Does water baptism save us

[saved1975]

there is something wrong with your Greek bible, because mine says water baptism does save us.

Where does the Bible say water baptism saves??.
And don't say, Mk 16: 16, Because Jesus said, HE THAT BELIEVETH, Then he can be baptised,
The Greek says the emphasis for, "Saved", in Mk 16: 16, Is on the BELIEVING, not baptism, Didn't Jesus prove it??, He went on to say, "He that believeth not shall be damned".
Jesus didn't say, "He that isn't baptised shall be damned", Putting the emphasis for salvation on the Believing.

And don't say Acts 2: 38, Because in the Greek there are subjects, verbs, persons and numbers, And the all have to agree in order to build a doctrine.
Now "REPEN YE", and "YE SHALL RECEIVE THE GIFT OF THE HOLY GHOST", Agree in person and number.
But, "Be baptised everyone of you", is completely different in person and number to Repent ye, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Again the Greek emphasis for "Remission of sins", in Acts 2: 38, Is on the "REPENTING", Not baptism.
And don't say Acts 22: 16, Because the Greek emphasis for, "Washing away sins", Is on the,
"Calling on the name of the Lord".
Also Acts 9: 6--17 tells us that Paul was saved three days before he was baptised in the Holy Ghost, And that was before he was baptised in water..

And don't say, 1 Pet 3: 21, Because Peter didn't say baptism saves, He says baptism is only a figure, A symbol.
And the Greek backs him up, by saying water baptism is,
"An expression of our ALREADY salvation, Not the medium for salvation, A symbol of salvation, Not the cause of salvation.
And don't say Gal 3: 27, Because baptism in only the symbol of salvation, We put on Christ through the rebirth, Not water baptism.
PLUS, If baptism saves, Why didn't it save the disciples, As they were baptised way before Jesus died. See Jn 3: 22--26.

 

[Elizabeth619]

Where does the Bible say water baptism saves??.
And don't say, Mk 16: 16, Because Jesus said, HE THAT BELIEVETH, Then he can be baptised,
The Greek says the emphasis for, "Saved", in Mk 16: 16, Is on the BELIEVING, not baptism, Didn't Jesus prove it??, He went on to say, "He that believeth not shall be damned".
Jesus didn't say, "He that isn't baptised shall be damned", Putting the emphasis for salvation on the Believing.

And don't say Acts 2: 38, Because in the Greek there are subjects, verbs, persons and numbers, And the all have to agree in order to build a doctrine.
Now "REPEN YE", and "YE SHALL RECEIVE THE GIFT OF THE HOLY GHOST", Agree in person and number.
But, "Be baptised everyone of you", is completely different in person and number to Repent ye, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Again the Greek emphasis for "Remission of sins", in Acts 2: 38, Is on the "REPENTING", Not baptism.
And don't say Acts 22: 16, Because the Greek emphasis for, "Washing away sins", Is on the,
"Calling on the name of the Lord".
Also Acts 9: 6--17 tells us that Paul was saved three days before he was baptised in the Holy Ghost, And that was before he was baptised in water..

And don't say, 1 Pet 3: 21, Because Peter didn't say baptism saves, He says baptism is only a figure, A symbol.
And the Greek backs him up, by saying water baptism is,
"An expression of our ALREADY salvation, Not the medium for salvation, A symbol of salvation, Not the cause of salvation.
And don't say Gal 3: 27, Because baptism in only the symbol of salvation, We put on Christ through the rebirth, Not water baptism.
PLUS, If baptism saves, Why didn't it save the disciples, As they were baptised way before Jesus died. See Jn 3: 22--26.

Please show the Greek references to back up your claim instead of "Don't say...". Without evidence of your claim then this has no meaning. All it shows is your own interpretation with no evidence of truth.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Who has denied faith? No one. Not one person in this thread has said faith isn't part of the gospel or that it isn't needed. Nor has anyone said faith has nothing to do with baptism

Where does baptism come in? Can one have faith before being baptized? or do they have to wait to get baptized?

That is what you are acting like. Why would you make the statement about faith above if you didn't think that way?

You misunderstood my statement. Thats all

Your problem is, is the your view of "work" Jesus' death was a work.

Yes it was his work. Not mine. Baptism in water is my work. Not his.

Wouldn't "calling on the name of the Lord" be a work as well?

How is me calling on someone else to do work in me a work of mine? Can I boast of this?

