How to know if you are sealed

[iamsoandso]

No, actually, I am just bringing out a point. You now have the lead in to tell us what you want about spirit and letter. My main purpose in posting here is to get people to read the scripture for what it really says and think about that. There are a lot more people reading these threads than ever post in them.

i agree with what you posted in post 162 and 164 on the idea of "circumcision of the heart",,deut 5;29 and it is also the same that paul said in romans 2;28-29,,,,,

 

[zone]

I would say most Christians recite Gal 2:19 (KJV) For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.


Gal 2:19 (CJB) For it was through letting the Torah speak for itself that I died to its traditional legalistic misinterpretation, so that I might live in direct relationship with God.

Does Jesus speak of traditional legalistic misinterpretations that we are to die to?

Many, many times He does. Why? Because of the traditions of men making the word of the Lord void.

Mat 15:3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?

Mat 15:6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.

Mar 7:3 For the Pharisees, and all the Jews, except they wash their hands oft, eat not, holding the tradition of the elders.

Mar 7:5 Then the Pharisees and scribes asked him, Why walk not thy disciples according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashen hands?

Mar 7:8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.

Mar 7:9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.

Mar 7:13 Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

Col 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

1Pe 1:18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

Jer 16:19 O LORD, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come unto thee from the ends of the earth, and shall say, Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit.

What should the Master (Yeshua/Jesus) find us doing when He returns? Keeping Torah.

Gal 3:10 For everyone who depends on legalistic observance of Torah commands lives under a curse, since it is written, "Cursed is everyone who does not keep on doing everything written in the Scroll of the Torah."

NOTE; It does not say "cursed is everyone who is doing" but "cursed is everyone NOT DOING".

" ...On this scale the Jewish New Testament tends toward the dynamically equivalent end of the scale. And at certain points especially related to the issue of Jewishness it becomes militantly so. For example, in other versions the Greek phrase upo nomon is usually translated "under the law". But because this rendering has been used to buttress anti-torah Christian theology, the Jewish New Testament spells out the meaning of these two Greek words in thirteen English words: "in subjection to the system which results from perverting the Torah into legalism." The Translator and His Interpretations. Which raises the question of whether the translator should "inject his opinions" into his translation. The Jewish New Testament cautiously answers in the affirmative,..."

- David Stern, xxi, Introduction, Jewish New Testament, The Complete Jewish Bible

 

[iamsoandso]

Honestly, we could get the bible to say anything we want by adding words that completely altar the text's meaning like the above two verses do.

"Azal revealed (Zechariah 14;5),,,thanks for posting that link and in it also is a prime example of with the misunderstanding of 3 verbs,,,,,that is it makes it read completely different,but i agree the interpreters of M.T. did not do that intentionally,,,

 

[iamsoandso]

i think the most direct path to "how do you know if you are sealed?",,,is rev.2;17,,," a white stone",, lhttp://lexiconcordance.com/greek/5586.html
a white stone is a "yes vote/seal",,,and a new name written ect.,,,,then the direct opposite is,, Strong's Number 5585 Greek Dictionary of the New Testament Online Bible with Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, Thayer's Lexicon, Etymology, Translations Definitions Meanings & Key Word Studies - Lexiconcordance.com 2:17 Ὁ "The-one" ἔχων "holding" οὖς "to-an-ear" ἀκουσάτω "it-should-have-heard" τί "to-what-one" τὸ "the-one" πνεῦμα "a-currenting-to" λέγει "it-fortheth" ταῖς "unto-the-ones" ἐκκλησίαις. "unto-callings-out-unto." Τῷ "Unto-the-one" νικῶντι "unto-conquering-unto" δώσω "I-shall-give" αὐτῷ "unto-it" τοῦ "of-the-one" μάννα "of-a-manna" τοῦ "of-the-one" κεκρυμμένου, "of-having-had-come-to-be-concealed," καὶ "and" δώσω "I-shall-give" αὐτῷ "unto-it" ψῆφον "to-a-pebble" λευκήν, "to-white," καὶ "and" ἐπὶ "upon" τὴν "to-the-one" ψῆφον "to-a-pebble" ὄνομα "a-name" καινὸν "fresh" γεγραμμένον "having-had-come-to-be-scribed" ὃ "to-which" οὐδεὶς "not-moreover-one" οἶδεν "it-had-come-to-see" εἰ "if" μὴ "lest" ὁ "the-one" λαμβάνων. "taking."

