AM I JEW OR A GENTILE IF I KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS ?

[Timeline]

Karraster, where did you get this from? (and this one of the reasons typing is bad, because I am actually just asking and not attacking)

God's Word will stand forever. The Word also says when Messiah comes, Torah will be sent to the nations, we will keep the Feasts, everything will be restored. Why in the would would anyone let the adversary win by believing God's Laws are done away with? What? Did He institute them, then say nevermind because Christians are privileged? Only to restore them again when Messiah reigns on earth? Is God the same yesterday and today and forevermore?

 

[KohenMatt]

The jews were ALWAYS under grace, David assures us of this in the psalms. It is the one who thought they were saved by the law that missed out, they rejected grace, and tried works.

YES!!! EXACTLY!!!

And it is these people that Paul spent so much time correcting.
And it is these people today that I pray will change. I know several, and I am sadened by them.

 

[chubbena]

I will also add.....the whole point of Revelation is.....

The Revealing of Jesus Christ as he is now as God on Throne and the Events that He brings to pass so as to reveal himself to the world as God......I find it interesting that he shuts down the sun, moon and stars before he reveals the brilliance of his power and the eyes as the flames of fire and a face as bright as the sun......

Your right...he does not come back as a lamb, but rather as a Lion...of the Tribe of Judah with full right and authority to sit upon the throne of David ruling the world with a rod of iron from the world capitol Jerusalem!

That's when the moon will shine like the sun, and the sunlight will be seven times brighter, like the light of seven full days, when the Lord binds up the bruises of his people and heals the wounds he inflicted cf Isaiah 30.
Of course before that the sun, moon and stars which give light would be covered by the smokes from the bottomless pit.
Of course the deceivers would like us to think this is literal rather than spiritual.

 

[KohenMatt]

There is a saying down South......."don't pay no heed to folks who talk outta both sides of their mouths.........."

KohenMatt Quotes this Scripture:
Matthew 5:19

"Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven."
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KohneMatt responds to e…t…

1. Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull
​

Law law says if you commit adultery, You and the one you committed the sin with must be stoned.

So how many adulterers has your church stoned.

Can you imagine if we as a society decided to implement this standard and punishment? If it happened only once, I think you would see a SERIOUS decline in adultery.

Mind you, I'm saying we should. But it's an interesting thought.
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KohenMatt’s Comment
Who here is advocating keeping "ALL THE LAW literally" to the point of sacrifices and stoning?

(please read Matthew 5:19 KohenMatt quoted)

Personally though, I can find a spiritual application to every command in the Torah, and a physical one for a large amount of them.

And in regards to your request, what do you mean by "bound to obedience"? I think this is a crucial phrase to understand before it can be answered.

Peace,
Matt

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ZINZERIO’S Comment

1. Originally Posted by p_rehbein
​

I have only one question to ask: How many folks have you and your group killed according to the Law?

Can you be more pacific and tell what people you are talking and what people do the murder ? and is ther a name for this group ?
ZINZIERO’s Comment
i have one thing to say and one thing only
1 John 2:3-5

New King James Version (NKJV)

The Test of Knowing Him


[SUP]3 [/SUP]Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. [SUP]4 [/SUP]He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. [SUP]5 [/SUP]But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him.


(excerpt from my comment)

Exodus 20:24) An altar of earth thou shalt make unto me, and shalt sacrifice thereon thy burnt offerings, and thy peace offerings, thy sheep, and thine oxen: in all places where I record my name I will come unto thee, and I will bless thee.
25 .) And if thou wilt make me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it. 26 .) Neither shalt thou go up by steps unto mine altar, that thy nakedness be not discovered thereon.

