Why such hatred for the seventh day?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Oct 31, 2011
8,200
182
0
I think you have avoided the the greatest commission that God has given to man and you have sacrificed it on the altar of the Sabbath. That is a shame because it is the greatest and highest calling that we can have here in this world and it takes the grace of God and the Holy Spirit to fulfill it.
I am not one of the posters who uses the word "only" for anything God says. I sacrifice no word of scripture for another word of scripture, it is one unit, one whole. I think everything works together, and I say so. Now!!! I am sacrificing EVERYTHING on the ALTAR of the Sabbath? Is that what it means when scripture tells us to keep the Sabbath? Is that sacrificing Sabbath on an altar? We all require the glace of God, every sinner of us, and we all need the Holy Spirit. Without it our very lives are not fulfilled. But thanks for telling us what you think. I was hoping for a word about scripture, not a personal reading of my heart that only Christ can do. Maybe you should take up fortune telling, aren't they supposed to be able to tell these things about others?
 
B

BradC

Guest
I am not one of the posters who uses the word "only" for anything God says. I sacrifice no word of scripture for another word of scripture, it is one unit, one whole. I think everything works together, and I say so. Now!!! I am sacrificing EVERYTHING on the ALTAR of the Sabbath? Is that what it means when scripture tells us to keep the Sabbath? Is that sacrificing Sabbath on an altar? We all require the glace of God, every sinner of us, and we all need the Holy Spirit. Without it our very lives are not fulfilled. But thanks for telling us what you think. I was hoping for a word about scripture, not a personal reading of my heart that only Christ can do. Maybe you should take up fortune telling, aren't they supposed to be able to tell these things about others?
I hope that you are convicted in your heart and that you rise up from the deadness of the letter. Keeping the Sabbath gives no one any life from God but receiving from the Spirit quickens us in the truth and raises us from the dead that we might be alive unto God. The letter, even the letter of keeping the Sabbath, will kill but the Spirit gives life. You want to honor God then receive grace through the Spirit so that you can have His life reigning in you and bearing His fruit. That is not what a fortune teller would tell you but the Spirit does through the promises of God.
 
J

john316forall

Guest
In response to the OP: Why such hatred for the finished work of Christ?
 
Jun 26, 2014
1,011
17
0
In response to the OP: Why such hatred for the finished work of Christ?
You have it backwards. When we don't obey God we hate the finished work of Christ. The finished work of Christ allows us to love God by the way He defines love. The finished work allows us to love God without fear, guilt or shame for our short falls. Start showing appreciation for what Jesus did through your obedience. It's like when a cop gives you a warning for speeding. The warning doesn't make you speed more, if it did, the cop would probably arrest you instead of just giving you a ticket.

Hebrews 10:26-27 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries.
 
Last edited:

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,424
6,703
113
Addressed t me, you say,

"sigh...here it is again...more proof that the people who are constantly harping about 'keeping the sabbath' -are not even observing the sabbath in the biblical way."

I do not merit this commentary since I do not insist anyone keep the Seventh Day on the Seventh Day. When I come into these discussions, I share what, why and how.

Now you have me going to the market every Saturday, when all I said is that due to my low income, if there is a sale on meat on the Saturday sale, I take advantage of it in order to keep my diet healthy. I am not stranger to hunger and malnutrition. Praise Yah, only in my childhood. Yahweh has blessed me beyond imagination, even during the worst of times since. If the disciples were allowed by Yeshua to glean wheat on the Sabbath, the Seventh Day, the mercy of Yeshua allows for me to eat well when possible, to fetch a donky fallen into a pit, to do whatever good given me to do on the Sabbath. You see the "Biblical way," as you have labeled it includes the Example of Yeshua, the New Testament, for Yeshua is all of the Word.

You do not know inherently to make blanket condemnations of how what you call Sabbath Keepers observe the Sabbath. You know Paul teaches how one man observes one day over another, and it is not sin as long as it is done with a clear conscience in the sight of Yah. Why then do you think it "off" to observe the Sabbath on the only day of the week mentioned in the Word? Why? Why do you say I am under the law? There is a big difference between having a nature given by the Holy Spirit to obey Yahweh, and blindly following all the laws listed in Torah. I love the laws of Yahweh because of the Salvation from Him in Yeshua, and the freedom afforded by grace and mercy.

Come down from your heights and allow others to worship Yeshua, Jesus, as is given them as long as they do not do anything to deny His singular work for each of us by His life, His suffering and His death on a tree.

I have been consistent in posting those who observe the first day considering it the seventh are family in Yeshua as long as they do it with a clear conscience in the sight of Yahweh. Judge not by apearances but with right judgment.

As far as your making your point, I have not replied to all of your post because that would be too long, just stop judging and labeling others in the family of God, Yahweh. It is not spiritually healthy.

