The Male and Disrespect

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Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
15,342
8,340
113
#41
The reason why any marriage, including their children, and finances, ect., is in chaos, is because the Believer Faith is misplaced. Their Faith is not placed and maintained exclusively in Christ and the Cross - It may be placed in Christ - but not the Cross (a lukewarm Christian). The result will be the works of the flesh and spiritual death (the sin nature comes alive) Gal. 5:19-21. This is called Spiritual Adultery - another Jesus. You have forsaking the Cross for other ways and methods to bring victory and blessings (grace).

Never allow any problem nor any circumstance to misplace your Faith from Christ and the Cross of Calvary where the victory was purchased and won. Unless the Believer submit to God's plan of victory, over sin, the world, the flesh, and the Devil, the result will always be defeat. The Life of Christ must be manifested through the power of the Holy Spirit in the Believer life to have victory (John 14:21; John 15:5; Romans 8:2).
This is sadly and dangerously naive. It puts all responsibility for the circumstances of the believer's life in his or her own hands, as though he or she had the power to make things happen. We aren't God; we can't control the choices that others make, and we can't control the universe. To think otherwise is foolishness.
 
Sep 3, 2016
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#42
you make a lot of assumptions in that very large blanket statement

where does the Bible say to place your faith in Christ and something else? Is it not sola fide, sola Christos?
Excellent question.

John 6:53 - "Except you eat the Flesh of the Son of Man, and drink His Blood (i.e., the Cross, i.e., The Finished Work), you have no life in you," (presents the demand that caused "many of His Disciples to go back, and walk no more with Him" (John 6:66). It does the same presently! This Verse tells us the degree of believing that is required; it refers to the Cross being the total Object of one's belief; failing that, there is no Life in you.)

John 6:66 - From that time many of His Disciples went back, and walk no more with Him.
 

oldethennew

Senior Member
Feb 28, 2016
10,944
2,761
113
#43
please excuse me, but I just couldn't read ALL of the replies'...

nother words, from what I have read from you posts and some others, u seem to be a complete (zero) in your present situation -
it's like 'nobody likes you or respects you in any way-shape or form', wow, this is beyond sad...

this is just us, hub and me, if we truly Love our Saviour and feel that we are serving Him in the best way that He expects us to,
then, we should absolutely at least see some 'results', not to mention, at least some 'interest'...???

what's going-on here???, (something seems really out of order) either in the post, if this is real, then, lots of Prayer is
needed here...
 
Sep 3, 2016
6,117
523
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#44
This is sadly and dangerously naive. It puts all responsibility for the circumstances of the believer's life in his or her own hands, as though he or she had the power to make things happen. We aren't God; we can't control the choices that others make, and we can't control the universe. To think otherwise is foolishness.
This is called the twisting of scriptures (by a evil spirit).
 

selfdissolving

Well-known member
Jun 29, 2018
536
434
63
34
#46
Excellent question.

John 6:53 - "Except you eat the Flesh of the Son of Man, and drink His Blood (i.e., the Cross, i.e., The Finished Work), you have no life in you," (presents the demand that caused "many of His Disciples to go back, and walk no more with Him" (John 6:66). It does the same presently! This Verse tells us the degree of believing that is required; it refers to the Cross being the total Object of one's belief; failing that, there is no Life in you.)

John 6:66 - From that time many of His Disciples went back, and walk no more with Him.
i see what you mean. you are referring to the finished work of Christ. i was confused by the terminology. I usually just say "the person and work of Jesus Christ" but the same concepts are being conveyed. thanks for the clarification.
 
Sep 3, 2016
6,117
523
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#47
i see what you mean. you are referring to the finished work of Christ. i was confused by the terminology. I usually just say "the person and work of Jesus Christ" but the same concepts are being conveyed. thanks for the clarification.
Hebrews 11:27 says, "By Faith he (Moses) forsook Egypt (which, spiritually speaking, every Believer must do), not fearing the wrath of the king (Pharaoh tried to kill him at that time [Exodus 2:15]): for he endured, as seeing Him Who is invisible. (This speaks of Christ, Whom Moses saw by Faith).

