Free Gifts Come With Conditions....

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SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#141
Mar 12, 2014
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#141
dcontroversal said:
HAHAHA NO doubt......the analogy is excellent and obvious....the truth always blares louder than the biggest heresies...
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Again, posthuman said:

SeaBass, in my garden the blueberries are ripe.

i set a mouthful aside for you. they are yours, a gift.

if you don't come to me and eat them soon, they will rot and be eaten by bugs.

they will rot because they are yours, and no one else will eat them.

A CONDITION was put upon the free berries and me working to meet the condition does not earn me the free berries.
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#142
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
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#142
crossnote said:
''Obeying from the heart'' is faith/truly believing that form of doctrine...
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Obedience is doing what Christ said not just sitting and thinking about it.


Again, them being made free from sin was conditional upon them first obeying from the heart.
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#143
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
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#143
dcontroversal said:
HAHAHA NO doubt......the analogy is excellent and obvious....the truth always blares louder than the biggest heresies...
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It was heresy that God required the Hebrews to work to gather the free manna?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#144
#144
SeaBass said:
It was heresy that God required the Hebrews to work to gather the free manna?
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yep. those poor hebrews. walking around bragging about how hard they had to work to pick up this manna. Maybe it was so heavy it took three people to pick up one peace and take back to thier houses? Thats why they were bragging?
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#145
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
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#145
eternally-gratefull said:
yep. those poor hebrews. walking around bragging about how hard they had to work to pick up this manna. Maybe it was so heavy it took three people to pick up one peace and take back to thier houses? Thats why they were bragging?
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So God is guilty of heresy for requiring the Hebrews work to gather the manna. Anything else God is guilty of?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#146
#146
SeaBass said:
So God is guilty of heresy for requiring the Hebrews work to gather the manna. Anything else God is guilty of?
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lol. They did not work. again prove to me how they could boast of picking up that manna.

Was it to heavy?

Was it flawed in any way?

what was wrong with this manna that the hebrews had to work so hard, and they could go around boasting how they had to work so hard to eat, or they would die?
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#147
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
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#147
eternally-gratefull said:

lol. They did not work. again prove to me how they could boast of picking up that manna.

Was it to heavy?

Was it flawed in any way?

what was wrong with this manna that the hebrews had to work so hard, and they could go around boasting how they had to work so hard to eat, or they would die?
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Did not work???????????? Gathering the manna was not work?

Are you thinking something is only work if one can boast about that work?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#148
#148
SeaBass said:
Did not work???????????? Gathering the manna was not work?

Are you thinking something is only work if one can boast about it?
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thats is what scripture says,

Eph 2: 9
"not of works LEST ANYONE SHOULD BOAST."

Rom 4
4 What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh?[SUP][a][/SUP] [SUP]2 [/SUP]For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about


Boasting is taking pride, or taking credit for doing something yourself. Since we can not save ourself. Any work we do which can cause us to boast would cause us to take credit for our own salvation. And takes away from the credit of God and his work.

 
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newbirth

Banned
#149
Mar 28, 2014
4,300
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#149
eternally-gratefull said:

lol. They did not work. again prove to me how they could boast of picking up that manna.

Was it to heavy?

Was it flawed in any way?

what was wrong with this manna that the hebrews had to work so hard, and they could go around boasting how they had to work so hard to eat, or they would die?
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see they had instructions to follow.....
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Then said the Lord unto Moses, Behold, I will rain bread from heaven for you; and the people shall go out and gather a certain rate every day, that I may prove them, whether they will walk in my law, or no.

[SUP]5 [/SUP]And it shall come to pass, that on the sixth day they shall prepare that which they bring in; and it shall be twice as much as they gather daily.


[SUP]19 [/SUP]And Moses said, Let no man leave of it till the morning.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]Notwithstanding they hearkened not unto Moses; but some of them left of it until the morning, and it bred worms, and stank: and Moses was wroth with them.