so in rev. 13;18 the word "count",,,,or to cast a vote(white stone or black stone) over the mark/name of the beast,,,,,then in rev.2;17 Jesus is stating he will cast/vote a white/yes stone,and on it write a new name(so your name is changed),on the white stone.,,,then compare this to (rev.3;5 and rev.3;12),,,,then (rev. 19;12 and 19;16),,

 

[iamsoandso]

here is the link from rev. 2;17 that does not work,,, Strong's Number 5586 Greek Dictionary of the New Testament Online Bible with Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, Thayer's Lexicon, Etymology, Translations Definitions Meanings & Key Word Studies - Lexiconcordance.com it is a little different word from the one used in rev. 13;18

 

[iamsoandso]

here's the question though,,,there is a man named George Carpenter,,,the lord writes his new name on a white stone,,,,which name is found in the "book of life"?,,,,,,

 

[weakness]

olossians 2:16-23, "16Let no one, then, judge you in eating or in drinking, or in respect of a feast, or of a new moon, or of sabbaths, 17which are a shadow of the coming things, and the body [is] of the Christ; 18let no one beguile you of your prize, delighting in humble-mindedness and [in] worship of the messengers, intruding into the things he hath not seen, being vainly puffed up by the mind of his flesh, 19and not holding the head, from which all the body — through the joints and bands gathering supply, and being knit together — may increase with the increase of God.20If, then, ye did die with the Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances? 21— thou mayest not touch, nor taste, nor handle — 22which are all for destruction with the using, after the commands and teachings of men, 23which are, indeed, having a matter of wisdom in will-worship, and humble-mindedness, and neglecting of body — not in any honour, unto a satisfying of the flesh."

I think we have v16 down, I want to focus on 20-23, as to see context. Shaul (Paul) in nearly all his thoughts talks about a topic and then goes on to explain, he uses an advanced style of writing as his (worldly) education was beyond that of the other NT writers.

20If, then, ye did die with the Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances?

So he is saying if your dead to the world why would you subject yourself to its (the worlds) ordinances. To think he is saying if your dead to the world then why would you subject yourself to Yahweh"s/Yahshua's Commandments would make no sense, but he explains it further.

21— thou mayest not touch, nor taste, nor handle

the pharisees had a law in which you could not eat meat and cheese togather, or even within 4 houhs of eachother. Now this is not in Yahweh's Law even, Yahweh's Law says dont boil a child in its mothers milk (3 times) (the local pagans had this as a religious practice Yahweh did not want His people to partake in these evil pagan practices) the pharisees using something called "midrashic interpretation" the pharisees looked at it and said well since it says this three times it must meant three different things. SO THEY MADE UP THEIR OWN LAW, that was completely disconnected from Scripture and enforced it as from Yahweh.

22which are all for destruction with the using, after the commands and teachings of men,

So here very clearly he states "the commandments of men", now if you read from 16-20 you see he stays on topic, and 20 says basically if your dead to the world why do what the world tells you, so we can see he is still on this topic from v16. In this verse 22, he says "which are all for destruction", how does Sabbath lead to destruction and it would also have to be a "commandment of men" if there is ant commandment that is the farthest thing possible from being a "commandment of men" it is the Sabbath, it was from creation and it shows the AUTHORITY of the Creator, the mark of the Creator. Also tying a "commandment of men" to destruction Romans 8:13, "For if you live according to the commandments of men, you will die; but if, through the Spirit, you put to death; put an end to, the evildoing of mankind, you will live."

23which are, indeed, having a matter of wisdom in will-worship, and humble-mindedness, and neglecting of body — not in any honour, unto a satisfying of the flesh.

Pleasing of the pharisees by following the talmud. v22 for context = "after the commands and teachings of men"

you see the pharisees would have a problem if you did things according to Yahweh's instruction and not their ORAL LAW, this is shown in MATT 15, 23, mark 7:7-9, etc

If you kept the Sabbath NOT according to the Talmud but according to the Scriptures the Pharisees would have a problem.