Faith without works is dead. If one's faith is dead how are they part of the body of Christ? How are they saved? When one refuses works they are showing an unchanged life. Their heart is "dead".

Ah here we go.

If i had true faith, And was truly saved by faith. Would I reject being baptized as God commanded me. or would I do the work God asked me to do?
See you still are not listening to me, You act as if I am telling someone never to be baptized. Or that we should not do it at all. This would not be the case.

A person who claims to be a Christian and lives in willful disobedience is not saved. This is why baptism is a large part of one's salvation. Now, is baptism the only thing that gets you saved? Nooooooooo.

And we would agree. A person who is saved would not continue in disobedience.

But then we go 180 degree apart. As baptism in water does not save you, Will not save you, and has never saved anyone. That is adding a work of men and replacing the work of God.

You obviously have to believe the gospel, and you can't believe the gospel unless you heard it. Once you believe one would have to admit they're a sinner and confess Jesus is Lord. If you cannot admit you're a sinner then you never understood the gospel. Then, one is baptized into the death, burial and resurrection in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost to begin their new transformed life as a Christian.

You are correct in almost all aspects.

Except as I said earlier, It is God who baptizes us into the death and burial and body of Christ (baptism of the spirit)

Once this occures, we are washed, we are born again, We are adopted as his children. Our salvation is complete. All by the work of God. THEN we should obey God and be baptized in the name of the fatehr son and spirit. because we are now disciples.

 

[Alligator]

What does 1 Peter 1:18-19 say?

1 Peter 1:18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;
1 Peter 1:19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

You say "water" saves, 1 Peter 1:19 says we are saved/redeemed "with the precious BLOOD of Christ". 1 Peter 3:21 says that baptism is the "like FIGURE". It doesn't say that water will redeem you or wash your sin away. Scripture does not contradict Scripture...so which is correct? Are we saved by water baptism (which is the "like figure") or by "the precious blood of Christ"? Can't be both.

You misunderstand the Scriptures. Acts 22:16 does, in fact, say that baptism washes away sins. Of course, we are saved by the blood of Christ. There is no contradiction unless one is trying to force a contradiction because of their personal beliefs. But how do we contact His blood. See Gal. 3:26-27, we are Baptized into Christ.

 

[Hoffco]

Where does the Bible say water baptism saves??.
And don't say, Mk 16: 16, Because Jesus said, HE THAT BELIEVETH, Then he can be baptised,
The Greek says the emphasis for, "Saved", in Mk 16: 16, Is on the BELIEVING, not baptism, Didn't Jesus prove it??, He went on to say, "He that believeth not shall be damned".
Jesus didn't say, "He that isn't baptised shall be damned", Putting the emphasis for salvation on the Believing.

And don't say Acts 2: 38, Because in the Greek there are subjects, verbs, persons and numbers, And the all have to agree in order to build a doctrine.
Now "REPEN YE", and "YE SHALL RECEIVE THE GIFT OF THE HOLY GHOST", Agree in person and number.
But, "Be baptised everyone of you", is completely different in person and number to Repent ye, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Again the Greek emphasis for "Remission of sins", in Acts 2: 38, Is on the "REPENTING", Not baptism.
And don't say Acts 22: 16, Because the Greek emphasis for, "Washing away sins", Is on the,
"Calling on the name of the Lord".
Also Acts 9: 6--17 tells us that Paul was saved three days before he was baptised in the Holy Ghost, And that was before he was baptised in water..

And don't say, 1 Pet 3: 21, Because Peter didn't say baptism saves, He says baptism is only a figure, A symbol.
And the Greek backs him up, by saying water baptism is,
"An expression of our ALREADY salvation, Not the medium for salvation, A symbol of salvation, Not the cause of salvation.
And don't say Gal 3: 27, Because baptism in only the symbol of salvation, We put on Christ through the rebirth, Not water baptism.
PLUS, If baptism saves, Why didn't it save the disciples, As they were baptised way before Jesus died. See Jn 3: 22--26.

Your words condemn you! You quote the Bible then, you deny the Bible verse which you just quoted; Is you brian short of a full load, or the fuses all burned out? Love Hoffco

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You misunderstand the Scriptures. Acts 22:16 does, in fact, say that baptism washes away sins. Of course, we are saved by the blood of Christ. There is no contradiction unless one is trying to force a contradiction because of their personal beliefs. But how do we contact His blood. See Gal. 3:26-27, we are Baptized into Christ.