[SUP]21 [/SUP]And they gathered it every morning, every man according to his eating: and when the sun waxed hot, it melted.

[SUP]27 [/SUP]And it came to pass, that there went out some of the people on the seventh day for to gather, and they found none.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#150
#150
newbirth said:
see they had instructions to follow.....
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Then said the Lord unto Moses, Behold, I will rain bread from heaven for you; and the people shall go out and gather a certain rate every day, that I may prove them, whether they will walk in my law, or no.

[SUP]5 [/SUP]And it shall come to pass, that on the sixth day they shall prepare that which they bring in; and it shall be twice as much as they gather daily.


[SUP]19 [/SUP]And Moses said, Let no man leave of it till the morning.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]Notwithstanding they hearkened not unto Moses; but some of them left of it until the morning, and it bred worms, and stank: and Moses was wroth with them.

[SUP]21 [/SUP]And they gathered it every morning, every man according to his eating: and when the sun waxed hot, it melted.

[SUP]27 [/SUP]And it came to pass, that there went out some of the people on the seventh day for to gather, and they found none.
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I see nothing hear about how one could boast (take credit) for getting the manna.

What I see is God providing food. And people suffering because they rejected his food.

Want to try again?
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#151
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
0
#151
eternally-gratefull said:
thats is what scripture says,

Eph 2: 9
"not of works LEST ANYONE SHOULD BOAST."

Rom 4
4 What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh?[SUP][a][/SUP] [SUP]2 [/SUP]For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about


Boasting is taking pride, or taking credit for doing something yourself. Since we can not save ourself. Any work we do which can cause us to boast would cause us to take credit for our own salvation. And takes away from the credit of God and his work.
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The works of EPh 2:9 are works of merit not obedience.

What was here to boast about in gathering the manna?

Lk 17:10 So likewise ye, when ye shall have done all those things which are commanded you, say, We are unprofitable servants: we have done that which was our duty to do.

Obedience is nothing to boast about for even after one obeys what is commanded him, he is still an unprofitable servant in need of grace.
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#152
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
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#152
eternally-gratefull said:
I see nothing hear about how one could boast (take credit) for getting the manna.

What I see is God providing food. And people suffering because they rejected his food.

Want to try again?
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They did not reject the manna, they worked to gather it.

What could one Hebrew have to boast about in gathering the manna? They were only doing as God commanded them in gathering the manna.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#153
#153
SeaBass said:
The works of EPh 2:9 are works of merit not obedience.
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sorry bro. a work of obedience is a work of mert, unless you expect nothing in return (you do it for no reward) which would make it a law of faith and love doing for someone else, and expecting absolutely nothing in return (which the church is called to do) Notice, Paul said lest they boast. He did not say they would boast, he said they had the ability to boast (take credit)

What was here to boast about in gathering the manna?
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nothing, thats why it does not fit your argument. God gave it to them, they received it.. trying to say this proves we have to do works of obedience to be saved (ie works of merit) is a false precept based on false ideas.

Lk 17:10 So likewise ye, when ye shall have done all those things which are commanded you, say, We are unprofitable servants: we have done that which was our duty to do.

Obedience is nothing to boast about for even after one obeys what is commanded him, he is still an unprofitable servant in need of grace.
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oh yes it is, people boast of it all the time, The pharisees were masters of this.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#154
#154
SeaBass said:
They did not reject the manna, they worked to gather it.

What could one Hebrew have to boast about in gathering the manna? They were only doing as God commanded them in gathering the manna.
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lol..

Some did not go get it, Or do it right, thus it died. or did you forget this?

it is not a work. No one could boast. so it was not done to earn the manna. They did not earn the manna whether they went to get it or not. It was a gift of grace. These were sinners who deserved nothing but death, Yet God showed them his love by feeding them anyway.

A work would be going, plowing the land, planting the crop. Taking care of the crop. and reeping the reward of your hard work. Thats a work.
 