JSM
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
15,342
8,340
113
#48
i see what you mean. you are referring to the finished work of Christ. i was confused by the terminology. I usually just say "the person and work of Jesus Christ" but the same concepts are being conveyed. thanks for the clarification.
FYI, MoTC quotes extensively from Jimmy Swaggart ("JSM"). All the red text in the quotes is Swaggart's commentary.
 

oldethennew

Senior Member
Feb 28, 2016
10,944
2,761
113
#49
lets just 'forgive ole 'jimmie' and write him off,...
 

Locoponydirtman

Well-known member
Oct 9, 2018
2,872
1,727
113
Texas
#50
Greek can be a slippery language. You might want to study it before you go making all these rules and laws based on what could be a bad translation.

I have several years of Master's degree Greek. I got outstanding student in all my classes. I read the Bible in Greek daily. No, I am not a master scholar. But, I have studied under them, and I continue to learn and grow.

εἶναι μιᾶς γυναικὸς ἄνδρα
To be one a woman man. (Note that the word εἶναι is an infinitive, you should use "to" with it, to show it is indefinite.)

γυναικὸς can mean wife, but also woman.

ἄνδρα can mean husband, and also man.

Since this is addressed to men, it is important to look at context. Because the point of this passage is for men not to be polygamous, which was very common among the patriarchs and other societies. This came about likely because of constant wars and the men dying, and not enough men for the women. Since women could not work, they basically needed a man to marry them, or they would end up prostitutes. Very sad indictment on that society, and keeping women from following careers and having jobs. And certainly not applicable to today!

So the context is about men not having more than one wife. No "he," and probably not wife/husband, according to most scholars. (Although it could be "to be a one wife husband"?)

So, try to not use Greek to prove your point, since you don't appear to know Greek at all, and missing the small nuances which you don't get using Strong's or other concordances. And then, you might want to consider how many other mistakes you have made trying to make Scripture say what you want, instead of the context and intention of the original, inspired writers.
Yes this is about a man not being a polygamist, in the context of being a officer in the church. These were the standards being expressed to Timothy, about "rulers" in the church.
And the nonesense of women not having jobs is silly. Women often worked in the market place. Lydia was no some anomaly she made purple dye, she wasn't a slave or a prostitute.
Then Pricilla was a tent maker.
The Bible mentions many women who worked in commercial trade some out side the home even (Prov. 31:16a, 24; Acts 16:14), in agriculture (Josh. 15:17-19; Ruth 2:8; Prov. 31:16b), as millers (Exod. 11:5; Matt. 24:41), as shepherds (Gen. 29:9; Exod. 2:16), as artisans, especially in textiles (Exod. 26:1 NIV; Acts 18:3), as perfumers and cooks (1 Sam. 8:13), as midwives (Exod. 1:15ff), as nurses (Gen 35:8; Exod. 2:7; 2 Sam 4:4; 1 Kings 1:4), as domestic servants (Acts 12:13, etc), and as professional mourners (Jer. 9:17). evidence from New Testament times shows that women were shopkeepers and vendors, jewellery makers, fullers and dyers, and at least one woman we know of was a blacksmith. About the only thing a woman couldn't do as be a soldier or a senator. Most of the people of that time would be what we would consider very poor by our standards today, and that meant everyone even the children did jobs out side the home to provide for the family.
 