Leviticus 20:7) Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I am the LORD your God. 8 .) And ye shall keep my statutes, and do them: I am the LORD which sanctify you. 9 .) For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him. 10 .) And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death. 11 .) And the man that lieth with his father's wife hath uncovered his father's nakedness: both of them shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. 12 .) And if a man lie with his daughter in law, both of them shall surely be put to death: they have wrought confusion; their blood shall be upon them. 13 .) If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. 14 .) And if a man take a wife and her mother, it is wickedness: they shall be burnt with fire, both he and they; that there be no wickedness among you. 15 .) And if a man lie with a beast, he shall surely be put to death: and ye shall slay the beast.

Leviticus 24:15) And thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel, saying, Whosoever curseth his God shall bear his sin.
16 .) And he that blasphemeth the name of the LORD, he shall surely be put to death, and all the congregation shall certainly stone him: as well the stranger, as he that is born in the land, when he blasphemeth the name of the Lord, shall be put to death.

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KohenMatt’s comment #164 this thread

rehbein,

For the record, I've never ONCE advocated doing every command physically. Obviously, I'm not advocating the killing or stoning of people, and I'm slightly embarrassed for you that you even brought up such a silly example.

My point is that every command of the law has a spiritual and/or physical application to it for Christians today.

But the fact still remains, Jesus told His followers to follow the Law.

Matthew 5:19

"Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

Not for nothing, but you guys are doing no more than "tap dancing" through all of this.......

Given your refusal to be specific, honest, and definitive.............I am exiting this thread, and any future discussions you guys are a part of...........

Not sure if you're still paying attention to this thread.....

But you've got a couple of different conversations referenced in this post. I can't speak for Zin, but could you clarify what part I play in this post?

Thanks.

 

[KohenMatt]

No, He is saying spiritually he is niether jew or gentile. He is saying he is a forigner in a strange land, He is saying his home is heaven, And until he gets home, he will be a stranger.

Right. Thank you.

The only land I'm a stranger in is this one. Thankfully, I am no longer a stranger in God's Kingdom, praise God!

 

[JaumeJ]

Everyone please bear in mind, the New Jerusalem is the capital of the Israel of God. As is written in the New Testament, we now are joined to the commonwealth of Israel. It is worth some meditation. Praise our blessed Salvation, amen.

 

[john832]

Adultry was s sin before God wrote the words in stone.

This is the part you do not get

What you don't seem to get is the Law was in force before Mt. Sinai. The seventh Commandment was in force at the time of Adam and Eve. The Law is not a temporary thing from Mt. Sinai to the crucifixion, it is eternal.

 

[john832]

Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all they soul, and with all they mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love they neighbour as thyself. ON THESE TWO COMMANDMENTS HANG ALL THE LAW AND THE PROPHETS.

so, if we summarize the Ten Commandments in to the Two Great Commandments, are the Ten now done away? Or are they safely hanging on the Two?

The law has been condensed into two commandments by Jesus himself. For the law is fulfilled in one word, in this: Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. . . But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. (Gal. 5:14,18) If you love the LORD your God with all you heart, soul, mind, and strength - you will not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain -

And if you love your neighbor as yourself - you will not commit adultery.

A very lovely sentiment, but the Apostle Paul disagrees. He plainly says that there is a nature in him that is warring against the Godly nature and he still did things he should not...

Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Rom 7:15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
Rom 7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
Rom 7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

He was still looking to Christ to save him from his nature over twenty years AFTER his conversion. It didn't happen to him as you would suggest, he still did the things he should not and needed Christ to deliver him from the death penalty...

Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

Unlike some who have arrived at a sinless state, Paul said he fought his nature continually...

1Co 9:25 And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.
1Co 9:26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:
1Co 9:27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

Php 3:10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
Php 3:11 If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
Php 3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
Php 3:13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
Php 3:14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good that he may have to give to him that needeth.

Now why would that instruction even be needed? After all, upon conversion one would NEVER think of stealing. *cough, choke*

Now, I have said all along that the OT 10 commandments are carried on throughout the NT - The thing is the law includes not only the 10 Commandments but also the many Levitical laws - and to obey the law we must obey all of it - Has Christ died in vain? . . .

So, do we obey all, any or none? It is pretty much all or none...