Matt 12:10 & 12, "And, behold, there was a man who had a withered hand. Then they asked
Him, saying; Is it lawful to heal on the Sabbath Days?--so that they might accuse Him."
"And how much more valuable is a man than a sheep? Therefore, it is Lawful to do righteousness on the Sabbath."

The "Rabbis" also made their own holidays, Haunnaka and Rosh hashanna and more. when they left babylon they even changed the names of the moons (months), and rosh hashanna even changes the time of the new year, commandment and ordinances of men. the calendar Yahweh instuted is Yahweh's calendar, the one who created it created the heavens and the earth. Our current calendar is the gregorian calendar, which goes back to the bablonian calendar. Yahweh said the days end and begin at sunset, not the "Rabbis."

% made up "feast days" the Pharisees may had, brought you to trial, beat, imprisoned, or even killed you for not honoring. The Talmud tells a story of another "Rabbi" disagreeing and wanting to follow the Scriptures, and the head Pharisees makes then man, on threat of death appear in public on a Scriptual Feast Day in a way that the man cant honor Yahweh, thus commanding him to disobey Yahweh.

Rosh Hashanah (New Year)
Rosh Hashanah occurs on the first and second days of Tishri (the 7th moon or month, Yahweh's year starts in the 1st month). In Hebrew, Rosh Hashanah means, literally, "head of the year" or "first of the year." Rosh Hashanah is commonly known as the Jewish New Year.

How does the year start in the 7th month? According to the Scriptures and Yahweh;s calendar the year starts in the 1st month, Abib.

Chanukkah
On the 25th of Kislev are the days of Chanukkah, which are eight... these were appointed a Festival with Hallel [prayers of praise] and thanksgiving. -Shabbat 21b, Babylonian Talmud

Tu B'Shevat
There are four new years... the first of Shevat is the new year for trees according to the ruling of Beit Shammai; Beit Hillel, however, places it on the fifteenth of that month. -Mishnah Rosh Hashanah 1:1

Purim
Is one of the most joyous and fun holidays on the Jewish calendar. It commemorates a time when the Jewish people living in Persia were saved from extermination.

Tisha B'Av
Five misfortunes befell our fathers ... on the ninth of Av. ...On the ninth of Av it was decreed that our fathers should not enter the [Promised] Land, the Temple was destroyed the first and second time, Bethar was captured and the city [Jerusalem] was ploughed up. -Mishnah Ta'anit 4:6[/QUOTE Paul and others do many times go on to explain their meaning and context. And in Col. the subject really starts earlier than 2:16. Verse 8 uses the phrase rudiments of the world then goes on to relate them directly to ordinances in the law(11) circumcision(13) trespasses, (14) ordinances that were contrary to us ( contrary because they brought death to us) and of course (16) Sabbath days.(14) blotting out the hand writing of ordinances( plural) that were contrary to us, and took it( singular)( the law) out of the way, (9) For in him dwelleth the fullness of the Godhead bodily. (10) And you are complete in him, which is the heed of all principalities and powers.(15) And having spoiled principalities and powers ,he made a show of them openly, triumphing over them in it. ( Gal 3:13) Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law ,being made a curse for us.( Gal 3:19) Wherefore then serveth the law???? It was added until until until !!!! UNTIL until UnTiL ! ! ( do you know what until means? ?) the seed should come, to whom the promise was made.(3:21) Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life verily righteousness should have been by the law (22) but the scripture hath concluded all all under sin, that the promise by faith of Christ Jesus might be given to them that BELIEVE.(23) but before faith came we were kept under the law.(24) Wherefore the law was our school master to bring us to Christ(25) But after that faith is come we are no longer under a schoolmaster ( THE LAW) Eph 2:15 And having abolished in his flesh the enmity , even the law of commandments contained in ordinances: for to make in himself of two, one new man, so making peace. Our Sabbath is every day ,We sit together in heavenly places, isn't sitting a restful position Don't we take all the weight off our bodies and onto the chair? Didn't Jesus say to believe on him that this was the work of God for us? We are to labor to enter into rest.wasn't the deliverance from pharaoh a rest ? their shoes and clothes waxed not old ,meat fell from God ,manna in the morning, water from a rock, isn't this a rest?/?/ Yet they provoked him. How much greater if we refuse him that speaks from heaven . Today if you hear his voice harden not your heart. as in the day they provoked him in the wilderness. If you want to observe a day(the law) which was meant to prove us of sin, go ahead. But I would rather enter the true rest of God that is in Jesus Christ , Everyday And tell others about this rest and salvation we have in Christ by Faith

 

[JesusLives]

did he really say this? is that how far gone they are? lol

Please say it isn't so.... is it us against them? Really?... No - In love let me remind us here on the site that if we call ourselves Christians then aren't we supposed to be on the same side?

