The Visual Nature of Men

Ugly · Jul 5, 2014

An explanation is not a cop out. I can explain why i do something, that doesn't mean i'm saying its ok, or can't be worked on, or making excuses. I would simply be stating a fact, that show a reason for the behavior. But this is the typical American argument, that if you try to explain yourself you're not taking responsibility. But that's not the case.
If i were to say 'yeah well, this is how God made me, so this is what i'm going to do', then yeah, that's a cop out. But enlightening people as to why, as in this case, men struggle more with this issue than women, is just that. Helping people who don't understand learn to understand. But as usual there's always someone that has to turn it into something it's not for the sake of argument.

violakat · Jul 5, 2014

Ugly said:

An explanation is not a cop out. I can explain why i do something, that doesn't mean i'm saying its ok, or can't be worked on, or making excuses. I would simply be stating a fact, that show a reason for the behavior. But this is the typical American argument, that if you try to explain yourself you're not taking responsibility. But that's not the case.
If i were to say 'yeah well, this is how God made me, so this is what i'm going to do', then yeah, that's a cop out. But enlightening people as to why, as in this case, men struggle more with this issue than women, is just that. Helping people who don't understand learn to understand. But as usual there's always someone that has to turn it into something it's not for the sake of argument.

I don't think men struggle more. I think women are just more quite about their struggles, as it comes across as unladylike. Whereas with men, it's only manly.

JustAnotherUser · Jul 5, 2014

Arlene89 said:

-tries so hard to refrain-

Tintin · Jul 5, 2014

Arlene89 said:

Pity I'm not good with textiles.

rachelsedge · Jul 5, 2014

A CC member said this to me via PM one time. This is how I feel on it:

I don't think men were created to be more visual. And I don't think they necessarily are. I think that sin messed up a lot of stuff, for both men and women.

Arlene89 · Jul 6, 2014

Tintin said:

You don't need to go to the gym. All you have to do it put a moustached taco in your hands, take a picture of you and the taco, post it on facebook and you're already a stumbling block to people like myself. Now I'm tempted to buy some tacos. Thanks a lot.

Tintin · Jul 6, 2014

Arlene89 said:

Oh, you make me giddy, Arlene! That was beautiful. It's amazing and so unusual that someone cares about me like you do. Thanks so much for being your silly and serious self.

Arlene89 · Jul 6, 2014

Tintin said:

You know how those little kids that get really crazy excited when they just find out they are now a proud owner of one of the rarest and coolest Pokémon cards ever and they jump around and tell everyone about it and do lots of happy dances? Well, that's like me! But I don't want to catch them all, I'm just so amazingly happy I caught you! And you're even better than a Pokémon! Hahahahah!

CatHerder · Jul 6, 2014

Well, it goes both ways -

I, for my part, am practicing modesty by not going to the gym.
My six-pack abs are conservatively covered in a few layers of fat.
I refrain from push ups and the like, lest my "guns" get too big.
From the knees down, I am pretty sexy. I try to cover up my calves by wearing long pants. I sacrifice comfort during the summer months so as to not stumble my sisters. When I wear sandals, I try not to walk suggestively to call attention to my feet.
I sometimes skip shaving, so my boyish good looks don't cause my beloved sisters in Christ to sin, but this often backfires, because my stubble is downright sexy. This is where I figure that women have a responsibility in this walk too.
I have a car that I got for the gas mileage and the price, but some may consider it a "chick magnet." I keep it dirty so that I am not too desireable.

**sigh** It's not easy being beautiful.

jandian · Jul 6, 2014

Dress in a manner that will be pleasing to GOD and the argument will be over.