May Yahweh bless you with tempered understanding, patience and love, amen.


it looks like i haven't done a good job of making my point...i am not saying -anything- is 'wrong' with regard to the sabbath day...i consider the question of how you spend your sabbath to be entirely up to your christian freedom...

my point is this...both of us are pretty much equal in terms of 'sabbath compliance'...we both go to the grocery store on saturday...but nobody attacks -you- for shopping on saturday...yet i and others frequently -are- attacked by 'sabbath keepers' for just this sort of thing...

so it appears to me that the -label- of 'sabbath keeper' is really the only thing that matters to most of the sabbatarians around here...isn't that unrighteous judgment?
 
T

ThePottersClay

Guest
I really just sit and wonder if God is looking at this debate in favor or if he is saddened that those who proclaim Christ can argue bout such a topic. The more I am exposed to arguments like this the more I am starting to wonder.... If my entire salvation and hope to enter the Kingdom of Heaven is dependent on following a Sabbath day, and if this is in fact the pivotal point of our Faith, and God in Heaven would deny me that grace for celebrating a day of Worship on a Sunday... I'm not so sure if I'm cut out for this....

I can see why you have athiests, why you have people who hate religion - its because of you people who cannot look past all these things and focus on the Cross and Jesus' defeat over death so we can be saved.

If God is true to his word saying that he wishes for ALL of mankind to be saved, enforcing the day of Sabbath after Christ had come to fulfill the law makes no sense, because surely He knows above all... that only a handful will be saved. Perhaps that is his plan after all... so everyone who worships on a Sunday, I suppose would be lost, because we fail to abide by that 1 law.

That's a nail in my coffin, thank you for your input on this forum post. It was most enlightening.

Thankfully.... I have Galatians 3

[h=3]The Law Brings a Curse[/h]10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written,“Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.”[e] 11 But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God isevident, for “the just shall live by faith.”[f] 12 Yet the law is not of faith, but “the man who does them shall live by them.”[g]
13 Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”[h]), 14 that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
[h=3]The Changeless Promise[/h]15 Brethren, I speak in the manner of men: Though it is only a man’s covenant, yet if it is confirmed, no one annuls or adds to it. 16 Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, “And to seeds,” as of many, but as of one, “And to your Seed,”[i] who is Christ. 17 And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ,[j] that it should make the promise of no effect. 18 For if the inheritance is of the law, it is no longer of promise; but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
[h=3]Purpose of the Law[/h]19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. 20 Now a mediator does not mediate for one only, but God is one.
21 Is the law then against the promises of God? Certainly not! For if there had been a law given which could have given life, truly righteousness would have been by the law.22 But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. 23 But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. 24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.
[h=3][/h]
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,424
6,703
113
It must be a heavy burden for you. Did you read the previous post, 225? There is nothing stating one must observe the Seventh Day on the Seventh Day. It is a reply to someone who also seems to misunderstand what is posted in response to them. For your benefit I will repeat myself for the umpteenth time.

Anyone who observes the Seventh Day on another day of the week with a clear conscience in the sight of Yahweh, God, is not sinning. Yes, my understanding impels me to go by what I see written plainly in the Word.

Is this arguing one must observe on the Seventh Day the day God designated as His Day of Rest? I do not believe it is. If it is, please show me, and I will repent of it immediately. The difficutly most have who observe the Sabbath of the Lord is when they explain to others who do no why they do, it is taken as being under the law, and not following their own new heart's desire to please the Father by obeying Him as best possible within the freedom of grace afforded by the Blood of His Lamb, Yeshua.

Nothing in this post should offend anyone, yet, it does. Pity. Praise Yahweh, God, and bless those who are not lawless.


I really just sit and wonder if God is looking at this debate in favor or if he is saddened that those who proclaim Christ can argue bout such a topic. The more I am exposed to arguments like this the more I am starting to wonder.... If my entire salvation and hope to enter the Kingdom of Heaven is dependent on following a Sabbath day, and if this is in fact the pivotal point of our Faith, and God in Heaven would deny me that grace for celebrating a day of Worship on a Sunday... I'm not so sure if I'm cut out for this....

I can see why you have athiests, why you have people who hate religion - its because of you people who cannot look past all these things and focus on the Cross and Jesus' defeat over death so we can be saved.

If God is true to his word saying that he wishes for ALL of mankind to be saved, enforcing the day of Sabbath after Christ had come to fulfill the law makes no sense, because surely He knows above all... that only a handful will be saved. Perhaps that is his plan after all... so everyone who worships on a Sunday, I suppose would be lost, because we fail to abide by that 1 law.

That's a nail in my coffin, thank you for your input on this forum post. It was most enlightening.

