Jesus turned water into unfermented wine and not fermented wine.
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U
Did you read Hebrews 5 and 6 like I suggested?
No man can be saved more than once.
If a man falls away, there is no 2nd salvation to be obtained through repentance. (A return to fellowship can happen when we stray and repent, but salvation was never lost, only blessing and fellowship)
You say their is no accountability, yet why does the Spirit still hold me accountable? (Also, God's discipline holds me accountable. He actively pursues and disciplines His Children in this life.)
AH! Because I do not overcome sin simply because if I don't I will be damned. I overcome sin because I love my Lord, and His Spirit works within me.
I do not pursue good works because if I don't I will not get to heaven. I pursue good works to express the love I have been given, and to show others what I obtained in Christ.
If a person is doing good and abstaining from evil so that they will stay saved, then they don't understand the Gospel. We don't need to stay saved. We are COMPELLED to do good good and pursue holiness by the Spirit, not fear of hell.
Those who preach against eternal security are preaching against the power of Salvation, and instead preaching the power of self-preservation.
(OSAS assumes that people can't accept the Good News and later reject it. The Parable of the Sower clearly teaches differently. The Word teaches eternal security to those who have been given faith. A person can claim to be a Christian, yet not have faith, and not actually be saved.)
No man can be saved more than once.
If a man falls away, there is no 2nd salvation to be obtained through repentance. (A return to fellowship can happen when we stray and repent, but salvation was never lost, only blessing and fellowship)
You say their is no accountability, yet why does the Spirit still hold me accountable? (Also, God's discipline holds me accountable. He actively pursues and disciplines His Children in this life.)
AH! Because I do not overcome sin simply because if I don't I will be damned. I overcome sin because I love my Lord, and His Spirit works within me.
I do not pursue good works because if I don't I will not get to heaven. I pursue good works to express the love I have been given, and to show others what I obtained in Christ.
If a person is doing good and abstaining from evil so that they will stay saved, then they don't understand the Gospel. We don't need to stay saved. We are COMPELLED to do good good and pursue holiness by the Spirit, not fear of hell.
Those who preach against eternal security are preaching against the power of Salvation, and instead preaching the power of self-preservation.
(OSAS assumes that people can't accept the Good News and later reject it. The Parable of the Sower clearly teaches differently. The Word teaches eternal security to those who have been given faith. A person can claim to be a Christian, yet not have faith, and not actually be saved.)
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U
Read the two chapters of 1st Peter.
What is "fear of the Lord"? Is it fear of damnation, or fear of His discipline upon His Children?
We do not need to fear that Christ will divorce us, or that God will disown or unadopt us.
We need to fear the God that is in control of all aspects of life and death, every cause and effect,
over all judgements of right and wrong, and hot and cold, and the judge over the mathematics structure of reality, and the very substance of time and space.
He judges whether an electron will bond or repel.
Do you not fear that He will cause you trouble when you disobey?
Believers hold God's watchful eye, and will reap the negative consequences for disobedience, when the unbeliever will make profit from being disobedient! (Until the Day of the Lord, when He judges the unbelievers, and withholds judgement from believers).
Fear of the Lord is physical and in the world, as He is the Judge of our world.
Joy of the Lord is spiritual and in all reality, as He is in control of all future, and loves us, and has good intent for us.
What is "fear of the Lord"? Is it fear of damnation, or fear of His discipline upon His Children?
We do not need to fear that Christ will divorce us, or that God will disown or unadopt us.
We need to fear the God that is in control of all aspects of life and death, every cause and effect,
over all judgements of right and wrong, and hot and cold, and the judge over the mathematics structure of reality, and the very substance of time and space.
He judges whether an electron will bond or repel.
Do you not fear that He will cause you trouble when you disobey?
Believers hold God's watchful eye, and will reap the negative consequences for disobedience, when the unbeliever will make profit from being disobedient! (Until the Day of the Lord, when He judges the unbelievers, and withholds judgement from believers).
Fear of the Lord is physical and in the world, as He is the Judge of our world.
Joy of the Lord is spiritual and in all reality, as He is in control of all future, and loves us, and has good intent for us.
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Apparently you fail at understanding what a definition means. The definition of Drunkard is HABITUALLY DRUNK. Maybe you just cant wrap you head around what habitually means? I'll help you out there as well. Habitually means regularly or repeatedly. So to be a drunkard, you have to be drunk regularly or repeatedly. Now unlike your collection of nonsense, i have used real-world definitions in my explanation of drunkard. Your entire attempt to discredit it with rape, murder, etc. fails because none of those require a repetitive act or form of behavior to be true, while Drunkard does. So now were the people at the wedding drunkards? It doesn't say. But one night of revlery isn't going to send you to hell. It certainly not as likely compared to your constant scripture twisting.
Drunkard | Define Drunkard at Dictionary.com
druhng-kerd] Spell Syllables
noun1.a person who is habitually or frequently drunk.
druhng-kerd] Spell Syllables
noun1.a person who is habitually or frequently drunk.
L
You see what you want to see even if its not there. You see judgment that is not good. I hope for your sake that your right otherwise you have called God who is good evil. There is only one sin not forgiven and if you are wrong you have committed it maybe blindly lead others who are weak astray despite several warnings to stop judging Gods wine.