Jas 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
Jas 2:11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.

Which of God's Laws are we free to disregard and break with abandon?

I am crucified with Crhist: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain. (Gal. 2:20,21)

And who says that righteousness comes by the Law? Who has said salvation comes by the Law?

Why would anyone want to put themselves under the yoke of bondage? Why is it everyone wants to quote the Ten Commandments like that is all there is in the law?

What is that yoke of bondage? Explain it to me if you will. Please show me how not committing adultery, not stealing, not taking the name of God in vain is a yoke of bondage.

Show me why this passage is false...

Psa 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.
Psa 19:8 The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart: the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes.
Psa 19:9 The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether.
Psa 19:10 More to be desired are they than gold, yea, than much fine gold: sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.
Psa 19:11 Moreover by them is thy servant warned: and in keeping of them there is great reward.

Perhaps the yoke of bondage is something different than the Law of God but please, show me how the Law of God is a yoke of bondage.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

It appears that the Jews (Scribes and Pharisees) thought it heresy for Paul to teach the Jews and Gentiles to forsake Moses’ teachings by not being circumcised, and to not live by the religious customs of the Jews. (Acts 21:21)

Then Paul said that in order to show that he was not doing this, have the 4 Jewish men who believed what Paul was teaching, follow through with their Nazarite vow, and shave their heads. (Acts 21:23-24)

Follow along if you please:

Paul went in with us unto James and all the elders were present - Paul declared particularly what things God had wrought among the Gentiles by his ministry.

And when they (James and all the elders present) heard they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law: they are informed of thee (they know about you) that thou teachest all the Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children, neither to walk after the customs. (that is what he was teaching) [To show this is what was being taught by the church: Acts 15:5 But there rose up certain of the Pharisees which believed (still zealous for of the law), saying that it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses. And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter. . . Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel and believe. . . .And put no difference between us and them purifying their hearts by faith. Now therefore why tempt ye God to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathres nor we were able to bear? But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.]

What is it therefore? the multitude must needs come together: for they will hear that thou art come. (What should we do because there will be a multitude come together because they know you are hear)

Do therefore this that we say to thee: We have four men which have a vow on them; (Ok, this is what we [James and the elders] want you to do) Them take, and purify thyself with them, and be at charges with them that they may shave heads: and all may know that those things whereof they were informed concerning thee, are nothing but thou thyself also walkest orderly, and keepest the law. (This is what we want you to do - take these four men and purify yourself with them so the multitude which will be against you, will believe you walk orderly according to the law. IOW - we will do this because we want to try to keep you out of prison)

So the next day - Paul took the men and purified himself with them and when the seven days were almost ended - when the Jews saw him in the temple, they stirred up all the people, and laid hands on him: This is the man, that teacheth all every where against the people (Jews) and the law and this place: and further brought Greeks also into the temple, and hath polluted this holy place.

As far as the Gentiles who believed, Paul wanted the Pharisees to notice that the Gentiles were to stay away from things offered to idols, drinking blood, eating strangled animals, and sexual promiscuity. (Acts 21:25)

Not Paul . . . As touching the Gentiles we have written - we who? James and the elders If we are going to quote the scripture then it should be done correctly.

Then as a Jew, Paul associated himself with the 4 Nazarite men who had a vow, and followed through with the ordinances of the Mosaic law. The offering mentioned was not a sacrifice for sin, but rather an offering according to temple worship. (Acts 21:26, Leviticus 7:16, Numbers 6:2-8)
After being arrested, Paul speaks in “tongues” Greek to the Roman soldier and Hebrew to the Jews, in order to show them he was a Jew. Because Hebrew was being spoken they listened to him. (Acts 21:40)

I asked when you last posted this - did you put tongues in quotes specifying the manifestation of the Spirit? Paul was a Roman (Acts 16:37,38; Acts 22:25-27) and a Pharisee (Acts 23:6) he knew the language.