Ephesians 6: 12-20 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all to stand. Stand therefore, having girded your waist with truth, having put on the breastplate of righteousness, and having shod your feet with the preparation of the gospel of peace; above all, taking the shield of faith with which you will be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked one. And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God; praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, being watchful to this end with all perseverance and supplication for all the saints--and for me, that utterance may be given to me, that I may open my mouth boldly to make known the mystery of the gospel, for which I am an ambassador in chains; that in it I may speak boldly, as I ought to speak.

We as fellow Christian need to unite against the real enemy and not each other. Trying to show the love. JesusLives

 

[JesusLives]

Your problem is that you can only conceive of obedience in terms of following the letters of the law of Moses. GOD said to obey his voice. GOD's voice is living and not static letters engraved in stone or written in a book. GOD also said that after Moses he would send a prophet speaking in his name. Jesus didn't give 10 commandments; he gave two - love GOD and love mankind. He is the one we are to listen to and obey.

Go and read Exodus 20: 1-19. God spoke the law before He wrote them on stone - Verse 19 says Then they (children of Israel) said to Moses , You speak with us, and we will hear; but let not God speak with us, lest we die.

The two commandments you speak of that Jesus said to Love God and Love man. Jesus was referring to the 10 in that the first 4 show our love and loyalty to God and the last 6 show our love toward man. Jesus said on these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. Matthew 22:40

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Go and read Exodus 20: 1-19. God spoke the law before He wrote them on stone - Verse 19 says Then they (children of Israel) said to Moses , You speak with us, and we will hear; but let not God speak with us, lest we die.

The two commandments you speak of that Jesus said to Love God and Love man. Jesus was referring to the 10 in that the first 4 show our love and loyalty to God and the last 6 show our love toward man. Jesus said on these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. Matthew 22:40

Yes the 10 are dependent on the two. If you do the two, you have done the 10. When Jesus was asked what the greatest commandment was, he didn't mention even one of the 10 commandments. He mentioned two that when obeyed satisfy everything required by the 10.

 

[cjordan38]

Wow doesnt the Word say if your offended in one point your guilty of the whole law...so if im a liar, im a thief and whoremonger as well...So if I break one commandment I break all...

 

[Hoffco]

Lets not get so patheticly stupid. If I don't kill someone I am not guilty of killing someone. Is that to hard to understand? God will not hold me guilty of killing someone if I have not killed someone. The "letter" of the law is what the judge looks for . Only God can hold me guity of not "loving" my neighbor. The civil judge can not fine me for not feeding my poor neighbors. As a Christian I want to help the poor all I can and if I can't help all the poor , no one can blame me for the little I do, good people will praise me for the good that I do. And God will praise me for every little help I do. We must keep the letter of all of the moral commands of God. And God demands 100% perfection; Both the "good" lost and the "wicked" lost, both, will go to Hell, but they are not judged the same. God is Just and will judge each person "according to their works" each will get the right degree, amount, of punishment , they deserve; but ,both are in Hell fire. SO, as far as being lost, both are lost, but the really wicked get a worse punishments. If a so called christians mocks God and doesn't care to be holy, because,
"SALVATION IS BY FAITH ONLY" and God knows, no one is perfect, so he beats up on others, verbally or physically, That person is lost.Because God says, only the good people are saved, only those who "sow to the Spirit " are saved. Gal. 6:7-10 etc. etc.. Grace teaches us "to deny ungodliness" and to live godly. Love is the goal of the lawkeeping ;but, you can not love if you don't keep the letter of the law first ,but you must do it out of love, to be well pleaseing , and a christian, before God. You people who are destroying the New Testament teaching are not christians at all. Christians are in a spiritual battle and part of that battle is to engage the evil peolpe who are destroying God's word, but we don't fight with physical weapons, unless we need to defend our selves physically, then I will kill physically to defend my self and my family. If I kill in the army, that is justified killing. Please read and teach the "whole teaching of God's word" We who believe are only beginning to enter our REST' But, our rest will not be fully enjoyed this side of Heaven and the new earth. The best is yet to come. I will not enter into "endless desputes" with mind less people. Love to all of good will, Hoffco

