Do Christians who commit suicide go to Heaven?

[Abing]

I fi murder someone and then repent for it before my death God will forgive me. However if I murder someone and then refuse to repent , then die, I will have to answer for my sin.

I totally Agree.

What I believe is when you commit a sin, you need to repent. not because you wanna be saved again, but to keep the relationship with God.
And well I'm not sure about this, but i agree more on, like when you commit a sin and you don't repent, you go to hell
Cause God's way is the narrow way, the road to heaven is not easy, if it was that easy that after you got saved, sinning will be of no big deal, then wow!
and God said to the woman, go and sin no more. God saved us for us to cleanse our sins.
sin after sin we need to repent. Acts 2:38 and

1 Behold, the LORD's hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear:
2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.


Isaiah 59:1,2



i guess this is a different topic but i just wanna share.

 

[NazariteNation]

Also I simply don't see how Sanctification and Once Saved Always Saved can co-exist. We are clearly called to conform to the likeness of Christ (which is a life long journey) however, if you believe in "eternal security" then what's the point of Sanctification or repentance for that matter? This doctrine has way too many loop holes in it that I feel justifies sin.

Isn't sin the reason why Adam fell? Didn't Jesus sacrifice his life for the forgiveness of sin? Wasn't the gospel given to the Gentiles because of Jews reluctance to believe (aka sin)? Does scripture not clearly state that God hates sin? I'm sorry but I simply can not dismiss the seriousness of sin than easily.

This doctrine is way too sugar coated for me to swallow...

 

[Abing]

True that.

And there is nothing to argue about the only way to be saved coz it's only thru Jesus and not our works.
But the point is, our works can separate us from God.

 

[Baptistrw]

I hope and pray that you don't not take my enquirees as being a personal attack. That not my intention at all. Personally I would love to sit down and discuss (not debate) this issue with someone face to face in a brotherly manner in oder to get a better understanding of each other's point of view.

Although I am a continuationist, I live in North Carolina where the Baptist faith is prevalent and would like to familiarize with the Baptist belief system as well as the Methodist belief system in the hopes that we can work together to win souls without stepping all over eachothers toes because of doctrinal differences.

I have no problem with that sort of approach. But when someone starts attacking someone and their beliefs on matters rather than the topic discussed as some do, I take offense to it.

 

[NazariteNation]

When we get saved our past sins are forgiven not our future.
Romans 3:25 Whom God has set forth to be a propitiation through faith in His blood, to declare His righteousness for the remission of sins that were past; through the forbearance of God.

If we continue to sin after salvation then we are not truly saved or have backsliden.
Titus 1:16 They profess that they know God: but in works they do deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

Hebrews 10:26-27
26 For if we willfully sin after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation that shall devour the adversaries.

1st John 1:6 If we say we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not know the truth.

1st John 2:4 He that says, I know Him, and keeps not His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

If we willfully commit murder and then die with repentance we will not go to Heaven

I think Onwings pretty much nailed the coffin shut with the scriptures given from Romans & Hebrews. Here is how they read in the New King James:

"For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed, to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus." (Romans 3:23-26)

"For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries." (Hebrews 10:26-27 - I PERSONALLY FEEL THIS SCRIPTURE SAYS IT BEST!!!!)

 

[Baptistrw]

I think Onwings pretty much nailed the coffin shut with the scriptures given from Romans & Hebrews. Here is how they read in the New King James:

"For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed, to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus." (Romans 3:23-26)

"For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries." (Hebrews 10:26-27 - I PERSONALLY FEEL THIS SCRIPTURE SAYS IT BEST!!!!)

The passage in Hebrews needed to be examined in light of its audience and historical context. See my previous post on the explanation of that passages. Also see Hebrews 6.. 4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, 5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, 6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. Heb 6:4-6 (KJV)

 

[NazariteNation]

Also see Hebrews 6.. 4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, 5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, 6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. Heb 6:4-6 (KJV)

That piece of scripture is clearly speaking of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit which I feel is a different matter altogether. Personally I don't see how that applies to this discussion.

However, I will look up the chapter in Hebrews as you suggested to get a broader view.

 

[NazariteNation]

As for your reference to Hebrews, the background is the defiant sin of Numbers 15:30-31 for which there was no propitiatory offering. If a person rejects the truth of Christ's death for sin, there is no other sacrifice for sin available and no other way to come to God. Only judgment remains (Hebrews 10:27). )

After reading the entire chapter in Hebrews, in my opinion, I believe you may be the one who are taking it of context. The author only speaks of the old sacrifices earlier in the chapter in order to highlight the significance of Christ's sacrifice which begins with Hebrews 10, verse 19 and continuing on till verse 38 which I believe gives several examples to the possibility of backsliding (forfeiting their salvation).