When Paul said that He was called by Jesus to minister to the Gentiles, that was the last straw for the Pharisaical Jews. (Acts 22:21-23)

This is parallel to the mindset of the same people who arrested, and crucified Jesus Christ. But as we all know the accusation was false. (Acts 32:29)

And finally, Paul outwardly states that he has in no way taught against the law of Moses or the prophets, just as Jesus said that nothing would be taken away from the law and the prophets. (Acts 24:14)

Acts 12:14
But this I confess unto thee, that according with the way they call a sect, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

Paul outwardly states - I worship the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets. Wouldn't Paul have been teaching the same thing as Peter did in Acts 15? It was the church, the apostles and the elders that were teaching something so different from what the Jews knew and believed according to their Law that caused the imprisonment, the beatings, the persecution of the apostles and the church.

So I have a question that I will answer for all who are reading this.
What have we learned from this story recorded in Acts, and what does the adversary fervently desire within the ranks of the church, (both Jew and Gentile) since the time of the ministry of our Lord Jesus Christ began?

Answer:
To separate the Jew from the Gentile, and separate the testimony of the grace of Jesus Christ from the law and the prophets, endorsing false doctrines of distortion, and railing false accusations toward those that teach of the true grace of Jesus Christ. Sound familiar?

The adversary wants Christians persecuted every where for teaching the truth concerning the love of Christ, salvation by faith in our Lord, how that faith will bring forth good fruit, how we are to stand fast in the liberty wherewith Christ has made us free and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. (Sound familiar? same thing said in Acts 15)

Jesus said He came to divide, (Luke 12:51) and then seems to contradict Himself by saying a house divided against itself cannot stand. (Matthew 12:25) God’s kingdom, being ALL of the Word of God, is not divided, and He didn’t have any part of it crucified. Sin has been crucified pertaining to us, NOT pertaining in any way to His kingdom.

If all the law changed because of the one change of the Priesthood changing to another tribe, the earth we are now standing on doesn’t exist according to the words of Jesus, and the jots, and tittles that have been thrown into never never-land will come back some day soon, like the fire from heaven that destroyed Sodom, and Gomorrah.

Gal. 5:2-7 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love. ye did run well; who did hinder you that ye should not obey the truth? . . . .v13,14 For, brethren, ye have been called to liberty; only not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another. For all the law is fulfilled in one word, in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as theyself.

 

[RedTent]

One side of this argument says that God did not cancel when He sent His Son, and when it explains fulfilling and replaced that Christ did, it was in the sense of completed and made perfect, not in the sense of getting rid of. The other side talks of everything of the OT made obsolete, and the law must not be listened to any more. They say that such as grace and the Holy Spirit is not only wonderful to be relied on, but if you have them they mean other wonderful things must be eliminated.

The side for keeping all of God gives scripture to back up their position and reasons they think their position is God based.

The other side uses character assassination and accusing of others to make their points. I have gathered some of their reasons that they declare they are right in what God says: 1. You don't go to Christ for salvation, you are dead in your sins. (In other words, go to hell) 2. You are a hypocrite. 3. You despise Christ. !!!! 4. You hate and despise the New Testament. 5. Bringing up the OT makes you look foolish. !!!! 6. You spit in the face of salvation. (Another way of saying go to hell) 7. You refuse to listen to the NT.

These, they say, are the reasons to believe that much of scripture has to be gotten rid of because of the wonders of scripture that they know of.

 

[john832]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to RedTent again.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Well I can't see how people are acting but I can certainly see how people are saying.

you can't?

so you can't see people saying one thing yet acting another?

You can;t see people ignore others, while at the same time talking about them (backbiting)

You can't see people continually bearing false witness against others?

You can;t see people say they have done something when they have not?

you can't see them demand repect when they do not show respect?

You must have a blind eye my friend.