Yes, We are baptized into Christ.

Now one must ask. Who has the power to do this?

well Galations tells us, The one who rose Christ from the dead, (did your pastor do this, Did Your priest do this? Did some pope or apostle do this?) well even you would say no to all these.

Yet you claim when you say one is baptized into Christ when we allow ourselves to be immersed in water,

Paul makes it clear, ,"In the working of God, Who raised him from the dead"

We are literally baptized into Christ. No water is involved, God did not replace OT circumcision (which never saved anyone) with NT baptism (which will also save no one) they are both symbolic traditions which symbolise what GOD HIMSELF does. That is why Paul said, Not done with the hands of men, but of God.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Your words condemn you! You quote the Bible then, you deny the Bible verse which you just quoted; Is you brian short of a full load, or the fuses all burned out? Love Hoffco

dude, you need to walk away and ask God to show you how ungodly your attitude and name calling is so unlike him.

 

[Alligator]

You think Peter (God's Word) is referring to a water baptism here? Wow! I am not even English and I know Peter is talking about the Baptism of the Holy Spirit here. THE RESURRECTION of Jesus Christ is not in WATER... It is IN SPIRIT. So it is the SPIRIT BAPTISM that makes Jesus ALIVE IN US....

NO one can have a clean conscience being baptized in water, but in Spirit comes ALL the heavenly gifts, of which the clean conscience is one of the gifts.

Some of you people will do anything to get water baptism out of the bible. Yes, as a matter of fact, I firmly believe he was speaking about water baptism because that is what it says. Did you read all the verse where it talks about comparing baptism to the flood?

 

[Alligator]

The Greek tells us what the English Biblical texts mean.
Abd it tells us that water baptism doesn't save.
And if you take the New Testament as a whole, you will see that water baptism doesn't save.

I must say that is the most feeble attempt I have seen to get water baptism completely out of the Bible.

 

[Alligator]

You can disagree all you want, but it doesn't change the truth.
Paul was ALREADY saved when Acts 22: 16 says be baptized and wash away thy sins.
He was saved at least three days before.
Baptism in Acts 22: 16, is just symbolic of an ALREADY SAVED PERSON.

As has already been proven to you, this is blatantly false.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

As has already been proven to you, this is blatantly false.

if this is true, No one in the OT was saved. because they did not do a requirement for salvation. Nor were the gentiles of Cornelius' house. Not have many thousands of people who did not have a chance to be baptized.

 

[Jackson123]

Matt 28:19
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Let me repeat my question.

Did every body who went to baptism ritual change his life?

Catholic said baptism will make person renew by Holy spirit.
If this true, then after baptism ritual person change and become holy person.

The fact is there is sex party in Vatican.

The player there not only being baptize but they are priest who has authority to baptize.

I believe as long as person not baptize by those three name, they not going to change.

Ritual it self is just a symbol.

It doesn't matter if you baptized 100 feed under water as long as you not baptize in the name of Father son and Holy spirit.

It will not change you and mean not save you.

Remember if the branch not bear the fruit will cut and throw in to the fire/hell.

 

[Alligator]

Where does the Bible say water baptism saves??.
And don't say, Mk 16: 16, Because Jesus said, HE THAT BELIEVETH, Then he can be baptised,
The Greek says the emphasis for, "Saved", in Mk 16: 16, Is on the BELIEVING, not baptism, Didn't Jesus prove it??, He went on to say, "He that believeth not shall be damned".
Jesus didn't say, "He that isn't baptised shall be damned", Putting the emphasis for salvation on the Believing.

And don't say Acts 2: 38, Because in the Greek there are subjects, verbs, persons and numbers, And the all have to agree in order to build a doctrine.
Now "REPEN YE", and "YE SHALL RECEIVE THE GIFT OF THE HOLY GHOST", Agree in person and number.
But, "Be baptised everyone of you", is completely different in person and number to Repent ye, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Again the Greek emphasis for "Remission of sins", in Acts 2: 38, Is on the "REPENTING", Not baptism.
And don't say Acts 22: 16, Because the Greek emphasis for, "Washing away sins", Is on the,
"Calling on the name of the Lord".
Also Acts 9: 6--17 tells us that Paul was saved three days before he was baptised in the Holy Ghost, And that was before he was baptised in water..

