draws you to Him, YOUR actions embracing His Love for you cause you to repent and be saved, become part of His sheep
Simple, huh.
Humans can love but 'it' is of the world, and, what does Jesus say about 'the world?'
Nope. Your hear, my heart, ALL our hearts are not good.Your thinking your heart is,good is not good either, meditation. Give your heart to God Note: This does not say our heart is,not important, it is critically important that we use it, but we MUST use it as God intended for Him.
Jeremiah 29:11-13 is,worth a read, note v. 13.
And, that speaks of what God wants us to do to find Him
Here is the sinister nature of our heart exposed, by this prophet, Jeremiah:
King James ”The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? Jer. 17:9
Simple, huh.
Humans can love but 'it' is of the world, and, what does Jesus say about 'the world?'
I guess I just take issue with the idea that someone should be saved and 'wait for their works'. I don't like that idea at all. (not saying that you are saying that explicitly, I don't think you are, but some do).
When we are saved, we will work
But I find that the actual love I have for others now is reward enough in itself. So I want to share it with others. And I want to show it to others. I don't really NEED to whole 'I'm going to heaven' thing. I just want to do my best while I'm here. Y'know
When we are saved, we will work
But I find that the actual love I have for others now is reward enough in itself. So I want to share it with others. And I want to show it to others. I don't really NEED to whole 'I'm going to heaven' thing. I just want to do my best while I'm here. Y'know
Note: This does not say our heart is,not important, it is critically important that we use it, but we MUST use it as God intended for Him. Jeremiah 29:11-13 is,worth a read, note v. 13.
And, that speaks of what God wants us to do to find Him
Here is the sinister nature of our heart exposed, by this prophet, Jeremiah:
King James ”The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? Jer. 17:9
G
Might seem to be, but times have changed, mediation, and, when I speak to Edward below, you will see why God is,
moving like He is--desperately wanting no one to perish--in these end times.....
absolutely not God's plan, gay marriage, eddie, but people are freewill choosing to do it like Seattle (washington state won't be far behind?) and SanFrancisco (california win't be far behind?) , New York City (new york won't be far behind). These states making gay marriage constitutional is saying just a matter of Time before more states ratify.it too. God is just, He knows that some will not be able to hear His word from men pastors, He is, therefore, on The move, bringing more and more women pastors into The fold because gay folk are often not liking listening to a man, they will be attending an all-gay church even, I.see this The next phase, and, ...
Will an all-women gay church be accepting a male pastor? Uh-uh.
End times, times are a-changin' and God is a-movin' , powefully leading , so that NONE should perish.
moving like He is--desperately wanting no one to perish--in these end times.....
absolutely not God's plan, gay marriage, eddie, but people are freewill choosing to do it like Seattle (washington state won't be far behind?) and SanFrancisco (california win't be far behind?) , New York City (new york won't be far behind). These states making gay marriage constitutional is saying just a matter of Time before more states ratify.it too. God is just, He knows that some will not be able to hear His word from men pastors, He is, therefore, on The move, bringing more and more women pastors into The fold because gay folk are often not liking listening to a man, they will be attending an all-gay church even, I.see this The next phase, and, ...
Will an all-women gay church be accepting a male pastor? Uh-uh.
End times, times are a-changin' and God is a-movin' , powefully leading , so that NONE should perish.
Well Rex, you make a very interesting and valid point. I do think that these were times where the male dominated the society. But one must think back. In biblical terms, again, Eve was made from Adam. So to go right back to the root, and also (although a real gender, as some say, is never actually specified), even God is referred to as a He. But that is just Christianity my friend. and again, it is up to the individual whether they wish to follow it as it is meant to be followed. As you said earlier, the text is just there. Like it or don't, you know?
But thanks for that point
But thanks for that point
B
God's actions in you through your faith and obedience. Consequently, when Christ draws you to Him, YOUR actions embracing His Love for you cause you to repent and be saved, become part of His sheep
Simple, huh.
Simple, huh.
Green, from this discussion I fully believe you are aware of the Truth and as such, YOUR actions will determine where you go with it now. It is that simple
and not what helps you sleep at night which is important to any of us; it’s whether it will save you. But I’ll make my election sure and I’m sure you are capable of taking care of yours
God Bless - and I sincerely say this
I know that Jesus death is not an excuse for sin. But similarly, we all do sin.
How is my willingness to sacrifice myself due to belief in Jesus, 'not a good heart?'
Jesus tells me to purify my thoughts many times. My intent should be pure. Does that just magically happen to me as some being descends into me after 'asking Jesus into my heart', or is it something that requires work and requires conscious effort on my part? I believe the latter.
The work is a fruit of the faith, yes that's true. But it doesn't mean it just happens. It requires work (see the point, 'work').
I am to sacrifice knowingly and willingly for the greater good, not just 'believe'. One is righteous, the other is a dead precept.
I didn't suddenly feel Jesus' wisdom, patience and love descend on me the day i professed that His was was the right way. I saw what He did and made a conscious decision to try to love others as myself.
Jesus did what He did, deliberately. I'm sure He had temptations (as a man), and He consciously chose not to give into them. It's not something that just happens.
God gives me a word in a book. He doesn't make me follow it. I choose to follow it and THAT is the point. I choose to. Even after I become 'saved' or 'in The Spirit' or whatever term one wishes to use, it doesn't mean that I automatically do good at every turn. I have to choose to. I don't automatically become perfect and completely blameless, without impure thoughts and without sin, I have to work to. Yes, if I fail, there's a safety net and I can get back up and try again but I still have to work at it.
How is my willingness to sacrifice myself due to belief in Jesus, 'not a good heart?'
Jesus tells me to purify my thoughts many times. My intent should be pure. Does that just magically happen to me as some being descends into me after 'asking Jesus into my heart', or is it something that requires work and requires conscious effort on my part? I believe the latter.
The work is a fruit of the faith, yes that's true. But it doesn't mean it just happens. It requires work (see the point, 'work').
I am to sacrifice knowingly and willingly for the greater good, not just 'believe'. One is righteous, the other is a dead precept.
I didn't suddenly feel Jesus' wisdom, patience and love descend on me the day i professed that His was was the right way. I saw what He did and made a conscious decision to try to love others as myself.
Jesus did what He did, deliberately. I'm sure He had temptations (as a man), and He consciously chose not to give into them. It's not something that just happens.
God gives me a word in a book. He doesn't make me follow it. I choose to follow it and THAT is the point. I choose to. Even after I become 'saved' or 'in The Spirit' or whatever term one wishes to use, it doesn't mean that I automatically do good at every turn. I have to choose to. I don't automatically become perfect and completely blameless, without impure thoughts and without sin, I have to work to. Yes, if I fail, there's a safety net and I can get back up and try again but I still have to work at it.