GardenofWeeden

Active member
Jul 27, 2018
117
136
43
The Garden of Weeden
#51
Instead of worrying about whether or not you family falls in line and respects God and you, by having devotions and prayer time with your direction, why not be the example they need to desire this time. Let them see you reading the Bible, praying and deriving joy from this. Joy they can't have without Christ. Focus your life on Christ and let Christ focus on your family. He will lead you the right way for your family, instead of you doing what you think is right and getting frustrated they aren't following. Don't let them define you, let Christ define you.
Be blessed, friend.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,079
2,225
113
#52
Yes this is about a man not being a polygamist, in the context of being a officer in the church. These were the standards being expressed to Timothy, about "rulers" in the church.
And the nonesense of women not having jobs is silly. Women often worked in the market place. Lydia was no some anomaly she made purple dye, she wasn't a slave or a prostitute.
Then Pricilla was a tent maker.
The Bible mentions many women who worked in commercial trade some out side the home even (Prov. 31:16a, 24; Acts 16:14), in agriculture (Josh. 15:17-19; Ruth 2:8; Prov. 31:16b), as millers (Exod. 11:5; Matt. 24:41), as shepherds (Gen. 29:9; Exod. 2:16), as artisans, especially in textiles (Exod. 26:1 NIV; Acts 18:3), as perfumers and cooks (1 Sam. 8:13), as midwives (Exod. 1:15ff), as nurses (Gen 35:8; Exod. 2:7; 2 Sam 4:4; 1 Kings 1:4), as domestic servants (Acts 12:13, etc), and as professional mourners (Jer. 9:17). evidence from New Testament times shows that women were shopkeepers and vendors, jewellery makers, fullers and dyers, and at least one woman we know of was a blacksmith. About the only thing a woman couldn't do as be a soldier or a senator. Most of the people of that time would be what we would consider very poor by our standards today, and that meant everyone even the children did jobs out side the home to provide for the family.

I stand corrected! Thanks for posting all these verses. I knew them, but somewhere in my head, I hear some preacher somewhere telling me women could not work. Good post!
 

Locoponydirtman

Well-known member
Oct 9, 2018
2,872
1,727
113
Texas
#53
I stand corrected! Thanks for posting all these verses. I knew them, but somewhere in my head, I hear some preacher somewhere telling me women could not work. Good post!
This is common, because so many teach it. I wish they wouldn't but they do. You have wonderful integrity, and I enjoy your posts.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,079
2,225
113
#55
I said I would post this a while back about Eve, and how the roles came AFTER the Fall.

The word עזרor "ezer" often translated "helpmeet" (KJV) from the Hebrew in Gen. 2:18 - It appears 21 times in the Old Testament. Two times it is in Genesis for the woman (Gen. 2:18, 20). three times for nations to whom Israel appealed for military aid. (Isa. 30:5, Eze. 12:14, Daniel 11:34),

And SIXTEEN TIMES for God as Israel's helper. (Exodus 18:4, Deut. 33:7, 26, 29, Psalms 20:2, 33:20, 70:5, 89:19 (translated STRENGTH) in NIV; 115:9, 10, 11; 121:1-2; 124:8; 146:5; Hosea 13:9.

So rather than the word being translated "Helper", a better translation would be STRONG helper! Ezer is used in a military context, "shield and defense," "better than chariots and horses," "Sentry watch over his people."

Even Eden fits this pattern, because truly the Garden of Eden was a war zone. God commanded the man to keep or guard the garden by using the same military language later used for the cherubim who guarded the garden with a flaming sword. The reason, of course, is that a powerful enemy was already planning an attack.

God created his daughters to be ezer-warriors with their brothers. God deploys the ezer to break the man's aloneness by soldiering with him wholeheartedly and at full strength for God's gracious kingdom.

As ezer-warriors, we must be strong, resourceful, alert to the cries of the needy and oppressed. Other verses that support the ezer-warrior image, include Ruth and the Proverbs 31 woman, and all believers are told to "put on the armour of God" in Eph. 6:10-17, not just the men.

Thinking of ezer as a warrior is entirely consistent with how Scripture views us. Everyone needs to be aware, that the Hebrew word in no way supports the idea of roles, based on this word used to describe Eve twice, and also for God 16 times, and 3 times for those who needed military aid.

As for roles? Genesis 3:1-7 is the record of the Fall. The God tracks down the man, and finds out what happens. In verses 15-19, he gives them the consequences of their disobedience, and roles come out of that.