 

[Zinzerio]

sinless perfection explained

Micah 7:18-19

New International Version - UK (NIVUK)

18 Who is a God like you,
who pardons sin and forgives the transgression
of the remnant of his inheritance?
You do not stay angry for ever
but delight to show mercy.
19 You will again have compassion on us;
you will tread our sins underfoot
and hurl all our iniquities into the depths of the sea.

Isaiah 43:25

New International Version - UK (NIVUK)

25 ‘I, even I, am he who blots out
your transgressions, for my own sake,
and remembers your sins no more.

Hebrews 8:12

New International Version - UK (NIVUK)

12 For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more.’[a]

Hebrews 10:17-18

New International Version - UK (NIVUK)

17 Then he adds:

‘Their sins and lawless acts
I will remember no more.’[a]

18 And where these have been forgiven, sacrifice for sin is no longer necessary.


1 John 5:18

New International Version - UK (NIVUK)

John 14:15

18 We know that anyone born of God does not continue to sin; the One who was born of God keeps them safe, and the evil one cannot harm them.


Jesus Promises the Holy Spirit
15"If you love Me, you will keep My commandments. 16"I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever;…

Love and hatred for fellow believers

3 We know that we have come to know him if we keep his commands. 4 Whoever says, ‘I know him,’ but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in that person. 5 But if anyone obeys his word, love for God[a] is truly made complete in them. This is how we know we are in him:


OK i hope that this is the end to the argument how i see sinnless perfection

 

[eternally-gratefull]

why do you keep saying where not under the law ? no one has said other wise i think or at least i have not herd anyone say we are under the law.

Everyone who states the law is not fulfilled in Christ, Is not fading away, and is just as applicable today for us than it was in the OT, and we must obey the commands is saying we are under law.

Don't you get it?

It is like saying I am in the United states, And I have to obey their laws. But I am not under their law. Both can not be true.

This topic could be very good to people who want to learn about Jews and gentiles, but if all this arguing carries on the thread will probably get closed and brothers and sisters who are wanting to fellowship in this thread or draw nearer to the lord will miss out.

So we should just continue to let people say things which are not true. Lie about others?

Sorry, As long as this happens, and people continue to want to place us under th eburden of the law. There will be arguments. There can be no fellowship with those who deny the words of God.

This is exactly what is happening here .

I will now attempt to reach you one last time.
People who are in God the lord will remember there sins no more, THIS IS NOT ME CLAIMING SINNLESS perfection, so please don't think that way about me.

I have searched and searched the scriptures to add edification for this thread and even you .
A child of God is kept safe from the evil one a child of god is loved and a child of God loves his fellow Israelite s in Christ.

A child of God becomes light in burden the farther banishes his sins in to the sea of forgetfulness (again this is not sinless perfection but it is close to it wasH rinse and repeat these word and understand that i am not claiming to be better than you or anyone else,

1 Peter 5:6-11

New International Version - UK (NIVUK)

[SUP]6 [/SUP]Humble yourselves, therefore, under God’s mighty hand, that he may lift you up in due time. [SUP]7 [/SUP]Cast all your anxiety on him because he cares for you.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]Be alert and of sober mind. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour. [SUP]9 [/SUP]Resist him, standing firm in the faith, because you know that the family of believers throughout the world is undergoing the same kind of sufferings.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]And the God of all grace, who called you to his eternal glory in Christ, after you have suffered a little while, will himself restore you and make you strong, firm and steadfast. [SUP]11 [/SUP]To him be the power for ever and ever. Amen.

ok. When are we going to see this?

When are we going to see humility?

When are we going to see people who will admit they have not answered questions. Admit they are bearing false witness of others, Admit they are saying one thing, and acting another?

I would love to see it myself.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

To expand, I think its necessary for everyone, on both sides of the fence, to clarify why "we need to follow it all". For what purpose do we need to follow it all? What happens if we do? What happens if we don't? All commands of the Law have application physically and/or spiritually. The applications may change, but the principles are still the same.

Well I think Paul already answered this for us. (the question as to what happens when we do not follow ALL of the law) As did moses.


