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ya know, it's really not a question of whether the law of Moses still stands or not. It's a question of what position a person has in relation to it. Those who believe into Christ have died to that law, and live to another law, i.e., the law of life and light. Yet some people still insist on remaining in the shadows...
You didn't misunderstand. You think the same way as most. That the Lord Jesus saved the bulls and goats and left you to obey the 10 commandments.
Colossians 2:14-15
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; [SUP]15 [/SUP]And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
The sacrifices weren't contrary to us. They were to temporarily atone for our sins. The 10 commandments are contrary to us.
Ephesians 2:15-17
[SUP]15 [/SUP]Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
[SUP]17 [/SUP]And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
Romans 8:2-6
[SUP]2[/SUP]For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
[SUP]4 [/SUP]That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
You know the carnal mind, the one that tries to use the flesh to "obey" the law.
How can the abolishing of the sacrifices cause carnal men to be reconciled to God???
Hebrews 7:15-19
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,
[SUP]16 [/SUP]Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]For there is verily a disannulling of the commandent going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.
The 10 commandments make nothing perfect. The 10 commandments demand a continual performance that the flesh cannot give. Because the 10 commandments are contrary to us. Following the 10 commandments by the power of your flesh and carnal mind is over, WAY over. That's the jewish way. The Christian way is by the Spirit. You can only get that by coming to Christ and having Him be your Lord and Saviour.
To answer your questions, Do I believe it is ok to murder, etc (10 commands)? No, of course not. But I know that there is no power in my flesh to perfectly obey God. The only law the flesh can perfectly maintain is the lust of the eyes, the lust of the flesh and the pride of life...
Which laws did the Lord Jesus free us from? ALL OF THEM.
Galatians 5:22-23
[SUP]22 [/SUP]But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
[SUP]23 [/SUP]Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Obeying commandments by your flesh and carnal mind cannot cause you to become spiritual. Only the Lord Jesus can cause someone to walk in the Spirit. Only the Holy Spirit can cause you to even understand this.
Otherwise you are trapped on HeRosefromthedead's merry go-round. Always learning but never able to arrive at the knowledge of the TRUTH.
Colossians 2:14-15
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; [SUP]15 [/SUP]And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
The sacrifices weren't contrary to us. They were to temporarily atone for our sins. The 10 commandments are contrary to us.
Ephesians 2:15-17
[SUP]15 [/SUP]Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
[SUP]17 [/SUP]And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
Romans 8:2-6
[SUP]2[/SUP]For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
[SUP]4 [/SUP]That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
You know the carnal mind, the one that tries to use the flesh to "obey" the law.
How can the abolishing of the sacrifices cause carnal men to be reconciled to God???
Hebrews 7:15-19
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,
[SUP]16 [/SUP]Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]For there is verily a disannulling of the commandent going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.
The 10 commandments make nothing perfect. The 10 commandments demand a continual performance that the flesh cannot give. Because the 10 commandments are contrary to us. Following the 10 commandments by the power of your flesh and carnal mind is over, WAY over. That's the jewish way. The Christian way is by the Spirit. You can only get that by coming to Christ and having Him be your Lord and Saviour.
To answer your questions, Do I believe it is ok to murder, etc (10 commands)? No, of course not. But I know that there is no power in my flesh to perfectly obey God. The only law the flesh can perfectly maintain is the lust of the eyes, the lust of the flesh and the pride of life...
Which laws did the Lord Jesus free us from? ALL OF THEM.
Galatians 5:22-23
[SUP]22 [/SUP]But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
[SUP]23 [/SUP]Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Obeying commandments by your flesh and carnal mind cannot cause you to become spiritual. Only the Lord Jesus can cause someone to walk in the Spirit. Only the Holy Spirit can cause you to even understand this.
Otherwise you are trapped on HeRosefromthedead's merry go-round. Always learning but never able to arrive at the knowledge of the TRUTH.
Being in the grace of Yeshua, we understand the desire to be obedient. Disputing with those who believe obedience is akin to bringing back the curse of the law is of no avail to us who are living in the freedom and grace afforded by the Blood of the Lamb of Yahweh. It is best to leave it for others to toil over, since it is no longer a burden for us.