"To the woman he said,
“I will greatly increase your labor pains;
with pain you will give birth to children.
You will want to control your husband,
but he will dominate you.”
17 But to Adam he said,
“Because you obeyed your wife
and ate from the tree about which I commanded you,
‘You must not eat from it,’
cursed is the ground thanks to you;
in painful toil you will eat of it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
but you will eat the grain of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat food
until you return to the ground,
for out of it you were taken;
for you are dust, and to dust you will return.”" Gen. 3:15-19

So, no roles before the Fall, roles as a consequence of sin. I know I certainly would not want to follow a pattern, that was a result of sin, as a born again Imago Dei, after the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Very sad this very wrong philosophy is being taught as true, when it is not!
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
15,342
8,340
113
#56
I said I would post this a while back about Eve, and how the roles came AFTER the Fall.

The word עזרor "ezer" often translated "helpmeet" (KJV) from the Hebrew in Gen. 2:18 - It appears 21 times in the Old Testament. Two times it is in Genesis for the woman (Gen. 2:18, 20). three times for nations to whom Israel appealed for military aid. (Isa. 30:5, Eze. 12:14, Daniel 11:34),

And SIXTEEN TIMES for God as Israel's helper. (Exodus 18:4, Deut. 33:7, 26, 29, Psalms 20:2, 33:20, 70:5, 89:19 (translated STRENGTH) in NIV; 115:9, 10, 11; 121:1-2; 124:8; 146:5; Hosea 13:9.

So rather than the word being translated "Helper", a better translation would be STRONG helper! Ezer is used in a military context, "shield and defense," "better than chariots and horses," "Sentry watch over his people."

Even Eden fits this pattern, because truly the Garden of Eden was a war zone. God commanded the man to keep or guard the garden by using the same military language later used for the cherubim who guarded the garden with a flaming sword. The reason, of course, is that a powerful enemy was already planning an attack.

God created his daughters to be ezer-warriors with their brothers. God deploys the ezer to break the man's aloneness by soldiering with him wholeheartedly and at full strength for God's gracious kingdom.

As ezer-warriors, we must be strong, resourceful, alert to the cries of the needy and oppressed. Other verses that support the ezer-warrior image, include Ruth and the Proverbs 31 woman, and all believers are told to "put on the armour of God" in Eph. 6:10-17, not just the men.

Thinking of ezer as a warrior is entirely consistent with how Scripture views us. Everyone needs to be aware, that the Hebrew word in no way supports the idea of roles, based on this word used to describe Eve twice, and also for God 16 times, and 3 times for those who needed military aid.

As for roles? Genesis 3:1-7 is the record of the Fall. The God tracks down the man, and finds out what happens. In verses 15-19, he gives them the consequences of their disobedience, and roles come out of that.

"To the woman he said,
“I will greatly increase your labor pains;
with pain you will give birth to children.
You will want to control your husband,
but he will dominate you.”
17 But to Adam he said,
“Because you obeyed your wife
and ate from the tree about which I commanded you,
‘You must not eat from it,’
cursed is the ground thanks to you;
in painful toil you will eat of it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
but you will eat the grain of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat food
until you return to the ground,
for out of it you were taken;
for you are dust, and to dust you will return.”" Gen. 3:15-19

So, no roles before the Fall, roles as a consequence of sin. I know I certainly would not want to follow a pattern, that was a result of sin, as a born again Imago Dei, after the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Very sad this very wrong philosophy is being taught as true, when it is not!
I am amazed that people (primarily males) read verse 16b as a command from God, but don't treat any other verse in the passage as such. Ironically they end up fulfilling the consequence to the letter.

I always appreciate your scholarly input, Angela. :)
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
12,839
5,755
113
#57
God calls me to be the spiritual leader in my home and I can't be that because I'm constantly being undermined by my wife. There has to be solutions.
What you have shared is basically a Satanic attack on you and your family. It is quite clear that they do not respect you or reverence God. And your wife fiddling on the phone during your family worship time is contemptuous and contemptible.

As to a solution, if you attend a church you need to sit down with the pastor(s) and share this confidentially with him/them (if you can trust him/them to maintain strict confidentiality). Not just to share this but to actively obtain his spiritual assistance. The next step is to invite him (or the one most suitable) to your home for a meal during the week (when you expect all family members to be present). Don't tell your family what your have in mind. The next phase must come as a total surprise.