Hebrews 10:19-38 (NKJV)

Therefore, brethren, having boldness to enter the Holiest by the blood of Jesus, by a new and living way which He consecrated for us, through the veil, that is, His flesh, and having a High Priest over the house of God, let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. 23 Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for He who promised is faithful. And let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching

For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. Anyone who has rejected Moses law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The LORD will judge His people.” It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

But recall the former days in which, after you were illuminated, you endured a great struggle with sufferings: partly while you were made a spectacle both by reproaches and tribulations, and partly while you became companions of those who were so treated; for you had compassion on me in my chains, and joyfully accepted the plundering of your goods, knowing that you have a better and an enduring possession for yourselves in heaven. Therefore do not cast away your confidence, which has great reward. For you have need of endurance, so that after you have done the will of God, you may receive the promise:

“For yet a little while, And He who is coming will come and will not tarry.Now the just shall live by faith; But if anyone draws back, My soul has no pleasure in him.”

 

[onwingsaseagles]

I tend to agree with this assessment however I approach it from another angle. Please keep in mind that I don't believe one can involuntarily lose one's salvation but that it can be willingly forfeited.

My problem with the doctrine isn't so much the package, it's the presentation. I know far too many people who clearly have no idea what it means to truly be saved, claim that they are saved even though they are currently living in fornication, committing adultery, abusing drugs, etc. However, despite theirobvious misgivings, they are absolutely convinced that they are saved because at some point in time in their life they repeated the sinners prayer and were baptized in water.

The sad part is when I have approached friends and coworkers who I believe are sincere about their salvation who share your point of view, I ask them about these folks who are obviously deceived and I get the some cold and uncompassionate response: "They're not saved." However when you ask them if they're concerned about these people I get the ussual "Why? You can't tell them nothing."

Which is true, you can't tell them anything because they have already put their trust in a doctrine which clearly has bad fruit.

I agree with this entire statement, even the part that you cannot involuntarily give up your salvation but murder/suicide in not an involuntary action.Hebrews 10:26-27 says if we willfully sin after salvation we loose our hope and have fire and indignation to look forward to.

 

[NazariteNation]

After reading the entire chapter in Hebrews, in my opinion, I believe you may be the one who are taking it of context. The author only speaks of the old sacrifices earlier in the chapter in order to highlight the significance of Christ's sacrifice which begins with Hebrews 10, verse 19 and continuing on till verse 38 which I believe gives several examples to the possibility of backsliding (forfeiting their salvation).

Hebrews 10:19-38 (NKJV)

Therefore, brethren, having boldness to enter the Holiest by the blood of Jesus, by a new and living way which He consecrated for us, through the veil, that is, His flesh, and having a High Priest over the house of God, let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. 23 Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for He who promised is faithful. And let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching

For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. Anyone who has rejected Moses law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? For we know Him who said,

 

[onwingsaseagles]

True that.

And there is nothing to argue about the only way to be saved coz it's only thru Jesus and not our works.
But the point is, our works can separate us from God.

Exactly Abing, our works can't save us but they can condemn us.

 

[NazariteNation]

Settles it for me...

 

[NazariteNation]

I agree with this entire statement, even the part that you cannot involuntarily give up your salvation but murder/suicide in not an involuntary action.Hebrews 10:26-27 says if we willfully sin after salvation we loose our hope and have fire and indignation to look forward to.

Suicide is definitely voluntary & premeditated.

 

[onwingsaseagles]

One who continues in unrepentent sin after salvation was never saved to begin with and will thus end up in hill. As I said, if we could lose eternal life, which we can't, then it's not very eternal is it? And how can someone be unborn? Good luck explaining that! The sacrifice of Christ is sufficient for all man, but only efficient for those who believe.

We receive eternal life by overcoming until the end not by saying the sinners prayer. Mathew 24:13, Mark 13:13, and Revelation 2:26 are just a few verses that tells us this.

 

[onwingsaseagles]

Here are those references

Matthew 24:13 But he who endures to the end shall be saved.

Mark 13:13 And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake. But he who endures to the end shall be saved.

Revelation 2:26 And he who overcomes, and keeps My works until the end, to him I will give power over the nations.

 

[Baptistrw]

That piece of scripture is clearly speaking of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit which I feel is a different matter altogether. Personally I don't see how that applies to this discussion.

However, I will look up the chapter in Hebrews as you suggested to get a broader view.

Neither of those passages were speaking of blasphemy of the Holy Ghost.

 

[Baptistrw]

So when does a person receive eternal life onwingsaseagles? After they have worked their entire life trying to keep God's commands?

 

[onwingsaseagles]

So when does a person receive eternal life onwingsaseagles? After they have worked their entire life trying to keep God's commands?

We shouldn't have to try to keep God's commandment we should gladly keep them, and if we do not keep them we do not belong to Him.

1st John 2:4 He who says, I know Him and do not keep His commandment we lie and do not know the truth.

1st John 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome.

 

[Baptistrw]

Nice job avoiding the question. Have a good time trying to keep all of God's commands perfectly for the rest of your life which is impossible to do because of our sinful flesh. 20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain. Galatians 2:20-21 (KJV)

 

[onwingsaseagles]

Nice job avoiding the question. Have a good time trying to keep all of God's commands perfectly for the rest of your life which is impossible to do because of our sinful flesh. 20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain. Galatians 2:20-21 (KJV)

1st off you obviously do not know what those verses mean. 2ndly if those verses are true in your life, then the discussion of OSAS is mute, only the sinner that confesses Christ needs the OSAS doctrine to sleep at night.