Keep in mind these people will not even read the law for the wisdom found therein, therefor for either of us to contend on it is unfruitful because those who do not understand do not have the freedom given us.
Keep in mind these people will not even read the law for the wisdom found therein, therefor for either of us to contend on it is unfruitful because those who do not understand do not have the freedom given us.
We're not against the 10 commandments or the good they stand for. We're against the idea that trying to keep them achieves righteousness. Notice that I said trying. No man can keep the law because the law requires perfect obedience. Only Jesus could do, and did, that. Jesus is not a get-out-of-jail-free card. Those who try to be righteous through law and then use Christ's sacrifice as a mulligan (so to speak) when they screw up, dishonor Christ.
Obeying the sabbath by the flesh is a shadow. Obeying any of the commandments by the power of the flesh and carnal mind is a shadow.
The commandments are our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ. They don't cause a person to come to Christ unless they are followed perfectly. Only then can a person realize that the power of their flesh and carnal mind has no hope.
If you attempted to keep the sabbath perfectly by your flesh you would see what I mean.
Hebrews 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
That is the description for sabbath.
Matthew 11:28-30
[SUP]28 [/SUP]Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
[SUP]29 [/SUP]Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
[SUP]30 [/SUP]For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.
That's how its accomplished.
John 15:4-5
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
That's how its kept.
The commandments are our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ. They don't cause a person to come to Christ unless they are followed perfectly. Only then can a person realize that the power of their flesh and carnal mind has no hope.
If you attempted to keep the sabbath perfectly by your flesh you would see what I mean.
Hebrews 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
That is the description for sabbath.
Matthew 11:28-30
[SUP]28 [/SUP]Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
[SUP]29 [/SUP]Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
[SUP]30 [/SUP]For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.
That's how its accomplished.
John 15:4-5
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
That's how its kept.
The Apostle John being one of those "some"...
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
Actually, you are the one who keeps saying that those of us who beleive we should obey are obeying because we fear God and we are obeying because we believe that obedience saves us.
We have been saying all along that we are saved by grace but God requires obedience. Now if God does not require obedience, unrepentant child molesters, rapists and murderers are welcomed right into the Kingdom.
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
Actually, you are the one who keeps saying that those of us who beleive we should obey are obeying because we fear God and we are obeying because we believe that obedience saves us.
We have been saying all along that we are saved by grace but God requires obedience. Now if God does not require obedience, unrepentant child molesters, rapists and murderers are welcomed right into the Kingdom.
E
the ten commands are part of the law of moses. It is the law God gave moses, When he gave it he told them if they (Israel) keep these laws. god will bless them.. If they break them God will curse them. they were part of the old covenant of God..
You will also notice. They were given with all the laws of the sanctuary, the priesthood and everything else while moses was up on the mountain. (ex 24 on)
Do not separate them..
I notice that most leave out verse 9. I understand why, it does not support your position because it declares the Sabbath is still to be kept.
Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
And we all know that the word rest here is not katapausis, it is Sabbatismos and the meaning of it is a keeping of the Sabbath.
The Diaglott renders this verse nicely...
Heb 4:9 Therefore remains a keeping of a sabbath for the people of the God.
And again, the premise here is that someone believes that they are justified by works, saved by works or whatever. God saves us through faith that is not even ours, it is the faith of Christ. Difference is that some of us are striving to do what God says to do. Obey Him, which is our patience...
And again the Diaglott renders it nicely...
Rev 14:12 Here patient endurance of the holy ones is, those keeping the commandments of the God, and the faith of Jesus.
Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
And we all know that the word rest here is not katapausis, it is Sabbatismos and the meaning of it is a keeping of the Sabbath.
The Diaglott renders this verse nicely...
Heb 4:9 Therefore remains a keeping of a sabbath for the people of the God.
And again, the premise here is that someone believes that they are justified by works, saved by works or whatever. God saves us through faith that is not even ours, it is the faith of Christ. Difference is that some of us are striving to do what God says to do. Obey Him, which is our patience...
And again the Diaglott renders it nicely...
Rev 14:12 Here patient endurance of the holy ones is, those keeping the commandments of the God, and the faith of Jesus.
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