First, where in the Bible does it ever condone a person to get drunk on occasion? Second, God is eternal. So there is no passage of time that would matter to Him. Your sin of drunkenness 10 years ago (that was not repented of) would be like it was still happening before Him because God is not bound by our linear concept of time. Third, Galatians 5:19-21 says there are works of the flesh that are manifested. Drunkenness is one of those sins or works of the flesh that is said that they which do such things will not inherit the Kingdom of God; And "drunkenness" is defined as a state of being intoxicated. It doesn't specify a continual state. Fourth, 1 Peter 5:8 says we are to be on the alert and be sober minded for our adversary the devil seeks those in whom he may devour. 1 Thessalonians 5:7-8 says that there two categories of people. There are those who are of the night who are drunken and there are those who are of the day who are sober. it is a contrast between believers and unbelievers.
The Bible clearly condemns drunkenness. That's where you fail to understand why Jesus could not do anything to make somebody drunk. For God does not do anything to lead us into sin. His miracle of making the wine was to show forth His glory. How would Jesus be glorified if people supposedly got more drunk off the wine He made?
Wow. If you are a true born again Christian, and adhere to the doctrine of OSAS, does that automatically label someone as not caring about sinning? "having no real accountability" "No true goodness" "Only evil."? That's a mighty fine judgment you have there and tons of assumptions.
I'm here to tell you that I believe that I'm eternally kept by God's saving grace but I still WANT to do good, I still feel accountable and still strive for goodness.
I think you should reevaluate your stance on OSAS.
I'm here to tell you that I believe that I'm eternally kept by God's saving grace but I still WANT to do good, I still feel accountable and still strive for goodness.
I think you should reevaluate your stance on OSAS.
You have things backwards. You are under the false impression that it is okay for God to create an intoxicating beverage so as to make people (Who are already drunk or tipsy) to be drunk with his miracle that showed forth his glory. This is wrong because we know that drunkennes and or being a drunkard is a sin. We also know that it is wrong to influence a child to sin, too. Right? For Jesus said it would be better if a millstone were to hung about such a person's neck. Now, we are the children of God, too. For we are to have a heart of a child. So if we are like the children, then it would not be possible for God or anyone else to influence us into doing anything remotely bad.
Actually, over the many years in my discussions against OSAS, I have cataloged three major types of OSAS.
OSAS Type #1:
Classic OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved) which says you can practice unrepentant sin that leads unto death (Such as lying, murder, hate, fornication, etc.) and yet you can somehow still be saved. This is the most popular form of OSAS.
OSAS Type #2:
Mid Range OSAS says that you cannot practice sin otherwise you do not know God. However, abiding in an occasional or small unrepentant sin and then dying in that sin will not necessarily send you to Hell.
OSAS Type #3:
OSAS Lite teaches that you if you practice or continually abide in unrepentant sin then you were never saved to begin with. Meaning that a true believer is characterized by them living righteously. So falling away from the faith would be impossible (Despite the many verses that talk about such a thing).
Personally, I believe in the Biblical View of "Conditional Salvation" that teaches that a true believer who is saved will naturally bring forth a life full of holiness and fruitful works. Now, do not misunderstand me, works are not done to be saved, but they are merely the evidence that you have been saved when one repents and accepts Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Savior. If a believer sins, they need to immediately confess that sin and forsake it and continue to walk uprightly with their Lord. If a believer continues to abide in unrepentant sin that leads unto death (lying cheating murder etc.) then they are not saved.
So seeing I hold to the Biblical View of "Conditional Salvation", I am naturally against all forms of OSAS. However, that said, I believe that only those who hold to "Conditional Salvation" and "OSAS Lite" are true Christians (or my brothers). I believe all other forms of OSAS are teachings from the pits of Hell.
OSAS Type #1:
Classic OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved) which says you can practice unrepentant sin that leads unto death (Such as lying, murder, hate, fornication, etc.) and yet you can somehow still be saved. This is the most popular form of OSAS.
OSAS Type #2:
Mid Range OSAS says that you cannot practice sin otherwise you do not know God. However, abiding in an occasional or small unrepentant sin and then dying in that sin will not necessarily send you to Hell.
OSAS Type #3:
OSAS Lite teaches that you if you practice or continually abide in unrepentant sin then you were never saved to begin with. Meaning that a true believer is characterized by them living righteously. So falling away from the faith would be impossible (Despite the many verses that talk about such a thing).
Personally, I believe in the Biblical View of "Conditional Salvation" that teaches that a true believer who is saved will naturally bring forth a life full of holiness and fruitful works. Now, do not misunderstand me, works are not done to be saved, but they are merely the evidence that you have been saved when one repents and accepts Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Savior. If a believer sins, they need to immediately confess that sin and forsake it and continue to walk uprightly with their Lord. If a believer continues to abide in unrepentant sin that leads unto death (lying cheating murder etc.) then they are not saved.
So seeing I hold to the Biblical View of "Conditional Salvation", I am naturally against all forms of OSAS. However, that said, I believe that only those who hold to "Conditional Salvation" and "OSAS Lite" are true Christians (or my brothers). I believe all other forms of OSAS are teachings from the pits of Hell.
Are you sure you do not abide in the sin of lying? You do enough good works to prove your salvation? Where do you look for your assurance of same?
Besides I have to say fruit is something entirely else than condition. All conditions for our salvation was fulfilled in the person and work of Jesus Christ alone. Bearing fruit as a believer is just that; fruit of salvation. Not a condition for same.
Besides I have to say fruit is something entirely else than condition. All conditions for our salvation was fulfilled in the person and work of Jesus Christ alone. Bearing fruit as a believer is just that; fruit of salvation. Not a condition for same.