What Laws are still valid to christians

WomanLovesTX · Oct 18, 2013

Genesis 48:19
And his father refused, and said, I know it, my son, I know it: he also shall become a people, and he also shall be great: but truly his younger brother shall be greater than he, and his seed shall become a multitude of nations.

Romans 11:25For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

There is a mystery that God wants you to understand. These two passages are 100% connected. When I get home tonight I'll put the Strong's and other scriptures with this.

eternally-gratefull · Oct 18, 2013

homwardbound said:

ok then, lets start from here.

1. Non of us could fulfill the requirments of the law even if we tried.
2. If we do not fulfill the requirements, the condemnation is death
3. Jesus took this condemnation in our place.
4. We can KNOW the will of God in our lives by looking to him and studying the NT
5. We can know we are in the will of God, by understanding, if we are doing something for self (even a good moral deed) it is sin, Yet anything we do outward focused (the spirit) is pleasing to God.

What basis would one have to follow a law which can only condemn us?

Yes we should read it.

1. it points to Christ
2. it points to God and shows his just requirement which we have already affirmed we can't do anyway.
3. It shows us history and examples of people who tried to follow it and failed. And shows us these real life examples we can follow
4. It shows us, when we follow the law, We are bound to fail, Yet we risk tending to ignore parts of the law we struggle wiht as long as they are not severe sins, So we can LIE TO OURSELVES that we are following the law. And thus think we are OK with God.
5. It shows us how arrogant, How proud, And how foolish those who follow the law are. so we would not be like them
6. It CAN not show us how to be morally good. How to do the will of God, and how to live our daily lives minute by minute seeking God

so..........

Why do people demand we must follow this thing?? Which in reality, as Peter said, Puts us under the yoke that NO ONE IN THE OT could handle??

do we think we are better than the people of the OT??

homwardbound · Oct 18, 2013

just-me said:

I have always been a person that held the Mosaic Law in high regard. Today, that gets me labeled, and into trouble, because the norm seems to be that through Christ the Mosaic Law has been done away with despite the Words of Christ Himself. This is a statement from one who disagrees with what I believe.
“We are no longer under the Mosaic law as the way to righteousness and to salvation, because it is weak and useless to do either.” (Heb 7:18-19).

So I read Hebrews 7:18-19 (KJV)
[SUP]18 [/SUP]For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.

I still couldn’t get my head wrapped around the way this scripture was presented, because I believe there has never been righteousness achieved by being under the Mosaic Law. I’ve always thought that the Mosaic Law had a purpose however, but I knew it had no power to make a man or a woman righteous because humans are incapable. The Word says, if you break one of the least commandments, that you’re guilty of breaking all of them. It looks like verse 18 really does appear to read as if the Mosaic Law has truly been disannulled.

So then I saw it. There was something “going before” this disannulling. It was a “weakness and unprofitableness thereof.” A subtlety that was very easy to miss without study. This person was actually saying the law was weak, and never mentioned that the flesh was weak. I can now see the distortion of scripture, yet it was not misquoted, and was even the truth, as far as it went, but wasn’t the whole truth.
I suppose that if one wants to negate the Mosaic Law, and throw it away, they would have to declare it as the entity at fault. So I began to search scripture that said that the law was weak.

Romans 8:3 (KJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

Yes, the law is weak, but not in itself, it is us affiliated with it that makes it weak. That isn’t God’s fault, it’s our fault, for if we claim his Word as weak in itself without us being attached, we actually are equating God’s Word as weak instead of us. That way of thinking (for all intents and purposes) inadvertently makes God’s Word weaker than we are, and then we can claim strength in salvation by neglecting reality, and just go on our merry old way, singing “I’ll fly away”.
Our adversary doesn’t want us to recognize our nature in the flesh, he wants us to turn a blind eye to the reality that even though we are saved by the blood of Christ, we still have this old nature that fights within our members. The Mosaic Law in its entirety is like the mirror that the brother of Jesus mentioned.

James 1:23-25 (KJV)
[SUP]23 [/SUP]For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:
[SUP]24 [/SUP]For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.

God never negated the law, for He wants us to see ourselves as He sees us, and that leads us to the law of liberty, understanding that the law is good if we use it lawfully.

1 Timothy 1:8 (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP]But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;

From reading the history of the founding fathers of the United States, I think that the 1[SUP]st[/SUP] continental congress had this understanding when they signed the constitution.

Are you trying to show the difference of the flesh verses the Spirit of God? At least that is what I saw in your post here

homwardbound · Oct 18, 2013

LT said:

That fault is one's flesh Spirit that needs life in God's Spirit, true or false?

homwardbound · Oct 18, 2013

HeRoseFromTheDead said:

So are you doing this, you only need to answer to self,
Luke 6:32 For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them.