Thankfully.... I have Galatians 3

The Law Brings a Curse

10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written,“Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.”[e] 11 But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God isevident, for “the just shall live by faith.”[f] 12 Yet the law is not of faith, but “the man who does them shall live by them.”[g]
13 Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”[h]), 14 that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
The Changeless Promise

15 Brethren, I speak in the manner of men: Though it is only a man’s covenant, yet if it is confirmed, no one annuls or adds to it. 16 Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, “And to seeds,” as of many, but as of one, “And to your Seed,”[i] who is Christ. 17 And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ,[j] that it should make the promise of no effect. 18 For if the inheritance is of the law, it is no longer of promise; but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
Purpose of the Law

19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. 20 Now a mediator does not mediate for one only, but God is one.
21 Is the law then against the promises of God? Certainly not! For if there had been a law given which could have given life, truly righteousness would have been by the law.22 But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. 23 But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. 24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,672
6,861
113
Just a thought here........but I betcha if folks paid more attention to what they were doing and how they were living, and not worrying so much about what others are doing, or how others are living........things would be a lot better.......

but, now, that may just be me.............so.............. :)
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,389
193
63
I hope that you are convicted in your heart and that you rise up from the deadness of the letter. Keeping the Sabbath gives no one any life from God but receiving from the Spirit quickens us in the truth and raises us from the dead that we might be alive unto God. The letter, even the letter of keeping the Sabbath, will kill but the Spirit gives life. You want to honor God then receive grace through the Spirit so that you can have His life reigning in you and bearing His fruit. That is not what a fortune teller would tell you but the Spirit does through the promises of God.
This is a gross twisting of scripture. Will keeping the letter of the seventh Commandment kill? Would you say the same thing about the stealing or lying?
 
C

chubbena

Guest
I hate the forcing of the 7th day because it is so disrespectful to Jesus, and sooo self righteous. Love to all , Hoffco
He's the one who gave the Sabbath on mount Sinai and reconfirmed that in the flesh. So disrespectful who?
 
C

chubbena

Guest
It must be a heavy burden for you. Did you read the previous post, 225? There is nothing stating one must observe the Seventh Day on the Seventh Day. It is a reply to someone who also seems to misunderstand what is posted in response to them. For your benefit I will repeat myself for the umpteenth time.

Anyone who observes the Seventh Day on another day of the week with a clear conscience in the sight of Yahweh, God, is not sinning. Yes, my understanding impels me to go by what I see written plainly in the Word.

Is this arguing one must observe on the Seventh Day the day God designated as His Day of Rest? I do not believe it is. If it is, please show me, and I will repent of it immediately. The difficutly most have who observe the Sabbath of the Lord is when they explain to others who do no why they do, it is taken as being under the law, and not following their own new heart's desire to please the Father by obeying Him as best possible within the freedom of grace afforded by the Blood of His Lamb, Yeshua.

Nothing in this post should offend anyone, yet, it does. Pity. Praise Yahweh, God, and bless those who are not lawless.
Indeed, not every Israelites rested on the Sabbath in the "OT". It was the most busy day of the week for the Levites and the priests. The gatekeepers had to work on that day too. But to make the Sabbath the most busy day for earthly entertainment is something else.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,389
193
63
I don't take issue with the seventh day however, I do take issue with those who refuse to recognize the New Testament fulfillment of the sabbath. Christ himself stated that He did not come to abolish the law but to fulfill it and that He did.... the entire law including the sabbath.

None but Christ could fulfill the law then and none but Christ can fulfill the law now. That is why Christ gave us His Spirit, to both inhabit and empower New Testament saints, to do in and through us what mankind could never do for ourselves since the fall of Adam.

The Old Testament law reveals to us not only the divine character of God but also mankind's inability to fulfill the law through human striving. Christ came to earth and gave his life so that right fellowship between God and man might be restored in the form of the indwelling Holy Spirit. New Testament believers now have access to everything necessaary to live a life pleasing to God through His Spirit if, and only if, those who are inhabited by His Spirit willingfully lay down their lives so that Christ can live His life in and through them. The Holy Spirit does the work, those He indwells simply follow his lead and enjoys the REST that only His divine presence can provide.