After the meal and the clearing of the dishes, you all need to sit down at the dining table and have the pastor show your family from the Bible the importance of what you are doing and the necessity for each one to be respectful and reverential, and to recognize that you are the spiritual leader in your home. They need to hear that they are disrespecting God, not just you. They also need to hear the relevant Scriptures.

Indeed, after he is done, he should ask for a verbal commitment from each one that they will do what he has recommended in good faith. He has the pastoral authority to do so, and hopefully this will make a difference.

At the same time, he should ask each one directly if they have actually been saved and given their lives over to Christ. If so, he should ask them if they have been baptized as believers. If not, he should make arrangements for them to be baptized the following Sunday. It would appear that your family may not even be genuinely converted.

You do not need to respond to this in any way. If it makes perfect sense, implement this and see what happens. At the same time, without strict confidentiality, this will become a source of unacceptable gossip, so your must get a solemn commitment for confidentiality from the pastor/elder.

(You can even print this off and show it to whomever you invite so that they are perfectly clear as to what is required).
 

MattforJesus

Senior Member
Apr 15, 2017
2,631
547
113
#58
Hello everyone,
I'm a man. Lately I have been trying to have worship with my family, but it seems futile. Every time I try and have worship, something happens. To give a little background, my wife and I have 4 children. So when we are sitting down the evening to have worship, and I say it's time for prayer, I look and notice that no one is paying attention and that everyone is doing there own things. I try to gently call things to order, and no one listens. They just keep doing whatever they have been doing. When I go to enforce things by discipline, my wife does not do anything, but rather supports the children in their disrespect.

This was something that I dealt with a lot when I was younger. I would try and share my faith with my friends, and they would make fun of me. I remember being called "preacher boy" at camp meeting, for trying to share some things about the Bible. What cuts the deepest is the fact that it is my wife now who is treating what I do when it comes to worship with contempt.

In fact, while I am trying to read to the children, a lot of times, she is on her phone and not paying attention to what I am saying. The children watch her and then follow suit.

As a result of this I find myself isolated, and feeling like what I say or do does not matter. I also feel emasculated and like less of a man. I know that an elder must have his children in subjection under him with all gravity, and I don't feel like they are. My brother is constantly telling me I need to "be the man, and take off the dress" and "wear the pants in the relationship." I feel pressure from almost every angle when it comes to this. I don't know if any other men can relate on this area, but it hurts, and it hurts deeply. I don't know why this is such a huge wound, but it is. I still remember my grandpa calling me a "mammas boy" at a very young age and it cutting to the heart. Feeling worthless and disrespected is a huge wound. I'm not sure how I'm going to get over it, but I know one thing for sure: God IS going to give me the victory! He would not have brought me to this Jordan, if He did not have a plan.

So on that note, I guess the question is: What should I do in this situation? My wife is a believer, but she is not supportive of me and who I am and what I stand for and that just hurts. I plan, by God's grace to be married to this woman for the rest of my life, and so I am just looking for solutions to the problem.

God calls me to be the spiritual leader in my home and I can't be that because I'm constantly being undermined by my wife. There has to be solutions.
If they do not pay attention to what you say about worship, or the Bible, it is obvious that they do not care that much concerning God, and the Bible.

And the thing is America gave liberty to females, and children, unlike the past, or any other nation, and when a person has liberty they will exercise it, and exalt themselves, for that is the way of the flesh whether, man, woman, or child.

Not to dog out women, and I am not in to controlling people, but America gave liberty to women unlike any time in the past, and unlike any nation, where they can have positions of authority in all phases of society, and job positions.

And because of that what do we find, but the women act like the men because of the liberty that they have in America, so they will exercise that liberty in the family.

That is why it is hard to find June Cleaver, and that pleasant attitude that she had on that television program, and woman do not act like they did in the 1950's and before that time, for it is a different ballgame now, and they are in to controlling now according to the liberty they have in America.

For a movement as bold as feminism, testifies that they have liberty, and a lot of it.

Concerning children they also have liberty unlike any other time, so they will exercise it, and that is why they are so outspoken as if they have some say so in the family trying to trump the parents.