Fenner · Jul 6, 2014

CatHerder said:

Well, it goes both ways -

I, for my part, am practicing modesty by not going to the gym.
My six-pack abs are conservatively covered in a few layers of fat.
I refrain from push ups and the like, lest my "guns" get too big.
From the knees down, I am pretty sexy. I try to cover up my calves by wearing long pants. I sacrifice comfort during the summer months so as to not stumble my sisters. When I wear sandals, I try not to walk suggestively to call attention to my feet.
I sometimes skip shaving, so my boyish good looks don't cause my beloved sisters in Christ to sin, but this often backfires, because my stubble is downright sexy. This is where I figure that women have a responsibility in this walk too.
I have a car that I got for the gas mileage and the price, but some may consider it a "chick magnet." I keep it dirty so that I am not too desireable.

**sigh** It's not easy being beautiful.

This is all appreciated.

Tintin · Jul 6, 2014

Arlene89 said:

Aw, Arlene! You're too kind! I love that I have this effect on you! Love the Pokemon reference. Funny thing - last night at evening church we had a message about resting in God. It was really good and there was even a Snorlax Pokemon reference. Haha!

tourist · Jul 6, 2014

CatHerder said:

Well, it goes both ways -

I, for my part, am practicing modesty by not going to the gym.
My six-pack abs are conservatively covered in a few layers of fat.
I refrain from push ups and the like, lest my "guns" get too big.
From the knees down, I am pretty sexy. I try to cover up my calves by wearing long pants. I sacrifice comfort during the summer months so as to not stumble my sisters. When I wear sandals, I try not to walk suggestively to call attention to my feet.
I sometimes skip shaving, so my boyish good looks don't cause my beloved sisters in Christ to sin, but this often backfires, because my stubble is downright sexy. This is where I figure that women have a responsibility in this walk too.
I have a car that I got for the gas mileage and the price, but some may consider it a "chick magnet." I keep it dirty so that I am not too desireable.

**sigh** It's not easy being beautiful.

You are one amusing guy. I could learn from you.

GaryA · Jul 8, 2014

No, Kim -- Stilly did not make a thread about this very subject a few days ago. That is not what this thread is intended to be about. This thread was intended to help women understand the 'mechanics' behind what is going on in a man's mind when he looks at a woman's body.

It was not intended to chide, chastise, berate, blame, rebuke, scold, lambast, lecture, reprimand, criticize, ridicule, or punish women in any way whatsoever in the slightest degree.

It was not intended to be an "extension" of Stilly's thread -- or, I would have posted in his thread instead of starting a new one.

I find it interesting that, while making your "rebuttal", you also 'liked' post #8 -- considering that Ken is making the point and actually illustrating the fact that - the "visual nature of men" is so powerfully significant that people would go to such great lengths to magnify it and exploit people just to "heighten" the pleasure of it... ( my interpretation of his post )

Why do you think the world is so full of [ the exploiting of women's bodies ] if it were not such a powerful influence on men ?????????????????????????

biscuit - you are correct. There is a difference between appreciating the natural beauty of a woman's body and lusting after her body.

Loveneverfails said:

Good Point. I agree.

Aimee:

I am not making an argument. I am not in any way suggesting that we should "just accept it" and "behave like animals" -- on the contrary, I said:

GaryA said:

I also said:

GaryA said:

What I am saying is - that this "effect" actually does exist "at the physiological level"...

How do I know this?

Because I am aware of it.

( I am probably one of the most self-aware people you might ever have the chance to meet.

)

Where exactly did this come from?:

DuchessAimee said:

Who said anything about lack of control or obsession? Who said anything about blame?

My intent was to convey the pure, simple, fact about the existence of the "physiological level" perception / reaction of men with regard to women's bodies...

GaryA said:

secularhermit:

"I think 'misfired' is an understatement..."

Thank you, Ugly -- you seem to understand where I am coming from - and what this thread was intended to do -- inform, not incite...

seoulsearch · Jul 8, 2014

GaryA said:

Hmm. And I find it interesting that you're keeping track of the posts I like, though I don't feel I need to give explanations as to why I've liked them. Since you've pointed it out, however, I will say that I find the author of the particular post you zeroed in on to be particularly insightful and humorous, and I happen to like a lot of his posts.