Unfortunately, very few New Testament saints seem to understand much less reside in His REST.
Just curious, are you resting from keeping the Sabbath? Also in this post are you resting from keeping the ninth Commandment?
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,389
193
63
Jesus rose from the dead on the first day of the week (Matt. 28:1-7; Mark 16:2, 9; Luke 24:1; John 20:1).
Jesus appeared to the disciples on the first day of the week (John 20:19).
Jesus appeared inside the room to the eleven disciples eight days after the first day of the week. The Jewish way of measuring days meant that it was again Sunday (John 20:26).
The Holy Spirit came on Pentecost, the first day of the week (Lev. 23:16; Acts 2:1).
The first sermon was preached by Peter on the first day of the week (Acts 2:14).
Three thousand converts joined the church on the first day of the week (Acts 2:41).
The three thousand were baptized on the first day of the week (Acts 2:41).
The Christians assembled broke bread on the first day of the week.
The Christians also heard a message from Paul on the first day of the week (Acts 20:7). [Note: the reference is until midnight which is not the Jewish method of measuring days, but the Roman system.]
Paul instructed the churches to put aside contributions on the first day of the week (1 Cor. 16:2).
Jesus gave the apostle John the vision of Revelation on the first day of the week (Rev. 1:10).


Sheesh, I played internet theologian & did a quick Google search & found this on the first site checked...... It's really not that hard, guys. :rolleyes:
Pulled several verses out of context and misread them that quickly did you?
 
L

LT

Guest
Pulled several verses out of context and misread them that quickly did you?
Actually, I think only one of those is debatable. The rest are clearly referring to the 1st day of the week.
Not that it matters.
... because it really doesn't matter.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Oct 31, 2011
8,200
182
0
I really just sit and wonder if God is looking at this debate in favor or if he is saddened that those who proclaim Christ can argue bout such a topic. The more I am exposed to arguments like this the more I am starting to wonder.... If my entire salvation and hope to enter the Kingdom of Heaven is dependent on following a Sabbath day, and if this is in fact the pivotal point of our Faith, and God in Heaven would deny me that grace for celebrating a day of Worship on a Sunday... I'm not so sure if I'm cut out for this....

I can see why you have athiests, why you have people who hate religion - its because of you people who cannot look past all these things and focus on the Cross and Jesus' defeat over death so we can be saved.
You are sure on the right track, it is up to God and what He sees! And to fight about a law and how to live after we are saved is silly and wrong, but to seriously consider how to do that in the best way, talking it over seriously, that can't be wrong.

This is getting into some pretty important stuff. Did Christ change how the Sabbath was made? Are we supposed to obey? There are posters here with different interpretations telling us why they think about it as they do. It is so fundamental feelings run deep. Those who aren't trying to discuss this but only accuse aren't using God's ways. People who feel personally threatened by posters if they state their beliefs have a serious problem.

People who have not focused on the cross and are saved by Christ are not interested in the Sabbath at all. We all have that in common. This thread is about the next step, what does the Lord want of us in obedience? There are fights here because we are sinful and human, aren't we all? But there is good discussion of scripture here, too.

I hope you will see this discussion in a different light and just focus on the scripture being brought out, each person needs to make decisions, but those decisions are for after the focus on the cross and their salvation.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,389
193
63
Actually, I think only one of those is debatable. The rest are clearly referring to the 1st day of the week.
Not that it matters.
... because it really doesn't matter.
Let's discuss the ones you think are clearly referring to the first day of the week.
 
L

LT

Guest
Let's discuss the ones you think are clearly referring to the first day of the week.
We've done that before on a different thread. It's a bit boring to go over the same verses, with the SDA people saying things like: by the '1st day of the week', they really mean 'the 1st Sabbath',
none of which make grammatical or logical sense.
 
T

ThePottersClay

Guest
It must be a heavy burden for you. Did you read the previous post, 225
Apologies, but my post was not aimed at your post at all, I was going through all the posts I haven't read and it was a general consensus on the idea that people so easily point fingers.... your post I understood very clear. But sadly there are those on this forum who very clearly and very blatantly condemn the ones who celebrates the 'seventh day of rest' on a day other than the original Sabbath day they believe in. Your understanding of the day of rest is the same as mine.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,424
6,703
113
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to ThePottersClay again.

Thank you. I concluded for myself a long time ago that it is important for each of us to share our understanding, yours being no exception. For me it is not a chore or works, it is my due. I am tickled pink to know someone else sees what I see. My aim is never to convince others of what I think for all glory is to God, Yahweh. It is a tricky proposition in an open forum containing theologies, sects, believers, unbelievers, even trolls, because there is always an interest or an interest group ready to attack any post no matter how docile, even attacking the words of the Lamb of Yahweh, God.

It is difficult at times not to think of the forum as an assembly of Yahweh, God. Of course it is not wholly, and this does cause some abrasion. Yahweh bless you and hold you close always.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,389
193
63
We've done that before on a different thread. It's a bit boring to go over the same verses, with the SDA people saying things like: by the '1st day of the week', they really mean 'the 1st Sabbath',
none of which make grammatical or logical sense.
So outta the blue, Christ changes the day He sanctified at creation, upheld for 4000 years and enacted the death penalty for breaking, then without so much as a whisper of the command to change it in the New Testament and that makes logical sense?