Linda70 · Oct 18, 2013

What Is The Christian's Relationship With the Old Testament Law?

The Bible says Christians are dead to the law (Romans 7:1-4). What does this mean?

(1) The law does not control the Christian's life (Romans 7:1-2). Christ is our new husband, and He controls our lives through the New Covenant. While the eternal principles of morality reflected in the law of Moses are respected by the Christian, our rule in life is not the law of Moses but the life of Christ as revealed to us in the New Testament

(2) The law cannot condemn the Christian (Romans 7:3). The Lord Jesus Christ took our condemnation upon Himself on the cross!

(3) The Christian serves Christ through the Spirit, not through his own power and wisdom (Romans 7:6).

The Difference Between Keeping the Old Testament Law and Living the Christian life.

(1) The motive is different: We do not live the Christian life in order to gain righteousness, blessing, and life, but because we already possess these things in Christ. We serve Christ out of a sense of gratitude because of the salvation God has given to us, not in order to earn salvation or escape judgment. We already have perfect righteousness (Romans 3:21-24; 2 Corinthians 5:21). We already have eternal blessing (Ephesians 1:3). We already have life (Ephesians 2:1).

(2) The power is different: We live the Christian life through the power of the indwelling Spirit, not through our own strength and wisdom (Romans 8:9-14).

(3) The compulsion is different: We live the Christian life because Christ lives in us and works in us (Colossians 1:29). The compulsion is from within. The law of God has been written on our hearts and compels us to serve God (Hebrews 10:16).

(4) The pattern is different: The Christian's goal is to be conformed to the image of Christ (2 Corinthians 3:18; Romans 8:29; 13:14; Colossians 3:10; Ephesians 4:23-24). The Old Testament law was only a shadow of Christ and of heavenly things (Hebrews 8:5; 10:1; Colossians 2:17; Romans 2:20). Now that the Lord Jesus Christ has come, we have the perfect pattern and substance.

Source: Way of Life Encyclopedia of the Bible and Christianity: LAW

homwardbound · Oct 18, 2013

Hizikyah said:

Only one wins the prize. Who won the prize? So whom do we need to be in by Faith, as so we have by that one and only one that has already won the prize at the cross and no other place?
Colossians 1:22 in the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

I see no way to improve on the above verse do you?
I mean it is like 100% of us die, and no one can improve on it can they?

homwardbound · Oct 18, 2013

vic1980 said:

1 Timothy 1:8

But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully; 9Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, 10For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine; 11According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.

So the Law stands upheld until Christ returns matthew 18:5 & 2 Peter 3:10 fullfillment. It is to edify those that do not understand there disobedience towards God i belive.

Someone who has faith in Christ fullfills all thee Law with Love, the same Love Jesus taught us. The fullfillment of the commandment is Love.

Romans 13:10 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law. 9For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Anyone have anything to add please share

God bless

Yes I do!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

homwardbound · Oct 18, 2013

eternally-gratefull said:

I truly am not sure how you can make that judgment when you do not know he motive(s) as she said you do not and asked how you would know, when only God knows her.
[h=3]Romans 14:4[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

[SUP]4 [/SUP]
Who art thou that judgest another man’s servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

[h=3]Romans 14:4[/h]Living Bible (TLB)

[SUP]4 [/SUP]They are God’s servants, not yours. They are responsible to him, not to you. Let him tell them whether they are right or wrong. And God is able to make them do as they should

eternally-gratefull · Oct 18, 2013

homwardbound said:

Scripture also teaches you can judge by the words and actions.

her words and actions show what she truly believes. And even you can see it, Unless you are hiding it.

Welshman · Oct 18, 2013

Jesus knows. His children have a sin issue, so does the father lol basic yes. Now save every person who ever lived be lost to god Jesus paid our price our sentence was upon him those that now trust Jesus not striving to any demands, but rather learn daily what he asks unto a perfect man ? We never be perfect bt our high priests blood reminds the father how he redeemed us? He doesn't see us as before seperated alienated from him he sees us as his whom The Lord chastises he loves amen

homwardbound · Oct 18, 2013

Hizikyah said:

Okay, so you are in The flesh or the risen Spirit of Christ? I am not concerned about what or how any man does after that. I am concerned of whether or not one is born again of God and does not make void the Law, rather upholds it, knowing one needs to be dead to the Flesh Spirit that has been dead in Adam since Adam fell.
Do you see this difference between flesh doing the Law for rewards and the new born again Spirit of God that is at rest in those that are born again? Teaching us daily to be dead to that dead flesh that we were first born with and thus alive to God in the
risen Spirit of Christ. Just asking to be clear on what you are promoting.
If I believe and Love all as God has done through Christ, and do not do the Torah, yet Love as God does am I still saved? In your opinion, now please remember that I love without condemnation to you or anyone else? thanks, I think your answer will clear up a lot.