Gal 3:
[SUP]10 [/SUP]For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.”[SUP][e][/SUP] [SUP]11 [/SUP]But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for “the just shall live by faith.”[SUP][f][/SUP] [SUP]12 [/SUP]Yet the law is not of faith, but “the man who does them shall live by them.”[SUP][g][/SUP]

[SUP]13[/SUP]Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”),

 

[Jda016]

I haven't read the whole thread, but are people actually arguing that none of the ten commandments matter anymore? That being a Christian means you can covet your neighbors wife, murder, have idols, etc?

I truly hope such an insidious and false doctrine has not spread in the church.

 

[Zinzerio]

Everyone who states the law is not fulfilled in Christ, Is not fading away, and is just as applicable today for us than it was in the OT, and we must obey the commands is saying we are under law.

Don't you get it?

It is like saying I am in the United states, And I have to obey their laws. But I am not under their law. Both can not be true.

what Jesus fulfilled the law means means he defeated satin by coming in the flesh and not breaking any commandments i believe he did this to show his people it can be done and he is the one who can do it and he can also help you to do it,

it may be true that we may fall but that is something you should not worry about because the lords know if you are a tryer or a quitter. the important is you get back up again

So we should just continue to let people say things which are not true. Lie about others?

Sorry, As long as this happens, and people continue to want to place us under th eburden of the law. There will be arguments. There can be no fellowship with those who deny the words of God.

you should forget past iniquities speak in love and kindness dont give the enemy a foot hold by repaying eveil with evil.

When are we going to see humility?

When are we going to see people who will admit they have not answered questions. Admit they are bearing false witness of others, Admit they are saying one thing, and acting another?

I would love to see it myself.

what does it matter about the people who will not answer your question ? you have people who are including me if you want to have a private just ask.
that is what your email button is for please consider using it because many people are afraid sometimes including me to speak on the internet. you are worth more than many sparrows

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I agree. Salvation is one thing; the starting point if you will. Sanctification is what takes place afterwards, in response to that salvation. It affects every part of our life. At least it should.

yes.

salvation;

1. Saved from eternal wrath
2. Saved from a life of conflict between you and God
3. Saved from the destruction which we were headed for if we continued in our sinful ways
4. Saved from a life of trying to find joy through drugs and alcohol, sex, entertainment, money, work, etc etc...
5. Saved from the fear that comes with knowing you are rightly condemned because of your alienation form god and life of sin
6. Saved from the fear of death, because you know your eternal future
7. saved from the fear of having to take care of yourself. because no one else will help you
8. Saved from the fear of suffering and tribulation which comes from living in a sinful world.
9. Saved from the popular saying "YOLO" (You Only Live Once) because you know this life is not all there is.

I am sure I have missed many, But I hope people get the point.

This is what God has saved us from. Yet from what I see and hear in here. People still fear these things. It is sad that the power and grace of God has not touched their lives, and they still have to live in fear. They say they have the words of truth, and those like myself have not. Yet their doctrine does not save them from most of the things God came to save us from!

 

[KohenMatt]

I haven't read the whole thread, but are people actually arguing that none of the ten commandments matter anymore? That being a Christian means you can covet your neighbors wife, murder, have idols, etc?

I truly hope such an insidious and false doctrine has not spread in the church.

No, I don't think anyone is saying that.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Before that, false prophets shall be rampant, like OT times, saying to the people peace, peace when there is no peace for the way of the people is wicked. The people say "Leave this way, get off this path, and stop confronting us with the Holy One of Israel." Leaders for the money gladly comply.
The two witnesses shall come, speak the truth, they'll say "Ask for the ancient paths, ask where the good way is, and walk in it, and you will find rest for your souls", said the same the OT prophets.
To be persecuted because of the Word or to exchange gifts with superficial love?
Decision time.

for those of us who have found the "good news" of Jesus Christ, and have experienced it personally.

We have no fear of these things..