If you have questions about why I've liked other posts as well, feel free to ask. (I almost feel slightly stalked!)

You made a thread about what you felt you needed to say... glad you were able to express your thoughts.

ChandlerFan · Jul 8, 2014

While I'm not sure that men are necessarily more visual than women, I don't believe that visual attraction is sinful (so I would disagree with what the person said to you in PM, Rachel). The reason is that there is so much beauty in God's creation, and God gave us eyes to see that beauty and brains to process it so that we might give Him glory for that beauty and splendor we see in it. I believe the same is true of the human body, and more specifically I believe that God created woman to be beautiful in the sight of man. There is nothing sinful about being beautiful or attractive, nor is there anything sinful about acknowledging beauty or feeling attraction. Song of Solomon is full of visual imagery about the beauty of the bride. That's why I don't believe that there is sin in being a visual person in terms of how you initially sense that someone is attractive.

Where it gets into the realm of sin is when you allow your eyes to stare and do double-takes in a way that is inciting lust in your heart and mind. Also, it is indeed sinful to only care and focus on the physical in a person with no care whatsoever for their soul. But that doesn't make visual attraction a result of the fall.

As far as modesty and lust goes, I think this is something that each gender needs to police for themselves. Men need to be worried and concerned about keeping their eyes, mind, and heart in check and hold each other accountable to that. Women need to consider what they are wearing and what their heart is behind wearing it.
Where I think things go wrong with men telling women or vice versa is that it comes across accusingly. Women don't want to hear from men that they need to dress more modestly. And if men are focused on honoring the Lord and the women around them and the women are focused on honoring the Lord and the men around them, we have a double safeguard against lust. And when someone fails to hold up their end of the bargain, that's on them.

Does it make it easier for me as a man to not see women with barely anything on or with clothes that emphasize certain body parts? Yeah. Do I have a lot of respect for women who choose to dress modestly? Totally. But that doesn't give me an excuse to lust after anyone, and I would never personally ask a woman to dress more modestly lest I be accused of making an excuse for myself or look as if I'm attempting to justify sin. What I will do is continue to ask the Lord to continue to redeem me from my sinfulness, that I would guard my eyes, mind, and heart so as to honor Him and the women around me.

I thought this article explained some things well and it's a message I think all men should heed:
Young Men, Sex, and Urge Ownership (And Why It's Not the Girl's Problem)

rachelsedge · Jul 8, 2014

ChandlerFan said:

I don't think the PM, nor I, am saying that visual attraction is a sin. I also believe that God gave us eyes for a reason, to appreciate the beauty He created and worship Him for it.

The issue lies when that kind of beauty is elevated, given special attention, worshiped instead of the Creator, or used to judge others. That goes for men and women, though since men usually are the culprits of "I was made this way" then that's who it usually focuses on.

So, really, I quite agree with you, I just wanted to point out that I don't think (or didn't intend for) the PM or my own stance to mean that any and all visual attraction is wrong.

ChandlerFan · Jul 8, 2014

That's fair

Thanks for clarifying that.

DuchessAimee · Jul 8, 2014

GaryA, you may say that this thread was simply to inform, but I don't buy it. I think you had other motives. For the record, you can say you're self aware and not truly be. Denial is a funny thing. Now, the reason I think you had other motives is because Stilly covered all the points you made. And honestly, he did a better job.

By the way, I said that you (or anyone, really) don't get to blame the opposite sex for their attraction or lust issues. And my point about physiology stands. Anything can be over ridden with enough work.

Whether a human is Christian or not, we as people are VERY well aware that we effect people on a physiological level. And anyone, assuming they're not a child, who denies that fact, is lying. A lot of people would rather not believe they have a physical effect on anyone, but that belief is simply nonsense and denial.

Fenner · Jul 8, 2014

Maybe I'm strange but I didn't find the original post offensive. I also don't think that he meant that men are pigs and can't control themselves. Just my opinion.

The Visual Nature of Men

Ugly

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