WomanLovesTX · Oct 18, 2013

Linda70 said:

A Covenant of Marriage

Few people realize that the Old Covenant was essentially a marriage covenant...

Few people realize that the Old Covenant was essentially a marriage covenant—by which God "was a husband" to Israel (Jeremiah 31:13). In this covenant, Israel, the wife, had agreed to submit to God and obey His laws. But she did not. Israel's adultery with foreign gods was so heinous that God divorced His people except for a few who still tried to serve Him (Jeremiah 3:8, 14; Isaiah 50:1).
The people never had the right heart and mind to obey (Deuteronomy 5:29; Romans 8:7). This fault of the people, the book of Hebrews explains, was the problem with the Old Covenant—and the reason a New Covenant was necessary (Hebrews 8:7-8). The book of Hebrews actually quotes this important passage from Jeremiah twice (verses 8-13; 10:16-17).
What, then, is the New Covenant? It is basically a new marriage contract God lays out with Israel and Judah.

Who is Israel today? We are.

You asked "The Bible says Christians are dead to the law (Romans 7:1-4). What does this mean?"

It means we are dead to the covenant marriage law. God divorced the House of Israel. They scattered around the world and forgot their identity (became Gentiles). The OT law did not allow remarriage as long as the husband lived. After his death she could remarry and it satisfied the covenant marriage law. Because Christ (who is God in the flesh) died, He is now free to remarry Israel/ie. The Church. Thus the new covenant is Christ the Bridegroom and those who have been immersed in death, burial, and resurrection to a new life in Christ Jesus are His Bride.

In a previous post I put a mystery that God wants His children to understand. It pertains to the fullness of the Gentiles.

Welshman · Oct 18, 2013

What is the fullness of the Gentiles? What does it mean. And what is its mystery? Lookin forward to your view?

homwardbound · Oct 18, 2013

just-me said:

Originally Posted by HeRoseFromTheDead

IMO, it demonstrates the dishonest nature of law-cultist exegesis to exclude this verse that defines GOD's new covenant commandment:

This is [GOD's] commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. 1 John 3:23

I like this one. If another shall come in his own name, (believing not the writings of Moses) and we receive them, we are like the Pharisees.

John 5:42-47 (KJV)
[SUP]42 [/SUP]But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you.
[SUP]43 [/SUP]I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
[SUP]44 [/SUP]How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?
[SUP]45 [/SUP]Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust.
[SUP]46 [/SUP]For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
[SUP]47 [/SUP]But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

Thanks seeing the connection, of both as one in the Spirit of God not the letter of the Law

homwardbound · Oct 18, 2013

HeRoseFromTheDead said:

Was Moses cursed, what Law did Moses follow, the Spirit of Law, love or the letter as many of that nation did, whining and screaming in the desert in unbelief, even after they saw the miracles of God, they never exercised belief, so they never could enter his rest because of unbelief, for forty years, do you get it? praying so, There is a connection of either one believes and does as God leads by the Spirit and has entered into his rest or not.

eternally-gratefull · Oct 18, 2013

Welshman said:

Fullness of the Gentiles. - the alloted time of gentile rule to end with the destruction of the final world empire (rome) and the beast who sits on its throne

The mystery, No one could have foreseen the church, All OT prophesy concerning the Messiah told of a

1. King
2. Rule the world
3. Rule with iron rod
4. Sit on throne of David
5. Never die
6. Never suffer
7. Not have ANY enemies
8. Bring peace on earth to israel and every nation
9. All the world will go to jerusalem and worship him.

The suffering servant.

1. Will not be looked on
2. Will suffer a horrible death
3. Will take the sin of his people
4. Will be one of sorrows
5. Will hang on a tree

No one could have seen that these two people were the same.

homwardbound · Oct 18, 2013

Hizikyah said:

To be clear, is that the Spirit of the Law or the letter of the Law?

Welshman · Oct 18, 2013

Lets start at the start? When is the time of Gentiles end? What or whom is the beast? Are we still in time of Gentiles ? Lets start here please

homwardbound · Oct 18, 2013

Hizikyah said:

Wow!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks I understand the difference, and see I do not by Christ have a license to sin, rather a license in the ability to obey by the Spirit of God not flesh

What Laws are still valid to christians

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