For the truth is children will only act according to how the parents, and government allow them to act, so if they are unruly then guess whose fault it is.

And children will be influenced by other children, and the majority of them live in households where they parents are relaxed in morals.

The counterculture movement opened a can of whoop butt in America, for now there is parents not as moral as they once used to be, so the children are not being taught strict morals, and the parents with their immorality cause the children to say that their parents do not do what is right, and they are trying to tell us to behave, which they are drunkards, druggies, stealers, breaking the law, cursing out the neighbors, and the such.

Which that is not the case with all parents, but children are still influenced for they know that is what goes on in America, and want to have liberty too, and a lot of children do not look to the father as the main authority, but the women as equal as the father, for she will act according to the liberty America gave her, so they will side with the authority of the mom like they would the dad, which ever way they want to go.

So it is standard procedure now their conduct, for people will basically act the same in society with a few exceptions which is those that are led of the Spirit, for they will escape it.

So women will exalt themselves, and children will exalt themselves, according to the liberty that America has given them, so the father is not listened to as he once was years ago.

A lot of relationships in America it is the woman that does the most controlling, for they like it according to the flesh of the liberty that America gave her.

So women will act like the men with that liberty, and the children will act like the parents with that liberty, and act as if they are the ones that can make decisions in the family.

Which a person could say but they flat out do not care, and the father is ignored, but why is that, it is because of the liberty that America gave them, so they will exercise it, for it is now standard procedure, and behavior in America.

1950's and before the standard procedure, and behavior was different, but when the 1960's came around the standard procedure, and behavior changed, and became worse where you can have trouble with a 5 year old rebelling, and swearing like a sailor.

Pro 30:11 There is a generation that curseth their father, and doth not bless their mother.
Pro 30:12 There is a generation that are pure in their own eyes, and yet is not washed from their filthiness.
Pro 30:13 There is a generation, O how lofty are their eyes! and their eyelids are lifted up.
Pro 30:14 There is a generation, whose teeth are as swords, and their jaw teeth as knives, to devour the poor from off the earth, and the needy from among men.

The last generation before Jesus comes back, standard procedure, and behavior, where the children will not obey the parents, and highly selfish, highly arrogant, aggressive towards each other, not washed from the filthiness although they think they are alright, and will devour the poor from off the earth, and the needy from among men, which we see they are doing a good job at that as millions, and billions of dollars is not enough for them.

It's a whole new ballgame today, and the Leave it to Beaver days are gone, and anything prior to it, for we are at the last generation.
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
113
#59
If they do not pay attention to what you say about worship, or the Bible, it is obvious that they do not care that much concerning God, and the Bible.

And the thing is America gave liberty to females, and children, unlike the past, or any other nation, and when a person has liberty they will exercise it, and exalt themselves, for that is the way of the flesh whether, man, woman, or child.

Not to dog out women, and I am not in to controlling people, but America gave liberty to women unlike any time in the past, and unlike any nation, where they can have positions of authority in all phases of society, and job positions.

And because of that what do we find, but the women act like the men because of the liberty that they have in America, so they will exercise that liberty in the family.

That is why it is hard to find June Cleaver, and that pleasant attitude that she had on that television program, and woman do not act like they did in the 1950's and before that time, for it is a different ballgame now, and they are in to controlling now according to the liberty they have in America.

For a movement as bold as feminism, testifies that they have liberty, and a lot of it.

Concerning children they also have liberty unlike any other time, so they will exercise it, and that is why they are so outspoken as if they have some say so in the family trying to trump the parents.

For the truth is children will only act according to how the parents, and government allow them to act, so if they are unruly then guess whose fault it is.

And children will be influenced by other children, and the majority of them live in households where they parents are relaxed in morals.

The counterculture movement opened a can of whoop butt in America, for now there is parents not as moral as they once used to be, so the children are not being taught strict morals, and the parents with their immorality cause the children to say that their parents do not do what is right, and they are trying to tell us to behave, which they are drunkards, druggies, stealers, breaking the law, cursing out the neighbors, and the such.