And don't say, 1 Pet 3: 21, Because Peter didn't say baptism saves, He says baptism is only a figure, A symbol.
And the Greek backs him up, by saying water baptism is,
"An expression of our ALREADY salvation, Not the medium for salvation, A symbol of salvation, Not the cause of salvation.
And don't say Gal 3: 27, Because baptism in only the symbol of salvation, We put on Christ through the rebirth, Not water baptism.
PLUS, If baptism saves, Why didn't it save the disciples, As they were baptised way before Jesus died. See Jn 3: 22--26.

Naturally you do not want to hear any of those scriptures because you can't answer any of them.

 

[Alligator]

if this is true, No one in the OT was saved. because they did not do a requirement for salvation. Nor were the gentiles of Cornelius' house. Not have many thousands of people who did not have a chance to be baptized.

Why do you think no one in the Old Testament was saved? What requirements are you talking about? Also, the household of Cornelius were baptized.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Why do you think no one in the Old Testament was saved? What requirements are you talking about? Also, the household of Cornelius were baptized.

1. Because baptism was only for priests. If salvation is a prerequisite, Then alot of people missed out.

2. Cornelious and his family were already saved when they were baptized. I am not downing baptism, or telling people not to be baptized. I am rejecting the fact that a physical water baptism done by the hands of men will save anyone (or be a part of their salvation)

 

[Alligator]

1. Because baptism was only for priests. If salvation is a prerequisite, Then alot of people missed out.

2. Cornelious and his family were already saved when they were baptized. I am not downing baptism, or telling people not to be baptized. I am rejecting the fact that a physical water baptism done by the hands of men will save anyone (or be a part of their salvation)

baptism had nothing to do with salvation in Old Testament times. Baptism represents the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ as explained in Romans 6:3–4. It is only after the death of Christ that baptism was required for salvation.
Please give me the scripture that says the household of Cornelius were saved prior to being water baptized.

 

[Elizabeth619]

Where does baptism come in? Can one have faith before being baptized? or do they have to wait to get baptized?


You misunderstood my statement. Thats all


Yes it was his work. Not mine. Baptism in water is my work. Not his.

How is me calling on someone else to do work in me a work of mine? Can I boast of this?



Ah here we go.

If i had true faith, And was truly saved by faith. Would I reject being baptized as God commanded me. or would I do the work God asked me to do?
See you still are not listening to me, You act as if I am telling someone never to be baptized. Or that we should not do it at all. This would not be the case.





And we would agree. A person who is saved would not continue in disobedience.

But then we go 180 degree apart. As baptism in water does not save you, Will not save you, and has never saved anyone. That is adding a work of men and replacing the work of God.



You are correct in almost all aspects.

Except as I said earlier, It is God who baptizes us into the death and burial and body of Christ (baptism of the spirit)

Once this occures, we are washed, we are born again, We are adopted as his children. Our salvation is complete. All by the work of God. THEN we should obey God and be baptized in the name of the fatehr son and spirit. because we are now disciples.

Bottom line is if you aren't obedient then you were never saved in the first place, and no one said the actual water saves. The physical, wet, clear water is just that. Water. It isn't blessed. It isn't prayed over, and the HS is sitting in there taking a bath. It is just water. We are commanded to be baptized IN WATER, but the water itself is not the salvation. The obedience to do so is the key here darlin, and I was baptized in the name of the father, son and holy ghost...IN WATER. This is not the work of man, but we can't baptize ourselves so a man has to administer it. There is no power in the man, and it is not coming from him. OR does God not work through people anymore?

Looks to me you are talking about two separate baptisms. There is only ONE baptism. Not two.

 

[Linda70]

Acts 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
Acts 10:45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 10:46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
Acts 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
Acts 10:48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

The household of Cornelius received the gift of the Holy Ghost BEFORE they were water baptized.

 

[Elizabeth619]

1. Because baptism was only for priests. If salvation is a prerequisite, Then alot of people missed out.

Yet many were required to wash themselves in water if they touched anything unclean. Check out Leviticus. Anytime they did something unclean they had to wash themselves to make themselves clean.

 

[Kerry]

I think you have to be saved in order to be baptized. I meant what sinner wants to be baptized? We are saved by the blood of Christ then we have a longing to be baptized and it is an outward show of an inward change nothing more and nothing less. I know people that have been baptized and you wouldn't think that they were christian by the way the act. I meant bad fruit. But, if you ask them they say oh yeah I was baptized when I was 5 so i'm good with God.