 

[cjordan38]

So in all those words you call God a liar. He said if your offended in one point your guilty of the whole law...Hey you steal you just as guilty as a liar and a liar will not tarry in his sight....If you dont like it then hey...I spread the word and keep moving so I said what I had to say...Whatever you mad at thats between you and God

 

[WomanLovesTX]

Yes the 10 are dependent on the two. If you do the two, you have done the 10. When Jesus was asked what the greatest commandment was, he didn't mention even one of the 10 commandments. He mentioned two that when obeyed satisfy everything required by the 10.

That's right. Jesus was not saying anything new or adding to the scriptures, He was quoting the Torah.

You also say "if you do the two, you have done the 10". So obeying is important, right?

Deu 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:
Deu 6:5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.
Deu 6:6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:

Deu 11:13 And it shall come to pass, if ye shall hearken diligently unto my commandments which I command you this day, to love the LORD your God, and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul,
Deu 11:14 That I will give you the rain of your land in his due season, the first rain and the latter rain, that thou mayest gather in thy corn, and thy wine, and thine oil.

Deu 11:18 Therefore shall ye lay up these my words in your heart and in your soul, and bind them for a sign upon your hand, that they may be as frontlets between your eyes. (Hands reflect what you do and when, "work" and frontlets between your eyes reflect "what you keep in your mind" - His Word.)

Deu 4:29 But if from thence thou shalt seek the LORD thy God, thou shalt find him, if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul.

Matthew 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

Mar 12:29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
Mark 12:30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
Mar 12:31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

Luke 10:27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.

There are over a 100 specific scriptures in the Torah regarding how to love and how not to treat your neighbour.

It is also true that of the Ten Commandments, the last six are how to love your neighbour and the first 4 are how to love Yahweh.

Eph 6:11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.
Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
Eph 6:13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.
Eph 6:14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth[SUP](1)[/SUP], and having on the breastplate of righteousness[SUP](2)[/SUP];
Eph 6:15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace[SUP](3)[/SUP];
Eph 6:16 Above all, taking the shield of faith[SUP](4)[/SUP], wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked[SUP](5)[/SUP].
Eph 6:17 And take the helmet of salvation[SUP](6)[/SUP], and the sword of the Spirit[SUP](7)[/SUP], which is the word of God[SUP](7)[/SUP]:


(1) Psa 119:142 Thy righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, and thy law is the truth.

(2) Psa 15:2 He that walketh uprightly, and worketh righteousness, and speaketh the truth in his heart.

(3) Isa 52:7 How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace; that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation; that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth!

(4) Psa 56:3 What time I am afraid, I will trust in thee.
Psa 56:4 In God I will praise his word, in God I have put my trust; I will not fear what flesh can do unto me.

(5) Psa 56:10 In God will I praise his word: in the LORD will I praise his word.
Psa 56:11 In God have I put my trust: I will not be afraid what man can do unto me.

(6) ... Isa 59:17 For he put on righteousness as a breastplate, and an helmet of salvation upon his head; and he put on the garments of vengeance for clothing, and was clad with zeal as a cloke.
Isa 59:18 According to their deeds, accordingly he will repay, fury to his adversaries, recompence to his enemies; to the islands he will repay recompence.
Isa 59:19 So shall they fear the name of the LORD from the west, and his glory from the rising of the sun. When the enemy shall come in like a flood, the Spirit of the LORD shall lift up a standard against him.
Isa 59:20 And the Redeemer shall come to Zion, and unto them that turn from transgression in Jacob, saith the LORD.
Isa 59:21 As for me, this is my covenant with them, saith the LORD; My spirit that is upon thee, and my words which I have put in thy mouth, shall not depart out of thy mouth, nor out of the mouth of thy seed, nor out of the mouth of thy seed's seed, saith the LORD, from henceforth and for ever.

(7) Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

 

[Elin]

God is not wrong, your interpretation is.

God said that you will face the judgment, then you will know if you are saved or not.

God said nothing about "then."

You are adding your word to the word of God.