Which that is not the case with all parents, but children are still influenced for they know that is what goes on in America, and want to have liberty too, and a lot of children do not look to the father as the main authority, but the women as equal as the father, for she will act according to the liberty America gave her, so they will side with the authority of the mom like they would the dad, which ever way they want to go.

So it is standard procedure now their conduct, for people will basically act the same in society with a few exceptions which is those that are led of the Spirit, for they will escape it.

So women will exalt themselves, and children will exalt themselves, according to the liberty that America has given them, so the father is not listened to as he once was years ago.

A lot of relationships in America it is the woman that does the most controlling, for they like it according to the flesh of the liberty that America gave her.

So women will act like the men with that liberty, and the children will act like the parents with that liberty, and act as if they are the ones that can make decisions in the family.

Which a person could say but they flat out do not care, and the father is ignored, but why is that, it is because of the liberty that America gave them, so they will exercise it, for it is now standard procedure, and behavior in America.

1950's and before the standard procedure, and behavior was different, but when the 1960's came around the standard procedure, and behavior changed, and became worse where you can have trouble with a 5 year old rebelling, and swearing like a sailor.

Pro 30:11 There is a generation that curseth their father, and doth not bless their mother.
Pro 30:12 There is a generation that are pure in their own eyes, and yet is not washed from their filthiness.
Pro 30:13 There is a generation, O how lofty are their eyes! and their eyelids are lifted up.
Pro 30:14 There is a generation, whose teeth are as swords, and their jaw teeth as knives, to devour the poor from off the earth, and the needy from among men.

The last generation before Jesus comes back, standard procedure, and behavior, where the children will not obey the parents, and highly selfish, highly arrogant, aggressive towards each other, not washed from the filthiness although they think they are alright, and will devour the poor from off the earth, and the needy from among men, which we see they are doing a good job at that as millions, and billions of dollars is not enough for them.

It's a whole new ballgame today, and the Leave it to Beaver days are gone, and anything prior to it, for we are at the last generation.
I like June Cleaver and every family should have one.

i didn't read your entire post because the only statement I'd like to make is that respect is earned.
Just because a male is the head of the family means very little if that male cannot be respected...for whatever reason.

That's it !
 

GardenofWeeden

Active member
Jul 27, 2018
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The Garden of Weeden
#60
What you have shared is basically a Satanic attack on you and your family. It is quite clear that they do not respect you or reverence God. And your wife fiddling on the phone during your family worship time is contemptuous and contemptible.

As to a solution, if you attend a church you need to sit down with the pastor(s) and share this confidentially with him/them (if you can trust him/them to maintain strict confidentiality). Not just to share this but to actively obtain his spiritual assistance. The next step is to invite him (or the one most suitable) to your home for a meal during the week (when you expect all family members to be present). Don't tell your family what your have in mind. The next phase must come as a total surprise.

After the meal and the clearing of the dishes, you all need to sit down at the dining table and have the pastor show your family from the Bible the importance of what you are doing and the necessity for each one to be respectful and reverential, and to recognize that you are the spiritual leader in your home. They need to hear that they are disrespecting God, not just you. They also need to hear the relevant Scriptures.

Indeed, after he is done, he should ask for a verbal commitment from each one that they will do what he has recommended in good faith. He has the pastoral authority to do so, and hopefully this will make a difference.

At the same time, he should ask each one directly if they have actually been saved and given their lives over to Christ. If so, he should ask them if they have been baptized as believers. If not, he should make arrangements for them to be baptized the following Sunday. It would appear that your family may not even be genuinely converted.

You do not need to respond to this in any way. If it makes perfect sense, implement this and see what happens. At the same time, without strict confidentiality, this will become a source of unacceptable gossip, so your must get a solemn commitment for confidentiality from the pastor/elder.

(You can even print this off and show it to whomever you invite so that they are perfectly clear as to what is required).
I have to say, if my husband EVER brought home the pastor to tell me I am wrong on a behavior, it would go over like a lead balloon. I would be FURIOUS with him, and I would NEVER attend the church of a pastor who believes it's okay to torpedo a membor of a family into behaving in a certain way to fit his, my husband's or anyone else's view of what's right or not.