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newbirth

Banned
#155
Mar 28, 2014
4,300
31
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#155
Flamingspirit said:
The problem with the story of the manna is that most do not understand it. Jesus gave you its true meaning when He said that He was the TRUE bread (manna) from Heaven. Therefore following Jesus with that same allegory, manna was not just bread wafers that fell from the sky, but in its spiritual application, the people were fed with the words of the various prophets moved by the Holy Spirit. Having ate those various teachings and laws given by them, they still died. Eating the words of Jesus however, we will not die.
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So true and they had to gather as they needed every day...notice what happen to those who tried to cheat by hoarding extras...Some people think God takes disobedience lightly....
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#156
#156
newbirth said:
So true and they had to gather as they needed every day...notice what happen to those who tried to cheat by hoarding extras...Some people think God takes disobedience lightly....
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yes he does, he chastens those who are his (does not kick them out)

but you missed the whole point. Jesus said whoever eats the bread he gives you will live forever, never die, never hunger or thirst, and HAS eternal life.

He does not say we have to go out every day and collect this food to stay alive, he says his food will never fade, thus we will never die again (spiritually speaking of course)

so much for losing salvation because you did not go out and get your daily manna (obeyed God), and died.
 
Galatians2-20

Galatians2-20

Senior Member
#157
Mar 17, 2013
261
19
18
#157
How can a person recieve that which is free unless he or she is first convinced that the gift is freely theirs for the taking?

Faith, my friends, is the one and only condition yet it is still a condition. ;)

You can lead a horse to water but you can not force him to drink.
 
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notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#158
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#158
SeaBass said:
The Hebrews while in the wilderness became hungry and God gave them for free manna to eat. Yet to satisfy their hunger required they do the work of gathering the manna. Their work in gathering the manna did not take away from the "freeness" of God's gift to them, therefore the work of gathering earned them nothing.

Such a simple concept young people can understand yet adults allow themselves to blinded to it for no other reason than an allegiance to a man-made teaching.
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Another painful example of how little is known by many about the curse of sin.

God provided to Israel that which they could not obtain through their own efforts. All they had to do was receive it. Many grumbled and complained about Gods wonderful provision. Boy that describes many today who gripe that God has provided eternal salvation by grace.

How ungrateful to have God give all that can be given and man complains about it. It should be received with great joy and thanksgiving but no the wicked hearts of men want only to corrupt even this great compassion, mercy and grace of our God.

It is hideous theology to make Gods gift like the gifts men give. Men's gifts always have expectations of recompense but God gives freely and only because He loves us with a love we cannot comprehend.

Why do you resist God? Why will you not let God be God?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#159
#159
Galatians2-20 said:
How can a person recieve that which is free unless he or she is first convinced that the gift is freely theirs for the taking?

Faith, my friends, is the one and only condition yet it is still a condition. ;)
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it is not a work thought. You can not boast of trusting someone else to do all the work for you, and save you when you are totally hopeless.

and again, as jesus said, It is the WORK OF GOD that we believe in the one he sent, it is Gods work, not ours. No boasting in self their! impossible
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#160
#160
notuptome said:
Another painful example of how little is known by many about the curse of sin.

God provided to Israel that which they could not obtain through their own efforts. All they had to do was receive it. Many grumbled and complained about Gods wonderful provision. Boy that describes many today who gripe that God has provided eternal salvation by grace.

How ungrateful to have God give all that can be given and man complains about it. It should be received with great joy and thanksgiving but no the wicked hearts of men want only to corrupt even this great compassion, mercy and grace of our God.

It is hideous theology to make Gods gift like the gifts men give. Men's gifts always have expectations of recompense but God gives freely and only because He loves us with a love we cannot comprehend.

Why do you resist God? Why will you not let God be God?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
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Pride.

It caused the fall of men.

and it will cause many to be lost forever, because they want to work for it. and not just sit back and let God save them.

They do not realise how helpless they are yet. Thus they have not repented.. and why they can not have faith (assurance) in God.
 
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